Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #14 *ARREST*

[Hatfield]

I understand it could be taken wrongly so best be clear.I'm new to posting on forums in general .I wasso saddened by Libbys disapoerance and found Websleuths by chance.I have great sympathy for everyone in Libbys family her friends all who knew her.Its beyond terrible what happened to a loveyy young girl her prime if life so much ahead hopes dreams . Reading all the posts has been so interesting and heartwarming.

Welcome. So glad to have new members participating in our discussions.

We do sometimes use unique abbreviations here on our crime threads, so if you ever see one being used and you dont know what it means, this link below can be helpful as it contains a lot of the common ones people use here at WS.

Websleuths Lingo

 

[Miss_French]

Yes, it's here
Missing student Libby Squire was last seen 'falling over drunk'
Tom Tulley, 20, who lives opposite, watched her “stumbling” and falling on Thursday night.
He said: “She was too drunk to be on her own. The taxi dropped her by a red car. She was walking away from her house, which is weird. She fell over a couple of times.”
Housemate Leon Caplin, 20, added: “She was struggling to walk, she was wobbling and could not walk in a straight line.”

But also "Mr Tully, 20, said yesterday: 'She was too drunk to be on her own. She was very drunk. She was dressed all in black. The taxi dropped her off. She got out and was walking down the street. She fell over a couple of times.' "

flipboard

 

[Skigh]

I think we are all on the same side and no one would dispute Libby should have been safe whether drunk or sober.
But drink did play a part in what happened.
as far as I see it people are only discussing it as far as wondering where Libby was heading and why GB stopped.
As well as what made PR persuade her into to get into his car.

 

[TheCasual]

But also "Mr Tully, 20, said yesterday: 'She was too drunk to be on her own. She was very drunk. She was dressed all in black. The taxi dropped her off. She got out and was walking down the street. She fell over a couple of times.' "

flipboard

Not blaming the lad at all.

There's another little coincidence that went against poor Libby.

Maybe they'd of taken her in gave her a coffee and let sober up until her friends got home.

 

[jacksmamma]

Exactly right, you said it “too risky being on main road”. Without the CCTV from electric company there probably would not be proof of LS getting in PR’s car. MOO he knew what he was doing, parking where he parked in the direction he parked was all intentional. He saw LS and saw an opportunity, he just had to wait until the coast was clear. Thank goodness for the CCTV.

I think there is more CCTV evidence en route to ORPF, so that wouldn't've been the only 'clue' - thankfully.

 

[Joolz1975]

Welcome. So glad to have new members participating in our discussions.

We do sometimes use unique abbreviations here on our crime threads, so if you ever see one being used and you dont know what it means, this link below can be helpful as it contains a lot of the common ones people use here at WS.

Websleuths Lingo

Hatfield i read that as Websleuths bingo! It's been a looong day!!

 

[PaddyOreally?]

I'm sure I see bare legs

I think everyone can apart from me! I have just come to accept that although I think I'm seeing a man's pair of trousered legs, that I'm probably just wrong. People must just see things differently.like how some people think tennis balls are green!

 

[Joolz1975]

I don't think anyone can deny drink played a part in the whole series of events that night.

Libby wasn't to blame for what happened to her, of course she wasn't but it would be naive to think drink had no part in it.

Her judgement would have been greatly impaired, so would her instinct to fight back.

Only one person was to blame for what happened however I don't think he would have dared to try it on someone more capable of defending themselves.

If it was pre planned then I think he was looking for someone in exactly Libbys predicament, he had probably scouted out opportunities many times before who knows.

Again I don't think Libby was to blame but the drink and been alone certainly made her a target.

It would be lovely if we could all go out, get really drunk and not have to worry about what may happen to us and our friends/family but in the real world it's not possible sadly.

 

[jacksmamma]

If PR told Libby he was a taxi driver, wouldn’t she get in the back seat? I can’t really see in the cctv if she’s resisting or not, but surely PR would’ve put her on the back seat too if she was unsteady/drunk instead of the front

She could've been put into the front seat then offered a bottle of water p p

If PR told Libby he was a taxi driver, wouldn’t she get in the back seat? I can’t really see in the cctv if she’s resisting or not, but surely PR would’ve put her on the back seat too if she was unsteady/drunk instead of the front

It seems as if belongings (Bag? Jacket?) were put on the back seat from the front. It would have been inconvenient for someone who wanted to get away quickly to then close the front door, open the rear door and put someone on the back seat.

 

[Newthoughts]

IMOO however we personally have no wish to accord her condition to the events of that night her alcohol level is relevant sadly. This is in no way judgement nor blame but we must accept this it cannot be ignored..

Alcohol Consumption and Women's Vulnerability to Sexual Victimization: Can Reducing Women's Drinking Prevent Rape?

Alcohol consumption has long been considered as being to increase vulnerability to sexual victimization, with numerous studies documenting a positive association between women's alcohol use and their experiences of sexual victimization, at both the global and the event level (see Abbey, 2002; Abbey, Zawacki, Buck, Clinton, and McAuslan, 2004; Testa and Parks, 1996 for reviews). Research shows that sexually victimized women tend to drink more than women without a history of victimization. Moreover, a substantial proportion of sexual assaults occur when the victim has been drinking and incidents of victimization are disproportionately likely to occur on drinking days as opposed to nondrinking days. These findings raise the intriguing question: Can the incidence of sexual victimization be reduced by reducing women's drinking? Because alcohol use is amenable to change, prevention efforts that focus on reducing women's drinking may be a promising means of reducing sexual victimization.

We do not mean to suggest that women who consume alcohol are responsible for their own victimization. Few would dispute that it is the perpetrator, nearly always male, who is responsible for sexual victimization and that it is imperative that prevention efforts target male perpetration. Nonetheless, without in any way blaming the victim, it is also responsible to help women to reduce their risk of sexual victimization by altering the behaviors that increase their vulnerability.

Before determining whether reducing women's drinking might serve to reduce their vulnerability to sexual victimization, it is necessary to evaluate the strength and nature of the relationship between the putative risk factor and the outcome. As Leonard (2005) has cogently argued regarding the role of alcohol in perpetration of intimate partner violence, there is no single study or design that can definitively establish causality.1 However, an accumulation of evidence from different types of studies may be strong enough to implicate alcohol consumption as a contributing cause.

I'm not quite sure of the relevance of much of that. It seems to refer a lot to women who drink a lot and women who are victims of partner violence. Statistically far more common than what happened.

All we know about Libby is that she was drunk the night she was abducted and killed. For all we know that could have been the first time she got drunk in her life. She might have been like a lot of students, a social drinker. There is nothing to suggest she drank any more or less than anyone else.

Furthermore I'd be very surprised given her loving family and friends if she'd ever been sexually victimised before that night let alone have a history.

I drink far less than most people I know. But I have been drunk.

Being drunk will have meant Libby was more vulnerable nobody is arguing otherwise! But the reasons for her being drunk are most likely boring, ordinary just drank too much. Like thousands of ordinary students before her.

What happened to Libby is not common. Most women know their attackers.

So it is PRs alleged previous behaviors that are relevant not Libby's. It is PRs alleged behaviors that abnormal. So let's concentrate on those

 

[jacksmamma]

I don't think anyone can deny drink played a part in the whole series of events that night.

Libby wasn't to blame for what happened to her, of course she wasn't but it would be naive to think drink had no part in it.

Her judgement would have been greatly impaired, so would her instinct to fight back.

Only one person was to blame for what happened however I don't think he would have dared to try it on someone more capable of defending themselves.

If it was pre planned then I think he was looking for someone in exactly Libbys predicament, he had probably scouted out opportunities many times before who knows.

Again I don't think Libby was to blame but the drink and been alone certainly made her a target.

It would be lovely if we could all go out, get really drunk and not have to worry about what may happen to us and our friends/family but in the real world it's not possible sadly.

Your post makes me a little uncomfortable. JS

 

[Enquirer-2019]

I think we are all on the same side and no one would dispute Libby should have been safe whether drunk or sober.
But drink did play a part in what happened.
as far as I see it people are only discussing it as far as wondering where Libby was heading and why GB stopped.
As well as what made PR persuade her into to get into his car.

I have pondered like most regarding why Libby got in his car?

I am of the belief as I mentioned previously she did not get in voluntarily. I base this on the CCTV which I think I see .. suspicious activity regarding feet movement (forwards and backwards).

Earlier I’m
Not sure who ... but a member quietude - ‘Wouldn’t there have been screams heard , if she was forced into the car.’

That got me thinking this... PR worked in a slaughter house where I supspect Stun guns like this may be used.
IMOO - If he did use this type of device or similar stun/ sedate method, it occured most probable at the side of the car as she walked down the road, heading to the UNI or elsewhere, he sprung upon her. (Link below from Wiki) Captive bolt pistol - Wikipedia

We know he was a thief, so it’s not illogical to question could he have stolen one from work, and used it to stun her, or even bought one online. (IMO)

I read the stun gun point raised much earlier in the thread. But cannot recall if his close familiarity to these things have been raised. (Forgive me of this has been.)

 

[motherofdaughters]

Hatfield i read that as Websleuths bingo! It's been a looong day!!

Greybeard
The Deep
Spidercam
Why did the taxi take so long?

BINGO?

 

[Ruthbullock]

Or unknown to you takes it to school for show and tell

As a past teacher I can say that has absolutely happened, as did teddy comfort toys with sanitary towels attached as nappies

 

[Joolz1975]

Your post makes me a little uncomfortable. JS

Hit the report button then that's what it's there for.

I don't know how I could have made it clearer that LS was not to blame but I genuinely don't think he would have tried this on someone more capable of defending themselves.

 

[Cherwell]

Do we definitely know she didn't go to her front door? We have MSM reports of her walking away.

It's an inference I draw from the Mirror quote, where he says
She was walking away from her house, which is weird.

I just think that if she'd gone to her door, he'd have said so. They may have missed a bit out, of course, but it's the fact that the "weird" bit is included that makes me think it's an accurate quote.

 

[motherofdaughters]

I

That got me thinking this... PR worked in a slaughter house where I supspect Stun guns like this may be used.
IMOO - If he did use this type of device or similar stun/ sedate method, it occured most probable at the side of the car as she walked down the road, heading to the UNI or elsewhere, he sprung upon her. (Link below from Wiki) Captive bolt pistol - Wikipedia

We know he was a thief, so it’s not illogical to question could he have stolen one from work, and used it to stun her, or even bought one online. (IMO)

I read the stun gun point raised much earlier in the thread. But cannot recall if his close familiarity to these things have been raised. (Forgive me of this has been.)

Woah, that's quite a leap....

 

[jacksmamma]

I tend to sit in the front when alone too. I get travel sick though so I'm first to hop in the front even if I'm with friends or family.

You beat me to it - so do I!

 

[Ruthbullock]

Yep, as a student myself (third year at a northern UK uni), I'm not buying the idea that he managed to walk into house parties and sneak upstairs to the bedrooms. Non-students stick out like a sore thumb, particularly as he's Polish (no judgement, just stating fact!) he would be more noticeable and people would realise they don't know him. Maybe the circles I hang around with are more cautious but I cannot for one second imagine that someone who nobody knows would even get two paces past the front door.

Anyway, back to writing my dissertation

However in Hull it does happen and is still happening to this day (even after his arrest). Students assuming it’s other students in the building.
Thieves follow woman home and break in as she's inside

 

[Ruthbullock]

Her inebriated state shouldn’t be a discussion. She should have been safe to get drunk and still get home.

She did get home, it’s questioning why she then made the decisions she did and alcohol maybe one of the reasons. JMO I don’t think it was alcohol, I think she had some other idea about how her night might pan out and why she did what she did.