Found Deceased UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *Arrest* #3

[SpursGyal]

I'm not really sure of what to make of the Head Teacher really.
'He could be exploited' - But hasn't ever seen that happen, also wouldn't do something he didn't want to and wouldn't need the money...

 

[Rosegold68]

no mention of the distinctive blue trainers

even though yesterday numerous pairs were mentioned

 

[Rosegold68]

no mention of the distinctive blue trainers

even though yesterday numerous pairs were mentioned

 

[Tortoise]

Just a reminder of the prepared statement -

"I did not murder Lindsay Birbeck. I was not involved in her death. I was not present at the time or place of her death.

"I did move a body from an area off Burnley Road Accrington in a wheelie bin.

"At first I hid the body but later moved it again in a wheelie bin, taking it to the cemetery on Burnley Road where I buried it on my own.

"A man came up to me when I was walking alone in that area off Burnley Road and he asked me to “get rid of a body” for him.

"He said that he would pay me a lot of money when everything was clear. He showed me where the body was and he went away straightaway leaving me to “get rid of the body”.

"I have not met this man before. I have not met him since nor have. I had any contact with him. He has not paid me any money.

"He told me that he would leave the money for me near where the body had been at first once everything was clear.

"I cannot describe the man other than to say he was white, male, spoke English.

"I could not see his face well as he was covering it with his hood. I am not sure of his height, build or age.

"Other than as above I do not wish to say anything further”

This isn't stacking up with the headteacher's evidence.

Examples -

He then asked: "Would you say that people who had worked with him over a number of years had never had a proper conversation with him"

She replied: "Yes"

She told the jury his language abilities were limited and he was unable to communicate properly.

"You always had to speak to him, and you would get one or two word answers from him.



Who wrote his statement and how did they get the information from him? It's important to me to know, from a credibility point of view, if he said "I am not sure of his height, build or age", or if these were separate questions put to him to which he answered no, or if someone like a family member could have written it for him and could have constructed the whole defence. I wonder if @Angleterre might be able to assist with any of these possibilities, once a suspect is in custody.

moo

 

[Ann Blyth]

This isn't stacking up with the headteacher's evidence.

Examples -

He then asked: "Would you say that people who had worked with him over a number of years had never had a proper conversation with him"

She replied: "Yes"

She told the jury his language abilities were limited and he was unable to communicate properly.

"You always had to speak to him, and you would get one or two word answers from him.



Who wrote his statement and how did they get the information from him? It's important to me to know, from a credibility point of view, if he said "I am not sure of his height, build or age", or if these were separate questions put to him to which he answered no, or if someone like a family member could have written it for him and could have constructed the whole defence. I wonder if @Angleterre might be able to assist with any of these possibilities, once a suspect is in custody.

moo

The defendant’s pre prepared statement would have been written for him by his legal representative whilst in custody after arrest, on day two. This is based upon what information the defendant has told his legal representative at the time.

 

[Tortoise]

The defendant’s pre prepared statement would have been written for him by his legal representative whilst in custody after arrest, on day two. This is based upon what information the defendant has told his legal representative at the time.

And yet I find that very hard to believe with information from people who had known him for years only getting one or two word answers from him. How did he communicate the scenario? Was he allowed visitors who could have slipped him a piece of paper? I wonder if his special needs could have afforded him privileged conditions.

moo

 

[Rosegold68]

he probably communicated better with family and people he knew well.

how would his ADHD display itself?

 

[Ann Blyth]

And yet I find that very hard to believe with information from people who had known him for years only getting one or two word answers from him. How did he communicate the scenario? Was he allowed visitors who could have slipped him a piece of paper? I wonder if his special needs could have afforded him privileged conditions.

moo

I think I have the answer, he would have had to also have an appropriate adult there too, which would more than likely have been a member of his family. There’s his defence, boom!

 

[Doris777]

Imo

I think he's been in a specialist school for kids with additional needs. So stuff like ADHD. Autism. Aspergus ect. It's not normal school rules that u make lessons for separate kids. His mental age is that of someone younger. The head teacher is obviously well educated in additional needs kids so will know his abilities. She's basically said of someone wanted to exploite him they could. So if someone said more that for me he would. He might have not even understood it was a human body!? He could have just seen it as an object? So he's gone about the task he's been told to do.

Or he's has some sort of fantasy/ funny episode where's he's gone of the rails..seen Zoe and gone to get her but she's scared him so adrenaline has taken over, he's then seen Lindsay and attacked her...her being naked could mean it's been sexual.

I just don't know what to think about it all now...it's all very confusing.

All moo obviously

 

[LancashireLad]

The defendant’s pre prepared statement would have been written for him by his legal representative whilst in custody after arrest, on day two. This is based upon what information the defendant has told his legal representative at the time.

I bet his pre prepared statement has caused his defence counsel some headaches. Presumably it wasn’t prepared by his current counsel who I’m sure would have worded it better i.e more believable

 

[HongKongPhooey]

It's very naive to think a 16 year old wouldn't rape an older woman.

Also, rape isnt often about "sex" IMO. Control, rage, impulse yes.

 

[MusicalMonkey]

Well, it's a good job I didn't try and go to court today.

I imagine that the toilets stink as much as the defence's fable.

 

[Tortoise]

I think I have the answer, he would have had to also have an appropriate adult there too, which would more than likely have been a member of his family. There’s his defence, boom!

Which makes me very suspicious because if it was written for him that person would have to have known what evidence they would find and not find, because it's all consistent with the story, before any findings/discovery would have been released by the prosecution.

Even him loitering in the area and clothing matching doesn't prove he did it, because he admits he was there.

moo

 

[Rosegold68]

he's the perfect disguise isn't he?

if someone truly wanted to commit this crime and cover it up, who better for a scapegoat than this lad?

its all so messy

 

[Loulou38]

I'm from the area, I'm new btw to this thread and it's all confusing.. I've reported what I've been told to the police by people who know stuff but nothing was done I don't think. I can't help but think he hasn't acted alone.

 

[Ann Blyth]

Which makes me very suspicious because if it was written for him that person would have to have known what evidence they would find and not find, because it's all consistent with the story, before any findings/discovery would have been released by the prosecution.

Even him loitering in the area and clothing matching doesn't prove he did it, because he admits he was there.

moo

Looks like maybe his “appropriate adult” was not all that appropriate! IMO

 

[Ann Blyth]

I bet his pre prepared statement has caused his defence counsel some headaches. Presumably it wasn’t prepared by his current counsel who I’m sure would have worded it better i.e more believable

It would have been prepared by a legal representative or solicitor whilst he was in custody at the cop shop, not his defence counsel, you’re right, I would hope learned counsel could come up with something better!

 

[MusicalMonkey]

I don't think anyone has highlighted this yet.

But the defendant supposedly agreed to bury a dead body for 'money'.

Yet witnesses from his former schools have both stated 'he didn't understand the value of money'.

 

[Alyce]

11:34am
Mr Fennalls asked the witness: "Did he understand the value of getting paid for a job?"
The witness said: "From my experience he doesn't value money.
"Everything he wanted was provided for him."
He then asked: "Would you say that people who had worked with him over a number of years had never had a proper conversation with him" She replied: "Yes"
Live from court as the Lindsay Birbeck murder trial enters day six

I don't understand why the Defence QC would ask this question. If the accused does not value money then his story of hiding/burying a body in return for being given a large amount of money, does not work.

 

[Alyce]

Which makes me very suspicious because if it was written for him that person would have to have known what evidence they would find and not find, because it's all consistent with the story, before any findings/discovery would have been released by the prosecution.

Even him loitering in the area and clothing matching doesn't prove he did it, because he admits he was there.

moo

Very worrying - would be so good to know who the appropriate adult was.