Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #6

[GeorgeFormby]

Clearly searching the river with potentially more accurate hardware/software is a good thing, there's something about this Peter Faulding guy that I find difficult to stomach though. He talks too much, he's looking for exposure and talking to the public via news interviews. Its a horrible situation, but just go and get on with the f*cking job, instead of saying things like this

“It’s very easy to be an armchair detective in cases like this. I’ve had all sorts of people like psychics contact me about it. I’m going in with an open mind. What we need to do is get on with the job.”

He said that while this kind of work could be emotionally gruelling he had been heartened by the support from the community, including Bulley’s family, that he had received.

“There is a big community effort going on here. The British are great at pulling together in these kinds of situations,” he said.
From the Guardian

Expert diver says he ‘doesn’t think’ Nicola Bulley is in River Wyre

Diver says view is his ‘gut instinct’ as missing woman’s partner says daughters ‘miss their mummy desperately’

www.theguardian.com

If I was using advanced hardware for a job like this, and my main motivation was to help the family either get closure, or rule out a river accident/incident, I would not be talking with the press at all, there's a job of work to be done.

Edited to add - He mentioned 6 person team, so why isn't he spending every minute with that team. He should be talking via the police, if he has to talk about it at all. His motives are somewhat blurred. He needs to run a business, but this sort of thing really riles me. Get the job done, get more business doing that job, stop with the media nonsense.

 

[Blamhappy]

I've noticed a really interesting phenomena and this is a good demonstration of it. Do people honestly believe the police are so inept that they'd not look at the bench for forensics? What is it that gives people the impression they know more than the police? Even though most have never stepped foot in Lancashire, let alone at the crime scene.

It's not a criticism as such, more an interesting observation. I'd love to know what spawned this behaviour.

It happens in every case on Websleuths. People always decide that the police are inept and have concluded too soon and got it wrong. I think it must be human nature. Lots of people on here seem to struggle with the idea thar someone could fall into a river, yet we know that it happens a lot. And lots of people have tried to construct an intricate narrative explaining why she might have been that close to the edge. But it could have been anything. Humans are fallible and life is nuanced.

 

[Themac101]

I mentioned this earlier as on the Angling map for the area it calls this point 'deep hole' . I would imagine this means it is deeper at the point directly below the bench

'Deep hole' in an angling sense doesn't mean its 18ft deep, it likely just means its a deeper hole than others on the stretch controlled by the angling club. Like ive said before, the level the day she went missing was around 0.4M, the hole doesn't have to be so deep to be labelled that. a 4ft hole would be deep in comparison.

 

[Woodburnbay]

Please forgive me if this has already been mentioned. Im struggling to keep up with thread due to the many repetitive comments.

I note that the description of Nicolas clothing broadcast in MSM on the early days of her going missing are stating that her jackets / outer clothing were black and her jeans were black.

However, the doorbell camera stills clearly show that she is wearing Blue olm, ,uterclothing and Blue denim jeans.

This reminds me of the Claudia Lawrence case when police circulated a picture of her with the totally wrong hair colour.

How can this error be made. I appreciate that sometimes navy blue can appear black, but on the doorbell footage, the coat is clearly Blue as are the denims.
n
Can anyone help me on this please?

Source:

Nicola Bulley: First images released of dog walker on day she vanished - as private underwater rescue team joins search

New CCTV pictures from Friday 27 January show her loading her car outside her home before driving her two children to school.

news.sky.com

 

[cottonweaver]

I've noticed a really interesting phenomena and this is a good demonstration of it. Do people honestly believe the police are so inept that they'd not look at the bench for forensics? What is it that gives people the impression they know more than the police? Even though most have never stepped foot in Lancashire, let alone at the crime scene.

It's not a criticism as such, more an interesting observation. I'd love to know what spawned this behaviour.

TBH 3point5 I think there's been some shoddy interviewing which hasn't helped.
I had to turn off my phone notifications cause I was seeing so many ' talking head' clips claiming that the case didn't stack-up, because for example
- that LE had ruled out 3rd party too early ( when they hadn't said that)
- that river drownings happen over dogs but dog was dry so she can't have gone in water ( false, UK data shows not the case)
- phone must be a decoy ( tons of us don't hand-hold our phones on a Teams listen-in)
- body should've been found by now ( research says that's not always the case)
- the investigation is ' a mess'
etc etc

All it takes as an interviewer is to follow-up with the right questions to bust some of this nonsense

 

[cottonweaver]

Clearly searching the river with potentially more accurate hardware/software is a good thing, there's something about this Peter Faulding guy that I find difficult to stomach though. He talks too much, he's looking for exposure and talking to the public via news interviews. Its a horrible situation, but just go and get on with the f*cking job, instead of saying things like this

“It’s very easy to be an armchair detective in cases like this. I’ve had all sorts of people like psychics contact me about it. I’m going in with an open mind. What we need to do is get on with the job.”

He said that while this kind of work could be emotionally gruelling he had been heartened by the support from the community, including Bulley’s family, that he had received.

“There is a big community effort going on here. The British are great at pulling together in these kinds of situations,” he said.
From the Guardian

Expert diver says he ‘doesn’t think’ Nicola Bulley is in River Wyre

Diver says view is his ‘gut instinct’ as missing woman’s partner says daughters ‘miss their mummy desperately’

www.theguardian.com

If I was using advanced hardware for a job like this, and my main motivation was to help the family either get closure, or rule out a river accident/incident, I would not be talking with the press at all, there's a job of work to be done.

Edited to add - He mentioned 6 person team, so why isn't he spending every minute with that team. He should be talking via the police, if he has to talk about it at all. His motives are somewhat blurred. He needs to run a business, but this sort of thing really riles me. Get the job done, get more business doing that job, stop with the media nonsense.

he launched a book he'd written about his life & career, last week.....

 

[RichardKimble]

Please forgive me if this has already been mentioned. Im struggling to keep up with thread due to the many repetitive comments.

I note that the description of Nicolas clothing broadcast in MSM on the early days of her going missing are stating that her jackets / outer clothing were black and her jeans were black.

However, the doorbell camera stills clearly show that she is wearing Blue olm, ,uterclothing and Blue denim jeans.

This reminds me of the Claudia Lawrence case when police circulated a picture of her with the totally wrong hair colour.

How can this error be made. I appreciate that sometimes navy blue can appear black, but on the doorbell footage, the coat is clearly Blue as are the denims.
n
Can anyone help me on this please?

Source:

Nicola Bulley: First images released of dog walker on day she vanished - as private underwater rescue team joins search

New CCTV pictures from Friday 27 January show her loading her car outside her home before driving her two children to school.

news.sky.com

How is it known that her phone was left on the bench at 9:20 ? from the sky article.

Ten minutes later, at 9.20am, her phone was left on a bench by the river. The conference call ended at 9.30am but her phone remained logged into the call.

 

[Moonchild90]

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This is interesting, thought I would share.

IMO maybe it was part of the agreement with LE that his team would join the search but they have to be on the same page with what's been communicated by the police. I doubt it is his personal view JMO.

 

[Normanly]

'Deep hole' in an angling sense doesn't mean its 18ft deep, it likely just means its a deeper hole than others on the stretch controlled by the angling club. Like ive said before, the level the day she went missing was around 0.4M, the hole doesn't have to be so deep to be labelled that. a 4ft hole would be deep in comparison.

Thanks for this. It just stood out to me that they decided to call that part of the river 'deep hole' so they must know it is deeper there than in other parts of the river which may be why NB got into trouble if she did fall in there rather than a shallower part.

 

[JeremyBentham]

Yeah, there is no way you're climbing out the bench side if you've fallen in.

I wonder how easy it would be to get across to the other side which appears to have a much easier bank to climb out of.

I guess it depends on if you'd even consider it as a thought. You'd have to have remained pretty calm to think about it, with the cold and shock factor. I think your immediate thoughts would be to get out at your nearest exit, despite how high and difficult it might have been. Scrambling your arms up to try and grab something, which on that edge looks like mostly grass. All while running out of energy. You might have looked over to the other side or not, but making it over there is another thing.

Quite frightening when you think about it :-(

 

[suzyjackson]

Please forgive me if this has already been mentioned. Im struggling to keep up with thread due to the many repetitive comments.

I note that the description of Nicolas clothing broadcast in MSM on the early days of her going missing are stating that her jackets / outer clothing were black and her jeans were black.

However, the doorbell camera stills clearly show that she is wearing Blue olm, ,uterclothing and Blue denim jeans.

This reminds me of the Claudia Lawrence case when police circulated a picture of her with the totally wrong hair colour.

How can this error be made. I appreciate that sometimes navy blue can appear black, but on the doorbell footage, the coat is clearly Blue as are the denims.
n
Can anyone help me on this please?

Source:

Nicola Bulley: First images released of dog walker on day she vanished - as private underwater rescue team joins search

New CCTV pictures from Friday 27 January show her loading her car outside her home before driving her two children to school.

news.sky.com

Afaik it's been confirmed that the appearance of blue is just on the security/doorcam footage. Everyone agrees that the clothing is black

 

[curiousbeaver]

Just to add a bit of local knowledge. The bottom of the Wyre is sandy silty mud. There are some really treacherous parts with sinking sand on the estuary. I lived a bit downstream of St Michaels near the Wyre and you can see the mud at low tide. I don’t have recent or in depth knowledge of the St Michaels section above the weir but if the river bed is similar there too I can imagine it really sucking you down if you tried to push yourself up…

 

[x44]

So where will we be if the new team finds nowt?

Options will be:
1. She IS there but both the main police and the secondary team failed to find her, Someone will eventually.
2. She WAS there but has been swept out to sea and will be washed up on Blackpool beach in the summer (err nice?)
3. She was never in the river in the first place, which opens up a whole can of unwelcome worms.

 

[GeorgeFormby]

he launched a book he'd written about his life & career, last week.....

He's a PR machine, seen it all before in other industries. If his statements about the family being his number one priority, are true, he needs demonstrate that with actions, not fluttering his eyes at any sh*t rag that's looking to fill their website or newspaper with pointless fillers. I had a guy in to fix a leaking roof the other day, he didn't write a press release about how his priority was to keep my family and home dry, and how the great British public love a water tight roof. He did the job, I paid him, he went home for his dinner.

Edited to add - Perhaps a comment once the work is completed would be appropriate.

 

[3point5]

It happens in every case on Websleuths. People always decide that the police are inept and have concluded too soon and got it wrong. I think it must be human nature. Lots of people on here seem to struggle with the idea thar someone could fall into a river, yet we know that it happens a lot. And lots of people have tried to construct an intricate narrative explaining why she might have been that close to the edge. But it could have been anything. Humans are fallible and life is nuanced.

It's a very strange phenomena. Perhaps I've just never followed a case this closely before to notice it. It must be very disheartening to the police and volunteers that are often putting themselves in harms way to get an answer, only to be told they're doing a s*** job and the public with no training could do better.

I do get it, people don't want her to be dead. None of us do. And if we admit the police hypothesis is likely, then we must also admit that her passing is likely.

It's a heartbreaking case all around, but I do hope some people take a step back at the end of it and think how disparaging some of the comments must be to those involved. Especially the dive team that have been putting themselves in danger for 10 days straight, only to be told they've done a job and a new team will do better.

TBH 3point5 I think there's been some shoddy interviewing which hasn't helped.
I had to turn off my phone notifications cause I was seeing so many ' talking head' clips claiming that the case didn't stack-up, because for example
- that LE had ruled out 3rd party too early ( when they hadn't said that)
- that river drownings happen over dogs but dog was dry so she can't have gone in water ( false, UK data shows not the case)
- phone must be a decoy ( tons of us don't hand-hold our phones on a Teams listen-in)
- body should've been found by now ( research says that's not always the case)
- the investigation is ' a mess'
etc etc

All it takes as an interviewer is to follow-up with the right questions to bust some of this nonsense

Thank you. I think that's a very good point. If people only followed the police press conferences then I agree a lot of the speculation would never have arisen in the first place. A lot of the inconsistencies to me seem more down to press jumping the gun than they do bad police info.

 

[WestLondoner]

This may have been talked through in some of the pages of previous threads on this, so apologies if so, but I have a question. If someone has fallen in a river, you know exactly where and at what tide state etc, but you can't find them - why can't you put an object of similar size, weight and buoyancy into the same water at the same tide state, and observe where it goes over time?

You could even do a sort of Monte Carlo analysis and do it dozens of times to see what the "usual" or "modal" result is. If you do it 50 times and the object ends up in 50 different places that's no help, but if it ends up in the same place half of the time that's where you'd focus.

Obviously as you're doing this in real time 10 days ex post, at best you'll find out where any body in the water might have been 10 days ago. Right now, however, that may still be of some help.

Or is this completely stupid?

 

[PandaMarch]

How is it known that her phone was left on the bench at 9:20 ? from the sky article.

Ten minutes later, at 9.20am, her phone was left on a bench by the river. The conference call ended at 9.30am but her phone remained logged into the call.

phone data police have looked at. Stated in press conference, good idea to watch that

 

[PandaMarch]

This may have been talked through in some of the pages of previous threads on this, so apologies if so, but I have a question. If someone has fallen in a river, you know exactly where and at what tide state etc, but you can't find them - why can't you put an object of similar size, weight and buoyancy into the same water at the same tide state, and observe where it goes over time?

You could even do a sort of Monte Carlo analysis and do it dozens of times to see what the "usual" or "modal" result is. If you do it 50 times and the object ends up in 50 different places that's no help, but if it ends up in the same place half of the time that's where you'd focus.

Obviously as you're doing this in real time 10 days ex post, at best you'll find out where any body in the water might have been 10 days ago. Right now, however, that may still be of some help.

Or is this completely stupid?

covered in press conference Friday, good idea to watch

 

[LuluR38]

do you have a link for found in the floor p!ease? I was quoting from the police press conference

If you listen to the police conference she corrects herself as well and other articles also state found ‘at’ a bench so is this another unclear point, was the phone on the floor also and placed on the bench. This was shared on Twitter as reported from @LancsLive … I’ll try to find the main link to the article.

 

[L_M_H]

This may have been talked through in some of the pages of previous threads on this, so apologies if so, but I have a question. If someone has fallen in a river, you know exactly where and at what tide state etc, but you can't find them - why can't you put an object of similar size, weight and buoyancy into the same water at the same tide state, and observe where it goes over time?

You could even do a sort of Monte Carlo analysis and do it dozens of times to see what the "usual" or "modal" result is. If you do it 50 times and the object ends up in 50 different places that's no help, but if it ends up in the same place half of the time that's where you'd focus.

Obviously as you're doing this in real time 10 days ex post, at best you'll find out where any body in the water might have been 10 days ago. Right now, however, that may still be of some help.

Or is this completely stupid?

Sounds like a good idea to me.