UK - Nurse Lucy Letby Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #12

[magikarpmagikarp]

I'm not sure this questioning about trauma or bleeding has been explained.

Yes, there is a lot of emphasis on whether or not bleeding was seen. I am curious why.

 

[Marantz4250b]

well it happened 2 years after she was no longer doing nursing, and a couple of months before her arrest. She apparently remembered the baby despite her only being in the hospital for a matter of hours before LL went off shift, and not being her designated nurse.

The defence has said she also searched parents of babies not included in the charges, but I'm not sure when that stopped.

I'm not sure that's a correct assumption; the chances are she may have been spoken to as a witness by the police before arrest, or had been speaking to other people or heard stuff through the grapevine about which babies were involved. Seems a no brainer to arrive at the conclusion that she would likely be researching those involved, especially as it would probably have become obvious she was a suspect, guilty or not.

I would be!

All MOO

 

[DinerMite]

So Baby K had trauma to the throat like other babies in this trial had? Defense seem to suggest it was intubation trauma whereas prosecution are going for a malicious attack....I think?

 

[Dotta]

I'm not sure that's a correct assumption; the chances are she may have been spoken to as a witness by the police before arrest, or had been speaking to other people or heard stuff through the grapevine about which babies were involved. Seems a no brainer to arrive at the conclusion that she would likely be researching those involved, especially as it would probably have become obvious she was a suspect, guilty or not.

I would be!

All MOO

She checked FB of Babies' parents all the time, and looong before the arrest.

Oh, and kept documents concerning the Babies UNDER HER BED for 2 years

JMO

 

[DianaWW]

I was wondering if the reason for her just searching the surname was because she didn’t get to know these parents, they weren’t there long enough before being transferred out, so she could only remember the surname perhaps. With the other searches, we were told she’d specifically search for the parents, either the Mum, Dad, or both. JMO.

 

[esther43]

Ok, that is potentially interesting. She just searched the “surname”, not the full name of the parent(s). When they said searching the names, I assumed she was searching full names (eg “Malcolm tucker”, not just “tucker” so that there was fairly little doubt about the individual who she was looking for.

But given that it is a common surname in the Midlands and northern part of England, I wonder how they can be sure that she was searching for baby k’s parents?

More likely that she doesn't even remember the mother's first name because she wasn't interested in the Mother at all. She just wanted to see what she was saying about child KS death on FB.
Jmo

 

[Dotta]

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[WaxLyrical]

I'm not sure that's a correct assumption; the chances are she may have been spoken to as a witness by the police before arrest, or had been speaking to other people or heard stuff through the grapevine about which babies were involved. Seems a no brainer to arrive at the conclusion that she would likely be researching those involved, especially as it would probably have become obvious she was a suspect, guilty or not.

I would be!

All MOO

This would be my instinct too. If no other searches for this baby’s family were carried out, and it was so close to the time of the first arrest. She was already aware of what was going on and the allegations (side note: I wonder what date she wrote that post it note). JMO.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Lucy Letby: Baby girl's breathing tube interfered with, trial told

Nurse Lucy Letby is accused of dislodging the baby girl's breathing tube two hours after her birth.

www.bbc.com

 

[Tortoise]

I'm not sure that's a correct assumption; the chances are she may have been spoken to as a witness by the police before arrest, or had been speaking to other people or heard stuff through the grapevine about which babies were involved. Seems a no brainer to arrive at the conclusion that she would likely be researching those involved, especially as it would probably have become obvious she was a suspect, guilty or not.

I would be!

All MOO

This was the only one we've been told she researched at that time though. I think she might have used that explanation to police if there was a valid reason. IMO

"Letby was found to have researched Child K's parents on Facebook in April 2018 - two years and two months after Child K had died. When asked about this, she said she did not recall doing so."
Recap: Prosecution opens trial of Lucy Letby accused of Countess of Chester Hospital baby murders

 

[Tortoise]

4:08pm

The next witness to give evidence is Joanne Williams, who was employed as a neonatal nurse at the Countess of Chester Hospital. She has returned to give evidence in respect of Child K.
She confirms she was working a night shift that night. She remembers Child K being born, and being on that night shift.
She remembers being called through at the birth of Child K, and recalls her being born at 25 weeks gestation. She said the delivery happened at the Countess, and Child K would be transferred later to a tertiary centre.
Ms Williams remembers Child K being bruised on her feet, which was not unusual a sight, as she had seen that in the past.
Immediate resuscitation was provided and Child K was intubated.

4:22pm

An observation chart is shown to the court for 'Baby Girl', as Child K had yet to be named.
Child K was on a ventilator for 45 breaths a minute when she was on the neonatal unit room 1.
As designated nurse, Ms Williams confirms she would check to make sure the ventilator was secure for Child K.

4:24pm

The oxygen saturation reading for Child K of 70% at 2.45am would be considered 'low', while the 94% reading at 3.30am was 'normal' and 'improved'.
The prosecution say that would be indicative the ventilator was working as it should be.

5:02pm

Here is a round-up story from today:
Lucy Letby: Nurse ‘tried to murder baby within two hours of her birth’

5:03pm

That concludes our coverage from the trial today.
We will be bringing further live coverage updates from the trial tomorrow (Tuesday, February 28).

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, February 27

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

This is a trial discussion thread to discuss trial testimony; it is sub judice to post opinions suggesting guilt or innocence of the accused.

Unless there is evidence or suggestion by the defence at trial that incompetence or lack of proper monitoring or care by staff is responsible, it is sub judice and off topic in this discussion.

 

[GoodDayToYouSir]

More likely that she doesn't even remember the mother's first name because she wasn't interested in the Mother at all. She just wanted to see what she was saying about child KS death on FB.
Jmo

She seems to have remembered both the mother’s name and the father’s name in other cases where she is charged , so I don’t know why baby k would be different.

 

[Anxala]

I'm not sure that's a correct assumption; the chances are she may have been spoken to as a witness by the police before arrest, or had been speaking to other people or heard stuff through the grapevine about which babies were involved. Seems a no brainer to arrive at the conclusion that she would likely be researching those involved, especially as it would probably have become obvious she was a suspect, guilty or not.

I would be!

All MOO

I certainly would be too if I thought I was suspected of carrying out such heinous crimes. I'd be using every source available to me to gather info.

It's impossible imo to assign with any certainty motivation to LL when we still really know next to nothing about her. It's so odd to me that she remains so elusive, nearly 5 months in.

I really hope the next stage of the trial puts some helpful meat on the bones of this woman at the epicentre of it.

 

[Dotta]

IMO, IF GUILTY

The searching of FB parents of Babies was the ritual, something to help to relive "certain moments" and gloat.
I guess, she knew the first names and surnames of parents very well, and checked SM many, many times.

The long time, even 2 years do NOT matter.
After all, the hospital documents seemed to stay with her forever -
that is TILL Police took them away.

That is typical for certain criminals (SK), who treat their victims as their "possessions" and jealously guard "souvenirs".

Everything has already been seen and described many, many times.

Nothing new under the Sun.

My Opinion Only

 

[ColourPurple]

She seems to have remembered both the mother’s name and the father’s name in other cases where she is charged , so I don’t know why baby k would be different.

The main difference with Baby K is that she died a couple of days after leaving the Countess. Which is apparently why they always had an alternative charge of attempted murder as well as murder for her. I won't link to the articles that say this as they all name the babies too. Though I will say I live in one of the areas where you said the surname is a common one and I'd never even heard of it before let alone know anybody with it. So IMO it's not the same as her having searched something common like Smith, Jones, Singh, Khan etc, like you'd suggested previously.

 

[marynnu]

One thing that has remained in the back of my mind throughout this is that 15 babies died in a period where they normally lost 2 or 3.

Letby is being charged for 7 of them, but that still leaves a situation where there were double/triple the number of deaths on that ward, which they cannot pin on Letby. That still feels like a very significant spike.

I truly hope the jury is going to be provided with the wider context on those deaths, I assume all of them were explainable and not down to failures of care, and not just that Letby wasn’t around for them.

JMO.

Just to say, we can't assume LL wasn't there - or was, for that matter!

 

[ColourPurple]

4:08pm

The next witness to give evidence is Joanne Williams, who was employed as a neonatal nurse at the Countess of Chester Hospital. She has returned to give evidence in respect of Child K.
She confirms she was working a night shift that night. She remembers Child K being born, and being on that night shift.
She remembers being called through at the birth of Child K, and recalls her being born at 25 weeks gestation. She said the delivery happened at the Countess, and Child K would be transferred later to a tertiary centre.
Ms Williams remembers Child K being bruised on her feet, which was not unusual a sight, as she had seen that in the past.
Immediate resuscitation was provided and Child K was intubated.

4:22pm

An observation chart is shown to the court for 'Baby Girl', as Child K had yet to be named.
Child K was on a ventilator for 45 breaths a minute when she was on the neonatal unit room 1.
As designated nurse, Ms Williams confirms she would check to make sure the ventilator was secure for Child K.

4:24pm

The oxygen saturation reading for Child K of 70% at 2.45am would be considered 'low', while the 94% reading at 3.30am was 'normal' and 'improved'.
The prosecution say that would be indicative the ventilator was working as it should be.

5:02pm

Here is a round-up story from today:
Lucy Letby: Nurse ‘tried to murder baby within two hours of her birth’

5:03pm

That concludes our coverage from the trial today.
We will be bringing further live coverage updates from the trial tomorrow (Tuesday, February 28).

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Monday, February 27

Thanks for all the updates!. It's great having more detailed info though I think I'd got used to being able to do a quick catch up of the days events lol

 

[Tortoise]

Thanks for all the updates!. It's great having more detailed info though I think I'd got used to being able to do a quick catch up of the days events lol

Chester Standard is there again tomorrow too!

 

[Dotta]

Chester Standard is there again tomorrow too!

I guess as "Chester" media they have certain duties to the citizens of this place, no?
Local media should be the first to report matters important to their local readers.

This is the point of their very existence, isn't it?


JMO