I'm not sure if the doctor who went off to boil the kettle might be the same one she is saying went off for cigarettes.
I believe also the same doctor she says is part of the gang of four.
I'm not certain but I think so.
JMO
UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #24
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I believe also the same doctor she says is part of the gang of four.
I'm not certain but I think so.
JMO
I didn’t reveal any confidential information, but when I was asked by a colleague I knew - as a friend - in another department to be their observer in a disciplinary process I did so because I felt that they must be innocent. I got far too invested in it emotionally and it caused me a great deal of stress. I was not thinking straight for a while.
After a while it became clear that the complaint was more than justified and I was really upset at being played in the manner I had been.
I suspect Dr Choc felt / feels the same and I pity him.
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Like a catalogue of potential victims. IMO she clearly has kept them for a reason. She claims that they were insignificant to her and so insignificant that she apparently forgot she had them, didn’t even jog her memory when she added yet another one to the bag for life or box marked ‘keep’. I think there is something very significant about them IMO. When you own a shredder and manage to shred bank statements ‘immediately’ but don’t think about disposing of a collection of hundreds of handover sheets then they hold some significance IMO. Trying to down play them as ‘just bits of paper’ or saying they ‘never crossed your mind’ fuels my belief even more so that they are relevant and hold some purpose.
MOO
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Now that I think about it, Meyers has said that LL looked up other families, besides her victimised families, on Facebook before---using that as a defense showing there was nothing nefarious about looking up the victims parents on FB.
But maybe she used the handovers to look at future potential victims, and looked up the parents on FB, to help her decide?
Well, I had to google it!
Can someone remind me what the nature of the liver injury was please? Was it lacerated and was the cause blunt force trauma? Also to those with medical knowledge - would a nurse of her level know exactly what to do to cause injury? Thanks in advance12:28pm
In police interview, Letby said she believed she had done chest compressions and drew up some drugs. Letby says after looking at records, she now believes she was just involved in medications.
Mr Johnson suggests Letby is distancing herself from the CPR so it could not be said she caused the liver injury to Child O. Letby denies this.
Letby says she "does not know" how Child O got the liver injury.
Letby denies injecting air into Child O to cause an air embolous, or inflicting a liver injury on him.
NJ: "These things all happened on your watch, didn't they?"
LL: "Yes."
Letby says she disputes an account that Dr Brearey told her not to come in after that shift.
NJ: "Were you bothered by what you witnessed?"
LL: "Of course I was bothered."
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…www.chesterstandard.co.uk
My heart breaks for every single one of these families effected by this. So unbelievably harrowing to hear, least of all to have to relive this. I really hope (whatever the outcome) that justice will be served. I cant imagine how these parents, their families and in time to come, their siblings growing up without their twin/triplet, the jury too, must all be feeling. Just Unimaginable.
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I especially feel for the family of baby O and P, their parents today having to listen to how after allegedly killing their baby someone then allegedly gave another one of their babies air before swiping out of the unit ready to come back the next day to watch their world fall apart, must be absolutely horrific. They lost 2 babies within 24 hours, and then learned that their babies were allegedly murdered by the person they’d trusted to care for them. I wouldn’t blame them if they couldn’t sit through todays evidence, it’s hard enough just reading the updates I can’t imagine what the parents must be going through.
I know nothing of such matters, but is it possible he could be struck off for this?
12:53pm
Mr Johnson turns to the case of Child P, triplet brother of Child O.
Letby, in her defence statement, denies hurting Child P. She said she did not recall having an argument with nursing colleague Kathryn Percival-Ward about working in room 1.
She said she was in conversation with student nurse Rebecca Morgan when Child P collapsed.
She said it was "chaotic" with all the staff arriving to resuscitate, and Child P was too poorly to be transferred to room 1, so was kept in room 2.
Child P's stomach was 'red'.
She says at some stage she pricked herself with a cannula needle and needed to go to A&E for treatment.
While there, she said she fainted, she believed due to stress at the time of the past few days, and had not eaten.
She said she had 'forgotten' she had taken a handover sheet home with her.
12:59pm
An examination of Child P at 10am on June 23, 2016 was "unremarkable", the court hears. Letby accepts that. She adds there was nothing of note during the day.
Mr Johnson suggests Child P worsened after Child O passed away. Letby agrees.
A 6pm feed for Child P is signed by Letby, and she says the writing above is not by her.
Dr John Gibbs had reported in his 6pm review for Child P that the baby boy was doing well. A blood sample taken at 6.35pm taken to a lab showed no signs of infection.
Letby denies overfeeding Child P 'at some point' between 5pm-8pm on June 23.
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
Mr Johnson turns to the case of Child P, triplet brother of Child O.
Letby, in her defence statement, denies hurting Child P. She said she did not recall having an argument with nursing colleague Kathryn Percival-Ward about working in room 1.
She said she was in conversation with student nurse Rebecca Morgan when Child P collapsed.
She said it was "chaotic" with all the staff arriving to resuscitate, and Child P was too poorly to be transferred to room 1, so was kept in room 2.
Child P's stomach was 'red'.
She says at some stage she pricked herself with a cannula needle and needed to go to A&E for treatment.
While there, she said she fainted, she believed due to stress at the time of the past few days, and had not eaten.
She said she had 'forgotten' she had taken a handover sheet home with her.
12:59pm
An examination of Child P at 10am on June 23, 2016 was "unremarkable", the court hears. Letby accepts that. She adds there was nothing of note during the day.
Mr Johnson suggests Child P worsened after Child O passed away. Letby agrees.
A 6pm feed for Child P is signed by Letby, and she says the writing above is not by her.
Dr John Gibbs had reported in his 6pm review for Child P that the baby boy was doing well. A blood sample taken at 6.35pm taken to a lab showed no signs of infection.
Letby denies overfeeding Child P 'at some point' between 5pm-8pm on June 23.
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
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No idea but to my mind, anyone who 'goes rogue' in a strictly hierarchical organisation that people's lives depend on - military, police, NHS - is putting innocent people's lives directly at risk and therefore has no place in such an institution.
JMO
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Why would a nurse need to go to A&E for a needlestick incident?
Interesting because I too am considering if it’s the same person (re cigarette and the kettle/tea room). Moo
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Dr Dewi Evans, Prosecution Expert WitnessCan someone remind me what the nature of the liver injury was please? Was it lacerated and was the cause blunt force trauma? Also to those with medical knowledge - would a nurse of her level know exactly what to do to cause injury? Thanks in advance
[...] Medical expert Dr Dewi Evans told the court Child O's death was a result of an intravenous air injection and trauma to his liver, which caused an internal bleed.
[...]
Dr Evans ruled out CPR being a cause for the liver bleed, saying that the chest compressions needed by Child O on 23 June were "carried out by experienced doctors" and "doesn't get near the liver".
Lucy Letby: Baby triplet died after trauma to liver, jury told
Nurse Lucy Letby is accused of killing the baby triplet after returning from a holiday in Ibiza.www.bbc.co.uk
r Evans said that inflicted trauma to the liver took place at some point and an amount of air was put down the infant’s nasogastric tube which caused vomiting and swelling to his stomach.
Mr Myers said: “I suggest that vigorous chest compressions can cause or are capable of causing internal injuries to the liver.”
Dr Evans replied: “I have never seen it.”
Dr Sandie Bohin, Prosecution Expert Witness
Fellow expert witness, neonatologist Dr Sandie Bohin, said she too had never seen liver damage from CPR.
She told the court she concluded that injections of air “with no innocent cause” were responsible for Child O’s “unexpected” deterioration.
Dr Bohin said the small discoloured mark observed on Child O’s right chest wall was more probably due to an injection of air rather than liver trauma
Baby allegedly murdered by nurse Lucy Letby was injected with air, court told
Just to clarify, I know doc kettle is one of the gang of four, the only thing I'm not sure about is if she's also the smoker.
Sausage777
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Hospital policy, get your bloods checked and whomever else is involved.
2:22pm
The cross-examination continues in the case of Child P.
Letby agrees there were 'no problems' at the time of the handover for Child P on the night of June 23. She recalls the x-ray taken shortly after that handover.
The x-ray report said: 'NG tube in satisfactory position...gas-filled bowel loops throughout the abdomen, through to the lower rectum, with no evidence of obstruction and no plain film signs of perforation'
Letby denies pumping Child P with air.
She agrees this was a deterioration for Child P.
Medical expert witness Dr Owen Arthurs had previously told the court this image was "quite unusual" for a baby of that gestation.
Letby says she cannot comment how the gas got there, only that she did not put it there.
2:24pm
A 14ml aspirate is recorded for Child P at the time of handover at 8pm.
NJ: "That was your doing, wasn't it?"
LL: "No."
NJ: "On your way home, you were sowing the seeds with your colleagues?" Mr Johnson refers to the 'Worry as identical' text message Letby had sent. "You were feeding a false narrative, trying to divert attention away from your homicidal activites?"
LL: "No."
2:32pm
5ml of air and 2ml of milk is aspirated from Child P at 7am.
"How much milk had [Child P] been fed overnight?"
Letby said Child P had been fed prior to midnight. She says if the NG Tube is in the stomach, air would come out.
Letby disagrees that Child P was well at the morning handover time, as Child P was 'nil by mouth'.
A police interview had earlier said Letby saying Child P was stable and well.
Mr Johnson suggests Letby is deliberately making the appearance of Child P worse now than at the time she gave her police interview.
LL: "No."
2:34pm
The day shift for June 24 is shown to the court. Student nurse Rebecca Morgan is on the rota. Lucy Letby is the designated nurse for Child P in room 2. The other surviving triplet is also in room 2, with designated nurse Christopher Booth. Child Q is in room 1 with two other babies. Three babies are in room 3, and three babies are in room 4.
2:36pm
Letby rules out staffing levels as a contributory factor in Child P's collapse and death.
She also rules out staffing mistakes.
She says there were "some issues with the chest drain", but "cannot say" how much of an effect that had on Child P.
2:40pm
By 0639, Sophie Ellis’ nursing note recorded that “abdo has been soft and non distended. 25ml of air aspirated by SNP Kate Ward. NGT placed on free drainage”.
Mr Johnson says Letby created a false nursing note at 8am to say: "...abdomen full - loops visible, soft to touch." He says that is not the picture from 6.39am.
Letby agrees that is not the same as Sophie Ellis' note.
Sophie Ellis's note for June 23 for Child O: 'Abdo looks full slightly loopy...abdo soft.'
Letby says her observation for Child P that morning was what she saw. She informed a doctor an hour later about the abdomen observation. She denies a suggestion by Mr Johnson that she is lying.
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
The cross-examination continues in the case of Child P.
Letby agrees there were 'no problems' at the time of the handover for Child P on the night of June 23. She recalls the x-ray taken shortly after that handover.
The x-ray report said: 'NG tube in satisfactory position...gas-filled bowel loops throughout the abdomen, through to the lower rectum, with no evidence of obstruction and no plain film signs of perforation'
Letby denies pumping Child P with air.
She agrees this was a deterioration for Child P.
Medical expert witness Dr Owen Arthurs had previously told the court this image was "quite unusual" for a baby of that gestation.
Letby says she cannot comment how the gas got there, only that she did not put it there.
2:24pm
A 14ml aspirate is recorded for Child P at the time of handover at 8pm.
NJ: "That was your doing, wasn't it?"
LL: "No."
NJ: "On your way home, you were sowing the seeds with your colleagues?" Mr Johnson refers to the 'Worry as identical' text message Letby had sent. "You were feeding a false narrative, trying to divert attention away from your homicidal activites?"
LL: "No."
2:32pm
5ml of air and 2ml of milk is aspirated from Child P at 7am.
"How much milk had [Child P] been fed overnight?"
Letby said Child P had been fed prior to midnight. She says if the NG Tube is in the stomach, air would come out.
Letby disagrees that Child P was well at the morning handover time, as Child P was 'nil by mouth'.
A police interview had earlier said Letby saying Child P was stable and well.
Mr Johnson suggests Letby is deliberately making the appearance of Child P worse now than at the time she gave her police interview.
LL: "No."
2:34pm
The day shift for June 24 is shown to the court. Student nurse Rebecca Morgan is on the rota. Lucy Letby is the designated nurse for Child P in room 2. The other surviving triplet is also in room 2, with designated nurse Christopher Booth. Child Q is in room 1 with two other babies. Three babies are in room 3, and three babies are in room 4.
2:36pm
Letby rules out staffing levels as a contributory factor in Child P's collapse and death.
She also rules out staffing mistakes.
She says there were "some issues with the chest drain", but "cannot say" how much of an effect that had on Child P.
2:40pm
By 0639, Sophie Ellis’ nursing note recorded that “abdo has been soft and non distended. 25ml of air aspirated by SNP Kate Ward. NGT placed on free drainage”.
Mr Johnson says Letby created a false nursing note at 8am to say: "...abdomen full - loops visible, soft to touch." He says that is not the picture from 6.39am.
Letby agrees that is not the same as Sophie Ellis' note.
Sophie Ellis's note for June 23 for Child O: 'Abdo looks full slightly loopy...abdo soft.'
Letby says her observation for Child P that morning was what she saw. She informed a doctor an hour later about the abdomen observation. She denies a suggestion by Mr Johnson that she is lying.
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
2:48pm
Letby says she escalated the observation to the shift leader.
Mr Johnson asks if Letby knew what she was telling her friend, the doctor, at this point. Letby does not recall.
The message shown to the court, sent at 8.04am: 'I've got [child] and [Child P], [Child P] has stopped feeds as large asps.'
Mr Johnson asks why Letby is lying about having the first child, whose designated nurse was Christopher Booth. Letby says she would have to check the paperwork, as she may have been assisting.
Letby's follow-up message, at 8.19am: '...I'm ok, just don't want to be here really. Hoping I may get the new admissions...'
Mr Johnson asks why Letby didn't raise it with the doctor colleague who was coming into work.
Letby says the doctor was not present in the neonatal unit that day. He went to the children's ward.
Letby denies the observation was a 'fabrication' as Dr Anthony Ukoh saw loops as well.
She said the context of 'don't want to be here really' was what she had seen earlier with Child O.
Mr Johnson refers to Dr Ukoh's note of observation at 9.35am: 'Abdomen moderately distended/bloated; soft'. Mr Johnson says there is no mention of loopy bowels. Letby: "No."
Letby says Dr Ukoh might not have recorded it.
NJ: "Or you have misrecorded it."
LL: "No."
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
Letby says she escalated the observation to the shift leader.
Mr Johnson asks if Letby knew what she was telling her friend, the doctor, at this point. Letby does not recall.
The message shown to the court, sent at 8.04am: 'I've got [child] and [Child P], [Child P] has stopped feeds as large asps.'
Mr Johnson asks why Letby is lying about having the first child, whose designated nurse was Christopher Booth. Letby says she would have to check the paperwork, as she may have been assisting.
Letby's follow-up message, at 8.19am: '...I'm ok, just don't want to be here really. Hoping I may get the new admissions...'
Mr Johnson asks why Letby didn't raise it with the doctor colleague who was coming into work.
Letby says the doctor was not present in the neonatal unit that day. He went to the children's ward.
Letby denies the observation was a 'fabrication' as Dr Anthony Ukoh saw loops as well.
She said the context of 'don't want to be here really' was what she had seen earlier with Child O.
Mr Johnson refers to Dr Ukoh's note of observation at 9.35am: 'Abdomen moderately distended/bloated; soft'. Mr Johnson says there is no mention of loopy bowels. Letby: "No."
Letby says Dr Ukoh might not have recorded it.
NJ: "Or you have misrecorded it."
LL: "No."
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
2:54pm
Within a few minutes of Dr Ukoh reviewing Child P, Child P collapsed.
NJ: "That has to be your doing, doesn't it?"
LL: "No."
Mr Johnson says Rebecca Morgan's evidence was Letby had left the room at the time of collapse.
Letby says from her recollection, she was in the room, and is "quite clear" on that.
Letby's note for the desaturation: '...[Child P] had an apnoea, brady, desat with mottled appearance requiring facial oxygen and Neopuff for approx 1min. Abdomen becoming distended.'
Mr Johnson says the note is deliberately written to make it look like the Neopuffing made the abdomen become more distended.
Letby agrees.
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
Within a few minutes of Dr Ukoh reviewing Child P, Child P collapsed.
NJ: "That has to be your doing, doesn't it?"
LL: "No."
Mr Johnson says Rebecca Morgan's evidence was Letby had left the room at the time of collapse.
Letby says from her recollection, she was in the room, and is "quite clear" on that.
Letby's note for the desaturation: '...[Child P] had an apnoea, brady, desat with mottled appearance requiring facial oxygen and Neopuff for approx 1min. Abdomen becoming distended.'
Mr Johnson says the note is deliberately written to make it look like the Neopuffing made the abdomen become more distended.
Letby agrees.
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
2:57pm
Dr Ukoh, the court is told, gave evidence to say Child P was in a very different condition between 9.35am and 9.40am.
He also said Letby was "very keen" for the doctor colleague to be called. Letby says this was because he had been present for Child O's deterioration. She adds it was one of the other doctors who suggested getting that doctor.
NJ: "Were you trying to attract [the doctor's] attention?"
LL: "No."
NJ: "Did you enjoy being in these crisis situations with [the doctor]?"
LL: "No....[doctor colleague] and I were friends.
NJ: "Something to share?"
LL: "No."
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
Dr Ukoh, the court is told, gave evidence to say Child P was in a very different condition between 9.35am and 9.40am.
He also said Letby was "very keen" for the doctor colleague to be called. Letby says this was because he had been present for Child O's deterioration. She adds it was one of the other doctors who suggested getting that doctor.
NJ: "Were you trying to attract [the doctor's] attention?"
LL: "No."
NJ: "Did you enjoy being in these crisis situations with [the doctor]?"
LL: "No....[doctor colleague] and I were friends.
NJ: "Something to share?"
LL: "No."
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 8 - cross-examination continues
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
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