UK UK - Penny Bell, 43, Ealing, London, 6 June 1991

[davidt]

I've always suspected that two people were involved. One had a car/ van already parked in a pre selected secluded spot in the car park, which the perp knew about. As Penny's car approached the pre parked car/van. It pulls out of the space to allow Penny's car in. After the attack, the perp gets into the pre parked car/van and is driven away. This would also help to explain why nobody bloodstained was seen leaving the scene. IMO.

The idea of an accomplice does have merit. We don't know if the leisure centre car park was specifically chosen or not. If it was then on his own the killer would have no control over what spaces were available. If he'd parked his own vehicle there earlier he'd have no way of ensuring there would be a space anywhere near it when he returned in Penny's car. An accomplice effectively reserving a space does make sense.

 

[greenwoodlad]

The idea of an accomplice does have merit. We don't know if the leisure centre car park was specifically chosen or not. If it was then on his own the killer would have no control over what spaces were available. If he'd parked his own vehicle there earlier he'd have no way of ensuring there would be a space anywhere near it when he returned in Penny's car. An accomplice effectively reserving a space does make sense.

This makes a lot of sense. I think the Leisure Centre Car Park would have to be chosen ...the killer would need to know the area would be quiet at that time of day....could the killer even have been someone who knew that car park well?..... maybe attended the leisure centre themselves so they knew it would be a quiet place at that time?

 

[tes1984]

This makes a lot of sense. I think the Leisure Centre Car Park would have to be chosen ...the killer would need to know the area would be quiet at that time of day....could the killer even have been someone who knew that car park well?..... maybe attended the leisure centre themselves so they knew it would be a quiet place at that time?

The Leisure Centre wasn't quiet at that time of day though, so a very risky choice if it was a planned murder.

We also don't know if Penny arrived at the Leisure Centre alone, or if someone was in the car with her.

A Leisure Centre car park wouldn't be a bad meeting place for a slightly dodgy business chat, or an exchange of cash, but I'm not sure about anyone selecting it in advance as a murder scene.

The murder itself was drawn out. The murderer went crazy, above and beyond what was needed to kill the victim. If it was a planned murder, disguised as murder by lunatic, then the killer(s) got extremely lucky not to be spotted in such a busy environment.

 

[davidt]

Yep, the murder itself looked frenzied and out of control rather than a calculated killing. Possibly an accomplice may have been there but not on the basis of a killing take place. Perhaps something to do with the £8,500 and something went wrong. The killing itself does look like something that happened on the spur of the moment. Perhaps some sort of prearranged meeting. Seems so many possibilities in this case.

 

[bluestsocks]

The $8500 is one of those tantalizing clues that could mean everything or nothing. It could be directly related to the motive, or it could be completely irrelevant. A lot of posts here discuss how it could be relevant, so I thought I’d mention ideas that popped into my head of how it could be irrelevant.

Maybe she decided to do something else to the house and her original appointment was to drop off the money with another company and sign a contract for it, and when she never showed up, the contractor didn’t put the two together, and her killer took it just because it was there and why not take 20k worth of funds if he’s already killed her?

Maybe same scenario, but she gave it to the contractor the day before and he was unscrupulous and never reported it because he wanted to keep the money.

 

[Terryb808]

The $8500 is one of those tantalizing clues that could mean everything or nothing. It could be directly related to the motive, or it could be completely irrelevant. A lot of posts here discuss how it could be relevant, so I thought I’d mention ideas that popped into my head of how it could be irrelevant.

Maybe she decided to do something else to the house and her original appointment was to drop off the money with another company and sign a contract for it, and when she never showed up, the contractor didn’t put the two together, and her killer took it just because it was there and why not take 20k worth of funds if he’s already killed her?

Maybe same scenario, but she gave it to the contractor the day before and he was unscrupulous and never reported it because he wanted to keep the money.

Very possible, I’ve read on previous post that the £8.5k wasn’t actually seen on the day she was murdered.
It was (shown in the police reconstruction sticking out of her bag), most likely to make the point that the money was unaccounted for.
To be honest the murder has deep hatred written all over it. No hitman would pick a busy leisure centre car park to commit a murder, that just doesn’t make any sense.

 

[Tombel]

Yep, the murder itself looked frenzied and out of control rather than a calculated killing. Possibly an accomplice may have been there but not on the basis of a killing take place. Perhaps something to do with the £8,500 and something went wrong. The killing itself does look like something that happened on the spur of the moment. Perhaps some sort of prearranged meeting. Seems so many possibilities in this case.

The actual killing does seem to have been very frenzied. However, it might not have been intended as a murder to begin with. It might have been blackmail or a slightly less than above board business deal. Penny seems to have been stressed from at least the time she was seen driving slowly towards the centre that morning. Once they got to the centre carpark it might have become clear to Penny that this situation was out of her control. Within the close confines of the two front seats of the car, and with Penny fighting for her life, possibly holding the wallpaper samples in an attempt to protect herself. Once the stabbing started it may have been a mixture of panic and anger on the part of the perp as he was unable to strike a fatal blow.
The fact that they went to the drivers side to continue, suggests either uncontrolled frenzy, or a need to finish poor Penny off, as she may have still been showing signs of life. Of course, if there were two people involved, could it be possible that the other person carried out the stabbing from the drivers side. Both then getting into the pre parked car and departing. It would take two identical knives, or the original perp passing their knife to their accomplice. The car park was busy that day, however nobody saw or heard anything out of the ordinary. So the location must have been quite isolated. It's all speculation, but worth considering given how little evidence there actually is.

 

[davidt]

The actual killing does seem to have been very frenzied. However, it might not have been intended as a murder to begin with. It might have been blackmail or a slightly less than above board business deal. Penny seems to have been stressed from at least the time she was seen driving slowly towards the centre that morning. Once they got to the centre carpark it might have become clear to Penny that this situation was out of her control. Within the close confines of the two front seats of the car, and with Penny fighting for her life, possibly holding the wallpaper samples in an attempt to protect herself. Once the stabbing started it may have been a mixture of panic and anger on the part of the perp as he was unable to strike a fatal blow.
The fact that they went to the drivers side to continue, suggests either uncontrolled frenzy, or a need to finish poor Penny off, as she may have still been showing signs of life. Of course, if there were two people involved, could it be possible that the other person carried out the stabbing from the drivers side. Both then getting into the pre parked car and departing. It would take two identical knives, or the original perp passing their knife to their accomplice. The car park was busy that day, however nobody saw or heard anything out of the ordinary. So the location must have been quite isolated. It's all speculation, but worth considering given how little evidence there actually is.

Penny was also said not to have been her usual self in the days running up to her death.

I think the police have struggled to find out how the killer escaped without being seen given he would have been covered in blood. Escaping in a vehicle seems a probable solution. Made easier if there was an accomplice ready to drive him away.

 

[tes1984]

Within the close confines of the two front seats of the car, and with Penny fighting for her life, possibly holding the wallpaper samples in an attempt to protect herself. Once the stabbing started it may have been a mixture of panic and anger on the part of the perp as he was unable to strike a fatal blow.
The fact that they went to the drivers side to continue, suggests either uncontrolled frenzy, or a need to finish poor Penny off, as she may have still been showing signs of life.

As I've mentioned before, the perp went above and beyond what was needed to kill Penny. It was either uncontrolled frenzy, or extremely cunning (and highly risky) additional staging.

 

[tes1984]

Penny was also said not to have been her usual self in the days running up to her death.

I think the police have struggled to find out how the killer escaped without being seen given he would have been covered in blood. Escaping in a vehicle seems a probable solution. Made easier if there was an accomplice ready to drive him away.

An escape on foot is possible, if we believe the modern day witness, who saw the man in boxer shorts.

 

[forensicswannabe]

This is another case that I think about often and hope will be solved one day the main head scratcher for me is the motive? This was such a frenzied killing attack that really seems to be personal and rage filled so its someone she knew.

 

[lee sumner]

This makes a lot of sense. I think the Leisure Centre Car Park would have to be chosen ...the killer would need to know the area would be quiet at that time of day....could the killer even have been someone who knew that car park well?..... maybe attended the leisure centre themselves so they knew it would be a quiet place at that time?

penny picking up the killer at a location then being taken to the leisure centre car park does seem odd. it allowed penny to try and signal for help. the killer would know this, so it makes more sense the car park was where she met him, but if that is true, then the sightings of penny on greenford rd are all false.

 

[lee sumner]

This is another case that I think about often and hope will be solved one day the main head scratcher for me is the motive? This was such a frenzied killing attack that really seems to be personal and rage filled so its someone she knew.

DS brian edwards, SIO, lead detective on the case knows who killed penny bell, but he could never prove it. so it does appear to be a case of knowing what happened, but not being able to prove it. he has never named the suspect.

 

[lee sumner]

The above information is from Wikipedia. I wanted to add this case as it has recently been the subject of an hour documentary in the Donal MacIntyre Unsolved series. The aspect of the case which most staggers me is the time of day and place of the murder. This was a busy area and a busy time, surely this was not a plan? The Unsub must have been covered with blood after the attack, add to this that Penny supposedly tried to solicit help by turning on her hazard lights, windscreen wipers and driving very slowly and it seems hard to understand how more eyewitnesses were not tracked down.

The documentary made much of the fact she had withdrawn £8, 500 in cash a few days earlier and was carrying that amount with her when she was attacked. The money has never been found and the husband had no idea what it was for, the withdrawal was not covered up by Penny as it was taken from the couples joint account. The investigation spent a great deal of time focused on the husband but he had an alibi and the police could not find a motive for him. Although it was not said in the documentary the whiteboard in the background noted that police had a partial palm print from the car that they believe to be from the suspect.

I feel very much for the daughter robbed so violently of her mother when she was a young girl. So I throw it open in the hope that some sharp minds from here might have some ideas.

macintyre thinks the killer placed the wall paper samples between the seats. why would he do that. staging does not make sense. it would give the impression penny knew her killer, and the killer would want the opposite, he would want investigators to think the killer was a stranger.

 

[tes1984]

DS brian edwards, SIO, lead detective on the case knows who killed penny bell, but he could never prove it. so it does appear to be a case of knowing what happened, but not being able to prove it. he has never named the suspect.

He may have a suspect, but the current police don't seem convinced. He sent them a dossier a couple of years ago, but it hasn't led to any recent arrest.

 

[lee sumner]

He may have a suspect, but the current police don't seem convinced. He sent them a dossier a couple of years ago, but it hasn't led to any recent arrest.

i did not know about dossier. he could be wrong.

 

[CSIAngus]

DS brian edwards, SIO, lead detective on the case knows who killed penny bell, but he could never prove it. so it does appear to be a case of knowing what happened, but not being able to prove it. he has never named the suspect.

I think that person will have been referenced in this thread on many occasions.

 

[lee sumner]

I think that person will have been referenced in this thread on many occasions.

no i dont think its JR. he was a friend of penny who made out he was having an affair with her, then went to a newspaper to sell his BS story. i believe JR has been ruled out as a suspect.

 

[tes1984]

no i dont think its JR. he was a friend of penny who made out he was having an affair with her, then went to a newspaper to sell his BS story. i believe JR has been ruled out as a suspect.

I agree that the 'new' suspect must be someone other than JR.

I definitely don't think JR has been ruled out as a suspect though.

 

[lee sumner]

no i dont think its JR. he was a friend of penny who made out he was having an affair with her, then went to a newspaper to sell his BS story. i believe JR has been ruled out as a suspect.

I agree that the 'new' suspect must be someone other than JR.

I definitely don't think JR has been ruled out as a suspect though.

re, JR being ruled out. i could be wrong about that. its interesting that JR was a builder by trade. was he contracted to do the work on PB home. just curious.