UK UK - Penny Bell, 43, Ealing, London, 6 June 1991

  • #321
It's amazing he was never looked into more, the only slight issue with richmond is, PB'S daughter said her mums long nails were worn down to nothing as she put up such a fight, so surely richmond or anyone for that matter would be covered in scratches/marks, has his family friends not been asked about this?

It's probably easier to explain away scratches/marks if you work in certain professions.

The nail evidence seems to have been lost, which is flabbergasting really.

I don't know about the nails being worn down to nothing though. It sounds a bit unlikely to me. I could be wrong, but I thought Penny wore false nails, rather than having naturally long nails.
 
  • #322
I don't know about the nails being worn down to nothing though. It sounds a bit unlikely to me. I could be wrong, but I thought Penny wore false nails, rather than having naturally long nails

If false nails then they would presumably rip or break off in a struggle and Penny would be left with her own nails, which could have been very short. Unless her own nails just got torn off as stuck to the false ones. "Worn down" is possibly just an odd turn of phrase.
 
  • #323
It's been almost two years since Penny's daughter mentioned a potential new suspect and new motive. No real updates since then though.

One of the articles from 2024 mentions that Penny was volunteering, and helping desperate people in crisis. I'm not sure how extensively the police examined the volunteering angle during the initial investigation.
 
  • #324
There probably are some other examples, but off the top of my head I can’t think of another murder like this one - such a violent, frenzied and sustained attack in such a small, contained space. And then, for there to be so little in the way of forensic evidence to work with, it just seems unfathomable.

If this crime had taken place pretty much anywhere else I’d assume it was the work of a lunatic, similar perhaps to Jean Bradley’s (unsolved) killing. But the circumstances of Penny’s murder makes it feel personal to me.

The murder weapon has never been confirmed, has it? This Guardian article from 2000 suggests a ‘long knife’ was used, but I’m not sure how accurate that description is. If it was indeed a knife that suggests, I’d say, whoever was in the car with Penny intended to hurt her that day. But perhaps it was a smaller knife, like one that a tradesman might have to hand.

I don’t think the killer intended to kill Penny at the leisure centre, that location was far from ideal, and a long way from where it’s believed Penny picked someone up that morning. I know witness sightings can be unreliable but we have a witness who sees a man getting into a vehicle like Penny’s, and another who sees the same kind of vehicle being driven by a woman with a man in the passenger seat. Even in a wealthy part of southern England there can’t have been too many people driving pale blue Jaguars at the time?

The time of day, too, makes me think it was a spontaneous act, a ‘crime of passion’ as they used to say.

There’s obviously a very good suspect in this case, but he also seems to have been ruled out, and quite categorically too. I’d love to know how police came to that conclusion, there’s a pretty good circumstantial case here imo but perhaps there’s something they know (an alibi, maybe, or forensics pointing towards someone else) that we don’t.
 
  • #325
The exact type of knife used doesn't seem to have been confirmed. Based on the wounds reported at the inquest, it may have been a penknife or small kitchen knife, with a 3 or 4 inch blade, but almost certainly wasn't a larger hunting knife with a protective bar.

None of the witness statements have been confirmed. The initial potential sighting of a man entering a blue car in Iver hasn't been ruled out, but the police said it would have been extremely tight in terms of the known timeline. There was another later potential sighting of a man entering a car in traffic, so chances are that at least one of the car entry sightings is wrong.

The police ran a traffic experiment and in one day spotted 14 pale blue Jaguars like Penny's. All were being driven by men.

AFAIK JR had an alibi and wasn't nearly as talkative with the police as he was with the newspapers. I wonder if JR took part in any identify parades and if not, why not?
 
  • #326
Is it that tight though, time wise? If she leaves the home around 9.40 for a 9.50 ‘appointment’, wouldn’t that fit with the supposed sighting on Fulmer Common Road around the same time? Google Maps suggests it’s a 10 minute drive so that seems to fit to me.

It could just be a coincidence that another woman was driving a blue Jaguar ten minutes down the road from Penny’s home around the same time Penny was known to have left home in her blue Jaguar, and that this woman picked up a male shortly before Penny was supposedly seen driving with a male passenger. And I’m often quite skeptical of witness sightings. But this one has always seemed quite compelling to me.

The description of the man seen getting into the car also seems to fit with the description of the man seen walking away from the murder scene later on, though I admit those descriptions are fairly vague. As you say, it’d be interesting to know if any of the witnesses could’ve picked him out.

One thing I’ve often pondered is, if this man was JR, would JR have been so smartly dressed? Was this is his usual attire? Did he dress up to meet Penny? He doesn’t look dressed to kill to me.

I definitely think you’d have to take anything JR said with a pinch of salt, at least anything said to the papers anyway.
 
  • #327
Is it that tight though, time wise? If she leaves the home around 9.40 for a 9.50 ‘appointment’, wouldn’t that fit with the supposed sighting on Fulmer Common Road around the same time? Google Maps suggests it’s a 10 minute drive so that seems to fit to me.

It could just be a coincidence that another woman was driving a blue Jaguar ten minutes down the road from Penny’s home around the same time Penny was known to have left home in her blue Jaguar, and that this woman picked up a male shortly before Penny was supposedly seen driving with a male passenger. And I’m often quite skeptical of witness sightings. But this one has always seemed quite compelling to me.

The description of the man seen getting into the car also seems to fit with the description of the man seen walking away from the murder scene later on, though I admit those descriptions are fairly vague. As you say, it’d be interesting to know if any of the witnesses could’ve picked him out.

One thing I’ve often pondered is, if this man was JR, would JR have been so smartly dressed? Was this is his usual attire? Did he dress up to meet Penny? He doesn’t look dressed to kill to me.

I definitely think you’d have to take anything JR said with a pinch of salt, at least anything said to the papers anyway.
Penny did drive a relatively uncommon car so any particular sightings of a lady driving such a car in the area at the right time is obviously of interest. Of course its possible the sightings were not of her but there's a better chance than if she'd been driving a Ford Fiesra or VW Golf or something. If the sightings were not of Penny then those other people never came forward to help.

As for the "appointment " it appears the only person she told about it was the builder. Apparently she normally kept very good records but there's nothing recorded anywhere about an appointment. If it was some sort of formal appointment that person also never came forward. If it was something of a more personal nature Penny may just have referred to it as an appointment to hide the true nature. Or she just may have made it up there and then as she didn't want the builders to hold her up.
 
  • #328
I'm going from memory, but I think the witness from Fulmer Common Road was the wife of a police detective, yet for some reason took two weeks to come forward with the information.

If Penny had scheduled an early morning appointment, then she couldn't have been planning a lengthy meeting, or travelling far off track. She had a confirmed 10.30am appointment at her workplace and was apparently never late for work.
 
  • #329
I'm going from memory, but I think the witness from Fulmer Common Road was the wife of a police detective, yet for some reason took two weeks to come forward with the information.

If Penny had scheduled an early morning appointment, then she couldn't have been planning a lengthy meeting, or travelling far off track. She had a confirmed 10.30am appointment at her workplace and was apparently never late for work.
Something else bothers me about the appointment as well. 9.50 seems such an odd time. About every formal meeting I've ever had has started on the hour or on the half hour. It would make sense for say a medical/dental appointment but it obviously wasn't for that. If it was a genuine appointment it sounds like more like something arranged to pick up or drop off something quickly. Perhaps she was going to drop off the money to someone?
 
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  • #330
JR said that Penny picked him up, although I don't think he said from where. He said she dropped him off at the war memorial near Northolt (which seems to be on Penny's normal route to work).
 
  • #331
JR said that Penny picked him up, although I don't think he said from where. He said she dropped him off at the war memorial near Northolt (which seems to be on Penny's normal route to work).
JR is a massive nuisance in this case. You can't believe a word he says. The police have completely ruled him out yet he's always there in the background.
 
  • #332
One thing thst was nentioned in one documentary I watched was something about a telephone call Penny was supposed to have received the day or so before she was killed. Its not something that I've really seen mentioned elsewhere and just wondered if anyone else was aware of this and knows any more details?
 
  • #333
One thing thst was nentioned in one documentary I watched was something about a telephone call Penny was supposed to have received the day or so before she was killed. Its not something that I've really seen mentioned elsewhere and just wondered if anyone else was aware of this and knows any more details?

I vaguely remember something like that. Penny withdrew the cash on the Monday and returned home at 6pm, where the cash was witnessed, but IIRC the appeals don't mention what she was doing on the Tuesday or Wednesday.
 
  • #334
Pure speculation, but I wonder if the cash could have been for something related to Penny's catering recruitment business.

She had some very big catering contracts, which were basically a licence to print money, but was it a shady industry? Did Penny pay finder's fees to agents? Cash backhanders to secure contracts? Protection money to stop criminal elements muscling her out of her most profitable deals?
 
  • #335
Pure speculation, but I wonder if the cash could have been for something related to Penny's catering recruitment business.

She had some very big catering contracts, which were basically a licence to print money, but was it a shady industry? Did Penny pay finder's fees to agents? Cash backhanders to secure contracts? Protection money to stop criminal elements muscling her out of her most profitable deals?
Well the cash has never been found or accounted for. Its not beyond the realms of possibly that it was used for paying off someone. Like a lot of things in this case there's little that can be confirmed. It's thought she may have had the money with her that morning but not definite. £8,500 sounds like an odd amount for blackmail or protection. However we've no idea if the cash was all for one purpose or for various things. In the Crimewatch reconstruction it's clearly stated its was the most she'd ever drawn in cash. Unfortunately that wasn't put in to any context so we have no idea what that infers. The initial reaction you have is that this is a highly unusual transaction but in reality we have no idea. It's more than she'd drawn before but we have no idea how much more. It might be a lot more or not much more at all.
 
  • #336
In the Crimewatch reconstruction it's clearly stated its was the most she'd ever drawn in cash. Unfortunately that wasn't put in to any context so we have no idea what that infers. The initial reaction you have is that this is a highly unusual transaction but in reality we have no idea. It's more than she'd drawn before but we have no idea how much more. It might be a lot more or not much more at all.

From my experience, Crimewatch reconstructions aren't always entirely accurate, and sometimes certain things are said (or not said) to help maintain public support.

Penny was earning over 100k a year. Alistair perhaps 30k or thereabouts. I wonder how much money was still in the joint account after the withdrawal.

Presumably Penny had other, personal bank accounts, so could the 8.5k withdrawal have been highly unusual for the joint account, but not out of the ordinary in terms of her other accounts?
 
  • #337
From my experience, Crimewatch reconstructions aren't always entirely accurate, and sometimes certain things are said (or not said) to help maintain public support.

Penny was earning over 100k a year. Alistair perhaps 30k or thereabouts. I wonder how much money was still in the joint account after the withdrawal.

Presumably Penny had other, personal bank accounts, so could the 8.5k withdrawal have been highly unusual for the joint account, but not out of the ordinary in terms of her other accounts?
It was a lot of cash in those days. Probably around £18 - £20k these days. That she was apparently so casual about carrying it around yet didn't even mention it to her husband seems so odd.
 
  • #338
It was a lot of cash, but Penny had just spent 100k on the house, 12k on a new kitchen etc. Did she pay for everything by cheque, or did she pay the builders with cash too?

I've suggested all sorts of dodgy scenarios for the 8.5k, but if Penny is so casual about carrying it around, and doesn't keep it secret from her daughter and the female family friend, then perhaps the cash was for something 'innocent' after all.
 
  • #339
Penny was the main bread winner, and was extremely generous towards her husband.

She's just spent over 100k on the house renovations, so perhaps the last 8.5k is for a gift for Alistair. A snooker table/grand piano/motorbike to compete the dream house?
 
  • #340
Penny was the main bread winner, and was extremely generous towards her husband.

She's just spent over 100k on the house renovations, so perhaps the last 8.5k is for a gift for Alistair. A snooker table/grand piano/motorbike to compete the dream house?
Could be.

One thing I was wondering about in respect of the cash. One early not unreasonable suggestion was that she may have been paying the builders in cash. That's been discounted but can anyone be sure? If you were one of the builders and had been being paid in cash would you come forward or admit it? Knowing the likely consequences from HMRC etc. As its a murder enquiry you'd hope they would but I'm not sure everyone would.
 

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