GUILTY UK - Rebecca Watts, 16, Bristol, 19 Feb 2015 #15

[ColourPurple]

I think it would require mouth and nose to be covered for suffocation.

True but I could imagine that happening accidentally if somebodys hand is quite big and covers both. I guess I just think once you've put your hands round somebodys throat it's not accidental, you know that could kill somebody.

 

[YidArmyRach]

a wall would also bruise her back if she was slammed against it hard. same as lying on a hard surface, but in an upright position.

I can't imagine someone who is unable to peg out washing, having the strength to slam someone hard against a wall. Especially when that person is fighting back.

 

[YidArmyRach]

Not having seen the movies , what kind of thing would it have that an accidental killer wouldnt want to watch? My entire knowledge of vampires is that they drink blood from biting the victims neck and don't like crosses or garlic. I'm guessing that's a little outdated.

You need to watch Twilight!! Vampires sparkle in the sun and use their powers to become amazingly wealthy these days

 

[ColourPurple]

You need to watch Twilight!! Vampires sparkle in the sun and use their powers to become amazingly wealthy these days

LOL, I've somehow managed to avoid the whole Twilight vampire trend.

 

[ColourPurple]

I can't imagine someone who is unable to peg out washing, having the strength to slam someone hard against a wall. Especially when that person is fighting back.

He was unable to peg out washing but could haul back loads of junk to his house with no problems.

 

[Tortoise]

I believe his fibro also caused problems in his sex life. The threesomes witness gave evidence about him feeling inadequate because of it. I think he was easily fatigued, and Retribution said something like that too.

 

[cottonweaver]

15 abdominal stab wounds. even if they thought it would stop the body expanding, or whatever the explanation was, 15!! to me it sounds more like an act of gratuitous violence which they derived pleasure or satisfaction from.

BIB I totally agree, not the act of someone who has caused an accidental death and then panicked. Nor does it fit with SH being unaware of him dismembering - if hiding this from all was paramount he wouldn't be wasting time inflicting more injuries either.

Looking at it from perspective of him being guilty of murder , Even if it was "stop the body expanding, or whatever the explanation " - no one is going to convince me he learnt that at Cadet/army training etc.

So if it's not Internet/TV ( Dexter CSI ) and pre-planned research to assist with draining or something - it has to be that he simply enjoyed it.
( I have watched all the Dexter series - not CSI- I wouldn't even remember this level of detail. )

I know I am stating the obvious but I am hoping the jury take a long time weighing all these things up together.

 

[cottonweaver]

They say a pic paints a thousand words. Am hoping these images really have an effect on the jury, to help assist them ( not traumatise the jury)

"uK & Eire database for all crimes against children

I think what will stand out most in the juries minds, is the CGI photos they were shown which details the various injuries. Stabbing anyone after death is extreme and was in any case not needed. It applies sociopathatic and deranged behaviour which again is extreme

 

[mrazda71]

Re the stab wounds inflicted after death.

I think it's reasonable to believe they were made thinking that they'd release gas/fluid ...

But I can also imagine them being done for that reason but that while doing it Nathan may have become enraged and done it in a kind of 'look what you've made me do' type of thing ...

IF it happened in any way like we've been told - as in, he didn't plan to murder Becky, then I can imagine him being really angry with himself and with her for ruining his plan and 'getting him in trouble again' ... just my own pondering.

 

[Clio]

<rsbm>
( I have watched all the Dexter series - not CSI- I wouldn't even remember this level of detail. )

I've never watched Dexter. I have seen it stated elsewhere that in the series, Dexter uses cling film to wrap bodies to prevent blood spatter - is that true?

ETA Was googling - found this
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-blood-curdling-murder-sentenced-9772960.html

 

[Tortoise]

Re the stab wounds inflicted after death.

I think it's reasonable to believe they were made thinking that they'd release gas/fluid ...

But I can also imagine them being done for that reason but that while doing it Nathan may have become enraged and done it in a kind of 'look what you've made me do' type of thing ...

IF it happened in any way like we've been told - as in, he didn't plan to murder Becky, then I can imagine him being really angry with himself and with her for ruining his plan and 'getting him in trouble again' ... just my own pondering.

does anyone know what happens when body's expand with gases? do they explode or something?

 

[cottonweaver]

Not having seen the movies , what kind of thing would it have that an accidental killer wouldnt want to watch? My entire knowledge of vampires is that they drink blood from biting the victims neck and don't like crosses or garlic. I'm guessing that's a little outdated.

Sorry CP missed that post:

Underworld &#8211; not scary to me but the themes and the violence &#8211; it's not something you would want to watch if you had killed your step sister by accident and was traumatised by it.

It's got family murder, blood, death and gore..

Maybe Shauna thinks she is Kate Beckinsale, the lead protagonist, warrior figure wreaking violence , in the story, because of another tribe of werewolves who killed her family. ( The character and her lover have a hybrid daughter. ...)
Not old school stakes, crosses etc. but still dark and gory - not nice when you unwittingly committed a murder, better to watch something unrelated so you can put the killing out of your mind.

Doesn't it just sound like the Frozen Video song!

Edit - Frozen not Taken !!!! oops

 

[cottonweaver]

I've never watched Dexter. I have seen it stated elsewhere that in the series, Dexter uses cling film to wrap bodies to prevent blood spatter - is that true?

Im sorry Clio - I cannot even remember and I have watched the whole lot! He had a preferred "dumping ' place ( apols) as he had a boat , I remember the outer bags/sacks more.


The "kill room" really sticks in my mind with all the heavy gauge plastic sheeting and masses of tape - clingfilm? - I will look it up now.

 

[Alyce]

I've never watched Dexter. I have seen it stated elsewhere that in the series, Dexter uses cling film to wrap bodies to prevent blood spatter - is that true?

ETA Was googling - found this
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-blood-curdling-murder-sentenced-9772960.html

many similarities including

A former girlfriend of Miles had told police that he described to her once his intention to kill someone, and that on one occasion he had strangled her for a matter of seconds.

I was encouraged by the Judge wanting to give him a Whole of Life Sentence - but not able to because of him being a teenager. Fortunately, NM does not have that problem.

 

[ColourPurple]

Sorry CP missed that post:

Underworld &#8211; not scary to me but the themes and the violence &#8211; it's not something you would want to watch if you had killed your step sister by accident and was traumatised by it.

It's got family murder, blood, death and gore..

Maybe Shauna thinks she is Kate Beckinsale, the lead protagonist, warrior figure wreaking violence , in the story, because of another tribe of werewolves who killed her family. ( The character and her lover have a hybrid daughter. ...)
Not old school stakes, crosses etc. but still dark and gory - not nice when you unwittingly committed a murder, better to watch something unrelated so you can put the killing out of your mind.

Doesn't it just sound like the Taken Video song!

Thanks for the info. Do you mean the Frozen video song?

 

[cottonweaver]

Just checked - Dexter doesn't dismember then wrap with cling film, but he does use it as part of his MO. to imprison his victims.

The MO is interesting- that's a big speculation that NM has previously watched Dexter - he could have got these ideas from another forensics drama that I haven't seen. I don't believe he got any of this practical knowledge from the army/just his own imagination.
The clever "saving grace" of Dexter is that it's high quality drama IMO and he is a forensics analyst who is out to murder murderers who have escaped justice and whose crimes are especially heinous. (Ultimately he is psychopathic too of course.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dexter_Morgan#Modus_operandi

Anyway, he or they have got these procedures from somewhere..... cannot believe he had a sudden light bulb moment of saws, cling film etc.
As a poster said previously - as a pure accident he would just have been in a total panic and dumped the body in that nearby park without being able to think through his next moves properly....

 

[Clio]

Heart West News &#8207;@HeartWestNews · 46s47 seconds ago
Court has resumed after lunch break. Judge is summing up the evidence #beckywatts

ITV Becky Trial &#8207;@ITVBeckyTrial · 2m2 minutes ago
Court has restarted again. The judge is running through NM's evidence. #beckywatts

ETA Links to NM's written statements & video interview

2nd March 2015
http://www.itv.com/news/west/2015-10-21/becky-watts-trial-matthews-confession-in-full/
http://news.sky.com/story/1573862/becky-watts-stepbrothers-police-statement

3rd March 2015
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cceSV8ULfeM

4th March 2015
http://www.independent.ie/world-new...-to-scare-her-by-kidnapping-her-34131549.html

 

[cottonweaver]

A few interesting opinions from UK&Eire Admin in the break

...Nathan clearly lacked the capability to empathize with the suffering of Becky. And showed no remorse after. Therefore there is a chance because of the severity of the after death injuries, he may be sectioned and sent to Broadmoor - That is just my opinion
....I believe that he will be in prison for several months - Then we will hear in the news that he has been transferred to a secure mental facility for the criminal insane - Again just my thoughts
.... I hate to say it - but no-one in their right mind would design a plan and execute it to such a level of violence (using a power saw to cut up a body) - The main question is - Was Shauna involved?

 

[Gigi-G]

all my opinion. NM has problems with his arm muscles - hanging washing - I think keeping a hand over Becky's mouth and nose for a long time, while she was resisting and biting (internal gum injuries), then I think it would have required considerable arm strength to maintain.

I'm struggling to understand. Why NM was not visibly showing any injuries sustained from his attack on BW.

 

[Beesknees]

The 21 questions for the jury are now available in my 'One Drive' I think this doc is very importante for us all who have been following Becky's trial, so I put it alone in a word document.

It is the doc nº 3 after the 'Timeline of events' and 'Summary of the charges' documents.

Bees