GUILTY UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London, Clapham Common area, 3 Mar 2021 *Awaiting Sentencing*, #15

[Dotta]

Based on the information available, I tend to disagree.

Good! Thats why I like WS - meeting people with different points of view. The truth is in the middle I guess

 

[Sherlockhames]

His behavior at school (bullying), his behaviour at work (Rapist nickname), his "incidents" not properly investigated.

But these “incidents” are so far apart, and also in themselves compartmentalised. Who was ever going to be able to piece anything together from this - even if it was “all there”.

If we find out post sentencing that there are strings of unsolved cases he is believed to be a suspect in, then that is one thing. But some conflicting comments from various individuals who may have known him to varying degrees are not enough IMO to label him as having been obviously deviant. I bet we could all construct negative narratives of even good people we know if they turned out to do something bad. Doesn’t mean it is obvious at the time).

I was more struck by the initial-on the-scene comments from locals describing him and his wife as being friendly with neighbours, helping out and being chatty, kids playing happily etc and family holidays to interesting places. That was what really confused me as the initial accounts all seemed so sympathetic that it seems journos have really had to trawl negative stuff and that is all they have managed to come up with. I also have a lot of sympathy for his wife, it really strikes me that while she may have been aware of a few little unsavoury proclivities he may have had, she was as genuinely horrified and mortified as everyone else. Her statements are quite independently minded - like, she didn’t seem like she knew he was bad but could have stopped it. She seemed as disgusted as everyone else and is now having to try to pick up the pieces from what he has shattered.

 

[Italia]

I found the part about his dads comments and the envy of his brother interesting. Not sure where the latter came from - the source for that in the Times article isn’t quoted but I was interested to see they the journo got reaction of the father.

 

[Italia]

If WC was using the DID anywhere it would either be diminished responsibility or insanity … which he hasn’t used as defence so I don’t know where he is going with that beyond actual treatment for himself, or setting it up now as a potential defence for yet to be uncovered offences.

 

[Nikynoo]

I found the part about his dads comments and the envy of his brother interesting. Not sure where the latter came from - the source for that in the Times article isn’t quoted but I was interested to see they the journo got reaction of the father.

yes, me too. And I cannt find it elsewhere either. I am curious as to whether his father also gave an interview and it will be more fully reported after sentencing. Strange.

 

[Dotta]

If WC was using the DID anywhere it would either be diminished responsibility or insanity … which he hasn’t used as defence so I don’t know where he is going with that beyond actual treatment for himself, or setting it up now as a potential defence for yet to be uncovered offences.

IMO he is lying through his teeth. He is as busy as an ant searching excuses for murdering an innocent woman. No honour and no courage to take responsibility for this crime. I have no pity for this excuse of a man. If he saw he had a problem, why didnt he contact a specialist and start a therapy? Arrogance and entitlement!

 

[seasideForest]

I don't feel qualified to give a firm answer (perhaps we have a psychiatrist somewhere in the ranks?) but an argument might be made for something like that. There's a lot of variance in people's different experiences of DID. But I couldn't say how commonly it is linked to adult trauma.

From what I've read of WC it seems like stress may be a trigger point for him. I would not be surprised to learn that various stressful events were happening in the lead-up to these crimes. A death in the family, a break in his controlled routine (lockdown, time off work), combined with reduced ways to cope with stress (e.g. difficulty getting a sex worker, or sex workers no longer being "enough" to meet his needs?) - I suspect these are factors.

You can be traumatised due to incidents or due to neglect in childhood or due to same occurring later. As far as I know DID is a really serious illness which people might have in addition to complex post traumatic stress disorder. Cptsd tends to develop in childhood, though it can in adulthood too. Plenty of people have cptsd but not DID, including myself. There are also people with just plain old ptsd, (traumatisation after a single incident) which is maybe what you mean with 'adult trauma'.

There are also people who go through difficult phases in their life but don't get traumatised. They might get depressed, have difficulties, take to the bottle etc as a result, but none of that means they're necessarily traumatised. I'm not a psychiatrist, but I have cptsd myself, though not DID. I do dissociate sometimes but often people round about me don't even notice that I've sort of 'gone' briefly. It's not a situation in which I'd be able to plan and carry out the sort of things WC did, if I were that way inclined which I'm not.

I don't believe WC has DID. If he's saying so, then it's a handy excuse. IMO MOO

 

[Sherlockhames]

IMO he is lying through his teeth. He is as busy as an ant searching excuses for murdering an innocent woman. No honour and no courage to take responsibility for this crime. I have no pity for this excuse of a man. If he saw he had a problem, why didnt he contact a specialist and start a therapy? Arrogance and entitlement!

Maybe in his warped mind he didn’t realise it was a problem until it was too late.

In certain sections of our society sexually violent fantasies against women are deemed acceptable/normalised (there is so much readily available violent for instance). I can’t speak for the police but a lot of male dominated workplace cultures thrive on “banter” against women. And that act of “othering” women sexually allows all sorts of horrid conversations and comments to go unchallenged. I work with a lot of perfectly nice men who can say some really bad things with a grin on their face and completely fail to appreciate the impact those words have in women around them (men with wives and daughters i might add). So in a background of this normalised behaviour, how easy is it for people to see they have a problem. (Also see -potentially violent fantasies acted out with quasi consenting sex-workers. If he thought that was normal and maybe was disgusted with himself but was sort of allowed to do it, the steps he took are not that much more).


(I agree he has no honour as he is not coming clean! But as I have said before, I think he is struggling to come to terms with it himself. So maybe he will in time).

 

[Dotta]

Maybe in his warped mind he didn’t realise it was a problem until it was too late.

In certain sections of our society sexually violent fantasies against women are deemed acceptable/normalised (there is so much readily available violent for instance). I can’t speak for the police but a lot of male dominated workplace cultures thrive on “banter” against women. And that act of “othering” women sexually allows all sorts of horrid conversations and comments to go unchallenged. I work with a lot of perfectly nice men who can say some really bad things with a grin on their face and completely fail to appreciate the impact those words have in women around them (men with wives and daughters i might add). So in a background of this normalised behaviour, how easy is it for people to see they have a problem. (Also see -potentially violent fantasies acted out with quasi consenting sex-workers. If he thought that was normal and maybe was disgusted with himself but was sort of allowed to do it, the steps he took are not that much more).


(I agree he has no honour as he is not coming clean! But as I have said before, I think he is struggling to come to terms with it himself. So maybe he will in time).

Let him struggle in his comfy cell. He will have a lifetime to ponder and come to terms. Good riddance!

 

[Italia]

Well obviously his QC didn’t think it was a strong enough for a defence, hence the guilty plea.

 

[Italia]

Jim Sturman QC - 2 Bedford Row - Criminal Barristers Chambers

quite the guy

 

[seasideForest]

What WC could have is a narcisstic personality disorder. Not that I or anyone can make a diagnosis from the keyboard. NPD wouldn't suit WC's plans because there won't be any mitigating factors there. He wouldn't be able to claim that he wasn't aware of what he was doing. IMO MOO

However what I feel most strongly about this case is: poor, poor Sarah. Her poor family. RIP Sarah. At least it's all over now for her. I hope she dissociated so badly during the crime that she was numbed somewhat to what was being done to her, and so her suffering somewhat reduced. MOO

 

[Moll]

Good! Thats why I like WS - meeting people with different points of view. The truth is in the middle I guess

I know I'm being pedantic, but the truth in a case doesn't lie at the midpoint of the opinions of a lot of people online whose information is very partial!

 

[Dotta]

I know I'm being pedantic, but the truth in a case doesn't lie at the midpoint of the opinions of a lot of people online whose information is very partial!

Ha ha ha Touche! I meant all of us present our (partial) points of view and they compose somehow a whole picture

 

[passingby]

I also have a lot of sympathy for his wife, it really strikes me that while she may have been aware of a few little unsavoury proclivities he may have had, she was as genuinely horrified and mortified as everyone else. Her statements are quite independently minded - like, she didn’t seem like she knew he was bad but could have stopped it. She seemed as disgusted as everyone else and is now having to try to pick up the pieces from what he has shattered.

I couldn't get off to sleep last night thinking how awful it must be for her. I wondered if anyone had started any sort of support campaign for her and her kids. Like go fund me or something, I don't know. Not just against the loss of income but more, to demonstrate to her that many of the public feel supportive. Everything my mind came up with though, had the possibility of negative unintended effects :-(

 

[Cherwell]

we need to be cautious around too much hearsay/character witness info in the press from many years ago. When Christopher Jefferies was arrested for the murder of Jo Yeates there was all manner of stuff dredged up by so called “acquaintances” that ended up being published sensationally implying he must have done it via character assassination. And he was very much innocent.

It was mainly unnamed ex-pupils who were quoted, and I always suspected that they were mostly fictional and the comments were made up by the tabloid hacks. There was a certain similarity of style about it all. I noticed that named individuals who were quoted spoke quite highly of Mr Jefferies.

 

[Dotta]

It was mainly unnamed ex-pupils who were quoted, and I always suspected that they were mostly fictional and the comments were made up by the tabloid hacks. There was a certain similarity of style about it all. I noticed that named individuals who were quoted spoke quite highly of Mr Jefferies.

I googled Mr Jefferies as I have never heard of him before. This poor man went through purgatory! Im glad he sued tabloids and they apologized to him. I see he fought like a Lion for his reputation. Respect Sir. If WC thinks media write false stories, he can sue them

 

[Gemmie]

I read that Police is now checking unsolved crimes in the vicinity where WC lived.

I think they need to broaden their range to include a radius around home, work, and anyplace else he frequented. Poke pins on a map and then draw a huge circle around them to be searched. He could be guilty of committing crimes anywhere within that circle if what happened the evening Sarah vanished is any indication.

 

[annpats]

I don't think WC has PTSD, split-personality, or any other form of mental illness.

He knew what he was doing, and he enjoyed it too.

The more he got away with it, the more smug he became, and the more it spurred him on.

His disregard for women and human life is appalling and I'm only surprised he could hide it from his family for as long as he did!

 

[Dotta]

Wayne Couzens sacked from police after admitting killing Sarah Everard