GUILTY UT - MacKenzie "Kenzie" Lueck, 23, Salt Lake City, 17 June 2019 #18 *ARREST*

[yellowmoose]

ML had lost 30 Lbs following a breakup with a boyfriend.Adderall is both a "study aid" and a "weight loss aid" not saying this is the case here but it fits.... IMO

Kenzie went to the gym OFTEN. She was very passionate about working out and loved going to the gym. She had weight loss goals and was reaching those with a healthier life style and working out. No I guess it can't be completely ruled out but I think this is less likely.

 

[Whiteorchids]

When this case was first developing, we spent a lot of time on WS speculating about why Hatch Park. I don't think we can totally rule out that maybe ML decided on the location. There was some claims by a person she had supposedly gone on a date with that they met at that park previously. That claim is 100% unverified and it could be someone just looking for attention. But even without that claim, maybe it was ML's idea to meet there. (And I don't think we need to spend any time on whether or not everyone thinks this was a safe/dangerous/risky choice .. I think we've beat a dead horse with that topic.)

Maybe she felt it was a safe spot to meet somebody given its right next to the North Salt Lake police station? And she wasn't comfortable meeting someone at their house or hers?

Just something to think about.

Thanks @yellowmoose I agree why beat a dead horse. I hope your doing well but know it must be hard under the circumstances.

 

[PommyMommy]

Yeah, his house isn't difficult to find at all. As you mention, it's on a very logical grid system of streets.

He lied about something, but that wasn't the lie.

Maybe he told her he rented an Airbnb. Did she know that he owned one? MOO

 

[ilovechili]

@ilovechili Just jumping off one phrase in your post.
Re bbm & sbm in ^ hypo'l convo, whether before or after flight.
If ML tried to insist on meeting at house, seems AA already knew her car was not at airport (right, anyone?), so he did not need to try to give her directions to his hard-to-find house, so difficult directions are not an excuse to meet at park (or elsewhere).
Presumably, he had already decided he would insist she take Lyft, but how could he say or hint w any semblance of seriousness - my house won't be easy for Lyft driver to find? Com'on, AA, no GPS in Lyfts? Not an excuse to meet in park (or elsewhere).

Finally re hard-to-find house, sorry, not buying it, AA. ML had lived there for 3? 4 yrs? SCL/SLC area has gridded, numbered streets & avenues. Not like some 350 y/o downtown areas in East Coast cities or like the winding un-signed dirt roads in way-out rural back holler.

IOW, 'hard-to-find' house is not an excuse to meet in park (or elsewhere). Jmo.

If you read my entire post, I made it pretty clear it is not my number one theory. I agree with your points. I can say I have seen an Uber though not be able to find a pickup location on more than one occasion with GPS and in fact have to be pointed to a drop off location when riding home and yet they have the address, former rides and GPS I would assume. I have also talked then to the next Uber and Lyft driver after a screw up on how that can occur? It does happen and I am just saying it may be a story he sold her and I myself having gone through it might so perhaps she bought into that...

I asked a driver once about a prior driver I had had who could not locate the pickup point (never did in fact even when talking with him on the phone--finally canceled and ruined the plans of our group) and he named a place for instance that on GPS led all drivers in that city to a furniture store across the street from the actual apartment complex.

On another note, we have a property that if it is looked up on Google Earth brings up a neighbor's address down the road and not ours and in fact it is not even the closest neighbor.

This is a bit sideways and is not really my point though, I am mostly saying if she has ever had a Lyft or Uber screw up it is a story she may have believed by AA that his address has issues with ride share finding him... Or a detour... Or that say AirBNB guests have had issues finding the location when using Lyft...

Again, I don't buy it but...

I was actually trying to agree to a point with people who think perhaps he lured her like with behaving prior, offering her a room at his AirBNB to chill, or lured her in some way, etc.

I truly do not believe this theory either but was trying to think outside of what I think more likely happened and I can honestly say I don't think this is what happened at all.

I some days back have also considered that he did not expect her to show up in a Lyft but perhaps her own car... Her flight was late.

But yes, I see your points.

My personal opinion is she met him willingly and went as far as his home willingly. I think his goal was to get her there and inside his own home.

Just my own opinion though and I certainly could be wrong. I base that on a few things, one of which there was just a very short period of time between the park and his home, 7 to 8 minutes per LE.

Lengthy--apologies.

Edited to change her to his and correct NOT 7 to 8 minutes at park but from park to home.

 

[Whiteorchids]

When this case was first developing, we spent a lot of time on WS speculating about why Hatch Park. I don't think we can totally rule out that maybe ML decided on the location. There was some claims by a person she had supposedly gone on a date with that they met at that park previously. That claim is 100% unverified and it could be someone just looking for attention. But even without that claim, maybe it was ML's idea to meet there. (And I don't think we need to spend any time on whether or not everyone thinks this was a safe/dangerous/risky choice .. I think we've beat a dead horse with that topic.)

Maybe she felt it was a safe spot to meet somebody given its right next to the North Salt Lake police station? And she wasn't comfortable meeting someone at their house or hers?

Just something to think about.

Then why not meet at police parking lot? I sell a lot of electronics on Craigslist I only meet in the lobby of PD to make a transaction if it’s closed I meet them at PD parking lot or inside a bank, where there are always cameras. If they don’t want to meet me there I presume their intentions are not good. My local PD advises meeting there for safety reasons.

 

[Seattle1]

Kenzie went to the gym OFTEN. She was very passionate about working out and loved going to the gym. She had weight loss goals and was reaching those with a healthier life style and working out. No I guess it can't be completely ruled out but I think this is less likely.

I recall earlier msm news that ML played water polo for her HS.

As an athlete, ML likely new better than most that she could achieve her weight loss goals quickly by just getting back in the water.

MOO

 

[yellowmoose]

Then why not meet at police parking lot? I sell a lot of electronics on Craigslist I only meet in the lobby of PD to make a transaction if it’s closed I meet them at PD parking lot or inside a bank, where there are always cameras. If they don’t want to meet me there I presume their intentions are not good. My local PD advises meeting there for safety reasons.

Another good question! This is one of the things about this case that stumps me the most. Maybe she suggested meeting at the PD and he countered with the park across the street? So many possibilities.

 

[Zella]

I can confirm that there are many students (some within the greek system) who Kenzie also knew, who did sell Adderall and others. In the greek system, it is common to be friends with people who sell them. This doesn't mean you're buying from them however. I am posting this to say if this is what she was interested in (not at all saying that is the case), she could have bought from a variety of people in the greek/uni circles that she personally actually knew.

I want to emphasize to those who might be jumping in later on in this case: The drug link is pure speculation at this point. There is no verified information anywhere saying she was even into drugs.

As her friend and from what I know, I am pretty confident in my thoughts that she was not meeting up with this person for drugs.

Thanks for saying all this! I've been out of college for a few years but firmly believe if she was after some sort of study enhancer--whether answers or pharmaceutical--she could easily access that from people who were currently students at her college. It just doesn't make sense to hit up someone who has never even been affiliated with the university you attend or has been out of college that long (nevermind how sporadic his actual attendance was) for those reasons.

Also, just MOO as an outside observer, ML doesn't strike me as the type who would be resorting to either for finals.

 

[iamcurious9]

the kids magazine from the 70's, it may or may not still be published, had pictures to find the hidden objects. I feel like we are all trying to find the hidden objects in this pic of maybe evidence. LE may already have known evidence found here secured.

Finally, well said.

 

[Deleted member 246707]

Another good question! This is one of the things about this case that stumps me the most. Maybe she suggested meeting at the PD and he countered with the park across the street? So many possibilities.

Off the top of my head...

What if ML had reasons for not wanting to be on camera and meet dates in a PD parking lot?
What if the proximity was more about her feeling "safe enough" if the person that showed up wasn't the person she had been talking to, or otherwise seemed dangerous?

 

[Lillymac]

If you read my entire post, I made it pretty clear it is not my number one theory. I agree with your points. I can say I have seen an Uber though not be able to find a pickup location on more than one occasion with GPS and in fact have to be pointed to a drop off location when riding home and yet they have the address, former rides and GPS I would assume. I have also talked then to the next Uber and Lyft driver after a screw up on how that can occur? It does happen and I am just saying it may be a story he sold her and I myself having gone through it might so perhaps she bought into that...

I asked a driver once about a prior driver I had had who could not locate the pickup point (never did in fact even when talking with him on the phone--finally canceled and ruined the plans of our group) and he named a place for instance that on GPS led all drivers in that city to a furniture store across the street from the actual apartment complex.

On another note, we have a property that if it is looked up on Google Earth brings up a neighbor's address down the road and not ours and in fact it is not even the closest neighbor.

This is a bit sideways and is not really my point though, I am mostly saying if she has ever had a Lyft or Uber screw up it is a story she may have believed by AA that his address has issues with ride share finding him... Or a detour... Or that say AirBNB guests have had issues finding the location when using Lyft...

Again, I don't buy it but...

I was actually trying to agree to a point with people who think perhaps he lured her like with behaving prior, offering her a room at his AirBNB to chill, or lured her in some way, etc.

I truly do not believe this theory either but was trying to think outside of what I think more likely happened and I can honestly say I don't think this is what happened at all.

I some days back have also considered that he did not expect her to show up in a Lyft but perhaps her own car... Her flight was late.

But yes, I see your points.

My personal opinion is she met him willingly and went as far as his home willingly. I think his goal was to get her there and inside his own home.

Just my own opinion though and I certainly could be wrong. I base that on a few things, one of which there was just a very short period of time between the park and his home, 7 to 8 minutes per LE.

Lengthy--apologies.

Edited to change her to his and correct NOT 7 to 8 minutes at park but from park to home.

I just rewatched the PC when AA was formally charged and if you listen closely toward the end he addresses the text convo between ML and AA. He was answering why it seemed LE didn't think it was urgent in the beginning.

It is scratchy, but he uses the words...consenting adults, amicable, and plan made on where to meet.

 

[Jealoushe]

Then why not meet at police parking lot? I sell a lot of electronics on Craigslist I only meet in the lobby of PD to make a transaction if it’s closed I meet them at PD parking lot or inside a bank, where there are always cameras. If they don’t want to meet me there I presume their intentions are not good. My local PD advises meeting there for safety reasons.

That is smart, but honestly everyone I know buys and sells online and I don't know a single person who meets at the Police station. They either meet at one of the buyer/sellers house or meet at a carpool etc. I personally always make my bf meet people because I am paranoid, but I just don't think the general public is even remotely aware of how dangerous life is.

IMO you are above average careful and it is not common for people especially youth to act in such a way. I am in Canada though so maybe we are just more careless here.

 

[Boxer]

Thanks for saying all this! I've been out of college for a few years but firmly believe if she was after some sort of study enhancer--whether answers or pharmaceutical--she could easily access that from people who were currently students at her college. It just doesn't make sense to hit up someone who has never even been affiliated with the university you attend or has been out of college that long (nevermind how sporadic his actual attendance was) for those reasons.

Also, just MOO as an outside observer, ML doesn't strike me as the type who would be resorting to either for finals.

MOO I was proposing that she would ask him as a friend. Reasons alternative to meeting him as a friend with or without a study drug seem much darker.
Unless, he was actually her boyfriend and no one knew it yet.

 

[10ofRods]

IMO she wouldn't go to this guy for Adderall. If she wanted one I'm sure she would've been able to get one from a close friend easily. Adderall is everywhere now a days, very easy to get without having to meet some weirdo at 3 am at a park.
All JMO

I agree. And whether or not she wanted to keep her own address away from him, it makes no sense to meet in a park (a park that she would likely never have heard of, wasn't in her neighborhood, was right next to where he used to live).

Maybe she asked him for a suggestion near his house (but why? why not just Lyft to his house?) I know we keep going round and round on this, and probably will for some time.

Drug person= MOO someone peers would describe that way, as "into drugs" or a "party person."

Well, Kenzie's friends and family say she was not one of those. That being said, I agree with previous posters that a college student who was feeling tired and wanted adderall or ritalin would just ask a friend in her sorority. Really commonplace drug at universities. moo

 

[yellowmoose]

Off the top of my head...

What if ML had reasons for not wanting to be on camera and meet dates in a PD parking lot?
What if the proximity was more about her feeling "safe enough" if the person that showed up wasn't the person she had been talking to, or otherwise seemed dangerous?

I suppose these could all be possibilities, yes. I think the proximity to NSL PD could be telling if Kenzie picked the location. Some element of control or safety for her maybe even if they weren't meeting in the actual parking lot. It's a stones throw from the police station.

 

[iamcurious9]

Off the topic of identifying items in the video. But just wondering how many people have walked past this evidence in the last couple of weeks. People didn't notice or put two and two together? Just interesting to me.

Unfortunately, too many people in today's world are all wrapped up in their own little world.

 

[ilovechili]

Off the top of my head...

What if ML had reasons for not wanting to be on camera and meet dates in a PD parking lot?
What if the proximity was more about her feeling "safe enough" if the person that showed up wasn't the person she had been talking to, or otherwise seemed dangerous?

This is one thought I have entertained. She had perhaps been there before with him or even with friend during the daytime, saw the surveillance signs, knew it was near a police station, etc. Of course, it is just speculation but I think it is a possibility.

 

[margarita25]

Unfortunately, too many people in today's world are all wrapped up in their own little world.

(Understatement of the year, moo.)

 

[Zella]

MOO I was proposing that she would ask him as a friend. Reasons alternative to meeting him as a friend with or without a study drug seem much darker.
Unless, he was actually her boyfriend and no one knew it yet.

I would think if they were friends, though, there would be no need to meet in the park like that, especially since she didn't have the final for a couple of days.

I guess this is what's been so hard for my mind to wrap around is for her to feel comfortable enough with him to meet him at that time of night in a park right after her flight back from her grandma's funeral and so far away from where both of them lived but for the meeting not to include just going to straight to one of their homes or him picking her up at the airport.

As of right now, my theory is that they connected on a dating app and had been in contact because of that, though I don't know whether that meant they had met before in person or if she was actually interested in dating him or had just sort of befriended him (in her mind).

 

[Boxer]

Unfortunately, too many people in today's world are all wrapped up in their own little world.

MOO the items above water looked like regular urban refuse so it took a
closer look to get suspicious.

Two stories emerged about how it was found: 1. a park employee alerted police to the items and 2. transients interacting with police dureing an outreach tipped the police. Did anyone see a last word on this?