Found Deceased VA - Morgan Dana Harrington, 20, Charlottesville, 17 Oct 2009 - #8

[weetziebat]

I have to wonder if a gf of a is sportin' a bright and shiny necklace...totin' a new camera and has a spare battery for her phone...

Hmm....wonder how long a girl could wear a beautiful and very noticeable necklace like that before LE strolled up to chat with her about it?

 

[wanttohelp]

anyone else think its weird the name of the guy at the concert hasnt circulated? i mean that seems like easy gossip that would have gotten around by now.

 

[MeoW333]

anyone else think its weird the name of the guy at the concert hasnt circulated? i mean that seems like easy gossip that would have gotten around by now.

It does seem odd, if you are referring to the boyfriend of one of the girls that was supposed to have accompanied them there.
They mention her two girlfriends' names, yet i've not read his name. Although it may be possible i missed it, i don't believe it's been brought up. I wonder why that is?

 

[weetziebat]

BBM:

The search dogs found nothing at all it seems.
Would there be any reasons for that? Would weather conditions and such throw off their trail? Anything that would cause them to not pick up on anything aside from her not being there?

They didn't pick up her trail from the spots where she was sighted either?

Would it be possible her purse was tossed out of a car and ended up where it did? There was no sign of a struggle, however if the struggle was inside a car, there would be no outside signs of it possibly, provided nothing spilled out the car or went out a window.
If the purse/pocketbook was thrown out a window..? It looks like other items are still missing from her purse such as her camera, and not sure what else.. searchers were told to look for a camera and some other unnamed items which might be in a purse.

Why keep the camera? Is it possible Morgan took a picture of the perp and that is why the camera was not throw out with the purse containing her cell phone?

This is a really good question. Would the dogs have sniffed around the arena, where she was supposedly seen by so many people, or just more in areas where she could have been hidden?

 

[weetziebat]

Oops! sorry for the double post. Impatient fingers hitting 'submit'

 

[eeyorelrn]

Ghostmaster that's possible, but I never heard of a phone ringing when it's turned off or the battery has been removed or dead. It usually goes straight to voice mail. Are all cell phones equipped with the T3212 timing program? I know that I have in the past tried my phone out by calling it when it was on to test it's ring, then turned it off and called to test it's voicemail. It always immediately went to vm as soon as it was turned off.

I have Verizon, and it is not uncommon for me to get voice mails when my phone has never rang, even though the phone is on and i am within range of a tower. I have never figured this little qwirk out, and quite frankly it is annoying, since my phone is set up to send me text messages of the voice mails I receive... I could understand it if I had the phone turned off or if i was out of range, but Its not and Im not.... Even my friend that works for Verizon cannot explain it.

 

[MeoW333]

MeoW333, I don’t mind at all. Let me try to give you some answers to your very insightful questions. Many folks have questioned on this forum what LE may or may not have done in the initial days after Morgan went missing. I can give you some insight as to what occurred because I’ve had some experience.

They would first check every hospital and ER in a 100 mile radius to see if any injuries came in related to the disappearance. They would check the local morgues as well (there have been cases where someone was wacked and someone else tried to pass them off as a relative and arrange a funeral) they would send out an electronic notice to every pawn shop within a certain radius and check back with them once a week. They would also check thrift stores, consignment stores, etc. where they buy items to resell as well as the internet looking for the jewelry. They would monitor some of the bigger social networks and chat rooms. They would have talked to every Cab Company, limo service and Bus Company in the area to see if they knew anything as well as the local airport. They would check with Amtrak even though there was not a train through C’ville at that time. They would send out an APB for a missing person to all LE agencies maybe within 150 miles to BOLO for her. Every 24 hour business, bar or restaurant would have been checked. Every video camera mounted outside at every business would have been checked.

As for the credit cards, LE could care less what’s purchased (unless it’s a ticket) every time you use a CC you are sending an electronic signal to your location. They are dodging the CC questions from the press for a reason. If someone is using them not only would they have the location but often times stores have video cameras as well. The fact that the phone was left in the purse but the battery wasn’t and the CC’s, I’m guessing may be gone, point to a theft. You can sell a phone battery and CC on the street. Everyone knows that cell phones have a locator built in and it sounds like someone didn’t want to take a chance being found with “hot” items. Also, maybe the purse was stolen in a separate incident, or lost and who ever took the items took the ID because it could be a female who wanted to use the CC and looked somewhat like her and wanted ID to prove the cards were not stolen. Police have NOT said whether they canceled the cards or not. I bet they have not; waiting to see if they turn up used somewhere. Also, keep in mind she may have had two phones. I do and know many others that do as well. Maybe she had a phone all along. That’s the way LE would be thinking. Maybe she’s using friends for awhile. You just don’t know. But she may not have been out of touch.

All this would have been done by LE and they would have had these same thought within 24 hours of her going missing. It’s standard procedure. I do think they know volumes more than they are saying. I think they have a timeline and POI in mind but can’t connect the dots just yet. But soon. Rich kids come from rich families in that part of Virginia; and can afford very good lawyers to defend themselves. LE wants things to be airtight.

Hunting season begins about now in Virginia with black powder and bow and arrow and runs through Thanksgiving for long guns (rifles) it’s been awhile since I lived in VA but the time is now for big game hunting. Hope this helps. Ghost.

Thank you Ghost, i appreciate it. I just had a reply ready and then lost it since i needed to log in again, right before it was to post, agh..

LE saying that the reason for concern being that they've not heard from her i would think would mean that the only cell phone she had was the one they found. Otherwise, it would just be easier for them to trace her calls to whoever coming from another phone to find her, instead of having huge searches.

As for the pocketbook, if it was stolen from Morgan, or items were stolen out of it after it was "rid of", it adds a whole slew of more questions to the case.
Are their 2 different criminals committing 2 different types of crimes? Are both crimes related? (serial killer Gary Hilton got caught after using some of his victims' credit cards).
Where was the pocketbook originally rid of? Was it moved? Did one crime lead to the other? (for example if she was having the purse violently snatched from her back in an area where she was sighted by the Lannigan field where it was found, would that lead to sighting #6 (being that she was so scared to get out of there she would to anything possible, including hitchhike, if that it is true at all she was seen hitchhiking). I'm not saying a rich perp wouldn't use her cards, you never know, yet it may be a reason that if the perp is one and the same if they didn't use the cards.
Her camera is also missing, would it be possible she has a picture of the perp on the camera, which is why it wasn't ditched with the pocketbook? He would be unsure whether or not the picture data was stored to the internal memory of the camera itself, or a memory stick, and possibly took the whole camera. Or was it stolen by a random thief along with other possible items?

LE is careful to say "most likely" Morgan will not have her ID or cell phone on her. We know they have her cell phone, as for her ID it is not as certain. The wording of "most likely" during the press conference by Rader seems to leave it open that Morgan may have her id, yet she may not as well.
If LE does have her id and credit cards, then possibly it would point to that the perp did not need them, as he already has money. (Along with the high reward amount in this case).
If it is 2 different criminals, the thief being seperate, may have not knew how to unlock the phone to resell (they also refer to it as "jailbroken") or deemed the phone not worth selling, and as you say didn't want the trouble of being pinged. The battery missing.. not sure they'd be worth selling that much at all. It was supposedly common that Morgan's battery would fall out, maybe she dropped the phone a lot..

A quick question for you, about the area and wording of LE.
In an article they mention:

"Somewhere out there lies the vital link of information we need," Rader said. Police urge anyone who was in the heavily traveled Ivy Road area that night, or anyone else who may have encountered a woman matching Harrington's description that evening, to contact them.

"Nothing is too trivial," Rader said. "We believe that what happened from 8:30 to 9:30 was very relevant. Please do not hesitate to call us; let us determine the relevancy."
....
Rader described her purse as black in color and the type that has two straps and can also be carried as a backpack. Her purse and cell phone were found by a passerby Sunday morning, Oct. 18, in the grassy, overflow parking lot next to Lannigan Field. Both were turned in to University Police."
http://www.virginia.edu/uvatoday/newsRelease.php?id=10167

LE stressing the hour between 8:30-9:30pm is very important.
What is your opinion of LE not mentioning the name of the boyfriend who was supposed to have accompanied Morgan and her girlfriends to the concert that night? Another poster brought it up and it is an interesting question. They mention the girlfriends' names, yet we've heard nothing about the boyfriend of one of the girls who was there.

Did they just rule him out?
Is it possible that the lack of "looking out" for Morgan by her girlfriends may be if she had run off with the one's boyfriend during the concert? That would give the other girls a reason to not accompany her to the bathroom and to be angry. Just a crazy theory i thought i'd throw out there..

I don't blame LE for wanting an airtight case, especially with a rich kid who can afford a good lawyer. I wonder what hunting season will bring in?

 

[lilacwine]

Do we know what kind of cell phone she had?

I would honestly think that a relevant pieces of info to give to searchers.

 

[MBLover]

Hmm....wonder how long a girl could wear a beautiful and very noticeable necklace like that before LE strolled up to chat with her about it?

This is true... Let's hope that someone is wearing it and the right person sees it

 

[Waddles]

Do we know what kind of cell phone she had?

I would honestly think that a relevant pieces of info to give to searchers.

I was told searchers were given that info but were told not to pass it on for some reason. (?) Some of them only were also told of the make and model of camera she had with her that night.

 

[Ghostmaster]

MeoW333, to answer your question, yes I think the boyfriend that was with Morgan and the girls can be ruled out. So can the boy she texted as well. If they were involved in any way things would have moved forward more than they have. Often times LE will not reveal minor players in a situation such as this because the press is hungry for information. Naming names would create a “feeding frenzy” for the press to go and talk with them which would serve no useful purpose. I don’t think she hooked up with another girls boyfriend either. I do believe she had a plan for the evening. And I think it included leaving the JPJ arena. She has been seen on video from JPJ standing in line at the restroom before going out. Supposedly one of her friends gave her a kiss good-bye. She took her purse with her. I think she was hitting the restroom thinking she would not be coming back. Left the arena and then something happened. Her plans changed. It is documented she had tried to back get in at several different entry points. Sounds to me like after she had gone to all the trouble to leave (bathroom, saying good-bye, and purse) that whomever she thought she’d be seeing outside wasn’t there. She attempted to get back in. Then maybe she did hook-up with the someone she was going to meet and it went from there. I still think my hunch is right; whatever happened that night wasn’t supposed to go down like it did. One thing led to another, then another and then got out of hand. I don’t think it was a planed rape, abduction or crime but rather a fun evening that turned out all wrong. And now someone is covering it up.

I have thought for the longest time that too much focus is being placed on the friends by folks on this and other forums. These are 20-21 year old girls, still “kids” for the most part. They may think they are tough, or cool but I think it would be impossible for them to keep any type of secret from LE. If LE squeezed them or leaned on them the least little bit, they would crumble and give up everything. I don’t think any of the group has retained a lawyer and that speaks volumes about what LE thinks (or doesn’t think). If any of the girls had a lawyer it would be in the news. The representing attorney would see to that just for the publicity. Same is true if they had been asked to take a LDT or VSA. The only thing the friends may be guilty of is bad judgment with not following up to see if their friend was ok. But they probably had no idea she wasn’t because something like this had happened before with Morgan or another of them (hooking up) The 8:30-9:30 time period is so important to LE I believe, because that’s when the plans for the night went off course. Morgan’s plans changed for some reason. She tried to get in again, couldn’t and it went from there. She let her friends know what was up and I’m certain they’ve told LE everything about any original plans and what happened to derail them. Both the friends and LE are both working on mysteries without any clues during that time period. They are wondering or know by now, what happened with the purse, the camera, the phone, etc. and many more questions we aren’t aware of. To a point Waddles made regarding the type of phone not being discussed by searchers; it probably has to do with the SIM card. I have a Verizon cell these days. I used to have an ATT one. The ATT have SIM cards that can be removed. If it was an ATT phone Morgan had and the SIM card was removed it would be evidence that someone did it intentionally thinking they may slow down the investigation. That, along with no battery would be a strong indicator of a crime occurring; and LE may not want to let that much info out.

I don’t think hunting season will yield many clues. We don’t know if she is even in the mountains. Of course, a hunter could always stumble over a body but it’s not likely. A helicopter search would have worked maybe in the first 24 hours but now is useless. Too much time has passed. Too many folks in the woods now, etc. The “trail” on any missing persons starts to go cold 24 hours after they are gone. Each day only gets worse. It’s over 30 days now and no Morgan. If LE is not close to announcing they have a suspect or POI and you don’t hear anything like that soon; then we can assume Morgan may be lost forever.

 

[Ghostmaster]

I just ran across this on the Find Morgan family website. It debunks some of the questions as to whether or not the parents were smothering her or to protective. It sounds to me like this young lady had her head in the right place and an excellent grasp of the real world.

It’s called “My Philosophy of Life” and in the forum section under General Discussion.

My Philosophy of Life, by: Morgan Harrington - Help Find Morgan Harrington

 

[Sue May]

I have to admit that my feeling on this is that it is more likely a friendly encounter of some sort that went wrong. She met up with an initially well meaning person or persons who invited her for drinks, party, somewhere warm to while away the time and then something went wrong. Overdose, alcoholic poisoning, something getting out of hand (sexual misunderstanding leading to rape) and the person/persons panicked and hid any evidence, including, unfortunately, Morgan. You do hear of this happening, I watched a programme only the other night, can't remember names or places, (in the US though), where 4 students (1 girl, 3 males) got very drunk and the boys all had sex with the near comatose girl and then panicked in case they'd be charged with rape, so unfortunately decided to kill her rather than face a charge. Of course they were found out in the end. But it did make me think of Morgan's case. I hope this is not what happened and that she's out there somewhere, safe and well and will come home soon.

On the other hand, it could have been a stranger abduction .............. Oh dear, I keep changing my mind.

 

[wanttohelp]

ghost master, I think meow and I weren't saying the boyfriend was involved, but we were saying its odd his name hasn't gotten out. I see you are rather new here, but after experiencing a few cases here you will see ws members uncover players relevent or not extremely fast. this goes at a few other sites as well. there are many small players that haven't been officiallt connected whos name have circulated around various sites. I find it extremely odd whoever this bf is has not gotten out.
which I have not heard an official source state whos bf, just "a friends", not even stating a friend they were with bf

 

[olive]

Can anyone shed a little light on some information I'm missing? There was the girl who looked like Morgan who was seen on the video. According to whsv.com, that girl stayed through the concert with her friends, even meeting up with Morgan's friends at some point. However, on this forum and some other ones, people are saying that girl (who looked like Morgan) was kicked out of the concert early on- therefore it could have been her causing the disturbances (kicking man in the leg, etc.) instead of Morgan. I can't find any links to verify this. Do you know where this was reported? Or is it just assumption that this girl was kicked out? Because according to her, she was there through the concert, which would have been underway during the time frame of Morgan's disappearance.

Thanks to anyone who can clarify.

 

[Janeumayer]

The Clifton Inn is across from Stone Robinson Elementary School, very close to the picture that was posted (of what I believe is a rock quarry). There was a question posted somewhere about a week ago (not here, iirc) about whether 250/Milton Road had been searched, but I'm not sure an actual search of that place has taken place.

IIRC the 250 milton rd address came from a post by someone suspicious and people reported the person. Maybe it was at the FB site?

 

[Janeumayer]

For some reason I seem to remember reading that the dogs lost her scent at the tracks???? I too thought that strange. Can't remember where I read that.

Do you know what part of the tracks that was? Would it dismiss the bridge or hitchhiking scenario?

 

[MeoW333]

MeoW333, to answer your question, yes I think the boyfriend that was with Morgan and the girls can be ruled out. So can the boy she texted as well. If they were involved in any way things would have moved forward more than they have. Often times LE will not reveal minor players in a situation such as this because the press is hungry for information. Naming names would create a “feeding frenzy” for the press to go and talk with them which would serve no useful purpose. I don’t think she hooked up with another girls boyfriend either. I do believe she had a plan for the evening. And I think it included leaving the JPJ arena. She has been seen on video from JPJ standing in line at the restroom before going out. Supposedly one of her friends gave her a kiss good-bye. She took her purse with her. I think she was hitting the restroom thinking she would not be coming back. Left the arena and then something happened. Her plans changed. It is documented she had tried to back get in at several different entry points. Sounds to me like after she had gone to all the trouble to leave (bathroom, saying good-bye, and purse) that whomever she thought she’d be seeing outside wasn’t there. She attempted to get back in. Then maybe she did hook-up with the someone she was going to meet and it went from there. I still think my hunch is right; whatever happened that night wasn’t supposed to go down like it did. One thing led to another, then another and then got out of hand. I don’t think it was a planed rape, abduction or crime but rather a fun evening that turned out all wrong. And now someone is covering it up.

I have thought for the longest time that too much focus is being placed on the friends by folks on this and other forums. These are 20-21 year old girls, still “kids” for the most part. They may think they are tough, or cool but I think it would be impossible for them to keep any type of secret from LE. If LE squeezed them or leaned on them the least little bit, they would crumble and give up everything. I don’t think any of the group has retained a lawyer and that speaks volumes about what LE thinks (or doesn’t think). If any of the girls had a lawyer it would be in the news. The representing attorney would see to that just for the publicity. Same is true if they had been asked to take a LDT or VSA. The only thing the friends may be guilty of is bad judgment with not following up to see if their friend was ok. But they probably had no idea she wasn’t because something like this had happened before with Morgan or another of them (hooking up) The 8:30-9:30 time period is so important to LE I believe, because that’s when the plans for the night went off course. Morgan’s plans changed for some reason. She tried to get in again, couldn’t and it went from there. She let her friends know what was up and I’m certain they’ve told LE everything about any original plans and what happened to derail them. Both the friends and LE are both working on mysteries without any clues during that time period. They are wondering or know by now, what happened with the purse, the camera, the phone, etc. and many more questions we aren’t aware of. To a point Waddles made regarding the type of phone not being discussed by searchers; it probably has to do with the SIM card. I have a Verizon cell these days. I used to have an ATT one. The ATT have SIM cards that can be removed. If it was an ATT phone Morgan had and the SIM card was removed it would be evidence that someone did it intentionally thinking they may slow down the investigation. That, along with no battery would be a strong indicator of a crime occurring; and LE may not want to let that much info out.

I don’t think hunting season will yield many clues. We don’t know if she is even in the mountains. Of course, a hunter could always stumble over a body but it’s not likely. A helicopter search would have worked maybe in the first 24 hours but now is useless. Too much time has passed. Too many folks in the woods now, etc. The “trail” on any missing persons starts to go cold 24 hours after they are gone. Each day only gets worse. It’s over 30 days now and no Morgan. If LE is not close to announcing they have a suspect or POI and you don’t hear anything like that soon; then we can assume Morgan may be lost forever.

The brand of cell not being mentioned, reminds me of an ATT phone i used to have. It wasn't a flip open phone, it had a removable SIM card, and the back of it always fell off, since the side was cracked. It was an older model phone. Verizon cell phones have a built in memory. It is doubtful that she would be using such an older model phone, being that she does come from a family that has some money, however i am guessing the phone she did use had a battery cover and was a newer model type.
The battery and SIM would have been removed, possibly the cover placed back on the phone. Did they check it for prints?
Even if just the battery was removed, it all seems an attempt to stall the investigation to buy the perp who removed it some more time. LE would get the phone records from the company anyway.

The camera is also missing, which would suggest that if it was taken by the perp, possibly he was concerned about his picture being on it. If he had gotten "friendly" with Morgan that night, she may have taken his picture, which he would not want "found" with her bag.

If would be great if we knew at what point was the bag tossed? Why would the perp toss the bag instead of keep it? He is leaving evidence out there. Obviously he wouldn't want the phone on his person in case it is pinged. If he is of the wealthier classes, why would he want to use her CCs? If the intent on ridding of her bag was for her not to be able to use the cell phone was it at the time when things went wrong, abduction and it was thrown out of a car window in the parking lot? There was no signs of a struggle where the purse was found. If it was moved from another area by a thief, that's more questions. It was found on the grassy parking area. A grassy area would have dirt, and if a struggle had taken place on it, the dirt would show that someone's footprints would have dug into the earth and made marks in the dirt (in an attempt to avoid being pulled away for example). If a struggle happened on pavement, it would be harder to tell than dirt. If the struggle occurred in a vehicle, it would be hard to tell..

Possibility of 2 different crimes existing if a seperate person, a thief had got into the bag before it was found? Also possible her CCs were in her bag along with her ID when it was found and turned into LE with the cell phone. Why keep her CCs when you rid of the phone? The tossing of Morgan's cell and keeping the battery does show some insight into someone attempting to stall the investigation, that same insight would make it probable they wouldn't bother using her CCs and be caught. That the perp would know CCs are traceable as well.
I do agree with you that to for LE to name unnecessary names and the feeding frenzy that would follow would only further distract from the case. Also, i agree with you that her friends would crumble under intense questioning by LE, especially given with the backgrounds they come from. They are not trouble makers, and are not exposed to the "snitch culture" and have no reason not to tell what they knew. When Morgan's father called them Sunday morning, they told him exactly what happened, which at that point i believe they all seem to realize that things didn't work out the night before for Morgan.
Morgan does seem to be a well rounded girl, going by what she has written with the blog of gardening, her eclectic tastes in music, her volunteering with children from violent homes.

It seems that after Morgan realized whoever was supposed to meet up with her wasn't there, she did try and get back inside the arena to her friends.
The video from JPJ of her on line for the bathroom should help tighten the timeline as when she left the arena.

Do you think that the perp is someone she had been talking to online prior? Or it is someone that she had met that night, as the person she was to meet didn't show?
Do you think she made it across the Copeley Rd Bridge to Ivy rd and the stores around there?
The last time she was seen was around the Copeley rd bridge around 9:30pm. That would be the end of the timeline, possibly she was seen and it was confirmed to be her on surveillance video of a bank or store near there?
That would make it such a concrete timeline of 8:30-9:30pm if she was seen on another video?
8:48pm we have her friends calling and reaching her. If she was voluntarily with someone at the time, she wouldn't have been trying to get back inside the arena the way she was. So it may be safe to say that she was alone at that point as well.
If we can go by different witness accounts, she was seen talking to BB players around 9-9:10pm. Maybe asking directions to a store? Asking to borrow a cell phone?
If she was walking towards stores on Ivy rd/Copeley rd Bridge, did she make it there? Not sure i buy the hitchhiking story from a witness..

This is such a big mystery, i really hope LE makes another public statement soon that announce a POI soon. I don't think if she would be lost forever, it may take a lot longer to find her..

What enforces your belief that what may have happened to Morgan may not have been planned, started out as fun, and ended up wrong?
Is it a combination of information that LE has released and also not said?
My apologies for all the questions, your posts are very well thought out and helpful.

 

[Janeumayer]

You know, Ive been trying to find a Pantera shirt with ONLY the name PAntera on it with cream letters and I can find none. There are, however, 2 or 3 designs with skulls, etc. that have the cream letters. I wonder if LE kept the details of the shirt to corroborate which people really did see Morgan at the concert?

 

[Waddles]

Can anyone shed a little light on some information I'm missing? There was the girl who looked like Morgan who was seen on the video. According to whsv.com, that girl stayed through the concert with her friends, even meeting up with Morgan's friends at some point. However, on this forum and some other ones, people are saying that girl (who looked like Morgan) was kicked out of the concert early on- therefore it could have been her causing the disturbances (kicking man in the leg, etc.) instead of Morgan. I can't find any links to verify this. Do you know where this was reported? Or is it just assumption that this girl was kicked out? Because according to her, she was there through the concert, which would have been underway during the time frame of Morgan's disappearance.

Thanks to anyone who can clarify.

:waitasec: Hi Olive- I think you're referring to Dee, DS. She was seen on multiple videos with her boyfriend and his friends at the concert, right through to the end. But DS was never kicked out of the concert. They then met up briefly with MH's friends at the end of the concert as they all know each other-at which time MH's friends said to her that they were missing someone in their party. She emailed me personally and was sincere and forthcoming. She was just stunned at how she got mixed up in it all.