GUILTY VA - Noah Thomas, 5, Pulaski County, 22 March 2015 #5

[deca]

Sorry- new to this thread and trying to catch up.
Was the lid on the tank?
How far was the septic tank from the house? (I would think that would be one of the first places LE would look and they would notice if lid was off or loose)
TIA

 

[atthelake]

They lied so they wouldn't get in trouble for leaving them alone.

Agree 100%

I honestly do not see how that is so hard to see.

Think most here see that

If they told the police that they left them alone ,their children might have been taken away from them or face charges.

Well, yes. Agree 100%

They were willing to risk lying in hopes the police wouldn't find out.

Agree 100%

Stupid ,yes,

Nope, that is beyond stupid :moo: ...that is CRIMINAL

but not everyones a smart cookie.

100% agree

This to me is an example of information that folks will say yes, yes yes.. but the underlying LOGIC on where the logic brings the logic to is faulty. :moo:

BTW.... where did this post bring us to?

Again, I'm seeing a post that looks like a defense attorney presenting to a focus group.... :moo:

 

[ANonyMs]

Sorry- new to this thread and trying to catch up.
Was the lid on the tank?
How far was the septic tank from the house? (I would think that would be one of the first places LE would look and they would notice if lid was off or loose)
TIA

We don't know 100% for certain if the lid was on and loose, on and bolted, or off entirely but we do have some info from MSM that the lid was on when LE and searchers arrived (we don't know about bolted).

The septic is in the yard shared between the two houses. I think it has been estimated to be 20 feet out the door. Courtney might be able to answer that better but it was not far away at all. Definitely in close proximity to the house.

We don't know for sure whether LE did or did not search it previously before it was drained. One MSM reporter posted to FB that he spoke with two men who claimed they searched it almost immediately in the search and also that a LEO made a cursory search but that has not been confirmed by an official agency or person.

 

[atthelake]

Where was it confirmed that Noah was thrown into a Septic tank?

This to me is an example of information that folks will say yes, but the underlying LOGIC on where the logic brings the logic to is faulty.

BTW.... where did this post bring us to?

Again, I'm seeing a post that looks like a defense attorney presenting to a focus group....

 

[courtneyb]

Duplicate post.. Again

 

[courtneyb]

They lied so they wouldn't get in trouble for leaving them alone.I honestly do not see how that is so hard to see.If they told the police that they left them alone ,their children might have been taken away from them or face charges.They were willing to risk lying in hopes the police wouldn't find out.Stupid ,yes,but not everyones a smart cookie.

But, let's not leave out of your story that there is a dead kid. That "complicates" things.

 

[atthelake]

In both scenarios,she intentionally made a decision that led to the death.I don't see a difference.JMO

But if they didn't know Noah was in the septic tank then theres nothing more that could be done other than calling and reporting him missing which is what they did.

Yep, she called over 2 1/2 hours after she came back? And coming home at 7:45 am and not noticing/or noticing he was gone ..

He could have fell in while jerking the lid off sideways,lost his balance jerking it and fell in with the lid falling shut behind him.

Ah, the reasonable doubt ( :moo: pfft) that so many juror don't understand... but most folks here do!

This to me is an example of information that folks will say yes, yes yes.. but the underlying LOGIC on where the logic brings the logic to is faulty.

BTW.... where did all these posts bring us to?

:moo: it brought us to where they are now.. in jail without bond.. deservedly so

Again, I'm seeing a post that looks like a defense attorney presenting to a focus group....

 

[ANonyMs]

But, let's not leave out of your story that there is a dead kid. That "complicates" things.

No, no, no...not really. That is just an "issue" the defense attorney's need to clear up.

 

[courtneyb]

We don't know 100% for certain if the lid was on and loose, on and bolted, or off entirely but we do have some info from MSM that the lid was on when LE and searchers arrived (we don't know about bolted).

The septic is in the yard shared between the two houses. I think it has been estimated to be 20 feet out the door. Courtney might be able to answer that better but it was not far away at all. Definitely in close proximity to the house.

We don't know for sure whether LE did or did not search it previously before it was drained. One MSM reporter posted to FB that he spoke with two men who claimed they searched it almost immediately in the search and also that a LEO made a cursory search but that has not been confirmed by an official agency or person.

The septic tank is closer to the white house in front, but still technically considered to be in the Thomas's yard, according to Angel, and she estimates it to be about 30 feet from the front door, off to the side a bit. The entire time she lived in the white house, the white vent pipe was the only visible part of the septic system. The lid was under a layer of sod and grass and was not visible, and one would have had to dig a layer of sod up to access the lid. At least as late as November 2014. She can't say what it was like after that.

 

[deca]

I am interested to see the autopsy findings. IMO there is little chance that someone falls into a tank at this age AND little chance that the lid stays on (I am guessing it was on or LE would have immediately drained it)

 

[ANonyMs]

And if Noah had fell and cracked his head on an end table and died while mom was doing the dishes I suppose she should still deserve to be punished for not being there to catch the fall.

There is no comparison in these two things. She intentionally made decisions that led to his death. Completely different circumstances.

In both scenarios,she intentionally made a decision that led to the death.I don't see a difference.JMO

It took seeing this re-quoted by attthelake for me to go back and find the comment to comment string.

I know I gave my personal opinion about your coffee table example before but I want to point out that there is a legal difference between the two scenarios you have claimed to be equal.

The difference is that, while the Virginia code does not expressly state what shall be permitted in terms of leaving a child unattended, one scenario involves *intentionally* leaving a child unattended and thus creating the potential for harm to come to the child who is not mature enough to make appropriate decisions alone, does not have access to an adult when in need of help, etc.

The act of intentionally leaving a child alone who is not mature or capable of making safe decisions or caring for himself is illegal and constitutes negligence for failure to provide adequate supervision.

The act of intentionally washing your dishes while your child plays in a nearby room is not illegal. Should an infant or just learning to walk toddler be left alone in a room with a sharp edged coffee table? No. Should a 5 year old be allowed to be play in the living room while mom washes dishes? I think most of us here would allow our children to do that. It is not creating an unsafe situation. It is not illegal. There is no neglect.

So, no...in both scenarios, she "intentionally made decisions that lead to the death." does not apply equally. Otherwise, we would all to have eat off paper plates and get rid of our coffee tables as doing dishes would be deemed negligence.

 

[tresptip]

But, let's not leave out of your story that there is a dead kid. That "complicates" things.

I agree it makes it suspicious.Still waiting for the toxology reports.Its also possible that nothing might be able to be successfully proven with those results either.Then you'll all just have to wait for the results of the trial as they will never tell us much of anything till the trial is over.

 

[courtneyb]

Yep, she called over 2 1/2 hours after she came back? And coming home at 7:45 am and not noticing/or noticing he was gone ..



Ah, the reasonable doubt ( :moo: pfft) that so many juror don't understand... but most folks here do!

This to me is an example of information that folks will say yes, yes yes.. but the underlying LOGIC on where the logic brings the logic to is faulty.

BTW.... where did all these posts bring us to?

:moo: it brought us to where they are now.. in jail without bond.. deservedly so

Again, I'm seeing a post that looks like a defense attorney presenting to a focus group....

Calling and reporting him missing, even if there was nothing she could have done, is the LEAST she should have done.

 

[tresptip]

It took seeing this re-quoted by attthelake for me to go back and find the comment to comment string.

I know I gave my personal opinion about your coffee table example before but I want to point out that there is a legal difference between the two scenarios you have claimed to be equal.

The difference is that, while the Virginia code does not expressly state what shall be permitted in terms of leaving a child unattended, one scenario involves *intentionally* leaving a child unattended and thus creating the potential for harm to come to the child who is not mature enough to make appropriate decisions alone, does not have access to an adult when in need of help, etc.

The act of intentionally leaving a child alone who is not mature or capable of making safe decisions or caring for himself is illegal and constitutes negligence for failure to provide adequate supervision.

The act of intentionally washing your dishes while your child plays in a nearby room is not illegal. Should an infant or just learning to walk toddler be left alone in a room with a sharp edged coffee table? No. Should a 5 year old be allowed to be play in the living room while mom washes dishes? I think most of us here would allow our children to do that. It is not creating an unsafe situation. It is not illegal. There is no neglect.

So, no...in both scenarios, she "intentionally made decisions that lead to the death." does not apply equally. Otherwise, we would all to have eat off paper plates and get rid of our coffee tables as doing dishes would be deemed negligence.

That's the law ,so be it.But in my eyes its the same.

 

[ANonyMs]

Calling and reporting him missing, even if there was nothing she could have done, is the LEAST she should have done.

I think that was my point with my ridiculously long post. She failed to do even the bare minimum. I should just write my posts to you so you can encapsulate them in one sentence for me.

 

[tresptip]

Yep, she called over 2 1/2 hours after she came back? And coming home at 7:45 am and not noticing/or noticing he was gone ..



Ah, the reasonable doubt ( :moo: pfft) that so many juror don't understand... but most folks here do!

This to me is an example of information that folks will say yes, yes yes.. but the underlying LOGIC on where the logic brings the logic to is faulty.

BTW.... where did all these posts bring us to?

:moo: it brought us to where they are now.. in jail without bond.. deservedly so

Again, I'm seeing a post that looks like a defense attorney presenting to a focus group....

And I'm seeing a prosecuting attorney with no other objective but then to crucify 2 young adults for making some bad parenting decisions.

 

[tresptip]

I think that was my point with my ridiculously long post. She failed to do even the bare minimum. I should just write my posts to you so you can encapsulate them in one sentence for me.

What are you talking about?She did call and reported him missing.Again you are making things up that haven't even been proven.

 

[vasportsmom]

Innocent people don't lie about dead kids. Loving parents don't protect themselves at the cost of their child's life.
I would rather tell the truth and lose custody of my 2 living children then lie to protect myself and end up with one child deceased in a septic tank.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[KristiA]

That's the law ,so be it.But in my eyes its the same.

Let me see if I am understanding you correctly. You feel that doing dishes while your child is playing in another room is no different than leaving a 5 year old and a baby home alone?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

And I'm seeing a prosecuting attorney with no other objective but then to crucify 2 young adults for making some bad parenting decisions.

How can you even say that when you don't know all the evidence he/she has?