Verdict: GUILTY for both Millard and Smich of 1st degree murder #2

[puppyraiser]

ICYMI full interview with Sharlene Bosma on CBC

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/sharlene-bosma-post-verdict-1.3642213

What an amazing woman. Live well, Sharlene!!!

 

[RandomName479]

Most of the "incidents" in my neighborhood are crack-related. Yeah, oxy people aren't great people either, but crack people are more unstable and more dangerous IMO. The oxy people in my neighbourhood only hit the news when they are dead of overdose. Crack users are in the paper all the time for all kinds of things.

You may have a point......I don't have a lot of professional dealings with crack addicts.....so I can't speak from experience, but I do agree they are portrayed (and likely are) extremely unstable. Oxy addicts may cause less neighbourhood drama (unless you have something they can steal and sell for $$ or you have the oxy they so desperately need)....my view is likely tainted by my personal experiences.....being robbed at gunpoint can do that I suppose....it truly has become a danger of being a pharmacist. All MOO

We may have gotten off topic

 

[Mscree]

No, we just think he looks scary! I Wouldn't want to run into him in a dark alley :hills:

I don't believe he looks scary. Lots of people come from different walks of life and can be the kindest person you will ever meet. The scariest thing to me is those that are amoungst us and appear like Mr Rogers and are the worst kind of monster. Look at most serial killers. Don't look like Isho. Look like Millard

 

[SnooperDuper]

You may have a point......I don't have a lot of professional dealings with crack addicts.....so I can't speak from experience, but I do agree they are portrayed (and likely are) extremely unstable. Oxy addicts may cause less neighbourhood drama (unless you have something they can steal and sell for $$ or you have the oxy they so desperately need)....my view is likely tainted by my personal experiences.....being robbed at gunpoint can do that I suppose....it truly has become a danger of being a pharmacist. All MOO

We may have gotten off topic

Well it goes towards the character of these guys. All we heard about in the trial was loads of pot. Pot, who really cares?

The fact is that both DM and MS were involved with the kind of ugly drugs that cause problems in the street and overdoses. Even among dealers, there is a a line...some drugs are higher penalty and higher problem. Sell some drugs and you lose a lot of respect. Anyone selling crack has to have the inner strength to show no compassion when someone begs and weeps for drugs. They have to stand there and say no and say I don't care what you do for the money but the money comes first. People on crack live on the edge and their situations are ugly and the dealer that sells to them is the ugliest of all.

 

[Dutchman]

I think the problem some sluethers having with MS, is because he was cleaning up his act, he was getting an education. We wanted to believe there could only be one DM out there. We developed a bit of pity, for a young guy who got caught up in DM s world. We want to believe there is good in him. But that was not who he was three years ago. Evidence shows that. He might have been well instructed by his lawyer what he needed to do to present a more innocent persona in court. Clearly it worked on a few. My mind changed on him, when he was on the stand, and his quick retorts to DMs lawyer disrespectful,mouthy at times. Showed his true colours. He was just a lot street smarter, to cover his tracks, lose the SIM cards. No fingerprints. Burn any evidence. Remember for his testimony to be true. Seven witnesses would have had to lie. And the phone pings had to be wrong. There is just too much evidence of his fore knowledge not to be 1st degree. The sad part is that he seemed clever, he could have made something of his life. He had a supportive family. Bad company, bad choices, and alcohol and drugs turned him into a criminal, and a convicted murderer. Waste of life. We all know he is up for charges in LB s murder. Wrong place wrong time again? Sad.

 

[NashBridges2]

Smich's lawyers introduced his criminal record IIRC. They must have thought that because his past convictions were for non-violent crimes, it may actually help his case. When MS decided to take the stand and testified to his GOOD character, he opened the door for character evidence to be admissible. DM didn't take the stand......

Even so, I don't see a huge discrepancy in what was allowed as character evidence for DM vs MS. DM did NOT come across as a choir boy. In fact, the character evidence against him that WAS allowed IMO was worse than MS. The thefts/missions.....multiple women....drug use/supplying friends with drugs/supplying MS with oxy....how MM felt about him....etc.

I understand why you see doubt, but IMO there was no miscarriage of justice as far as what was allowed into evidence. MS's violent and gory snuff film wasn't allowed (assuming bc it would have been too prejudicial). They were both bad apples.....the jury just wasn't privy to exactly how bad they were.

all MOO

This, exactly. I have no problem with people having a difference of opinion. But when suddenly, they are assuming the jury made their decisions for the wrong reason, or without enough evidence, or that they could have lied and been searching on their phones for info they shouldn't see, or that the judge made errors on allowing certain evidence (then ignoring WHY the bad character evidence was allowed, without understanding the law), that's when I get upset. Both of these clowns received a fair trial, the judge did an amazing job, and the jury deserves our respect, not our accusations of wrong doing.

 

[Mscree]

I was referencing the test drive with IT. The reason they said they never stole that one was because he was sick from mixing Oxy and alcohol.

If you believe them!

 

[SnooperDuper]

I was referencing the test drive with IT. The reason they said they never stole that one was because he was sick from mixing Oxy and alcohol.

You don't get sick from mixing oxy and alcohol. You get fully loaded.

 

[Mscree]

But it pertained to this one. Just like the incinerator did. Of course I'm not a lawyer or judge.

Yes because the incinerator was used in this crime. anything to do with the other murders was omitted so not to taint the jury of the other charges

 

[canadiangirl]

You don't get sick from mixing oxy and alcohol. You get fully loaded.

http://www.projectknow.com/research/mixing-alcohol-and-oxycodone/

Symptoms of Oxycodone and Alcohol Use

Oxycodone use can have numerous side effects. Mixing it with alcohol amplifies these effects. Several side effects of oxycodone use are:
Nausea
Vomiting
Headaches
Dizziness
Dry mouth
Sweating

 

[Mscree]

And that is exactly why I believe there was too much evidence suppressed that should have been allowed in this case, however, if presented here would present legal arguments down the road regarding the integrity of evidence in future trials.

The text convo between Iisho & Millard clearly show the "state of mind" of DM regarding intent and premeditation to use that gun. Doesn't matter when it took place as it didn't reference a date or victim. It also shows that clearly there is a relationship between MWJ & DM that does not include MS. Though MS stated in testimony he was aware of the gun(s) is there evidence that he was part of the conversation regarding intent???? IMO that text clearly shows proof of Aiding & Abetting and possible charges for MWJ. He sold the gun DM used to commit murder knowing DM's intent to use it and then offered to change it's "print" after the fact. MOO

From the texts it sounds to me that at first it was a loaner gun, after it was used dm and ms decided they wanted their own. Hence I will make it clean again? IMO

 

[Jen Darme]

I am stunned! Did the prosecution actually argue that an accused is more likely to be guilty of a criminal act because that accused has minimal education and plays video games?

My list of complaints wasn't all about the lawyers. People were listing off why MS was guilty and would include that he didn't graduate high school, et al. That was happening even early in the trial.

IIRC, most of that type of stuff in the court room came from DM's lawyer NS. At times it was like he was comparing him to some paragon of wholesomeness -- given the paragon was a little kid, eg, he asked didn't they play Snakes and Ladders? Monopoly? MS answered they'd rather play video games. The next topic was his grade 10 education and repeated questions about why he dropped out of school. I can't figure out the relevance.

OTOH, Dungey, MS's lawyer, kept referring to video games as "killing games" when AM, DM's roomie and good friend, was on the stand resulting in legal arguments.

The judge did address it in his charge to the jury, saying they were to draw no inferences about the characterizations the lawyers made about video games and that neither were on trial for their lifestyle choices. Somewhere I read that the judge's comments about video games included that he knew people who played them, but I cannot find it. Ah ha!

Later, Goodman expressed “judicial notice” that playing Halo was not as deviant as suggested.

“It’s more popular than I was aware. Many individuals play that game now,” Goodman said, adding after a pause, “including people I know.”​

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...jury-didnt-hear-in-the-tim-bosma-murder-trial

 

[Mscree]

Can you link this please?
All I can find is that MS wanted to move to Calgary, but MM did not want to go.

It was linked earlier in this thread by another poster. There was no reference if she wanted to go or not

 

[canadiangirl]

It was linked earlier in this thread by another poster. There was no reference if she wanted to go or not

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...TlebQlyw__2QSDhYkGxMU/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0
Tweet 4278

It was DM writing in letters to CN that suggested otherwise, and then NS ran with that
I don't believe MM was ever asked

 

[SnooperDuper]

http://www.projectknow.com/research/mixing-alcohol-and-oxycodone/

Symptoms of Oxycodone and Alcohol Use

Oxycodone use can have numerous side effects. Mixing it with alcohol amplifies these effects. Several side effects of oxycodone use are:
Nausea
Vomiting
Headaches
Dizziness
Dry mouth
Sweating

Naw, I had a buddy that mixed morphine and alcohol every day until he died of an OD.

Oxy and alcohol doesn't make you sick, it makes you fully loaded.

MS and DM were into some ugly stuff. Once you get into pills and crack/meth, especially selling them, normally, you start losing a lot of friends.

 

[Mscree]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...TlebQlyw__2QSDhYkGxMU/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0
Tweet 4278
It was DM writing in letters to CN that suggested otherwise, and then NS ran with that
I don't believe MM was ever asked

Sorry not sure what your link is suppose to show me however, the poster posted many links from mms testimony regarding out west, getting a license and registration of the caddy. I also take anything written in the letters with a of grain Salt they changed quicker thenDm's jail issued skivies :jail:

 

[canadiangirl]

Sorry not sure what your link is suppose to show me however, the poster posted many links from mms testimony regarding out west, getting a license and registration of the caddy. I also take anything written in the letters witha grain of. Salt they changed quicker thenDm's jail issued skivies ��

You stated in your previous post there was no reference that MM wanted to go or not and my post had that reference in it whereby I specified the tweet.

 

[Mscree]

You stated in your previous post there was no reference that MM wanted to go or not and my post had that reference in it whereby I specified the tweet.

Sorry could not find it in there. It was roll call of jurors. I will not go through the entire trial tweets to find the tweets you are referring too.

 

[lauriej]

Mscree: Mm was suppose to get a licence and have it registered under her name

Can you link this please?
All I can find is that MS wanted to move to Calgary, but MM did not want to go.

--tweets I posted yesterday reference putting the Cadillac n her name:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...-Day-39/page15

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 33s34 seconds ago
Sachak asks if she's seen Smich's Facebook photo. Yes she has. It had a big Cadillac emblem. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 28s29 seconds ago
You've seen #Smich FaceBook profile. A big cadillac photo. He loved that red cadillac. Even sings about it in his rap songs.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 17s17 seconds ago
Millard had a red Cadillac, she agrees. Smich loved it. Helped work on it. He'd rap about a Cadillac. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 40s40 seconds ago
But he didn't have a license. Discussions of Millard giving him that Cadillac--and then maybe putting it in her name or his mom's name.

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 36s36 seconds ago
#Smich would help #Millard fix the cadillac. He didn't have a license. Meneses was going to maybe get a license and put it in her name

Smich was talking about moving to Calgary for a bit, Sachak says. Meneses agrees.
by Adam Carter 2:31 PM

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 53s54 seconds ago
#Smich wanted to move to Calgary, where his sister Andrea was living.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 1m1 minute ago
There was also talk of Smich wanting to move to Calgary in May 2013--and take the Cadillac. His sister Andrea was living there. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 54s55 seconds ago
#Smich wanted to take the red cadillac to Calgary.

 

[Mscree]

--tweets I posted yesterday reference putting the Cadillac n her name:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...-Day-39/page15

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 33s34 seconds ago
Sachak asks if she's seen Smich's Facebook photo. Yes she has. It had a big Cadillac emblem. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 28s29 seconds ago
You've seen #Smich FaceBook profile. A big cadillac photo. He loved that red cadillac. Even sings about it in his rap songs.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 17s17 seconds ago
Millard had a red Cadillac, she agrees. Smich loved it. Helped work on it. He'd rap about a Cadillac. #Bosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 40s40 seconds ago
But he didn't have a license. Discussions of Millard giving him that Cadillac--and then maybe putting it in her name or his mom's name.

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 36s36 seconds ago
#Smich would help #Millard fix the cadillac. He didn't have a license. Meneses was going to maybe get a license and put it in her name

Smich was talking about moving to Calgary for a bit, Sachak says. Meneses agrees.
by Adam Carter 2:31 PM

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 53s54 seconds ago
#Smich wanted to move to Calgary, where his sister Andrea was living.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 1m1 minute ago
There was also talk of Smich wanting to move to Calgary in May 2013--and take the Cadillac. His sister Andrea was living there. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 54s55 seconds ago
#Smich wanted to take the red cadillac to Calgary.

Thank you very much this is exactly the post I was referring to thank you very much for this post Lauriej