WA - 3 children, ages 13, 9 and 7, among 5 killed inside Fall City home, 15 y.o. in custody - 21 October 2024

[Seattle1]

However, if you look at the map of King County

^^rsbm

I suggest ignoring "Fall City" that few have ever heard of and instead map the actual address of the residence. I believe you will find that their Lake Alice neighborhood itself is actually more along the I-90 corridor and better aligned with "Snoqualmie Ridge" than "Fall City" where the family home is only a 5 minute bike ride to the YMCA, Mod Pizza, Safeway, Starbucks, etc., Exit 25 or Snoqualmie Parkway would be my choice versus "Fall City Rd" exit which leads to the the historic town center in the opposite direction of the family's residence and where you have to loop back get nearer to I-90!

IMO, I think this or any realty video describing "Snoqualmie Ridge" gives a better idea of the environment the family enjoyed. I trust after viewing, you can see where anybody living here would not likely describe their existence as feeling "trapped."

 

[KonaHonu]

Unfortunately, we just don't have enough information about them. Maybe they had a lot of equity in their last home that rolled over into this one? Maybe they came into a family inheritance or a large bonus at work? It's difficult to speculate.

We don't have to speculate much. The sales records are available in public records as are their mortgages.

They bought a house in Edmonds in October 2008 for $365,000 and sold it in 2019 for $685,000. If we assume they put 20% down they had a mortgage of $292,000 and the interest rate would have been about 6% at the time leading to a payment of about $1750 per month. They refinanced in 2012 which would have lowered their payment. They were both working and only had 1 kid at the time so it's plausible they over paid and built up additional equity. Let's estimate about $100,000, about $10,000 per year, just a guess really. So when they sold they would have walked away with $493,000 before commissions and closing costs.

They paid $1,475,000 for the Lake Alice property then almost immediately did a $556,000 renovation so their total combined mortgage would have been $1,538,000 and the payment would be about $6,500 per month assuming a 3% interest rate. The normal underwriting guideline is that mortgage expenses are limited to 28% of income so they would have needed a combined income of about $280,000. That consistent with my estimate above if you include Sarah's nursing income. I'm really not sure what nurses make but in 2019 she had about 15 years of experience so I'm going to guess about $80,000.

Mark was an electrical engineer. Software engineers generally make more IME.

https://www.snoco.org/proptax/(S(amu2zy3gsvvftctzcmvxbbev))/ParcelInfo.aspx?parcel_number=00576100002800

King County Department of Assessments: eReal Property

Information about interest rates is from my personal experience. I bought a property in October 2008, refinanced in 2012, and refinanced on another property in 2020 after watching rates for about a year.

 

[georgiajean]

We don't have to speculate much. The sales records are available in public records as are their mortgages.

They bought a house in Edmonds in October 2008 for $365,000 and sold it in 2019 for $685,000. If we assume they put 20% down they had a mortgage of $292,000 and the interest rate would have been about 6% at the time leading to a payment of about $1750 per month. They refinanced in 2012 which would have lowered their payment. They were both working and only had 1 kid at the time so it's plausible they over paid and built up additional equity. Let's estimate about $100,000, about $10,000 per year, just a guess really. So when they sold they would have walked away with $493,000 before commissions and closing costs.

They paid $1,475,000 for the Lake Alice property then almost immediately did a $556,000 renovation so their total combined mortgage would have been $1,538,000 and the payment would be about $6,500 per month assuming a 3% interest rate. The normal underwriting guideline is that mortgage expenses are limited to 28% of income so they would have needed a combined income of about $280,000. That consistent with my estimate above if you include Sarah's nursing income. I'm really not sure what nurses make but in 2019 she had about 15 years of experience so I'm going to guess about $80,000.

Mark was an electrical engineer. Software engineers generally make more IME.

https://www.snoco.org/proptax/(S(amu2zy3gsvvftctzcmvxbbev))/ParcelInfo.aspx?parcel_number=00576100002800

King County Department of Assessments: eReal Property

Information about interest rates is from my personal experience. I bought a property in October 2008, refinanced in 2012, and refinanced on another property in 2020 after watching rates for about a year.

Range of RN wages in WA state = $35-$67 per hour. https://www.indeed.com/career/registered-nurse/salaries/WA
At the average of $48/hour, with no overtime or other bonuses, it would be about $90,000 gross.

 

[KonaHonu]

Range of RN wages in WA state = $35-$67 per hour. https://www.indeed.com/career/registered-nurse/salaries/WA
At the average of $48/hour, with no overtime or other bonuses, it would be about $90,000 gross.

Ok, so I was not too far off. Thanks for the additional information!

 

[Charlot123]

^^rsbm

I suggest ignoring "Fall City" that few have ever heard of and instead map the actual address of the residence. I believe you will find that their Lake Alice neighborhood itself is actually more along the I-90 corridor and better aligned with "Snoqualmie Ridge" than "Fall City" where the family home is only a 5 minute bike ride to the YMCA, Mod Pizza, Safeway, Starbucks, etc., Exit 25 or Snoqualmie Parkway would be my choice versus "Fall City Rd" exit which leads to the the historic town center in the opposite direction of the family's residence and where you have to loop back get nearer to I-90!

IMO, I think this or any realty video describing "Snoqualmie Ridge" gives a better idea of the environment the family enjoyed. I trust after viewing, you can see where anybody living here would not likely describe their existence as feeling "trapped."

Snoqualmie Ridge is bigger, and growing faster. It is a nice area. As I have said, when we moved here in 2002 from MA, tbh, both Bellevue and Issaquah felt rural to me. Not to say, Redmond. Our friend lived in Sammamish, which was one big street up the hill and "something" on the sides. Our friend bought a house in Redmond but was saying it was "Kirkland", because it sounded more "poshy". Look at this area now, though. So predictably, the whole area will be developing towards that 202 corridor.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Could members please specify how information in their post relates, or possibly relates, to this crime. If it doesn't relate to the crime, it is off topic unless there is indication of how it may factor in.

We have members alerting on posts about home sale prices, father's income, wages in WA state, mom's nursing licence, etc etc and there is nothing in these posts that suggests any connection to the crime or possible motive, etc.

Please stay on topic.

Thanks !!

 

[Bounceycat]

I think the shooter told on himself as to what the motive was, when he blamed his brother and said he got caught watching p*rn. As the oldest child, if he was caught doing something like that and it was his parents' first experience with this phase of parenting, they may have come down very hard on him - especially if he had been caught more than once recently. The surviving sister saying it was due to failing grades, was probably the reason that the younger kids were told. I really think it's as simple as that, Occam's Razor. JMHO.

 

[Charlot123]

I don't know if there is "one" reason. We might know more as this case unravels.

Does anyone feel that the type/amount of the wounds might indicate the perpetrator's feelings towards the deceased, or it was just a planned execution but how it went was random? The accused is a good shooter, so maybe the amount of projectiles was somewhat indicative?

To me, it feels that the biggest source of fear and hatred was the father. The next in the intensity of feelings was the 13-year-old brother (as a close in age male, potentially a bigger threat? He was likely also in growth spurt and strong? Or was it jealousy? Or perhaps "hanging the murders" on the brother was a special punishment? Could he feel that the brother was "telling on him" to the parents? Or was the brother the only "potential" person to blame it on, besides himself?). There is clear overkill with the brother. What does it mean? It would seem that the mother was the next in the degree of emotions she elicited - he absolutely planned to eliminate her but she was not the obvious source of fear, so he finished her off later? As to the siblings, as a good shooter, he eliminated them quickly. Initially I thought that perhaps the 11-year-old sister, the firstborn girl, enjoyed special attention from both parents, and probably, even the accused? But now I think that the perpetrator merely overrated his shooting skills - everyone is unmoving, so he became sloppy. Or perhaps, for some reason, calling the police ASAP was the bigger goal than finishing the sister?

In any case, he thought that he had an airtight case with his younger brother being the shooter. (From this standpoint, leaving one child wounded wouldn't matter; he didn't know the sister was the perfect witness, and he himself wasn't wounded, so what if one of the kids was just wounded, not dead? His goal was to take out the three - dad, brother, mom - and call the police ASAP to explain why he survived; barricaded somewhere).

What do people think?

 

[Charlot123]

I wonder whether the accused was the oldest, but either not the best in grades/behavior, or had some other reasons to be intensely jealous of the brother? The role he assigned to the brother was horrible. Perhaps he was the firstborn, but the brother was "the golden child"?

 

[Kemug]

I don't know if there is "one" reason. We might know more as this case unravels.

Does anyone feel that the type/amount of the wounds might indicate the perpetrator's feelings towards the deceased, or it was just a planned execution but how it went was random? The accused is a good shooter, so maybe the amount of projectiles was somewhat indicative?

To me, it feels that the biggest source of fear and hatred was the father. The next in the intensity of feelings was the 13-year-old brother (as a close in age male, potentially a bigger threat? He was likely also in growth spurt and strong? Or was it jealousy? Or perhaps "hanging the murders" on the brother was a special punishment? Could he feel that the brother was "telling on him" to the parents? Or was the brother the only "potential" person to blame it on, besides himself?). There is clear overkill with the brother. What does it mean? It would seem that the mother was the next in the degree of emotions she elicited - he absolutely planned to eliminate her but she was not the obvious source of fear, so he finished her off later? As to the siblings, as a good shooter, he eliminated them quickly. Initially I thought that perhaps the 11-year-old sister, the firstborn girl, enjoyed special attention from both parents, and probably, even the accused? But now I think that the perpetrator merely overrated his shooting skills - everyone is unmoving, so he became sloppy. Or perhaps, for some reason, calling the police ASAP was the bigger goal than finishing the sister?

In any case, he thought that he had an airtight case with his younger brother being the shooter. (From this standpoint, leaving one child wounded wouldn't matter; he didn't know the sister was the perfect witness, and he himself wasn't wounded, so what if one of the kids was just wounded, not dead? His goal was to take out the three - dad, brother, mom - and call the police ASAP to explain why he survived; barricaded somewhere).

What do people think?

I would like to know how he enticed his father out of the parental bedroom. Was that the real reason he shot his younger brother/s?

 

[Charlot123]

Loop 8th⁸

I would like to know how he enticed his father out of the parental bedroom. Was that the real reason he shot his younger brother/s?

Possibly. The father was lying close to the younger child’s body, so maybe he ran to the younger son in response to the shot, then got shot from the back?

 

[KonaHonu]

To me, it feels that the biggest source of fear and hatred was the father. The next in the intensity of feelings was the 13-year-old brother (as a close in age male, potentially a bigger threat? He was likely also in growth spurt and strong? Or was it jealousy? Or perhaps "hanging the murders" on the brother was a special punishment? ...

Snipped for focus.

The father was shot 4 times, more than anyone else. But one shot just grazed his arm and another was to his armpit and may not have been fatal (see PCA, available on court web page but not directly linkable).

He broke down the bathroom door to get to the mom so I'm inclined to think she may have been the one he was most angry with.

 

[KonaHonu]

Loop 8th⁸

I would like to know how he enticed his father out of the parental bedroom. Was that the real reason he shot his younger brother/s?

I think he shot the younger brother first. Dad heard the gunshots and ran to investigate. But I'm having real trouble figuring out a sequence that matches all of the information in the PCA. For example, there was blood on the floor next to the bed leading to the master bath where mom was fatally shot. So she must have been shot before going in the bathroom.

At 5 AM it is possible dad was an early riser and was upstairs, he shot mom then dad and little brother ran to investigate and he picked them off as they got to the bottom of the stairs.

 

[Charlot123]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>
We don’t know much about the boy or the family, yet, except for the obvious facade. I watched several interviews with the school shooters, and yes, there usually is messed up home life, but also, a vulnerable child.

 

[KentuckyFilly79]

Is there a link to the PCA that I might have missed somewhere?

 

[KonaHonu]

Is there a link to the PCA that I might have missed somewhere?

Case number: 24-8-00878-2

Terms of Use | KC-Script Portal

dja-prd-ecexap1.kingcounty.gov

You will have to pay a few dollars.

 

[KonaHonu]

Case number: 24-8-00878-2

Terms of Use | KC-Script Portal

dja-prd-ecexap1.kingcounty.gov

You will have to pay a few dollars.

KC Script Portal | KC-Script Portal is a better link. Click on "Request/View Court Records"
You will need to register and pay.

 

[Charlot123]

I think he shot the younger brother first. Dad heard the gunshots and ran to investigate. But I'm having real trouble figuring out a sequence that matches all of the information in the PCA. For example, there was blood on the floor next to the bed leading to the master bath where mom was fatally shot. So she must have been shot before going in the bathroom.

At 5 AM it is possible dad was an early riser and was upstairs, he shot mom then dad and little brother ran to investigate and he picked them off as they got to the bottom of the stairs.

Not sure. From what I understand, he shot his older brother twice - killing first, and later, shooting again and putting the gun in his hand. (Some questions about one or two guns in the house, but we'll find it out). It is my understanding that mom was shot, then barricaded in the bathroom and it was she who cried, "stop", but it means that he followed her once most of the people were killed. So he definitely planned to kill mom, but was not in a hurry to. But of course, we don't know the details; I hope we shall.

 

[KonaHonu]

Some questions about one or two guns in the house, but we'll find it out.

Snipped for focus.

I think my post way up thread may have caused confusion over the number of guns. It was made before I had read the PCA and was based on what was presented in MSM without context.

After reading the PCA it is clear that the police searched the house and only recovered one gun, a black Glock. (Source: PCA)

 

[Charlot123]

Snipped for focus.

I think my post way up thread may have caused confusion over the number of guns. It was made before I had read the PCA and was based on what was presented in MSM without context.

After reading the PCA it is clear that the police searched the house and only recovered one gun, a black Glock. (Source: PCA)

Do we know what model (I am thinking of how many bullets)?