Found Deceased WA - Ben Keita, 18, Seattle, 26 Nov 2016

  • #21
He wouldn't have ice crystals in his heart if he was dead I would think. Blood is no longer pumping, he's not breathing in the cold, so it can't be because he was hanging outside. IMO from knowledge I've learned while in veterinary school.
http://www.anapsid.org/necropsy.html


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I don't understand the confusion about the ice. Why could ice not form in a non-beating heart if it's cold enough? Blood that is not in motion separates pretty quickly into solid and liquid components. The serum (liquid part) can certainly freeze. Blood components in blood banks are frozen all the time for storage.
 
  • #22
CAIR ( Council on Islamic-Relations) is intervening for the family. They are listed on Wikipedia as an Islamic advocacy group, but have been criticized by the Anti Defamation League as having past ties to Hamas (terrorist organization). Wikipedia also claims the group has purported to have had anti-semites at its rallies. Another critic claims CAIR is an organization for "victimization".

So do LE have believe Ben was practicing Islam and this is some kind of retaliation? Because his parents belong to a Baptist church and his mother is most certainly Christian. My apologies to the mods if that skirts the line of the rules but I feel it is important to clarify as it muddies the waters of this case quite a bit.
 
  • #23
This case has an unfortunate lack of attention, which is somewhat disappointing to me. There are three big questions that I have; why was the rope so long, why did he miss school for almost a month prior to him being reported missing and why is there evidence pointing to a hate crime.

The rope, theoretically, could have been long in an attempt to die instantly, as strangulation takes longer and if he did jump from that distance his neck would have not only broken but there would be a high likely hood of internal decapitation and him losing consciousness if not dying immediately- I didn't see any mention of the latter two options so I'll move on.

Him being missing from school could point to both depression and/or abuse due to his choice in faith; I do hope they find a suicide note or mentions on social media to one or the other as it would really help in determining whether this should be constituted as a hate crime or an unfortunate suicide; possibly a matter of both if he had been pressured to do it due to his faith by others.

And my unfortunate final question of why the hate crime leads me two just two possibilities. He was receiving threats and bodily harm prior to the incident or someone has decided to use the death of a child as a political argument- and if that is the case I truly think those involved should be held liable for libel for making a young adults last message to the world be one that may not actually be his.
 
  • #24
I don't understand the confusion about the ice. Why could ice not form in a non-beating heart if it's cold enough? Blood that is not in motion separates pretty quickly into solid and liquid components. The serum (liquid part) can certainly freeze. Blood components in blood banks are frozen all the time for storage.

Hmm I may be wrong then. Anything I saw/learned in regards to the pathology of the heart after freezing was that the cells would lyse. Thanks for that tidbit about the serum!


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  • #25
So do LE have believe Ben was practicing Islam and this is some kind of retaliation? Because his parents belong to a Baptist church and his mother is most certainly Christian. My apologies to the mods if that skirts the line of the rules but I feel it is important to clarify as it muddies the waters of this case quite a bit.

That really does muddy the waters. Interesting.


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  • #26
This case has an unfortunate lack of attention, which is somewhat disappointing to me. There are three big questions that I have; why was the rope so long, why did he miss school for almost a month prior to him being reported missing and why is there evidence pointing to a hate crime.

The rope, theoretically, could have been long in an attempt to die instantly, as strangulation takes longer and if he did jump from that distance his neck would have not only broken but there would be a high likely hood of internal decapitation and him losing consciousness if not dying immediately- I didn't see any mention of the latter two options so I'll move on.

Him being missing from school could point to both depression and/or abuse due to his choice in faith; I do hope they find a suicide note or mentions on social media to one or the other as it would really help in determining whether this should be constituted as a hate crime or an unfortunate suicide; possibly a matter of both if he had been pressured to do it due to his faith by others.

And my unfortunate final question of why the hate crime leads me two just two possibilities. He was receiving threats and bodily harm prior to the incident or someone has decided to use the death of a child as a political argument- and if that is the case I truly think those involved should be held liable for libel for making a young adults last message to the world be one that may not actually be his.

I completely agree. I didn't know that about the length of rope on what it would do to a body depending on how long it is!


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  • #27
  • #28
Hmm I may be wrong then. Anything I saw/learned in regards to the pathology of the heart after freezing was that the cells would lyse. Thanks for that tidbit about the serum!


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That's true, the cells would lyse. But plasma freezes. Hence FFP (fresh frozen plasma)
 
  • #29
CAIR is likely pressuring the media and the family to paint this as an anti-Islamic hate crime. We don't know all the facts yet for this case, however, if it was a murder -- hate crime or not, i hope justice comes very soon for those who killed this young man.
 
  • #30
  • #31
CAIR is likely pressuring the media and the family to paint this as an anti-Islamic hate crime. We don't know all the facts yet for this case, however, if it was a murder -- hate crime or not, i hope justice comes very soon for those who killed this young man.

I agree 100%. When I saw the first article about him I just had to come here. My heart aches for him. He looks so young and he had such a future ahead of him.


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  • #32
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  • #34
 
  • #35
Literally everything about this case suggests suicide except for the bizarre "length of rope" portion. That should probably be fact checked. Something tells me CAIR hasn't.

I can't think of any reason, suicide or otherwise that someone would be hanging 2.5 feet off the ground from a rope tied 50 feet up in a tree.
 
  • #36
Literally everything about this case suggests suicide except for the bizarre "length of rope" portion. That should probably be fact checked. Something tells me CAIR hasn't.

I can't think of any reason, suicide or otherwise that someone would be hanging 2.5 feet off the ground from a rope tied 50 feet up in a tree.

Yeah the more I read about it the more I thought it was suicide but that it was an odd choice of placement. I’ll say how close the tree was to civilization was odd too (like ten feet?) and that no one saw him but that can be refuted as many of us don’t pay too much attention to our surroundings. I believe the FBI consulted on this case and it was their decision as well that it was suicide. I have no idea how he got the rope up there though.
 
  • #37
I worked with his father. This is such a sad case. His family still does not believe this was suicide. I wish they had the answers they are looking for.
 
  • #38
I worked with his father. This is such a sad case. His family still does not believe this was suicide. I wish they had the answers they are looking for.
That's the thing, families are so close to it that they don't want to believe it could be suicide and they also can't emotionally handle digging into explicit details. Families like that can benefit tremendously from a trusted but objective friend reviewing and if necessary verifying the actual first responder and medical reports or, barring that, hiring a private investigator to just put in a few hours or a single day doing it.

I'm sure that the answers are contained in those reports but the family is relying on news and political organizations to inform them, both of whom have bigger reasons to amplify incongruities than they do to actually explain them - which I think is missing in this case.
 

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