WARNING:GRAPHIC PHOTOS Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #8

Status
Not open for further replies.
  • #1,061
I think common sense is what Hendry uses in his discussion of the glass patterns. After decades investigating auto accidents, I think Hendry has quite a bit of experienced with glass and how it flies when broken.

I find it odd that you think broken glass continuing to move while a room is tossed so incredible, but two young men who have never met joining together in a matter of minutes and agreeing to commit rape and murder doesn't phase you.

Feel free to discuss Hendry, but please don't expect me to debate his opinion. I have asked for independent verification of his credentials as a crime scene analyst. It does not seem to be available. I'm not interested in discussing the opinion of some retired guy. I am interested in justice for Meredith.
 
  • #1,062
1) Below, taken from a pro-guilt site, is extremely disturbing: To me, it reeks of someone making a false confession under duress, and attempting to reveal that that is what has occurred:

"One of Knox’s own first statements placed her at the scene of the crime, coming after Sollecito changed his story and no longer provided her an alibi. "While Knox’s first statement was not admittable in the trial, her written statement was, and she admitted she couldn’t not confirm any of her actions the night of the 1st:

“I also know that the fact that I can’t fully recall the events that I claim took place at Raffaele’s home during the time that Meredith was murdered is incriminating.”

Knox also questioned her own memory:

And I stand by my statements that I made last night about events that could have taken place in my home with Patrik, but I want to make very clear that these events seem more unreal to me that what I said before, that I stayed at Raffaele’s house. (…) Is the evidence proving my pressance [sic] at the time and place of the crime reliable? If so, what does this say about my memory? Is it reliable?
http://aklwei.wordpress.com/2011/02/21/the-actual-case-against-amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito/

2) Why "feel free to discuss Hendry" if he is going to be dismissed as irrelevant?

3) If the break-in being staged, is as Mignini said, "Case closed", then why have an appeal at all? An empty gesture. We know that the staging traps Amanda and Raffaele, if true.

4) If it is all sewn up, then what is there to sleuth, what is there to discuss? Nothing.

5) The worst thing about being a person endowed with empathy, is that you have to care about injustice, even though there is nothing to be done...:(
 
  • #1,063
One is either convinced by the below, or automatically sees alternate explanations:

Against the lone-wolf scenariohttp://aklwei.wordpress.com/2011/02/21/the-actual-case-against-amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito/
Both the Micheli report from Guede’s trial and the Massei report from Knox/Sollecito’s trial rejected the argument that Guede acted alone. There are many reasons for this; chief among them that the argument that this was a break-in was rejected and instead the disarrayed room was staged to make it appear there was a break in. Guede would not have a reason to stage a break-in to deflect attention while at the same time leaving unassailable evidence of his presence, including in the bathroom. Therefore, Guede would have had been provided access to the house, and the Massei report argues that it is improbable that Meredith let Guede in.. therefore whoever let Guede in was at the house that night and was responsible for staging the break-in to deflect attention from themselves. Amanda was the only resident without an provable alibi.

The signs that the burglary was staged include:

No footprints in the grass below the window (and no ground dirt tracked in)
An undisturbed nail sticking out on the outside wall under the window, which seems unlikely if someone pulled their body up over that wall
A lack of scuff marks on the wall that would have been climbed
Glass still sitting on the window sill that a climber would have had to pull themselves over
No glass was found on the ground outside the window
What was disturbed in the bedroom with the “break-in” was only clothes; boxes and drawers remained closed and unchecked
Valuables, including computer, were not taken
The shutters on the window with the broken glass were argued to be closed; this would have required climbing the wall twice.
Someone breaking in would have to rely on the chance occurrence that the inner shutters were not locked, and thus not preventing access once the window was broken.
 
  • #1,064
Last question:
It is easy enough to picture Meredith, sitting there in her coat, dialing her Mom's number, while Guede, who heard her enter while he was on the toilet, and realizing he was no longer at his leisure, paused, and then rushed into her room with a knife, demanding $$$.........Picturing all 3 rushing in like that is bizarre....I will admit, IF the break-in was staged, it had to be AK and RS---and since that stands, why have an appeal at all? Throw out the knife and the bra clasp, and the staging still gets them.....seems a waste of time to me. One last thought: I have NEVER heard of a trio not ratting eachother out. You would think Rudy's first words would have been to the effect that, 'yes, I was in there, but it was Amanda and Raffaele who hurt her, not me"---this pact of silence is bizarre, and for me, a first.....
 
  • #1,065
The signs that the burglary was staged include:

[. . . ]
What was disturbed in the bedroom with the “break-in” was only clothes; boxes and drawers remained closed and uncheckedWas Rudy disturbed in his search, by needing a trip to the bathroom?

Valuables, including computer, were not takenWas Rudy disturbed in his hoist, by the early and unexpected arrival of Meredith?

The shutters on the window with the broken glass were argued to be closed; this would have required climbing the wall twice.F first said they were closed, then said she was not certain.

Someone breaking in would have to rely on the chance occurrence that the inner shutters were not locked, and thus not preventing access once the window was broken.Burglars are willing to take that chance.

It would appear that an Italian Forensics detective - albeit "retired", although I fail to see the shame in retirement :cop: - did believe that the break-in was NOT staged: http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=7995762

"One witness said his office window had been broken with a large rock, and a computer stolen. The computer and a cell phone were later found in the possession of Guede, who was also found with a switchblade."http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=7995762&page=2
 
  • #1,066
I just recalled , we are only supposed to be discussing trial points :floorlaugh:

in any case, it is all so much water under the bridge in the legal sense: To me, if the staging stands, it all stands, and I do not even see what the appeal is attempting to achieve now. Reduced sentences? would be bizarre, if "they did it"......
 
  • #1,067
Cannot refrain from these last :twocents:
This kind of speculation - which strikes me as fantasizing, and I would hate it if it were done of me - is still ongoing at places such as PMF, and it does seem to all rest on presupposing that all findings have been beyond reasonable doubt:


Post 1387 from Perugia Murder File:
Smacker, I think the line was crossed, and fiercely, by Amanda. I don't think there was much escalation. I think your points above went by way too fast for any of them to be considering consequences. I think it was AK's fury that drove it.

Was she accused of taking the money? Criticised for bringing strange people in who stole the money?

I still wonder about the last time they were together the afternoon before the murder. The statement analyst pointed out a flag that might indicate that. (AK saying something like "nothing unusual happened.") I'd always wondered about that "last meeting" berfore I read that. Raff "appreciated" the way Meredith was looking in her jeans at that time, which AK may very well have noticed. There might have been a reminder from MK about the rent being due/dirty dishes/turn to clean in front of RS, or worse. There may have been an argument even about the laundry ... was AK throwing her stuff in without contributing to the laundry consumables? Maybe MK was just cool towards Knox.
 
  • #1,068
uh pure fantasy...where is the proof? ridiculous.
 
  • #1,069
uh pure fantasy...where is the proof? ridiculous.
Right---imagine being on the receiving end of this kind of thing, people saying, "and then she said this, and did this, because of that"----horrifying, they never even met Knox!
This from one dissident poster at PMF, is how I would LIKE to feel right now, but simply cannot be this optimistic:

Because of their irrevocable belief in guilt, they will continue to believe in guilt even if the defendants are released from jail. In May, the DNA results will be rejected, and since Curatalo will be bounced, the strongest evidence tying the defendants to the scene will be gone, and the court will have developed a strong suspicion of the quality of the underlying investigation. The Court will maybe allow one more round of review (TOD, computers, footprints?), and then will bounce the case by Christmas. At that time, everyone can live happily ever after, except that the few here whose identities are known will have their personal reputations tarnished forever. The others will slink away leaving those unfortunates holding the bag. Source: Perugia Murder File
 
  • #1,070
again the winwdow could have broken during a struggle...why iis everyone so bent on this guy entering thru a window? he could have come in other ways...he could have been invited in...they could have had consensual sex...she could have woken to him ransacking her room...he could have hit his rock in his backback against the window.... I think the shutters may have been closed later to hide the window hole...and also the covering of meredith ...before he left...trying to cover up and have time to get away...
 
  • #1,071
again the winwdow could have broken during a struggle...why iis everyone so bent on this guy entering thru a window? he could have come in other ways...he could have been invited in...they could have had consensual sex...she could have woken to him ransacking her room...he could have hit his rock in his backback against the window.... I think the shutters may have been closed later to hide the window hole...and also the covering of meredith ...before he left...trying to cover up and have time to get away...
I think it is because of the rock they found in the room, and the way the glass was broken....likely did not look like a struggle. The consensual sex or Meredith admitting Rudy in was dismissed out of hand, and may be worthy of dismissal or may be shades or racism or classism....I do see your points ..as regards the fantasizing, this was the most obnoxious explanation of a motive for murder posted on PMF:
Maybe MK was just cool towards Knox.
 
  • #1,072
The break in was staged. The next question is who and why.

I think this is incorrect, and I don't give a hoot what sort of corrupt trial and mishandled case evidence backs this viewpoint. I think the break in was not staged, and that RG broke into the flat and murdered MK alone.

I think that a reasonable person could arrive easily at this conclusion. As such, I think AK and RS should be released lacking proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

Reasonable doubt clearly exists in this case, just look at the poll numbers from right here on this site; and this is a site that tends to bias in favor of the prosecution! (I count myself among the folks tending to favor the prosecution in most cases.)
 
  • #1,073
I think this is incorrect, and I don't give a hoot what sort of corrupt trial and mishandled case evidence backs this viewpoint. I think the break in was not staged, and that RG broke into the flat and murdered MK alone.

I think that a reasonable person could arrive easily at this conclusion. As such, I think AK and RS should be released lacking proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

Reasonable doubt clearly exists in this case, just look at the poll numbers from right here on this site; and this is a site that tends to bias in favor of the prosecution! (I count myself among the folks tending to favor the prosecution in most cases.)
Yes, but this is the whole problem: Those who uphold conviction on a plethora of forums, will not concede that the prosecution may have had a flimsy and concocted case, because it was upheld by the judges. Even though this sort of thing can and does occur......:( and so much is not even being considered within the appeals process.......................
 
  • #1,074
why would a young girl in puppy love... in school in Italy with hours to spend perusing art and sexy underwear... bother to leave a virtual love nest/ private apartment in the middle of the night... to go murder her roomate with some lowlifes from a bar?

in the name of god....! seriously? who does this? in the most bizarre of circumstances there is nothing that can convince me that all of these people were together in Merediths room consenting together to rape and kill this girl...

absurd....and I have been to some whacky parties...
 
  • #1,075
It is not uncommon that in a murder with knives no (or not much) evidence is left. What was Meredith supposed to do against 2 knives? No DNA is to be expected. Then with a knife in your hand it is more difficult to leave fingerprints. Besides how many fingerprints did RG leave? Also, there are fingerprints that could not be identified. You are denying a large part in the judges report that discusses the multiple attackers and knives. To say that 'nothing suggests multiple knives' is not true. You don't have to agree with it of course. The evidence that AK was in the murder room comes from all the traces left in the cottage, the dynamics of the murder, her boyfriends traces, and her own statements and alibi problems. I don't think we have to go through all that again. IMO.

IMO - before I would confict someone I would need solid evidence, or really good circumstantial evidence. I just don't see it in the case.
AK would have to have been extremely luckily not to have left or have something more substantial implicating her - an her carefree attitude should have worked against her when it came to leaving evidence behind.
 
  • #1,076
IMO - before I would confict someone I would need solid evidence, or really good circumstantial evidence. I just don't see it in the case.
AK would have to have been extremely luckily not to have left or have something more substantial implicating her - an her carefree attitude should have worked against her when it came to leaving evidence behind.
Well said...
 
  • #1,077
why would a young girl in puppy love... in school in Italy with hours to spend perusing art and sexy underwear... bother to leave a virtual love nest/ private apartment in the middle of the night... to go murder her roomate with some lowlifes from a bar?

in the name of god....! seriously? who does this? in the most bizarre of circumstances there is nothing that can convince me that all of these people were together in Merediths room consenting together to rape and kill this girl...

absurd....and I have been to some whacky parties...
I concur fully. As though Raffaele, soon to get his Master's degree, and Amanda, an honor student, both having love and fun, and both having family and friends who cared, had nothing better to do than rape and murder Meredith, maybe even because, as one poster said, Meredith had been a bit cool to them in the afternoon! -- And this is why posters at PMF, who say such outlandish things which somehow "prove" Guede had 2 accomplices, infuriate me. Here is another such from PMF:

I tend to think the final blow was because the victim could identify the attacker, and they had gone too far so unfortunately they made a coherent decision to remove the "witness". I dont think it was some unknown person fleeing through Perugia, instead probably someone Meredith would easily recognize.http://perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=340&start=750
 
  • #1,078
I concur fully. As though Raffaele, soon to get his Master's degree, and Amanda, an honor student, both having love and fun, and both having family and friends who cared, had nothing better to do than rape and murder Meredith, maybe even because, as one poster said, Meredith had been a bit cool to them in the afternoon! -- And this is why posters at PMF, who say such outlandish things which somehow "prove" Guede had 2 accomplices, infuriate me. Here is another such from PMF:

I tend to think the final blow was because the victim could identify the attacker, and they had gone too far so unfortunately they made a coherent decision to remove the "witness". I dont think it was some unknown person fleeing through Perugia, instead probably someone Meredith would easily recognize.http://perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=340&start=750


stockholme's ? mass psycosis? an explanation eludes me.
 
  • #1,079
  • #1,080
Of course the article is already being shredded to bits by those who believe fully in the prosecution and conviction. I wish I could have confidence that their convictions will be overturned, but I must say, I do not have faith in it. :(
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
118
Guests online
2,445
Total visitors
2,563

Forum statistics

Threads
633,156
Messages
18,636,546
Members
243,415
Latest member
n_ibbles
Back
Top