WARNING:GRAPHIC PHOTOS Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #9

[otto]

Maybe there were three sets of window coverings ... I was only aware of the window and the outside shutters. Interesting ... will have another look at it.

 

[SMK]

It looks like there are inner shutters to me.

 

[SMK]

No, when I look more, there seems to be green outer shutters, and glass and white inner shutters, so that is TWO sets---the "third" looks like a reflection in the glass....

 

[dgfred]

Yes, outer shutters (greenish)- glass panes- inner shutters (white).
The outer shutters would not shut 'completely' due to wood swelling. The inner shutters also had locking devices on them. Quite a feat for a burgler to climb up and get thru IMO... if one would even try in the first place.

 

[wasnt_me]

No, when I look more, there seems to be green outer shutters, and glass and white inner shutters, so that is TWO sets---the "third" looks like a reflection in the glass....

Yeah, but not if you look at the bigger picture I put in there. I see the reflection you mention, but look more left in the smaller picture. It's a totally different design the inner panel. See where the glass is broken, there is a reflection of the green shutter, but then the glass is missing and if you look behind the glass, you see a white panel with a very different design on it. It seems to be attached to the wall of the window. I was thinking before that it could have been the door of that cabinet next to the window, but looking at the larger photo, you still see an inner panel on the right side.

 

[ziggy]

Some clear pictures here:

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry------2.html

I get what you are seeing. One theory is that they were not completely shut but partially open, the rock made impact which is supposedly visible in one picture and that the impact site on the so called inner shutters has crushed glass in it. The impact caused the shutter to fly open and allow the glass to spray inwards into the room as is illustrated in the photo of the blue throw rug - the inward spray went that far - it was a pretty darn big rock.

Also noted is that had it been thrown from inside, there would have been some type of impact site on the outer dark green shutters which seems to be lacking and in addition, this theory fails to explain how the trajectory from and object travelling from inside to out causes a spray of glass that looks to be consistent with an outside/in trajectory. I have no idea if I spelled that right

 

[wasnt_me]

I find it completely strange that you cannot see that inner panel in this photograph.

 

[SMK]

Yeah, but not if you look at the bigger picture I put in there. I see the reflection you mention, but look more left in the smaller picture. It's a totally different design the inner panel. See where the glass is broken, there is a reflection of the green shutter, but then the glass is missing and if you look behind the glass, you see a white panel with a very different design on it. It seems to be attached to the wall of the window. I was thinking before that it could have been the door of that cabinet next to the window, but looking at the larger photo, you still see an inner panel on the right side.

OK, I DO see that now, yes. In the big picture....it has a solid white wood with design, plus there are the glass and white, plus the green = 3 sets of shutters, oy vey.....

 

[dgfred]

Some clear pictures here:

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry------2.html

I get what you are seeing. One theory is that they were not completely shut but partially open, the rock made impact which is supposedly visible in one picture and that the impact site on the so called inner shutters has crushed glass in it. The impact caused the shutter to fly open and allow the glass to spray inwards into the room as is illustrated in the photo of the blue throw rug - the inward spray went that far - it was a pretty darn big rock.

Also noted is that had it been thrown from inside, there would have been some type of impact site on the outer dark green shutters which seems to be lacking and in addition, this theory fails to explain how the trajectory from and object travelling from inside to out causes a spray of glass that looks to be consistent with an outside/in trajectory. I have no idea if I spelled that right

:spinner: Note if the window was opened (to the inside) the rock could have been thrown from the inside. There is a sort of impact site on the 'white' inner shutters. Hard to figure out anything from the 'glass trajectory' in the room IMO.
It is my belief that a rock was found, the inner shutters and glass window were opened, green outer shutters closed, and the rock thrown against the window from the inside.

 

[SMK]

I find it completely strange that you cannot see that inner panel in this photograph.

I do not in this one, but see my other post, I DO see it in the other one---3 sets. One with glass and white, one with white etching, and one with green louvres.

 

[ziggy]

There are some things that don't make sense on both sides of that shutter issue. I wish someone could do a recreation of how the rock made it into the room, past the inner wooden shutters. And BTW, her room, by the look of the table and the clutter on it, was not as tidy as she claimed, imho. The way the shoes are left looks just like a typical girl's room from my college days and all through the years.

 

[wasnt_me]

Some clear pictures here:

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry------2.html

I get what you are seeing. One theory is that they were not completely shut but partially open, the rock made impact which is supposedly visible in one picture and that the impact site on the so called inner shutters has crushed glass in it. The impact caused the shutter to fly open and allow the glass to spray inwards into the room as is illustrated in the photo of the blue throw rug - the inward spray went that far - it was a pretty darn big rock.

Also noted is that had it been thrown from inside, there would have been some type of impact site on the outer dark green shutters which seems to be lacking and in addition, this theory fails to explain how the trajectory from and object travelling from inside to out causes a spray of glass that looks to be consistent with an outside/in trajectory. I have no idea if I spelled that right

Okay, I think I need to read this, but I don't have time yet! I hate to have to duck out on the convo and then come back later when you guys will be onto something else, but this window perplexes me. I see the scuff marks, so that holds with the theory that something hit the inner shutters. If there are marks on these inner shutters, then I can no longer rule out that someone from outside the house threw it into the house, as I was debating about in that long post earlier.

 

[dgfred]

Is that where the boots were prior to being 'ransacked'? Is that how she left her room? This is where the 'supposed' truth finding really comes in to play.

 

[ziggy]

:spinner: Note if the window was opened (to the inside) the rock could have been thrown from the inside. There is a sort of impact site on the 'white' inner shutters. Hard to figure out anything from the 'glass trajectory' in the room IMO.
It is my belief that a rock was found, the inner shutters and glass window were opened, green outer shutters closed, and the rock thrown against the window from the inside.

That could be - I get your description and seeing that possibility. So you are saying that they closed the outer green shutters, opened the window first as though someone came in through it, and then tossed the rock at the window.

The devil's advocate on that one says - a rock thrown at such a very short distance from inside the room may have not been thrown hard enough to cause that sort of impact damage.

I mean, you look at the rock and the glass and you can determine it would not have to be thrown very hard to break the glass at close range. I'm just thinking from the "staging" mind. I don't think they would hurl it.

 

[wasnt_me]

Is that where the boots were prior to being 'ransacked'? Is that how she left her room? This is where the 'supposed' truth finding really comes in to play.

I don't know anything about F's boots being moved, but I ready a theory about some boots being kicked under the bed in MK's room.

 

[dgfred]

That could be - I get your description and seeing that possibility. So you are saying that they closed the outer green shutters, opened the window first as though someone came in through it, and then tossed the rock at the window.

The devil's advocate on that one says - a rock thrown at such a very short distance from inside the room may have not been thrown hard enough to cause that sort of impact damage.

I mean, you look at the rock and the glass and you can determine it would not have to be thrown very hard to break the glass at close range. I'm just thinking from the "staging" mind. I don't think they would hurl it.

Alright, making progress then. :rocker:

Have you seen the rock and noted the weight/size? Kind of big rock.

They didn't have to hurl it, it could have been held, wrapped in something, tossed, etc.

 

[ziggy]

Is that where the boots were prior to being 'ransacked'? Is that how she left her room? This is where the 'supposed' truth finding really comes in to play.

I suppose. The slippers look most natural to me in the way they are left - have you had a pre-teen or teen girl and been in their room?

Boots bring up a memory of that show where the ex-criminal burglers breached peoples' homes to show them how easy it would be to steal everything in minutes. They ALWAYS went for the boots...they said women always try to hide money and other valuable things like weapons in boots. This would be something a thief would know or think of...so maybe the boots were targeted, don't know. Do you have any information on that that you feel is relevant?

 

[wasnt_me]

That could be - I get your description and seeing that possibility. So you are saying that they closed the outer green shutters, opened the window first as though someone came in through it, and then tossed the rock at the window.

The devil's advocate on that one says - a rock thrown at such a very short distance from inside the room may have not been thrown hard enough to cause that sort of impact damage.

I mean, you look at the rock and the glass and you can determine it would not have to be thrown very hard to break the glass at close range. I'm just thinking from the "staging" mind. I don't think they would hurl it.

But in the photos, it appears that marker "R" is supposed to be an impact mark for the rock. "R" is marked on the white inner shutter, an "R" is facing outside the house. This is supposed by me just looking at all the pictures at: http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/RonHendry------2.html but I haven't read any of the material yet.

 

[dgfred]

I suppose. The slippers look most natural to me in the way they are left - have you had a pre-teen or teen girl and been in their room?

Boots bring up a memory of that show where the ex-criminal burglers breached peoples' homes to show them how easy it would be to steal everything in minutes. They ALWAYS went for the boots...they said women always try to hide money and other valuable things like weapons in boots. This would be something a thief would know or think of...so maybe the boots were targeted, don't know. Do you have any information on that that you feel is relevant?

I have a 20 year old daughter, 21 in November, in college... sooo yes I have.

 

[ziggy]

Alright, making progress then. :rocker:

Have you seen the rock and noted the weight/size? Kind of big rock.

They didn't have to hurl it, it could have been held, wrapped in something, tossed, etc.

Yep could have been except now you're stretching to a point that starts to get outside what the acts a non-career criminal would perform and fighting some semantics.

Your what if fails to explain how if it were wrapped it would leave such an impact and if not hurled how the impact would contain the crushed glass fragments imbedded therein.

If wrapped, first - that's way too criminal mindish and second, it would soften the impact on the wood.

If not hurled because it was so big - would not have reached a velocity to cause the type of damage created by the alleged impact.