Warren Jeffs FLDS compound in Texas surrounded by police #4

[Leila]

From this article: "We've got nothing to hide. We've broken no laws. "It makes me feel like a criminal."



My response: You should feel like a criminal because you have broken laws- rape, incest, and bigamy for starters!



More from this article:Williams, who said he now lives in southern Utah, said he has three sons among the children from the YFZ Ranch in state custody in San Angelo.
Williams said that when he left the FLDS church, his wife left him and came to the YFZ Ranch.
He made it clear that despite having left the sect, he has not repudiated its beliefs.
"The heavenly father is boss, and Warren Jeffs is his representative on Earth," Williams said, referring to the leader of the sect who is now serving prison time for being an accomplice to rape.
Williams said he wants to obey the laws of the land as long they don't conflict with the laws of the church. When pressed by reporters, he said that when they do conflict, he would disobey the laws of the land and endure persecution.



My response: This is exactly why this cult must be broken up and the children never returned!

I agree!

I wonder if this man voluntarily left the FLDS or if he's one of those 21 men who were booted out and their wives/children given to another man? It really sounds like the latter.

 

[Ca-Sun]

ok I read the article at the link above. I think I see where some of the confusion comes in. Before 2005 the law in Texas allowed its citizens to marry at age 14. Since 2005 the law has been changed to 16. So if a girl became pregnant at age 14 in 2005 she would be a 17 year old mother now. I wonder how the state can prosecute a person for doing something that was legal then and isn't now? Their best case is to find girls who are currently pregnant and under 16 and what I had read is that there are possibly 3 girls in that category. If so then that is less than the number of girls who get pregnant in Texas at the same age who are not FLDS.

The last figure I heard was that there are 5 girls between 16 and 19 who are pregnant.

We aren't talking about people living FREELY in the state of Texas who chose to get pregnant; we are talking about young girls in a controlled, abusive environment who are told they will be "spiritually" married so some old geezer can impregnate her. Glow, this is RAPE. Three, 5 or 20 - who cares about the exact number according to a state law that was changed? Rape is rape and even ONE is one too many!

 

[LovingTheChaos]

Does anyone have any information on what conditions the children are being kept in currently?

Do they have toys to play with? Are they attending classes? Do they get to go outside & play? I am getting concerned, as this drags on, that the kids are cared for properly. A sports arena is no place for children. I don't think that they should go back, but something needs to happen to get them into a more normalized environment soon.

ETA - I found an update from an above link:

http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2008/apr/22/sanangelo-coliseum-locked-down-as-buses-on/

They are shipping them out to foster homes all over TX. Every attempts wil be made to keep siblings together.

 

[Floh]

Does anyone have any information on what conditions the children are being kept in currently?

Do they have toys to play with? Are they attending classes? Do they get to go outside & play? I am getting concerned, as this drags on, that the kids are cared for properly. A sports arena is no place for children. I don't think that they should go back, but something needs to happen to get them into a more normalized environment soon.

They have been given toys according to links in the thread and also they have now left the sports area and have been taken elsewhere. somewhere which hasn't as yet been publicised which i imagine will be to keep them in a protected environment away from those who have damaged them pre the raid.

 

[LovingTheChaos]

Thanks Floh - I have another question - Were nursing mothers allowed to stay with their infants?

 

[Leila]

Things are becoming crystal clear now! After reading the material at the link below, I can see how this all came together.

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬/2008/04/short_creek_redux_colorado_cit.php

Warren Jeffs exerted tremendous control over FLDS members in Colorado City, AZ and Hildale, UT by retaining control over the homes they lived in. When the state of Utah took control of the FLDS property in these two communities and is holding it in trust, Warren Jeffs total control began to slip. Here's a quote from the above publication:

"A large portion of Colorado City people no longer follow Warren Jeffs. It was just a matter of them having their freedom, when he lost the power to kick them out of their homes if they didn’t do what he said. Then they no longer paid him allegiance."

We've read that Warren Jeffs built the YFZ ranch in Texas as his ultimate FLDS community. When it came time to decide who would go live at the Texas ranch, Warren Jeffs selected those who were the most loyal to him. Based on the above quote from the Arizona publication, it was more a matter of choosing those who were STILL loyal to him.

Warren Jeffs put those loyal followers in a compound in Texas, surrounded by fencing and guards at the entrance. The land, homes, and all within that compound is owned by the FLDS, achieving what they could no longer achieve in Colorado City and Hilsdale, with the state of Utah maintaining control of the property in those two communities.

The YFZ ranch in Texas represents Warren Jeffs total control of the people who live there.

If it's true that the men from the YFZ ranch are not showing up for DNA testing, and if it's also true that many of the men have left the YFZ ranch, I think it's a safe bet they wouldn't go back to Colorado City or Hildale where they don't have a strong base of support. They're more likely to have gone to a safe house of some sort, perhaps over the border into Mexico where they reportedly have a FLDS community.

If this turns out to be accurate, then it's safe to assume that even though many of the men have left, a few men remain to run the ranch and care for the livestock. But, I'm sure there's cell phone contact and the leadership is still in charge.

Speaking of leadership...........Merrill Jessop is the leader of the YFZ ranch. Yet, he's never shown his face let alone having made a statement on behalf of the community. I bet he was one of the first to leave.

 

[Leila]

Does anyone have any information on what conditions the children are being kept in currently?

Do they have toys to play with? Are they attending classes? Do they get to go outside & play? I am getting concerned, as this drags on, that the kids are cared for properly. A sports arena is no place for children. I don't think that they should go back, but something needs to happen to get them into a more normalized environment soon.

ETA - I found an update from an above link:

http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2008/apr/22/sanangelo-coliseum-locked-down-as-buses-on/

They are shipping them out to foster homes all over TX. Every attempts wil be made to keep siblings together.

It was reported early on that people from all over the state of Texas were sending toys and needed items. The women from several San Angelo churches got together in long all-day sessions to make individual quilts for each child. It was reported that their goal was to complete the project within 10 days, and that was reported shortly after the children were brought to San Angelo.

 

[SuziQ]

Here is a link to info on the South Dakota compound. Photo gallery at the very bottom:

http://www.childbrides.org/dakota.html

 

[Moe]

It would not surprise me one bit if the COWARDS, oh I mean the men ran away. Did the woman go too, and why is no one on this story?

 

[SuziQ]

Apparently, this is turning out the way many of us expected - the men not willing to give their DNA. I'm sure that any man who's fathered a child with an underage girl is going to avoid giving DNA, fearing it would lead to criminal charges.

There was one comment following that article I saw that I hope will be confirmed or refuted in the next day or two - here's the comment:

I heard the news reporters from San Angelo say last night that the men were all gone from the compound. So they not only won't claim their children, they also leave the women to take care of themselves, after having held them on the premises for years.

Much to the embarassment of the Utah AG, about 80? Kingston men fled when ordered to take DNA tests.

 

[SuziQ]

http://www.gosanangelo.com/news/2008/apr/22/dna-sampling-of-ranch-parents-starts-in-eldorado/

Only a few people from the YFZ Ranch had appeared for DNA testing by 10:30 a.m. at the collection point near the Schleicher County Courthouse.
Three men who appeared to be polygamist sect members entered the sampling area at 10:15 a.m. One left at 10:30 and denied all interview requests, so there was no way to immediately verify whether he in fact submitted to the DNA sampling.

 

[SuziQ]

According to this article, only a handfull of men and about a dozen women submitted to testing today.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA042208.polygamistsdnatest.en.8c278418.html

 

[LovingTheChaos]

According to this article, only a handfull of men and about a dozen women submitted to testing today.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA042208.polygamistsdnatest.en.8c278418.html

I can't even imagine this - come he!! or high water, I would be doing whatever it took to get my kids back. Maybe they are going to write the children off as being 'tainted' by the outside world. They hold no value to them if they are inspired by ideas outside of the compound...

 

[SewingDeb]

I can't even imagine this - come he!! or high water, I would be doing whatever it took to get my kids back. Maybe they are going to write the children off as being 'tainted' by the outside world. They hold no value to them if they are inspired by ideas outside of the compound...

That is horrifying to think of them no longer valuing the children since they have been tainted by outside influences, but maybe it is in the best interest of the children.

 

[Native New Yorker]

Thanks Floh - I have another question - Were nursing mothers allowed to stay with their infants?

What nursing mothers? Do you mean wet nursing mothers? They passed the babies around, so no one would get attached to "their baby". Not the same as when I nursed my girls...this was community living....

I am glad to see this thread moving on to real issues, and AWAY from the last two weeks of circular arguments which have gone nowhere.....maybe that is why we could not get a separate forum?

I hope we can continue to focus on the lives of a victimized population of women and children, and stop splitting hairs over what constitutes rape and pedophilia. We can leave that to the FLDS defense lawyers, though I would not mind one thread on a forum being for that topic. In the meantime, though, let's please focus on the victims.....

 

[cheko1]

What yellow belly chicken chits!!!!!
I just knew nobody would show up for the DNA tests or else the young guys who have worked & paid there dues for a young wife & only has one wife would show up.

The old geezers could care less about the kids. Same way with the women....they all put on such a fake phoney act. SHAME ON THEM ALL!

 

[Texana]

What nursing mothers? Do you mean wet nursing mothers? They passed the babies around, so no one would get attached to "their baby". Not the same as when I nursed my girls...this was community living....

I am glad to see this thread moving on to real issues, and AWAY from the last two weeks of circular arguments which have gone nowhere.....maybe that is why we could not get a separate forum?

I hope we can continue to focus on the lives of a victimized population of women and children, and stop splitting hairs over what constitutes rape and pedophilia. We can leave that to the FLDS defense lawyers, though I would not mind one thread on a forum being for that topic. In the meantime, though, let's please focus on the victims.....

Well said.

 

[cheko1]

Has anyone heard anything about where they all went?
Am sure they're all scared to death after reading how accurate DNA testing is. :furious: :furious:

 

[Leila]

What nursing mothers? Do you mean wet nursing mothers? They passed the babies around, so no one would get attached to "their baby". Not the same as when I nursed my girls...this was community living....

I am glad to see this thread moving on to real issues, and AWAY from the last two weeks of circular arguments which have gone nowhere.....maybe that is why we could not get a separate forum?

I hope we can continue to focus on the lives of a victimized population of women and children, and stop splitting hairs over what constitutes rape and pedophilia. We can leave that to the FLDS defense lawyers, though I would not mind one thread on a forum being for that topic. In the meantime, though, let's please focus on the victims.....

Well stated Native New Yorker........the focus should be on the real issues of what's happening with this case.

It would appear, by the lack of cooperation of the FLDS men and women, that their concern over exposure of their cult is paramount to their desire to get their children back.

Didn't we hear those women who were interviewed at the ranch state that they would do whatever it took to get their children back? Yet, require them to take a DNA test or identify themselves and they won't do even that.

 

[Leila]

Has anyone heard anything about where they all went?
Am sure they're all scared to death after reading how accurate DNA testing is. :furious: :furious:

After reading that publication from Arizona (see my post above on this page), I doubt the men would return to Colorado City or Hildale. They don't have a strong base of support there. My best guess is an unknown safe house type of place or, over the border into Mexico where they reportedly have an FLDS community.

I bet any men left at the FLDS ranch are young men with one wife, or young men who are single.

There was a comment on the San Angelo news site that the members of the FLDS compound in S.D. have left that compound too.