Was Burke Involved? # 4

[Ambitioned]

Those just cannot be the longjohns that JBR was found in, they are boys clothes! And very short in the leg, like knickers for baseball.

Where did you get this photo UK GUY?

I put this photo up on the Ask Dave thread. It was from that article posted today.

Didn't Linda Wilcox say she wore Burke's castoffs?

 

[OliviaG1996]

The article posted yesterday from Daily Camera (Here) featured a photo of the size 12 "Wednesday" underwear JBR was found in. (Picture).

Since the photos of both the longjohns and underwear feature the circular green sticker in the lower-right corner and a red "evidence-holder" clipped to them, I'm assuming they're both the real articles of clothing found on JBR.

 

[Ambitioned]

The article posted yesterday from Daily Camera (Here) featured a photo of the size 12 "Wednesday" underwear JBR was found in. (Picture).

Since the photos of both the longjohns and underwear feature the circular green sticker in the lower-right corner and a red "evidence-holder" clipped to them, I'm assuming they're both the real articles of clothing found on JBR.

Yup. Urine stain on both longjohns and undies look to be the same area

 

[PositiveLight]

This is an interview with Linda Wilcox. VERY interesting to say the least. Also going in to the family dynamics.
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-linda-wilcox.htm

 

[PositiveLight]

The photo of the long johns is telling to me. First they are soaked in urine. Secondly they are obviously boys due to the fly in front. Third they seem to look too big for JonBenet. JMOO but considering she was put in size 12-14 panties and now these NOT tight long johns, it would have been easy to put these both on her. I had in my mind them trying to wrestle JonBenet's tight long johns on her. This makes much more sense now.

 

[BBB167893]

Pretty much. If you go over her interviews carefully. (Hello Excedrin) She has so many inconsistencies and lies. I think it just snowballed out of control and she lost track of which lies were which.

And then she was also clueless. "I don't recall" "I haven't a clue" "Maybe, I don't know..." It's a blooming miracle she remembered her name.

And people say she was valiumed out of her mind as if that's an excuse. That's no excuse. Your daughter is dead and you believe IDI. You better damn well try to find the killer.

What's the old saying? A good liar needs a good memory.

 

[PositiveLight]

What's the old saying? A good liar needs a good memory.

Amen!
Tell the truth from the beginning and the story won't change. No need to memorize prior statements either.

 

[icedtea4me]

The article posted yesterday from Daily Camera (Here) featured a photo of the size 12 "Wednesday" underwear JBR was found in. (Picture).

Since the photos of both the longjohns and underwear feature the circular green sticker in the lower-right corner and a red "evidence-holder" clipped to them, I'm assuming they're both the real articles of clothing found on JBR.

Maybe John was long that night.

 

[ghostrighter]

Question I've always had: would JBR's eye be droopy immediately or shortly after the head blow? Would the eye still be droopy after the funeral home prepped her for viewing? MOO

 

[BBB167893]

Question I've always had: would JBR's eye be droopy immediately or shortly after the head blow?

It's certainly possible that it would be.

Would the eye still be droopy after the funeral home prepped her for viewing? MOO

I guess it depends on how bad it was and how skilled the undertaker was.

 

[singularity]

I agree with all of the above.

I don't know icedtea4me personally but unless I am mistaking him or her for someone else, they have been a longtime poster on the case and used to post on FFJ. Not a troll, just someone who isn't necessarily on the BDI train. And from what I've seen in reading old FFJ threads, someone whose posts are pretty good. I don't think they're trying to disrupt the thread. They may come off a little blunt because they've been here so long and are skeptical. That said, I'm not a mind reader.

Anyway, I just wanted to say that because I like reading from all the posters involved here and wanted to nip any acrimony in the bud if possible. Ultimately we're all on the same side.

icedtea4me tries to keep some of the discussion grounded when it veers into some unconventional areas. I also get a 'devil's advocate' vibe from some of their posts. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

Some of those old FFJ discussions are great. if people have no problem with reading old discussions they cant respond to, I highly recommend digging into their old threads, especially the stuff around 2006. I have no idea why the site is closed to registration. I've seen the handful of people still there complain a bit about the site's low activity but obviously it cant increase if they wont allow anyone to join.

I would actually like to see more "No way Burke could have done it!" posters. Echo chambers can get dull.

I'm one of them. Most of them seem to be fairly quiet and have thrown it in neutral and probably waiting for the storm to pass.

Are these BR's longjohns, i.e. did he redress JonBenet in the size-12's and longjohns, all that staining looks creepy?

.

Jesus. Creepy indeed. It's also very sad. Is that a small tear? I assume if so that it was used for testing.

This looks more like thermal underwear to me.

Me too.

The article posted yesterday from Daily Camera (Here) featured a photo of the size 12 "Wednesday" underwear JBR was found in. (Picture).

Dear lord. They both have huge stains. Neither are the original panties she was supposedly first wearing that night. God only knows what that pair looked like if they felt the need to dispose of those yet allow these to be found.

While not an exact match obviously, both stains appear to be similar....start on the top right and drift downwards. On the panties, the stains appear to be on the lower backside as well. I agree with Olivia...these have to be what she was really wearing.

 

[singularity]

If she urinated near the wine cellar, why are these stains there? She may have been staged long before she was strangled.

 

[BoldBear]

The volume on BDI is very loud right now, but I don't completely like the sound. (I'm not BDI) Kolar's book and theory are great. I was thrilled with the CBS special because we were finally getting to see evidence that wasn't so blatantly dismissive of RDI. And the BDI theory is plausible. There's a lot of logic to it.

There are, however, psychological issues that no one has really dived into here that may explain Burke's behavior. I'm not talking about the Dr Phil interview, but his childhood behavior.

The Dr Phil interview was a trainwreck. Good Morning America also comment on it http://abcnews.go.com/US/da-opens-cleared-ramsey-family-jonbenets-murder/story?id=43106426. GMA was only parroting what everyone here on WS was saying for a long time. Nevertheless, I saw Burke as being scared to death during the DP interview. His smile and his nervousness were a defense. And no, I'm not saying he's guilty or innocent. I also believe he was being deceptive during the interview about some things.

One of the things that bothers me was the introduction of the flashlight. John and Patsy denied knowing anything about it. Now Burke brought it into the game (Burke actually didn't say the words on camera but Dr Phil did). Why? To mix metaphors here, I think he brought it into the game to take if off the table. He put the flashlight into John's hands that night. John and Patsy had nothing to do with the flashlight and there it is. This was 20 years later. I can't help to think that this wasn't done by accident. So what might come out to put the flashlight into John's hands? Why the foreshadowing? And then why put Burke onto the 1st floor at the same time his sister was being murdered? He's covering. I can't help but think he jumped into the path of the bullet because he's wearing a vest.

Yes, I am a crazy conspiracy theorist. I hang out here and obsess about a 20 year old murder mystery.

All my opinion, of course.

 

[mrseeker]

The volume on BDI is very loud right now, but I don't completely like the sound. (I'm not BDI) Kolar's book and theory are great. I was thrilled with the CBS special because we were finally getting to see evidence that wasn't so blatantly dismissive of RDI. And the BDI theory is plausible. There's a lot of logic to it.

There are, however, psychological issues that no one has really dived into here that may explain Burke's behavior. I'm not talking about the Dr Phil interview, but his childhood behavior.

The Dr Phil interview was a trainwreck. Good Morning America also comment on it http://abcnews.go.com/US/da-opens-cleared-ramsey-family-jonbenets-murder/story?id=43106426. GMA was only parroting what everyone here on WS was saying for a long time. Nevertheless, I saw Burke as being scared to death during the DP interview. His smile and his nervousness were a defense. And no, I'm not saying he's guilty or innocent. I also believe he was being deceptive during the interview about some things.

One of the things that bothers me was the introduction of the flashlight. John and Patsy denied knowing anything about it. Now Burke brought it into the game (Burke actually didn't say the words on camera but Dr Phil did). Why? To mix metaphors here, I think he brought it into the game to take if off the table. He put the flashlight into John's hands that night. John and Patsy had nothing to do with the flashlight and there it is. This was 20 years later. I can't help to think that this wasn't done by accident. So what might come out to put the flashlight into John's hands? Why the foreshadowing? And then why put Burke onto the 1st floor at the same time his sister was being murdered? He's covering. I can't help but think he jumped into the path of the bullet because he's wearing a vest.

Yes, I am a crazy conspiracy theorist. I hang out here and obsess about a 20 year old murder mystery.

All my opinion, of course.

I have never been a BDI either and this interview with DP is a disaster for him. Now I don't know what to think. I have been a strong PDI for decades. I pointed this out pages ago regarding BR being downstairs after everyone went to bed. In John Douglas's book, The Cases That Haunt Us, Douglas says JR and BR did not go to bed right away because BR insisted on staying up to put a toy together. So is this new story an intentional revision, or faulty memory, or did BR go down even later than JR knew. Douglas, who I have always respected, except in this case, was part of Team Ramsey. His book is based on what they told him. Did BR just forget his father stayed up with him? So looking back, when does JR say they all went to bed? The timeline is narrowing. The flashlight explanation is ridiculous to me. Who walks around their house with one when they have power except to look in poorly lit storage areas perhaps? Or to go outside maybe? I think the flashlight being out is something everyone in the household would understand. Why are they so obtuse about it? One of the 3 who did not die that night is responsible and the 2 still living know what happened. To continue to suggest there is another person, and intruder, is insulting. DP should have said it just that way, but he was not doing this to enlighten but to continue the Ramsey ruse and drive his ratings.

 

[MURDERER_SERVANT]

I have doubts that P would put on JB those old white boys shorts for staging.
JBR was a child beauty queen and the shorts even had that boys thing in the front. The whole world might see her in those in the morning when the police came and photos taken. Don't think she put them on her or even handled them to J. That was how she was found by parents imo.
This makes me think whether size 12 panties are B's too. Jenny's panties thing seemed like a lie to me from the getgo.
I would like to search both JB and B's wardrobe and drawers at the time .

 

[mrseeker]

I have doubts that P would put on JB those old white boys shorts for staging.
JBR was a child beauty queen and the shorts even had that boys thing in the front. The whole world might see her in those in the morning when the police came and photos taken. Don't think she put them on her or even handled them to J. That was how she was found by parents imo.
This makes me think whether size 12 panties are B's too. Jenny's panties thing seemed like a lie to me from the getgo.
I would like to search both JB and B's wardrobe and drawers at the time .

Maybe it had something to do with her bed wetting and soiling. PR might have thought it added some protection.

 

[treeseeker]

Maybe those long johns were in the basement, and PR's story about dressing her in them initially was a lie.

 

[TeaTime]

Maybe she was drunk.

 

[southernmimi]

A large amount of urine for a small child. I don't think she had been to gone to bed or the bathroom before her death. I also don't think the ugly boy thermals were staging. Sadly, I think she probably slept in those. Only a beauty queen when others can see.

 

[mrseeker]

A large amount of urine for a small child. I don't think she had been to gone to bed or the bathroom before her death. I also don't think the ugly boy thermals were staging. Sadly, I think she probably slept in those. Only a beauty queen when others can see.

You would also think, if she had a serious bed wetting issue they would have woke her up to use the bathroom when they got home. She was not a toddler, and it was not that terribly late. JR said after he carried JBR to her room, he was with BR assembling the toy and PR was with JBR getting her ready for bed whatever that means. He claimed PR went to bed from there, and he stayed up for awhile with BR. So why was her bladder full anyway. Sounds like something happened before she went through the going to bed ritual. And with a known bed wetter that ritual surely would have include a stop at the toilet.