was madeleine EVER there?

[gord]

I believe she is either in Portugal or Spain, within the distance that the rental car drove on one the McCann's excursions. Fatima? Huelva? Another village along the way?

The main road near the resort was being dug up and paved over, with holes everywhere. They didn't have to dig a grave. This article has a good map showing which streets were paved over since then, and how close they were to the family's hotel:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2005320001-2007420470,00.html

from the moment this story broke the Mccaans have been under the glare of the worlds media , TV , paparazzi , police , etc etc

Every where they go some journalist usualy follows them with the hope of a good story / picture .

I just cant buy the fact under this sort of scrutiny they could just dispose of a body 25 days later . - at this stage the police probably has their suspicions anyway and would be keeping an eye on things.

anything I suppose is possible in this world - but I just cant buy that theory

 

[april4sky]

from the moment this story broke the Mccaans have been under the glare of the worlds media , TV , paparazzi , police , etc etc

Every where they go some journalist usualy follows them with the hope of a good story / picture .

I just cant buy the fact under this sort of scrutiny they could just dispose of a body 25 days later . - at this stage the police probably has their suspicions anyway and would be keeping an eye on things.

anything I suppose is possible in this world - but I just cant buy that theory

I can't buy it either gord. The whole thing sounds too ludicrous.

How could thay have managed it with the worlds press and apparently the police watching their every move.
They were also in an unfamiliar country where they wouldn't have known the area.

And most ludicrous of all...Can you imagine the state a body would be in after 25 days.
You wouldn't need to rely on dogs to pick up that scent.

 

[ThoughtFox]

from the moment this story broke the Mccaans have been under the glare of the worlds media , TV , paparazzi , police , etc etc

Every where they go some journalist usualy follows them with the hope of a good story / picture .

I just cant buy the fact under this sort of scrutiny they could just dispose of a body 25 days later . - at this stage the police probably has their suspicions anyway and would be keeping an eye on things.

anything I suppose is possible in this world - but I just cant buy that theory

Three little letters - DNA. Also hair and body fluids.

The parents said they made numerous trips to the airport to pick up family members. That is how they explain the DNA, so in saying that, they are admitting that there was something in the trunk.

And most ludicrous of all...Can you imagine the state a body would be in after 25 days.
You wouldn't need to rely on dogs to pick up that scent.

Well according to the McCanns there were some nasty odors already emanating from their vehicle.

They said the cadaver dogs were confused by the "rotting meat in the trash bags" and "dirty diapers from the twins." Imagine that, if you will! :hand:

If you wanted to mask the odor of a dead body, those would do it. But they would smell just as bad, so the McCann's must have been able to deal with the smell, right?

No one put that story about the trash and the dirty nappies out in the public except the McCanns - they volunteered it to the press.

 

[SleuthMom]

Do we have any good reports that say who rented the car before the Mc Canns did? IF it was one of the Tapas friends then probably that person could have carry the body right away after death in that same car. No need to wait for 25 days.

 

[gord]

Three little letters - DNA. Also hair and body fluids.

The parents said they made numerous trips to the airport to pick up family members. That is how they explain the DNA, so in saying that, they are admitting that there was something in the trunk.


Well according to the McCanns there were some nasty odors already emanating from their vehicle.

They said the cadaver dogs were confused by the "rotting meat in the trash bags" and "dirty diapers from the twins." Imagine that, if you will! :hand:

If you wanted to mask the odor of a dead body, those would do it. But they would smell just as bad, so the McCann's must have been able to deal with the smell, right?

No one put that story about the trash and the dirty nappies out in the public except the McCanns - they volunteered it to the press.

The DNA thing has been done to death

1stly - It has not yet been established 100% that it is even Maddy DNA - the twins will have very simillar DNA

2ndly If it can be islotated to be 100% DNA then we are talking about minute amounts - whic could have come from a miriad of cross contamination opportunities

I go back to a point I made a while ago - if a body had placed in that trunk especially a dead body there would be a mass of DNA - it would have jumped out the trunk itself - it would not be minute trace elements that it seems the police have . IF the police had that sort of evidence then the Mccaans would be in a portoguese cell waiting for a trial date

to say that they are somehow admiting that someone was in the trunk is just not true . Numerous DNA experts have said how a hair from Maddy could have got onto anything - the twins toys etc etc .Sweat , saliva from weeks before can still be found -

 

[april4sky]

The DNA thing has been done to death

1stly - It has not yet been established 100% that it is even Maddy DNA - the twins will have very simillar DNA

2ndly If it can be islotated to be 100% DNA then we are talking about minute amounts - whic could have come from a miriad of cross contamination opportunities

I go back to a point I made a while ago - if a body had placed in that trunk especially a dead body there would be a mass of DNA - it would have jumped out the trunk itself - it would not be minute trace elements that it seems the police have . IF the police had that sort of evidence then the Mccaans would be in a portoguese cell waiting for a trial date

to say that they are somehow admiting that someone was in the trunk is just not true . Numerous DNA experts have said how a hair from Maddy could have got onto anything - the twins toys etc etc .Sweat , saliva from weeks before can still be found -

Yes the portuguese police have now backed away from the DNA and hair claims being as important as they had first claimed.

The DNA is no longer said to be 100% Madeleines.

And as for the "Hair"

In an interview with Dr Baden on Greta.

He said they would have known within ten minutes of testing "Madeleine's" hair found in the car whether it was from a live Madeleine or a dead Madeleine.

Do the Portuguese police already know this?

They have said they don't have any evidence that Madeleine is dead.

Some things are still being tested but If Dr Baden is right the hair test wouldn't have taken this long.

 

[IrishMist]

from the moment this story broke the Mccaans have been under the glare of the worlds media , TV , paparazzi , police , etc etc

Every where they go some journalist usualy follows them with the hope of a good story / picture .

I just cant buy the fact under this sort of scrutiny they could just dispose of a body 25 days later . - at this stage the police probably has their suspicions anyway and would be keeping an eye on things.

anything I suppose is possible in this world - but I just cant buy that theory

I'm with you on this one, Gord.

 

[april4sky]

It just seems to get ever more ridiculous.

The latest in a long list of unfounded claims made in the Portuguese press in an attempt to incriminate the McCanns.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...tml?in_article_id=484238&in_page_id=1811&ct=5


The Diario de Noticias claimed police believed that the couple disposed of Madeleine's body together on August 3, three months to the day after she "disappeared".

Diario de Noticias also stated that English Catholics have a tradition of visiting the tomb of a loved one three months after their death. :waitasec:

Several British photographers accompanied them on the day trip, in which the McCanns handed out Madeleine posters and wrist bands at a bus and petrol station.

The police case against the McCanns has been sinking ever since detectives failed to extract confessions from the couple during two days of questioning.

Yesterday, it emerged police have now scaled back plans to dig in Praia da Luz, including the area around the church where the McCanns prayed, saying they will only excavate if they have "credible" leads.

 

[philamena]

from the moment this story broke the Mccaans have been under the glare of the worlds media , TV , paparazzi , police , etc etc

Every where they go some journalist usualy follows them with the hope of a good story / picture .

I just cant buy the fact under this sort of scrutiny they could just dispose of a body 25 days later . - at this stage the police probably has their suspicions anyway and would be keeping an eye on things.

anything I suppose is possible in this world - but I just cant buy that theory

I agree too.
Seriously where would they hide the body for 25 days?
Unless it was put into a freezer, the body would start decomposing and it would----well it would have an odor.

 

[IrishMist]

I agree too.
Seriously where would they hide the body for 25 days?
Unless it was put into a freezer, the body would start decomposing and it would----well it would have an odor.

And where would they find such a freezer in a vacation apartment?

 

[Tuba]

I've read that one of the diners/doctors actually changed his clothes while on a check of the children & returned to the table in fresh clothes. Supposedly a question of his daughter vomiting. This report, like most, was unreliably sourced but has anyone else come across it? If so, do you believe the doctor's explanation?

 

[CaliKid]

In July when the British detectives and dogs arrived in Portugal, there was a question about someone changing clothes and the purchase and use of bleach in the apartment. We never found out if it was true.

 

[Barnaby]

I've read that one of the diners/doctors actually changed his clothes while on a check of the children & returned to the table in fresh clothes. Supposedly a question of his daughter vomiting. This report, like most, was unreliably sourced but has anyone else come across it? If so, do you believe the doctor's explanation?

No I dont believe anything that those doctors said!
What human being leaves a child who is vomiting in an apartment alone & goes to dinner UGH"
Caring medical profession my a**!

 

[SleuthMom]

No I dont believe anything that those doctors said!
What human being leaves a child who is vomiting in an apartment alone & goes to dinner UGH"
Caring medical profession my a**!

:clap:

 

[hcc2007]

And where would they find such a freezer in a vacation apartment?

Didn't they move out of the apartment, like, the next day? And weren't they settled in a villa (full-sized house) by the end of the following week? (or something on that order). A full-sized house in a hot climate probably would have a freezer.

Not that the frozen-body scenario is very plausible to me. I mean, these people may be careless, neglectful, and even self-centered, but that's a long way from being ghouls.

 

[CaliKid]

It wasn't the end of the week. They were given another apartment to stay in until the PJ were done with the original one. Then for some inexplicable reason they chose to move back in to the first one (although why any parent would want to live in the rooms their daughter was "abducted from" is beyond me!). It wasn't until early-to-mid summer that they moved to the villa when the apartment owner put it up for sale.

 

[hcc2007]

It wasn't the end of the week. They were given another apartment to stay in until the PJ were done with the original one. Then for some inexplicable reason they chose to move back in to the first one (although why any parent would want to live in the rooms their daughter was "abducted from" is beyond me!). It wasn't until early-to-mid summer that they moved to the villa when the apartment owner put it up for sale.

Thanks for correcting me on the apartment-> villa move.

As for moving back into the apartment, I think that wanting to be 'near' a lost love is very natural. It doesn't speaking, one way or another, to how she was lost (abducted vs accidentally killed).

Kate is a strange one, and I'm flabbergasted at some of the things she has said (if indeed she has said them). But the showing of emotion in public?

Actually I'd go easy on her there. We Americans sometimes underestimate the british "stiff upper lip" when it comes to suffering in public. Some people just can't do it, and sometimes the worse the suffering, the less emotion shown. Just look at children who lose a parent (I was one, at age 11), or have experienced a big trauma. Emotionally dead is how they seem. And it's true, they are. The pain is so bad, you just don't let yourself feel it. Sometimes it's only years later that you finally cry.

 

[gord]

It wasn't the end of the week. They were given another apartment to stay in until the PJ were done with the original one. Then for some inexplicable reason they chose to move back in to the first one (although why any parent would want to live in the rooms their daughter was "abducted from" is beyond me!). It wasn't until early-to-mid summer that they moved to the villa when the apartment owner put it up for sale.

are you sure that they moved back into the actual apartment ? I heard that it was let to another holiday family by Warners ( very strange ) - it wasnt until the british police got more involved that they then made it a crime scene again

 

[IrishMist]

Thanks for correcting me on the apartment-> villa move.

As for moving back into the apartment, I think that wanting to be 'near' a lost love is very natural. It doesn't speaking, one way or another, to how she was lost (abducted vs accidentally killed).

Kate is a strange one, and I'm flabbergasted at some of the things she has said (if indeed she has said them). But the showing of emotion in public?

Actually I'd go easy on her there. We Americans sometimes underestimate the british "stiff upper lip" when it comes to suffering in public. Some people just can't do it, and sometimes the worse the suffering, the less emotion shown. Just look at children who lose a parent (I was one, at age 11), or have experienced a big trauma. Emotionally dead is how they seem. And it's true, they are. The pain is so bad, you just don't let yourself feel it. Sometimes it's only years later that you finally cry.

I can so totally relate to this paragraph. May be part of the reason why I'm so hesitant to bash the McCann's for what I perceive to be coping.

 

[Barnaby]

are you sure that they moved back into the actual apartment ? I heard that it was let to another holiday family by Warners ( very strange ) - it wasnt until the british police got more involved that they then made it a crime scene again

Yes I actually heard that also I dont think they moved to the same apartment again.