weekend break: discuss the latest here #124

[TartLemon]

This is not a feminist rally, counseling session or comedy revue. ALV is a witness and should not be telling JM how or which questions to ask.

The guffawing from the gallery was totally inappropriate and disrespectful to the process of justice for Travis Alexander.

 

[Sleuth5]

There is a line of inquiry in psychology (esp the Jungian branch) that examines the role and function of fairy tales in children's lives. Bruno Bettelheim's "The Uses of Enchantment" is an example; Marion Woodman's works also rely heavily on these themes.

The theory is that the fairy tale allows the child to live vicariously through the hero/heroine. Presumably the child listening to or viewing the tale is naive, nestled in a loving, protective, nurturing relationship with the parents. The fairy tale allows the child a safe way to preview the loss/privation/death that life inevitably brings (especially the death of a parent). The story is scary--I still can't watch the part of Bambi where his mother dies--but it's "safe-scary" for the child because it's "just a story."

The tales also all involve redemption for the hero/ine, which according to these theorists, parallels & metaphorically represents the development of a healthy autonomous identity that ideally happens as we mature, create lives apart from our parents, and become our adult selves. So theoretically, children absorbing these stories are absorbing lessons about what to expect from life, what they themselves can achieve, and more.

Which is all well and good, except that in so many fairy tales (Snow White, Cinderella, etc), the "redemption" or success of the heroine comes about via a rescuing hero, rather than through the female protagonist developing the ability to stand on her own and defend herself autonomously. This has been the source of some pushback from feminist theorists, who might point out that even when Rapunzel let down her long hair, it was so that some handsome dude could climb up it.

I don't doubt that a lecturer of ALV's generation would be well familiar with these theoretical paradigms. I've yet to wrap my head around her Snow White/Wicked Witch analogy however... and at any rate, IMO this level of metaphorical analysis has absolutely NO bearing on the cold hard facts of this case.

Terrific and informative. Thanks!

 

[seguek9]

I help piece the victims bodies back together if it's even possible. Many of them I know by name they're such frequent flyers. I call the CAS to have their children removed to safety and the police to have the abusers caught and dealt with. I put the toe tags on their corpses and call for the attendants to take them to the morgue. Then I call their next of kin. If it's not too late, I help find them emergency shelter and an advocate to help them save their own lives. It's not a chuckle fest lets pretend we're Dopey or Snow White to me. Her approach is unprofessional IMHO and I expected more.
In my line of work if the heart isn't beating and there's no brain activity then all the mental health chit chat over the span of months and years is for naught.

We're traumatized by default and there are scores of us. <modsnip>

Thank you Karn....For all you do :hug:

 

[Tsunvirtual]

Yes.The prosecution in the KC trial did not, unfortunately, do that. Their closing argument was not good. They didn't go through June 15th/June 16th bit by bit. They sort of glossed over that day and spent more time on the days after. None of that was necessary of course. The evidence was compelling.

I have faith in JM. I think he will do a brilliant job.

We can all agree these jurors are no dummies. However, just to be on the safe side he needs to do an explanation geared to reasonable doubt for dummies to drive it home.

 

[Dmacky]

I'm confused! Help!

It's about the durned cell phones. I know JA says she lost one, but Gus helped her out with a new one. The old one didn't have recording capability, but with her new toy they were able to make the sex tape.

So here's where I get confused. The sex tape was on May 10th, right.

Her journal entry of May 22 has good news, and that is she got her new cell phone.

Am I missing something?

Which "lost" cell phone was found by the aunt eons later?

:dunno:

Good catch gcharlie !!
Apparently while making her "new journal", JA got her dates mixed up :giggle:

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Don't expect a smoking gun. It's disappointing when there isn't one! There is plenty of evidence to send to death row. If there happens to be some unheard of bombshell then that will be nice but don't expect it.

I'm not necessarily expecting a "smoking gun", but I do think that JM will unveil some enlightening information during rebuttal. During his cross-examination of defense witnesses, JM has dropped some subtle hints about incidents and/or individuals that I think will play a prominent role in rebuttal. There were several, and I can't name all of them at the moment, but MM is definitely one of them for a number of reasons. I also think that there was something fishy about the relationship between Jodi and Dr. Samuels and the number of hours that they spent together. I also think that computer/technical forensics will reveal some things that we haven't been privy too thus far in the case. :moo:

 

[JustJudy]

Sydni I just talked to my brother, who lives in TN, and he had no clue who Arias was :facepalm: I was like NEVERMIND!

I swore I would never get caught up in another trial after OJ, then came CA (I lied), swore never again......now here I am demanding justice for Travis and his family.

I hear you, but her crime demands we do this. This time, Jodie is OUR dirty little secret.

 

[Rosemary Pierce]

I am very thankful for my family. After dinner on Easter my family, who know about the case but don't follow it, asked what I am going to do when this is over. I told them there are a couple trials starting soon.

I was almost yelling at him...."This is a genuine sociopath that we are being able to observe, it's downright chilling!"

 

[gcharlie]

Originally Posted by gcharlie View Post
I'm confused! Help!

It's about the durned cell phones. I know JA says she lost one, but Gus helped her out with a new one. The old one didn't have recording capability, but with her new toy they were able to make the sex tape.

So here's where I get confused. The sex tape was on May 10th, right.

Her journal entry of May 22 has good news, and that is she got her new cell phone.

Am I missing something?

Which "lost" cell phone was found by the aunt eons later?

Gus 's. The helio

Zoey, the helio was the one found by the aunt and it was the one with the sex tape? It still does not make sense, because she writes she got the new phone after the sex tape was recorded. That's why I'm confused:facepalm:

 

[LambChop]

In fairness, Jean Casarez did not get Juror #5 kicked off of the jury. The judge determined that there were grounds sufficient to remove her during the questioning occasioned after defense motion for mistrial involving JM and the photo/signing.

Sure, you can argue that the motion for mistrial based on the JM incident would never have happened had JC not reported her concerns about it. But I say that this defense team would have found another reason for the same kind of questioning because the jury is not sequestered. There would simply have been a different proximate cause. We can see that in Nurmi's demand for sequester, which would have happened in any event as various media outlets show more and more new information.

So, even if JC's report was the proximate cause for questioning the witnesses, Juror #5 still had to have said something that gave the judge concerns sufficient to remove her -- and I can't believe that even if JC hadn't reported it, the DT wouldn't have found out about it and made the same motion. At this point, you need to watch what you say in the lunch line (just ask Katie DDJ). The DT is going to look for any opportunity, and would have no matter how any external forces played into things. Just my opinion.

:cow:

I believe if they had sequestered this jury after all the days Jodi was being questioned by defense, half the jury would have attempted to throw themselves out the hotel windows or would have opted to leave due to illness. We have to trust people to do the right thing. Just because jurors are sequestered would not stop them from making comments in jest or otherwise. Jurors are to base their decision on the evidence presented and not their personal feelings. jmo

 

[kscornfed]

:therethere: Real trials don't have Perry Mason moments because of all the rules and the discovery process. But . . . for connecting the dots and getting to the truth of things, Juan Martinez does keep things lively. Who could possibly sleep through the moment he dropped the camera? Or after digging away at Jodi's loss of memory, when he said, "Well, it's YOUR fog? Or how he got a psychologist with a PhD so rattled he blurts out, "SIR! I BEG your pardon"!

absolutely can't wait for his closing argument!! he can connect these dots perfectly because they FIT perfectly.

recording that phone call. where's the evidence TA asked her to do that? it's not even mentioned in the course of the phone call. hmmm....why did she want that recording? mimi? the bishop? who was going to get that tape?

the journal which conveniently says nothing bad about travis, is cool about him dating others, and is also written after he died as if she had no idea what happened to him. hmmmmm....when was this really written?

so many i can't think of them all. those are my 2 biggies.

 

[Sleuth5]

I believe if they had sequestered this jury after all the days Jodi was being questioned by defense, half the jury would have attempted to throw themselves out the hotel windows or would have opted to leave due to illness. We have to trust people to do the right thing. Just because jurors are sequestered would not stop them from making comments in jest or otherwise. Jurors are to base their decision on the evidence presented and not their personal feelings. jmo

I think you're right. :seeya:

:cow:

 

[TexMex]

Bringing this over from the previous thread:



I don't think so. There is nothing from the 1000 places in Cancun or even very close. The only one within 100 miles is just a hotel.

From the 1,000 places book and the distances from Cancun:

Mexico
898. Las Ventanas al Paraiso - San Jose Del Cabo - just a resort - Cabo san lucas - 1481 miles as the crow files; distance by land 2131 miles
899. Whale Watching in Baja - 1742.5 nautical miles; land 2307.65 miles
900. Na Bolom - another hotel - in San Cristobal - 651.8 miles from Cancun
901. Palenque - 539.46 miles
902. Copper Canyon - 1977 miles
903. Cervantes Arts Festival - Guanajuato distance 1194 miles
904. San Miguel de Allende - Guanajuato 1194 miles
905. Acapulco Bay - 1073 miles
906. Taxco - 1078 miles
907. Zihuatanejo - 1297 miles
908. Teotihuacan and the National Museum of Anthropology - 1001 miles
909. Michoacan - 890 miles
910. Monarch Butterfly Migration
911. Las Mananitas - cuernavaca - 1022 miles
912. Oaxaca's Saturday Market and Camino Real - 902.8 miles
913. Chichen Itza - Yucatan - 125 miles archaeological site
914. Maroma - Riveriera Maya - Mayan Riviera Resort 41.9 miles away
915. Hacienda Katanchel - hotel - 171.4 miles away 3 hrs 3 min
916. Cable Car Over Zacatecas - 1366.9 miles
917. El Dia de Los Muertos - Day of the dead, November 1 and 2 celebrated throughout Mexico
http://thegillespies.info/thousand_places.htm

I think it's more likely that their long exchanges May 25-26 and the 16-page, single spaced rant Travis sent her put her over the edge.
Remember Travis' friend Taylor Searle who said he told Travis, "Aren't you afraid she is going to hurt you?" after Travis read him part of what he wrote?

"Another of Alexander’s friends, Taylor Searle, tells HLN that around the first week of June 2008, Alexander caught Arias hacking into his Facebook account and told her he wanted her out of his life. Searle says Alexander called him the next day and read the contents of an online chat between Alexander and Arias.

Searle says he asked Alexander, "Aren't you afraid she's going to hurt you?"
http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/03/21/who-jodi-arias

While Cancun isn't one of the 1000 places, JA said she and TA planned to visit three near Yreka:

Oregon

811. The Oregon Coast
812. Oregon Shakespeare Festival
814. Crater Lake National Park

In the taped May 10 phone conversation, TA said he was looking forward to their little forest, uh, [adventure, as JA finished his sentence].

As we know, Travis never did visit her the end of May as he said in that tape he planned to. The May 26 exchange left little doubt why not.

In the tapes she tells Flores Travis cancelled the end of May trip and she was disappointed bcse he was supposed to come hear her sing the National Anthem at the races on May 24th...


I bet he would've gone to these two:
We did the ruins on a day trip from Cancun.

Chichen Itza - Yucatan - 125 miles archaeological
Maroma - Riveriera Maya - Mayan Riviera Resort 41.9 miles away

 

[SassyMom]

You were very fortunate, as was I. That's not the case for everyone. It still exists and not just in foreign countries but right here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes Linda, it's a very complex issue. My sister, who was raised by the same mother, went to the same high school as me, was only 3 years older than me was a battered woman. She took it for less than 5 years and divorced him. Their eldest daughter, however, married at 19 and was beat up by her husband. That marriage lasted 6 mos.

So to me, you really can't distill DV to neat, tidy catagories or explanations. My point was that IN GENERAL, women haven't been 'groomed' for passivity for a very long time by society.

 

[luv]

I wanted to share this video. I think this guy is very funny but he certainly knows his facts. Worth watching in full.

Jodi Arias Pre Meditation Proved , Evidence !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gcrnKD2UAk&feature=youtu.be



.

 

[seguek9]

A couple of points...
This may be OT, but as the father of a young girl, I have seen nearly every single animated Disney movie and I have noticed a common thread that runs through nearly every single one of them: the mother of the main character is either 1. Dead, or 2. A character who dies during the movie. From Bambi to Princess and the Frog, this holds true. I can't figure out why and I wonder if it is supposed to raise questions within the young viewer. My little girl, normally very inquisitive, has not noticed and/or asked about this. Again, probably OT, but ever since Thursday's cross, I can't help but wonder if/how this could tie in.

Also, I am noticing a lot of JA supporters bashing J Mart for his short stature. It's an obvious grasp at straws, yet I wonder how ALV classifies such behavior? Would she consider it abusive? If I can say one thing about J Mart's size, it would be that it only sticks out to me when I notice millions of people taller than him are actually looking up to him.

As always, thoughts and prayers are with the Alexander family.

My daughter hated every single Disney movie when she was little because they were "too
sad"....except for Mulan. That one she liked.

And I loved your comment on JM thank you! Well eaid

 

[Rosemary Pierce]

This is not a feminist rally, counseling session or comedy revue. ALV is a witness and should not be telling JM how or which questions to ask.

The guffawing from the gallery was totally inappropriate and disrespectful to the process of justice for Travis Alexander.

The loudest "guffaw" was from that Mit. Specialist. She's deplorable :furious:

 

[AfterSunset]

Respectfully snipped by me for space:

ETA: I am neither looking for sympathy or trying to be snarky with you, Molly333. It is just such, excuse the term, a slap in the face to REAL survivors and women/men who have endured FAR worse and have NEVER slaughtered their abusers.[/QUOTE]


{{{{{hugs}}}}}} thank you so much for your post...I see you, I hear you, I feel you, I share your pain...you are me and I am you! Bless you sweet girl for I know that path well!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[KandyKane]

Seems like I recall photos of the dryer and the bedlinen was found there. The items in the washing machine were the towels and his clothing. I wonder who and when washed the bed linens. Was it Travis? He may have thought she had already left, stripped the bed, threw them in the washing machine and then went to take a shower. Perhaps it was Jodi who threw them in the dryer when she threw the towels and his clothes in the washing machine.

It seems to me that because of the little time she had to do everything she did before the roommate came home that it's entirely possible that it was Travis that stripped the bed and washed the bed linens. Considering that she had less than half an hour from the time she killed him to drag him back to the shower, clean up her own self and put on clean clothes, wash the camera and his clothes and collect what she wanted to take with her to get out she likely wouldn't have had enough time to strip the bed and wash the linens.

 

[Irisha]

This may have been discussed already and I missed it.

On June 4th, was Napoleon was gated downstairs by skanky. I have read Napoleon always had run of the house. Was he ungated when she left? Wouldn't Napoleon have "sensed" or smelled something during the 6 days until Travis was found and scratched and barked continuosly at his door? Wouldn't the roommates found it strange Napoleon was gated downstairs if they thought Travis had left?Do I have the story krect?