weekend discussion: discuss the trial here #141

[leebee52]

I respectfully and wholeheartedly disagree. While I don't believe everything Aileen Wuornos said, and I certainly don't agree with the decisions she made in her life, I do think watching them shows two completely different kind of killers.

When I watch Aileen I see someone who was just born on the wrong day, had a completely crap life and has the worst case of PTSD probably ever documented.

I don't get angry when I watch Aileen. I do get upset and angry when I watch JA.

I agree with you. I kind of felt sorry for Aileen. Having been a victim myself and one that no one else bothered to help, I could identify with parts of what Aileen said. Not that I would kill anyone.

 

[Rocco]

I respectfully and wholeheartedly disagree. While I don't believe everything Aileen Wuornos said, and I certainly don't agree with the decisions she made in her life, I do think watching them shows two completely different kind of killers.

When I watch Aileen I see someone who was just born on the wrong day, had a completely crap life and has the worst case of PTSD probably ever documented.

I don't get angry when I watch Aileen. I do get upset and angry when I watch JA.

Funny you should say that. I have the same impression.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Just out of curiosity, has there been a post where someone has researched BWS/self defense in murder cases?

I've tried to do some look up, but a lot of the data is old. I have not seen many successful cases and in the few where it is successful, the woman has turned herself in. None of the cases I've found come anywhere near as gruesome as this murder and all of the women lived with the victim.

Based on the evidence presented in this case and case history precedent, JA is going to find herself convicted of first degree murder.

I believe it was Joey Jackson who spoke about that the other day on HLN.

He said only around 4% of murder case does the defendant (always female) use the BWS/self defense argument. He said only 1% out of the 4% that use it as a defense are found NG or gets a lesser charge.

So it doesn't work most of the time.

The Wendi Andriano case was based on these same defenses. The jury believed her so much they gave her the death penalty. That is the case where Juan was the Prosecutor.

I remember a NC case where a woman used the same defense and the jury did not buy it. In fact they believed she was the abuser and murdered her ex husband because he left her. She is serving LWOP but I cant think of her name now.

My hubby's co-worker was murdered by his wife. She also claimed self defense. He had filed for divorce and his divorce would have been final two days after she shot him 6 times in the back and once in the head when he was on the ground. Their children testified against her and said their father never abused her and she had constantly abused him even hitting him in the face with her fists numerous times in their 18 year marriage. The family court had awarded him the two children. The jury didn't believe her and she is doing LWOP.

IMO

 

[Schuby]

Anyone hear the other day on HLN, can't remember who said it but...all the stuff that the juror's haven't been able to hear can be brought out at the sentencing phase.

Yes, it can. It is considered prejudicial only in the guilt phase.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Wow, you are good. No snarkiness intended, so please don't take it that way.

I'm haven't looked at the peni pix...it's my way of respecting Travis's privacy.

Can't look at the pix of his corpse either, but that is for an entirely different reason. I close my eyes in movies, so there is no way I want to have something like this etched into my memory.

I think they belong to Gus.

 

[Schuby]

So you think she took it to him on June 4?
Then left it behind?

Yes, I do.

 

[Ammonitida]

Oh I know it would not have but I do think she did mail it. Maybe even post dated it knowing the 25th and 26th were not banks days....
Another manipulation.IMO
no way she took that check to TA the day she murdered him...
if she had she would not have left it. She could not locate it.
That is why she asked det Flores about it.
extra $ for her to flee with...
just my take on it...

Travis was no dummy... he would have checked with her bank
to verify her acct balance prior to cashing it.

I have had to do that with people... it sucks... but ya cash it when it's good...
moo

The check was part of her coverup. This check is the subject of a text message she sent to dead Travis on June 6th. It was to make her look innocent, much like her fabricated journal entries from May 26th to June 17.

Jodi is no dummy. Rather clever.

 

[Allyne Smithe]

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh: Look how many Books of FIFTY SHADES OF GRAY have been sold.

$ex $ell$...and I think JA introduced TA to fantasy. She bought it all in, IMHO

And how many reviewers of Fifty Shades of Grey said it seemed like it was written by a teenager? Like this one:

"About half way through the book, I looked up the author to see if she was a teenager. I really did because the characters are out of a 16 year old's fantasy. The main male character is a billionaire (not a millionaire but a billionaire) who speaks fluent French, is basically a concert level pianist, is a fully trained pilot, is athletic, drop dead gorgeous, tall, built perfectly with an enormous p****, and the best lover on the planet. In addition, he's not only self made but is using his money to combat world hunger. Oh yeah, and all of this at the ripe old age of 26! And on top of that, he's never working. Every second is spent having sex or texting and emailing the female character. His billions seem to have just come about by magic. It seriously feels like 2 teenage girls got together and decided to create their "dream man" and came up with Christian Grey."

Another "And oh, the repetition...and the repetition...and the repetition. I'm convinced the author has a computer macro that she hits to insert one of her limited repertoire of facial expressions whenever she needs one. According to my Kindle search function, characters roll their eyes 41 times, Ana bites her lip 35 times, Christian's lips "quirk up" 16 times, Christian " his head to one side" 17 times, characters "purse" their lips 15 times, and characters raise their eyebrows a whopping 50 times. Add to that 80 references to Ana's anthropomorphic "subconscious" (which also rolls its eyes and purses its lips, by the way), 58 references to Ana's "inner goddess," and 92 repetitions of Ana saying some form of "oh crap" (which, depending on the severity of the circumstances, can be intensified to "holy crap," "double crap," or the ultimate "triple crap"). And this is only part one of a trilogy...If I wrote like that, I'd use a pseudonym too."

"I can't figure out what the big deal is about this book!
After all the hype, I thought I should read this book. What a waste of time. It reads like something written by a 14-year-old that has read a few issues of Cosmopolitan. What a bore! 50 shades of snooze. The characters are all unappealing. I kept waiting for it to get better and it didn't improve. ?

That said, every guy has heard of French maid's outfits and I doubt TA needed JA to introduce him to that.

 

[Liar]

License plates and floor mats too

It makes no sense to me that JA would intentionally turn a licence plate upside down. I wonder whether Jodi brought a second plate or set of plates (stolen or borrowed from someone). Switched them after the murder on June 4th to dispose of the gun, gas cans, knife, clothes etc. Then made the error of putting it back on upside down which led Officer Officer Michael Galieti to pull her over.

The investigators would have focused on looking for any trace of a White Ford Focus with Plate #6DGVO99 on video footage and tolls.

 

[panthera]

So you think she took it to him on June 4?
Then left it behind?

I do. It was too easily found on Travis' desk after the murder, as if it had been deliberately left there to be found. It also could have been her "excuse" for dropping by.

MOO

 

[tss]

Jodi Arias Trial - TIME OUT FOR ALYCE - YouTube

Impeachment of an expert witness

http://www.crossexam.com/impeaching-an-expert-witness.html

 

[wenwe4]

Tricia taking call from Jan . . . regarding 911 audio tape where the female caller is clearly casting suspicion on JA immediately. . . . have those been introduced into evidences and if not could they be . . (given ALV's testimony about dv)

Holly doesn't remember whether it has been played in court. Katiecool doesn't remember. Chatroom people said it was Mimi on the tape - she was aware that JA was slashing tires - TA's and another woman he was dating. They cannot bring JA in but because there is no police report implicating JA. JA can implicate TA as being a pedophile without proof.

Unable to bring in allegations of JA's tire slashing as part of a pattern of behavior . . .

Judge has had to rule on balance scale . . . prejudicial stuff cannot come into court with out some kind of proof . . . taint JA's ability to have a fair trial. keeps it out of appellate court if at possible.

Tricia asking if some of the shower pictures were taken through the glass shower door.
No way to ever know what actually happened in the bathroom. She knows a lot more and remembers more than she is telling.

Katiecoolady is trying to assist TA's family in fundraising to offset expenses incurred so they can attend the trial (ie: housing, travel, food, lack wages, etc).

 

[leebee52]

I believe it was Joey Jackson who spoke about that the other day on HLN.

He said only around 4% of murder case does the defendant (always female) use the BWS/self defense argument. He said only 1% out of the 4% that use it as a defense are found NG or gets a lesser charge.

So it doesn't work most of the time.

The Wendi Andriano case was based on these same defenses. The jury believed her so much they gave her the death penalty. That is the case where Juan was the Prosecutor.

I remember a NC case where a woman used the same defense and the jury did not buy it. In fact they believed she was the abuser and murdered her ex husband because he left her. She is serving LWOP but I cant think of her name now.

My hubby's co-worker was murdered by his wife. She also claimed self defense. He had filed for divorce and his divorce would have been final two days after she shot him 6 times in the back and once in the head when he was on the ground. Their children testified against her and said their father never abused her and she had constantly abused him even hitting him in the face with her fists numerous times in their 18 year marriage. The family court had awarded him the two children. The jury didn't believe her and she is doing LWOP.

IMO

My sister in law stabbed her husband 27 times,he bled to death because EMS took so long. Guy was so drunk he didn't even know he'd been stabbed and was wandering around laughing. She pleaded self defense and was found not guilty. She had 15 wits though, if there hadn't been all those wits, I think she would have been convicted.

 

[IBsleuthin]

Yes he said 'Kool-Aid stains which had to be red or dark rusty stains.

Remember when Juan was cross examining Ms. Udie or whatever her name was and he asked her did she 'blood' in the vehicle when she and JA were sitting there talking and she said 'no because it was already dark.'

I think the jury picked up on the stains being blood.

IMO

Ya just gotta love someone that gets a rental back and immediately thinks 'Kool-Aid'. The way my skeptical brain works, I'd be thinking MURDER!! I HAVE TO GET ON WEBSLEUTHS!!!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I agree with you. I kind of felt sorry for Aileen. Having been a victim myself and one that no one else bothered to help, I could identify with parts of what Aileen said. Not that I would kill anyone.

I just cant feel sorry for serial killers.

A lot of serial killers have been grossly abused but I don't think that makes them sympathetic when they murder people in mass numbers.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Ya just gotta love someone that gets a rental back and immediately thinks 'Kool-Aid'. The way my skeptical brain works, I'd be thinking MURDER!! I HAVE TO GET ON WEBSLEUTHS!!!

LOL! I know what you mean but they probably are use to cleaning up quite a few stains on the vehicles they get back in.

I have never had to rent a vehicle but I thought if it wasn't brought back like it was when they gave it to you .............you would have to pay extra for the cleaning. Did they even charge her with not having the floor mats?

IMO

 

[Ammonitida]

I do. It was too easily found on Travis' desk after the murder, as if it had been deliberately left there to be found. It also could have been her "excuse" for dropping by.

MOO

Yes. Note the subject of the June 6th text message to dead Travis. It discusses nothing else but this check. Like her cell phone being turned off for 18 hours, it's another one of Jodi's tricks. And she had a lot of tricks in her bag.

 

[Rocco]

Jodi Arias Trial - TIME OUT FOR ALYCE - YouTube

Impeachment of an expert witness

http://www.crossexam.com/impeaching-an-expert-witness.html

All of the criteria sounds familiar.

 

[gcharlie]

Maybe she made cash on the side from dealing dope. Although, not a biggie to me.

Was Jodi a drinker or pothead? Anyone know? tia

When on the stand answering questions about her memory, she did testify that she blacked out twice while drinking, IIRC once when she was 15 and then again at 19.

She would not have been drinking in the presence of Mormons after her conversion to LDS.

 

[Liar]

Cleaning up:
She could have worn dark tight biker shorts and top under the baggy sweat outfit that we saw. After the murder she would just have taken off the outer layer and cleaned her face and arms. Possibly using the washing machine water as it was filling or doing it at the same time she cleaned TA body. Her hair was dark and would not have shown the blood.