Weekend Discussion Thread 04/27-30/2012

[Macright]

All good I just wanted to be clear as all the posts I have read it wasnt clear. Thanks now I know.

I hope you are not taking notes etc. or making a list... ha...just joking...JMO


respectfully....

 

[Macright]

Sorry I just wanted to make sure I heard you correctly because you said that you didnt agree with what the "journalist" was writing about but you did agree that she was on a joy ride just like the journalist said.

no I said TM,as in TS's mother said she was on a joy ride...didn't know that any reporters said the same...I watched those daily news briefs at the time and heard TM say that and I agree with her....then and now....JMO

 

[crazyladi]

I hope you are not taking notes etc. or making a list... ha...just joking...JMO


respectfully....

No lol.. I just sometimes need people to say what it is that they believe happened, cut and dry is all. Sometimes its very confusing to know what people are saying, thinking and believing. Since so many people respond its hard to remember all the posts and since I have been on here for 3 yrs I really cant even remember the details from when this tragedy first happened.

I respect that everyone has a right to their opinion and if its not the same as mine I want to know why to see if there is something I missed.

 

[jenniferleia]

I am so looking forward to tomorrow! I agree with a few on here that we need to hear both sides of the story, but if there is no other side of the story, I think his goose is cooked.

All of the evidence so far with the cell phone activity (or non-activity) does not paint a pretty picture for him.

I personally think MR WILL testify, there is no other way around it. It is going to be an interesting day regardless!

JMO!!!!!!

 

[snoofer]

I am so looking forward to tomorrow! I agree with a few on here that we need to hear both sides of the story, but if there is no other side of the story, I think his goose is cooked.

All of the evidence so far with the cell phone activity (or non-activity) does not paint a pretty picture for him.

I personally think MR WILL testify, there is no other way around it. It is going to be an interesting day regardless!

JMO!!!!!!

I will be sure to have my popcorn, barf bag and dangit doll ready! MOO

 

[Macright]

No lol.. I just sometimes need people to say what it is that they believe happened, cut and dry is all. Sometimes its very confusing to know what people are saying, thinking and believing. Since so many people respond its hard to remember all the posts and since I have been on here for 3 yrs I really cant even remember the details from when this tragedy first happened.

I respect that everyone has a right to their opinion and if its not the same as mine I want to know why to see if there is something I missed.

well I have been following this from the start...there was a lull after the initial arrests etc. but once the trial started I picked it up again...those daily news briefs are embedded in my mind because my heart always bled for the father...not so much for anyone else because I wasn't so sure just what was going on.. my posts are usually "cut & dry" because I don't feel the need to pad them ..JMO

 

[swedie]

Has anyone ever thought that his lawyer might be trying to pull the insanity route? is this possible this late in the game??

Derstine cannot claim MR is insane. If that was the case it would've happened long ago and delayed the trial even longer. Derstine would have to argue that before any court proceeding got underway.

The thing is, if MR is innocent of any of these charges, he and his defense wouldn't have any issues putting him on the stand. If one is telling the truth it shouldn't be hard to explain away the evidence and any testimony against an innocent person. I know he does not have to take the stand, but if I was begin accused of some crime I did not commit, no one would stop me from taking the stand in my own defense. It's as simple as that. MOO

Tomorrow we will find out. I've wondered if Derstine would call TLM as a witness. Now wouldn't that be interesting?! Other then her I cannot imagine who Derstine will call to give "evidence". I do not think he can call anyone for character testimony alone. They have to give evidence, JMO though.

 

[otto]

<snipped for emphasis>

THIS would be one for the murder history books I think. Kidnapper, murder, rapist lady bums a drive to the murder scene with the victim...unbeknownst to the innocent driver. MOO

So the ticker headline would read:

KIDNAPPER/RAPIST/MURDERER BUMS A DRIVE WITH VICTIM FROM UNSUSPECTING FRIEND TO THE MURDER SCENE-FRIEND IN SHOCK BUT STILL ABLE TO SPEED DATE

add to that ... asks unwitting driver to stop at the hardware store to pick up murder weapon and choose secluded location for murder ... but still, the innocent dupe should be considered innocent of all charges. He was clearly bewildered the following day, week and month - as evidenced by his simpe desires to get stoned and hook up.

 

[snoofer]

Derstine cannot claim MR is insane. If that was the case it would've happened long ago and delayed the trial even longer. Derstine would have to argue that before any court proceeding got underway.

The thing is, if MR is innocent of any of these charges, he and his defense wouldn't have any issues putting him on the stand. If one is telling the truth it shouldn't be hard to explain away the evidence and any testimony against an innocent person. I know he does not have to take the stand, but if I was begin accused of some crime I did not commit, no one would stop me from taking the stand in my own defense. It's as simple as that. MOO

Tomorrow we will find out. I've wondered if Derstine would call TLM as a witness. Now wouldn't that be interesting?! Other then her I cannot imagine who Derstine will call to give "evidence". I do not think he can call anyone for character testimony alone. They have to give evidence, JMO though.

Good lord; what if TLM has a THIRD version! MOO

 

[Tahorn]

Would TLM have planned a kidnapping, murder, rape without MTR knowledge ...and what...used him for his car???? Why not plan a murder not include him and do it on foot? Or why not with a gang member with a car. Does it really make sense that she had to bum a drive so she could commit a murder, rape, kidnapping. OR...does it makes sense they both knew and planned the kidnapping and the rest followed. MOO

THIS would be one for the murder history books I think. Kidnapper, murder, rapist lady bums a drive to the murder scene with the victim...unbeknownst to the innocent driver. MOO

It doesn't have to make sense to us ... It is what was going through a junkie mind at the time.

 

[snoofer]

add to that ... asks unwitting driver to stop at the hardware store to pick up murder weapon and choose secluded location for murder ... but still, the innocent dupe should be considered innocent of all charges. He was clearly bewildered the following day, week and month - as evidenced by his simpe desires to get stoned and hook up.

lol MOO

 

[otto]

I am so looking forward to tomorrow! I agree with a few on here that we need to hear both sides of the story, but if there is no other side of the story, I think his goose is cooked.

All of the evidence so far with the cell phone activity (or non-activity) does not paint a pretty picture for him.

I personally think MR WILL testify, there is no other way around it. It is going to be an interesting day regardless!

JMO!!!!!!

He would be a fool to testify, but I hope you are correct. I would really like to see him sit still, make eye contact with the jury and tell them that he genuinely thought that he was babysitting a child up until the moment the child was murdered and then he was so scared to report the crime that he indulged himself with his harem.

 

[Macright]

He would be a fool to testify, but I hope you are correct. I would really like to see him sit still, make eye contact with the jury and tell them that he genuinely thought that he was babysitting a child up until the moment the child was murdered and then he was so scared to report the crime that he indulged himself with his harem.

if he did testify, I don't think he would claim that HE was babysitting a child...I think he might say TLM TOLD him she was babysitting a child...I don't see any reason why he should take the stand, I think his lawyer is quite capable of driving his side home to the jury...JMO

 

[tmhco]

This is a list of things you must believe in order to find the defense theory plausible IMO. Feel free to add to the list as this is just off the top of my head.

MR car just happened to be driving by TS school on several occasions on the day of the abduction.
*
TLM convinced BOTH TS and MR that she was babysitting.*
*
MR just happened to park at a remote lot down the street, around the corner and past a side street with parking and the main CCRH parking lot, either by chance or by TLM direction(and THAT didn’t raise an alarm)
*
The backseat of MR car was removed prior to the abduction and yet he agreed to bring TS on a long road trip.
*
The seat fabric (with blood traces) was a remnant from another time.
*
TS after being in the car for hours with no seat) did not want to go into the gas station or Home Depot so one of them stayed with her.
*
ATM stop before Home Depot was just a coincidence.
*
MR did not ask and thought nothing of a Home Depot stop and popped the trunk for TLM to put the bag.
*
They accidentally ended up at a remote location known to him.
*
A prolific BB user suddenly abandoned his habit during the murder as he took a walk.
*
TS blood just happened to fall on a sperm faction.
*
TLM described the murder scene perfectly for LE so they would find TS with no clothing on her lower half to frame MR
*
Not enough DNA evidence or forenics to prove guilt even though TS was not found for 3 months.
*
TLM had some gang/drug debt and kidnapped TS even thought she couldn’t afford to keep her track phone going.
*
*

 

[otto]

It doesn't have to make sense to us ... It is what was going through a junkie mind at the time.

Junkie mind or not, what happened has to make sense to the jury or it will not be considered credible. MR, the junkie, was not so stoned that he couldn't pre-arrange deposits into his account, pick up cash that was problably used to pick up a murder weapon in a location where he would not be easily recognized, go to a secluded location close to where he had previously worked, turn off his cell phone at crucial times, or lie to police ... so it would be hard to believe that he was so stoned he didn't know something was amiss in taking someone else's child off the street and leaving her murdered under a rock pile.

 

[jenniferleia]

if he did testify, I don't think he would claim that HE was babysitting a child...I think he might say TLM TOLD him she was babysitting a child...I don't see any reason why he should take the stand, I think his lawyer is quite capable of driving his side home to the jury...JMO

Ya, you may be right. I just see him as the type to get on the stand and tell his side of the story. We will see tomorrow.

 

[Salem]

BBM -

Derstine cannot claim MR is insane. If that was the case it would've happened long ago and delayed the trial even longer. Derstine would have to argue that before any court proceeding got underway.

The thing is, if MR is innocent of any of these charges, he and his defense wouldn't have any issues putting him on the stand. If one is telling the truth it shouldn't be hard to explain away the evidence and any testimony against an innocent person. I know he does not have to take the stand, but if I was begin accused of some crime I did not commit, no one would stop me from taking the stand in my own defense. It's as simple as that. MOO

Tomorrow we will find out. I've wondered if Derstine would call TLM as a witness. Now wouldn't that be interesting?! Other then her I cannot imagine who Derstine will call to give "evidence". I do not think he can call anyone for character testimony alone. They have to give evidence, JMO though.

I sincerely doubt that Derstine will be calling anyone for character evidence because if he puts MR's character into question, the Crown can use everything they have to show MR does not have a good character. That means any evidence Derstine got thrown out before the jury saw it, that goes against MR's character, would be allowed in.

I believe that Derstine did win a few "suppress evidence" motions regarding character evidence because of the legal arguments that were called during the testimony of all those women. I DON'T know this for fact, I'm just making an educated guess.

Salem

 

[crazyladi]

Well in a matter of hours we will know if he does or does not. Very intense indeed.

 

[snoofer]

He would be a fool to testify, but I hope you are correct. I would really like to see him sit still, make eye contact with the jury and tell them that he genuinely thought that he was babysitting a child up until the moment the child was murdered and then he was so scared to report the crime that he indulged himself with his harem.

Being the dutiful 28 year old babysitter; did he take VS to Dairy Queen or for a burger? Maybe they stopped at the park to swing....shopping? Did she regale in his stories of dance? The murder was at what time? Did the child ever get out of the car before the murder; that is a long, long time in a car for an 8 year old who was supposed to have movie night with her girlfriends. Surely, what they offered as babysitters was much more exciting. Yes, I want to hear exactly how they entertained so well this 8 year old child all those hours in that car. MOO

 

[swedie]

In view of the totality of the crimes and the horrific nature of them, could any jury member really believe that the 18 year old woman was calling all the shots and the 28 year old man was just tagging along without any control over anything ... even though he was driving the car, he had prior history with the location of the body, he withdrew money moments before the purchase of the murder weapon, he had a knife throughout the crime and the blade of the knife is now missing, the young girl was found half undressed and murdered, he did not report the crime, he attempted to get away with it through lies and manipulation, and so on?

What "nagging question" could the jury have regarding his complicity in the crimes.

I would love to see MR testify. He thinks he's a smart guy, too smart to need a formal education. In fact, he's so stupid he doesn't realize how stupid he is ... so I would really like to see him get on the stand and try to wiggle out of the questions the prosecution has for him. He will self-incriminate in no time. Unfortunately for us, I'm pretty sure his lawyer will not let that happen.

Great post Otto! And if he was so innocent, why hasn't he given up where he disposed of all the evidence? Surely LE would be able to find some of it. MR isn't telling because he knows right well that evidence has his guilt written all over it. Number one his backseat and number two TLM's white jacket would have his and Tori's DNA all over it. I don't buy it that he MAY have given that information up either. If LE was able to find all this other incriminating evidence, I'm sure they wouldn't spare the resources to locating the much needed evidence to prove MR's guilt or innocence. AND MR would give it up to prove TLM's testimony is full of lies. I bet MR got nervous with his car seat sitting out on the curb in front of his mother's house for so long for pick up, he took and disposed of it somewhere himself. Same with the other evidence. I can see him going back to that car wash and retrieving those garbage bags just in case TLM broke and told someone about the murder.

I agree, MR is stupid but not so stupid to try and cover his azz in someways. MOO