Who screamed?

[eileenhawkeye]

When LE was going door-to-door on 12/26, Stanton told LE that she didn't hear anything unusual. Now, did LE said "The Ramseys' daughter is missing or was found dead--did you hear/see anything unusual?" or did they just ask "Did you hear/see anything unusual last night?" without telling what happened? However, she says she didn't tell about the scream then because she didn't want to be involved in the investigation. Now, I would like to think that if you know a little girl was missing or murdered, you wouldn't hold back information because of that. But if say, you just saw police cars, and had no idea what had actually happened, I could see someone more likely to have that attitude. So it seems most likely to me that LE didn't mention JonBenet at all when asking about anything unusual on 12/26. It wasn't until January 3rd when Stanton brought up the scream when LE was interviewing her about the night of the murder. So I am kind of in the middle. I think it's likely that she didn't want to get involved at first, and when she heard a little girl was killed, she changed her mind, but I also think it's possible that when LE was asking her on 1/3, when she knew about the murder, it made her think she did hear something.

 

[otg]

We'll never resolve whether or not the scream actually happened. With the conflicting information about Mrs. Stanton's recollection, all we can do is guess. I don't know that it happened, but I choose to believe it did and that Mrs. Stanton did hear it for the following reasons:

I can understand her vacillation given the circumstances. She says she heard it, it woke her up, and that she listened for five to ten minutes afterwards to see if she heard anything else. Then she said she went back to sleep, thinking that the parents of whoever it was she heard had taken care whatever was the reason for the scream. It wasn't until much later (several days?) that police began canvassing the neighborhood asking questions. When she was told about the death of JonBenet, she said she was in such disbelief that she didn't make a connection between that and the sound she had heard during the night several days prior. It wasn't until later when she thought about it (perhaps even during the conversation) while talking to a neighbor that she made the connection. She told her neighbor (Diane Brumfitt), who then told BPD. When police contacted her, she told them about what she heard. I can imagine that every resident in the area was contacted by at least several reporters trying to get any information they could get to scoop a story before anyone else in the press. We can only imagine what it must have been like to anyone who lived nearby. So it's not at all surprising to me that she would try to back out of saying she heard it. And we only know second or third hand accounts of what she said. So her not wanting to be involved or connected to the case makes me think she did not come up with the story to try and get attention. Just the opposite -- she tried to avoid it. She and her husband even moved away shortly afterwards.

Another reason I believe her original account is that it fits with what we do know about the circumstances (TOD, possible area of house it happened, her description of what it sounded like, etc.).

But regardless of our opinion, investigators put enough belief into it to conduct experiments (done at night to try and replicate conditions) to see if sound could be heard at the Stanton residence but not on the fourth floor of the Ramsey hellhole. I found one link that still works (you have to read it though without paying any attention to Smit's blather about what he "envisions"):

http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1998/09jobene.html

[FONT=helvetica,arial,sans][SIZE=-1]"A source close to the family said auditory tests performed by police during a second search of the home in the summer of 1997 determined that sound travels more easily from the basement out to the street than it does up through the home's four levels."
[/SIZE][/FONT]​

One more thing... I said in another post that Melody Stanton had died. I may have been wrong about that. Since DeeDee questioned it, I had to check my sources, and I found where I believe she may now live. (I have a phone number too, but I wouldn't dare call and bother her if it is indeed her.)

 

[CherCher]

We'll never resolve whether or not the scream actually happened. With the conflicting information about Mrs. Stanton's recollection, all we can do is guess. I don't know that it happened, but I choose to believe it did and that Mrs. Stanton did hear it for the following reasons:

I can understand her vacillation given the circumstances. She says she heard it, it woke her up, and that she listened for five to ten minutes afterwards to see if she heard anything else. Then she said she went back to sleep, thinking that the parents of whoever it was she heard had taken care whatever was the reason for the scream. It wasn't until much later (several days?) that police began canvassing the neighborhood asking questions. When she was told about the death of JonBenet, she said she was in such disbelief that she didn't make a connection between that and the sound she had heard during the night several days prior. It wasn't until later when she thought about it (perhaps even during the conversation) while talking to a neighbor that she made the connection. She told her neighbor (Diane Brumfitt), who then told BPD. When police contacted her, she told them about what she heard. I can imagine that every resident in the area was contacted by at least several reporters trying to get any information they could get to scoop a story before anyone else in the press. We can only imagine what it must have been like to anyone who lived nearby. So it's not at all surprising to me that she would try to back out of saying she heard it. And we only know second or third hand accounts of what she said. So her not wanting to be involved or connected to the case makes me think she did not come up with the story to try and get attention. Just the opposite -- she tried to avoid it. She and her husband even moved away shortly afterwards.

Another reason I believe her original account is that it fits with what we do know about the circumstances (TOD, possible area of house it happened, her description of what it sounded like, etc.).

But regardless of our opinion, investigators put enough belief into it to conduct experiments (done at night to try and replicate conditions) to see if sound could be heard at the Stanton residence but not on the fourth floor of the Ramsey hellhole. I found one link that still works (you have to read it though without paying any attention to Smit's blather about what he "envisions"):

http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1998/09jobene.html

[FONT=helvetica,arial,sans][SIZE=-1]"A source close to the family said auditory tests performed by police during a second search of the home in the summer of 1997 determined that sound travels more easily from the basement out to the street than it does up through the home's four levels."
[/SIZE][/FONT]​

One more thing... I said in another post that Melody Stanton had died. I may have been wrong about that. Since DeeDee questioned it, I had to check my sources, and I found where I believe she may now live. (I have a phone number too, but I wouldn't dare call and bother her if it is indeed her.)

Years ago when I lived in Elmira NY, I heard several murders being committed and didn't realize it. It was summertime and I had all windows open. In the Southern Tier of NYS summer evenings are nice and cool. usually. My husband worked nights, and I fell asleep on the sofa around 9 pm. At around 11 pm I awoke to what I thought was firecrackers going off. I was alarmed and annoyed, but after 5 or so minutes, I went back to sleep because there were no other sounds except cars going back and forth along the street.

When I woke up the next morning my husband (who had just got home from work) told me about the murders that had been committed 2 blocks from our home. A man had killed his ex-wife and her new husband and taken off with his children. I asked myself over and over whether the "firecrackers" I'd heard were actually gunshots. No police officers ever questioned me, and by the time I'd put 2 and 2 together, the ex husband had been arrested.

 

[borndem]

The neighbor who heard the scream was asked about this and if I recall she replied that she knew the difference between a child's scream and an adult's. However, there have been many people who think the scream may actually have been Patsy (having discovered what happened) and, while I feel the scream came from JB and prompted the head bash, I do concede that a woman's scream could possibly have been thought to be a child's.

bbm

Just now coming back to this thread...

That's what I recall, too, DeeDee -- it may have been in Kolar's book. I will add, that I think I would know the difference, too, as would most folks, IMO. But I do think, even if she had done all or part of the crime, she still would have screamed (but in the early afternoon -- at least from what had been said to LE -- not at night) on sight of her daughter stiff in rigor.

 

[txsvicki]

Could the scream have been B? Patsy could have taken him to the basement and scared him badly then sent him back to his room.

 

[borndem]

I absolutely believe the scream happened. I just wonder if it was the scream of a child who was just injured (plausible and likely) or of a mother discovering her deceased child (also plausible and likely).

Hmmmm, Tawny -- you think the scream might have been PR's at 12:00--2:00am? Interesting, isn't it? Now that is indeed something to think about...under what conditions? Was it part of a scheme? Was it real -- IOW, did she know nothing and either JR and or BR was responsible? Hmmm. Good point, Tawny. As you say, it certainly is plausible. And sadly, we'll never know. Grrrrr.

 

[DeeDee249]

Could the scream have been B? Patsy could have taken him to the basement and scared him badly then sent him back to his room.

Yes. Although I believe it was JB who screamed, it is still possible it could have been Patsy. I hadn't considered BR, but at that age his voice hadn't changed, so I suppose it is possible. Even though the neighbor who heard it said she could tell the difference between a child's scream and an adult's, the scream did wake her up- so being awakened from a sound sleep by a scream, the senses might not be full awake and awareness may not be 100%.

 

[Soulmagent]

I believe the neighbor probably heard a scream ,and as much as she liked to think she would be able to tell if it was a child or not ,imo, I dont think anyone could tell .

Years ago I lived about a block away from where a person was murdered and I heard a scream. It was a blood curling scream , I heard it from the farthest room in my aparment away from the direction it came from , I got up and ran to look out of my third story apartment window to the direction it came from, convinced it was a womans scream right out of my window.

I didnt see anything , I looked up and down my street ,and to the 24 hour store a block away ,nothing . So I go back to my computer (I never looked at the time ).

The next day I found out a man had had his throat slit in the motel behind the 24 hour store. I was pretty upset I hadnt called the police ,I was also shocked that the scream was that of a man. I also wouldnt think she would be able to correctly say how long the scream lasted , as when one is counting in the smallest amout of time 3 /10 of a second could seem like 3 seconds or 3 seconds could feel like 3/10 of a second.
From memory the scream I heard gets longer everytime I remember ,not because it lasted long but because as I replayed it in my head seeking its meaning and breaking apart every pitch in the scream it has taken on the impression of a long scream when the reality of it was it was very short ,compact and bone chilling.
It was bone chiling even before I knew there was a murder. I however was not awaken by it I was already awake.

That said I do believe it was Jon benet's scream ,but only because she was the one who was murdered. I dont believe anyone else in the home would have screamed loud enough for it to travel.

 

[DeeDee249]

I believe the neighbor probably heard a scream ,and as much as she liked to think she would be able to tell if it was a child or not ,imo, I dont think anyone could tell .

Years ago I lived about a block away from where a person was murdered and I heard a scream. It was a blood curling scream , I heard it from the farthest room in my aparment away from the direction it came from , I got up and ran to look out of my third story apartment window to the direction it came from, convinced it was a womans scream right out of my window.

I didnt see anything , I looked up and down my street ,and to the 24 hour store a block away ,nothing . So I go back to my computer (I never looked at the time ).

The next day I found out a man had had his throat slit in the motel behind the 24 hour store. I was pretty upset I hadnt called the police ,I was also shocked that the scream was that of a man. I also wouldnt think she would be able to correctly say how long the scream lasted , as when one is counting in the smallest amout of time 3 /10 of a second could seem like 3 seconds or 3 seconds could feel like 3/10 of a second.
From memory the scream I heard gets longer everytime I remember ,not because it lasted long but because as I replayed it in my head seeking its meaning and breaking apart every pitch in the scream it has taken on the impression of a long scream when the reality of it was it was very short ,compact and bone chilling.
It was bone chiling even before I knew there was a murder. I however was not awaken by it I was already awake.

That said I do believe it was Jon benet's scream ,but only because she was the one who was murdered. I dont believe anyone else in the home would have screamed loud enough for it to travel.

It is hard to scream when your throat is being slit- in fact it is impossible! So don't be too hard on yourself. The man whose throat was slit may not have been the one who screamed. There could have been a woman who witnessed it.
That being said, the neighbor who heard JB scream was asked whether she was sure it was a child and she said she was- that she knew what a child's voice sounds like. However, I think it could just as easily have been Patsy.

 

[DeDee]

We'll never resolve whether or not the scream actually happened. With the conflicting information about Mrs. Stanton's recollection, all we can do is guess. I don't know that it happened, but I choose to believe it did and that Mrs. Stanton did hear it for the following reasons:

I can understand her vacillation given the circumstances. She says she heard it, it woke her up, and that she listened for five to ten minutes afterwards to see if she heard anything else. Then she said she went back to sleep, thinking that the parents of whoever it was she heard had taken care whatever was the reason for the scream. It wasn't until much later (several days?) that police began canvassing the neighborhood asking questions. When she was told about the death of JonBenet, she said she was in such disbelief that she didn't make a connection between that and the sound she had heard during the night several days prior. It wasn't until later when she thought about it (perhaps even during the conversation) while talking to a neighbor that she made the connection. She told her neighbor (Diane Brumfitt), who then told BPD. When police contacted her, she told them about what she heard. I can imagine that every resident in the area was contacted by at least several reporters trying to get any information they could get to scoop a story before anyone else in the press. We can only imagine what it must have been like to anyone who lived nearby. So it's not at all surprising to me that she would try to back out of saying she heard it. And we only know second or third hand accounts of what she said. So her not wanting to be involved or connected to the case makes me think she did not come up with the story to try and get attention. Just the opposite -- she tried to avoid it. She and her husband even moved away shortly afterwards.

Another reason I believe her original account is that it fits with what we do know about the circumstances (TOD, possible area of house it happened, her description of what it sounded like, etc.).

But regardless of our opinion, investigators put enough belief into it to conduct experiments (done at night to try and replicate conditions) to see if sound could be heard at the Stanton residence but not on the fourth floor of the Ramsey hellhole. I found one link that still works (you have to read it though without paying any attention to Smit's blather about what he "envisions"):

http://web.dailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1998/09jobene.html

[FONT=helvetica,arial,sans][SIZE=-1]"A source close to the family said auditory tests performed by police during a second search of the home in the summer of 1997 determined that sound travels more easily from the basement out to the street than it does up through the home's four levels."
[/SIZE][/FONT]​

One more thing... I said in another post that Melody Stanton had died. I may have been wrong about that. Since DeeDee questioned it, I had to check my sources, and I found where I believe she may now live. (I have a phone number too, but I wouldn't dare call and bother her if it is indeed her.)

There certainly could have been a chilling scream from JonBenet that awoke Melody Stanton, iirc, around midnight.

Is it true her husband also awoke, or she awoke him, in time to hear scraping of metal against concrete that we suppose to be the movement of the paint cans in the hellhole?

In no particular order, JonBenet:

• could have screamed when she saw her killer swinging a maglight toward her head.
• could have screamed when her vagina was jammed w/ a wooden paintbrush with jagged ends.
• could have screamed when her restraints were tied.
• could have screamed just prior to being strangled.
• could have screamed as the abrasions on her face and back were being made.

This precious 6yof victim experienced extreme terror and acute pain with multiple levels of injuries in her final hours on earth.
RIPJB

 

[otg]

There certainly could have been a chilling scream from JonBenet that awoke Melody Stanton, iirc, around midnight.

Is it true her husband also awoke, or she awoke him, in time to hear scraping of metal against concrete that we suppose to be the movement of the paint cans in the hellhole?

In no particular order, JonBenet:

• could have screamed when she saw her killer swinging a maglight toward her head.
• could have screamed when her vagina was jammed w/ a wooden paintbrush with jagged ends.
• could have screamed when her restraints were tied.
• could have screamed just prior to being strangled.
• could have screamed as the abrasions on her face and back were being made.

This precious 6yof victim experienced extreme terror and acute pain with multiple levels of injuries in her final hours on earth.
RIPJB

Hi, DD. I agree that there are different possibilities accounting for the scream. The only thing I have to disagree with is the condition of the end of the paintbrush. I don't believe that the vaginal injuries indicate that anything jagged could have been used. If the paintbrush had been used after the end was broken off, there should be cuts and probably torn flesh noted in the AR. There would also be evidence on the paintbrush itself. Instead, I think it was the blunt, rounded, unbroken end of the paintbrush that caused the abrasion described in the AR below:

A 1 cm red-purple area of abrasion is located on the right posterolateral area of the 1x1 cm hymenal orifice. (snip) The area of abrasion is present at approximately the 7:00 position and appears to involve the hymen and distal right lateral vaginal wall and possibly the area anterior to the hymen.
​

(I also think that it was because of the fact that the end of the paintbrush was used that it was broken off and disappeared.)

 

[DeDee]

Hi, DD. I agree that there are different possibilities accounting for the scream. The only thing I have to disagree with is the condition of the end of the paintbrush. I don't believe that the vaginal injuries indicate that anything jagged could have been used. If the paintbrush had been used after the end was broken off, there should be cuts and probably torn flesh noted in the AR. There would also be evidence on the paintbrush itself. Instead, I think it was the blunt, rounded, unbroken end of the paintbrush that caused the abrasion described in the AR below:

A 1 cm red-purple area of abrasion is located on the right posterolateral area of the 1x1 cm hymenal orifice. (snip) The area of abrasion is present at approximately the 7:00 position and appears to involve the hymen and distal right lateral vaginal wall and possibly the area anterior to the hymen.
​

(I also think that it was because of the fact that the end of the paintbrush was used that it was broken off and disappeared.)

New Year Greetings, otg.

If the paintbrush had been used after the end was broken off, there should be cuts and probably torn flesh noted in the AR.

Well, wasn't it kind of the murderer not to use the jagged end?

The clarification on the paintbrush injuries means the paintbrush was broken into thirds. The brush end was discovered in the paint tote, the center portion was used as the garrote and the end portion is missing.

What conscious six year old girl would not scream when their killer inserts a wooden paintbrush without jagged edges? It bled bc she was alive. Where is the logic in the theory that the digital penetration at death was to hide previous abuse?

The importance of the scream is that it determines JonBenet was alive in the basement near the time of her untimely death.

 

[otg]

New Year Greetings, otg.

...and to you as well, DeDee.

Well, wasn't it kind of the murderer not to use the jagged end?

I'm not quite sure what you mean on that, DD.

The clarification on the paintbrush injuries means the paintbrush was broken into thirds. The brush end was discovered in the paint tote, the center portion was used as the garrote and the end portion is missing.

No disagreement on that. It is because I believe the unbroken paintbrush was used that I also believe the stagers (IMO, the Ramseys) felt it necessary to dispose of it. To be a little more explicit (which I was trying to avoid, but we're all adults here, I hope), I think the missing end would have had vaginal fluid and blood on it. That is why (again, IMO) the remaining portion of the paintbrush was used to create the illusion of a "garrote". This was to obfuscate the actual use of the paintbrush, as well as make it appear to have been used to tighten the cord around her neck (thereby altering the appearance of the way the cord actually tightened around her neck).

What conscious six year old girl would not scream when their killer inserts a wooden paintbrush without jagged edges? It bled bc she was alive. Where is the logic in the theory that the digital penetration at death was to hide previous abuse?

I agree with all this (except for the "jagged edges" part). I have never bought the idea that the sexual assault that occurred during the night was to "hide previous abuse". On the contrary, the attempt was made to hide any evidence at all of sexual abuse. In fact, I'm not convinced that Patsy or JR knew about the extent of prior abuse. I think they probably suspected something, but maybe they weren't convinced of just how far it might have gone before she died. I think they convinced themselves that wiping/washing the blood away would be enough to hide the sexual aspect so the medical examiner wouldn't check any further. It never made sense to me to think that anyone would hope to hide abuse by committing more -- and then remove the obvious evidence of it. The only point I was trying to make earlier was that I don't think the paintbrush was broken prior to insertion.

The importance of the scream is that it determines JonBenet was alive in the basement near the time of her untimely death.

Which is where I think everything happened that night. I believe the scream was her reaction to pain (and probably seeing her own blood immediately afterwards). We all have different ideas about who might have screamed, and even whether or not the scream actually happened. I think it did happen, and I think it was JonBenet's scream.

 

[DeDee]

...and to you as well, DeDee.

I'm not quite sure what you mean on that, DD.

No disagreement on that. It is because I believe the unbroken paintbrush was used that I also believe the stagers (IMO, the Ramseys) felt it necessary to dispose of it. To be a little more explicit (which I was trying to avoid, but we're all adults here, I hope), I think the missing end would have had vaginal fluid and blood on it. That is why (again, IMO) the remaining portion of the paintbrush was used to create the illusion of a "garrote". This was to obfuscate the actual use of the paintbrush, as well as make it appear to have been used to tighten the cord around her neck (thereby altering the appearance of the way the cord actually tightened around her neck).

I agree with all this (except for the "jagged edges" part). I have never bought the idea that the sexual assault that occurred during the night was to "hide previous abuse". On the contrary, the attempt was made to hide any evidence at all of sexual abuse. In fact, I'm not convinced that Patsy or JR knew about the extent of prior abuse. I think they probably suspected something, but maybe they weren't convinced of just how far it might have gone before she died. I think they convinced themselves that wiping/washing the blood away would be enough to hide the sexual aspect so the medical examiner wouldn't check any further. It never made sense to me to think that anyone would hope to hide abuse by committing more -- and then remove the obvious evidence of it. The only point I was trying to make earlier was that I don't think the paintbrush was broken prior to insertion.

Which is where I think everything happened that night. I believe the scream was her reaction to pain (and probably seeing her own blood immediately afterwards). We all have different ideas about who might have screamed, and even whether or not the scream actually happened. I think it did happen, and I think it was JonBenet's scream.

I'm not quite sure what you mean on that, DD.

My sincere apologies are extended for the facetious remark born out of anger and frustration over this case. Of course, the killer was not kind to JonBenet.

I have never bought the idea that the sexual assault that occurred during the night was to "hide previous abuse".

Nor have I, otg. I almost removed the comment but left it intact bc some here feel it a possibility.

the remaining portion of the paintbrush was used to create the illusion of a "garrote". This was to obfuscate the actual use of the paintbrush

Why would the perp insert this object then clean the fluids from her body before, or after, strangling her? Or do you feel one person penetrated and another wiped her?

I have difficulty placing 9yo BR as being sexually promiscuous on Christmas night with his baby sister and do not believe she would go willingly down to the basement at nighttime. And why didn't she have an overhead light in her bedroom?

the attempt was made to hide any evidence at all of sexual abuse.

Dressing a size 6 girl in a size 12 pair of undies is not exactly hiding her abuse. JIMO, the large sized bloomers scream: Hey! Check this out!

 

[otg]

My sincere apologies are extended for the facetious remark born out of anger and frustration over this case. Of course, the killer was not kind to JonBenet.

No need to apologize, I just didn't get it. Sarcasm is hard to convey in written form, which is why we have this emoticon:

Nor have I, otg. I almost removed the comment but left it intact bc some here feel it a possibility.

Okay, I'm glad we agree on that point, DD. I know there are those who still see that as a way of accounting for all the injuries, and I don't want to offend anyone, but I just can't see the logic in it.

Why would the perp insert this object then clean the fluids from her body before, or after, strangling her? Or do you feel one person penetrated and another wiped her?

Yes.

I have difficulty placing 9yo BR as being sexually promiscuous on Christmas night with his baby sister and do not believe she would go willingly down to the basement at nighttime. And why didn't she have an overhead light in her bedroom?

I can't answer you on any of that. If you find something hard to believe, I won't try to convince you otherwise. (And I don't know about the overhead light.)

Dressing a size 6 girl in a size 12 pair of undies is not exactly hiding her abuse. JIMO, the large sized bloomers scream: Hey! Check this out!

But there was so much more done to hide the very obvious abuse. I agree that the oversized panties are out of place, and we'll never know what was going through someone's mind when they decided to put them on her. But whoever it was who put them on her apparently didn't think it was something that would be suspicious. But then... neither did they think the "War and Peace" of ransom notes would be suspicious either.

 

[DeDee]

< Respectfully snipped >

But there was so much more done to hide the very obvious abuse. I agree that the oversized panties are out of place, and we'll never know what was going through someone's mind when they decided to put them on her. But whoever it was who put them on her apparently didn't think it was something that would be suspicious. But then... neither did they think the "War and Peace" of ransom notes would be suspicious either.

otg,

If you don't mind, how did you arrive at this conclusion?

whoever it was who put them on her apparently didn't think it was something that would be suspicious

Plenty of the evidence was established in order to conflict with nature and contradict the norm.

What if the size 12 undies were specifically chosen to simply make LE wonder why the child was wearing undies far too large for her?

But there was so much more done to hide the very obvious abuse.

Let's see. May need some help here. To hide the obvious sexual abuse,

• the child was wiped down with a cloth even though she died in wet panties with blood on them.
  
• it is possible the child was not rushed to the ER after her skull was injured for fear of the abuse being discovered.

 

[Charterhouse]

DeDee, of all the dumb stuff I remember, I may be able to answer one of your questions.

JBR did not have an overhead light because when they remodeled her room they put in a ceiling fan without a light kit. This was on the switch to the room. To turn on a light you had to walk in the room and turn on a lamp. I know I read this on ACandyRose but I don't know where. Sorry!

 

[gramcracker]

you are remembering correctly, Charterhouse. housekeeper Linda Wilcox shared that during a Peter Boyles radio interview in '98

PETER BOYLES: Why did you think that?

LINDA WILCOX: Gut feeling more than anything. But even now, more than then, I would (something) on everything I have that a stranger did not kill JonBenet. The lay of the house doesn't...it would be very difficult. Possibly, there are people who are professional. But then they would have done a professional job. Lots of little things contribute to my belief. Someone who didn't know that house, really well, couldn't have done what they done (sic) without being noticed. It's not possible. It is physically impossible. You had to know little things. Like for example, you walk in the room and hit the switch, the light doesn't come on. See, cause when the room was redone, they put in a ceiling fan, one of the metal ones, without a light kit on it. The only light in her room was the lamp between the two beds. You have to physically walk over and turn it on. It isn't run by the switch. The switch was meant to run the overhead ceiling light which was removed to install the ceiling fan.

http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/07211998lindawilcoxon-pb.htm

 

[DeDee]

DeDee, of all the dumb stuff I remember, I may be able to answer one of your questions.

JBR did not have an overhead light because when they remodeled her room they put in a ceiling fan without a light kit. This was on the switch to the room. To turn on a light you had to walk in the room and turn on a lamp. I know I read this on ACandyRose but I don't know where. Sorry!

Charterhouse, I do believe you may be correct as that accounting is familiar.

Thank you for the link, gramcracker.

Was JBR's bedroom the only bedroom without an overhead light?

Why would Patsy not want the light kit attached so that her young child had an overhead light in her bedroom?

In this screen capture, it is plain to see that when one enters the (dark) room, one must carefully maneuver around the wooden chest at the end of her bed before turning to walk between the two beds to reach the lamp on the bedside table.

 

[otg]

otg,

If you don't mind, how did you arrive at this conclusion?

Which conclusion? I think I was just speculating on something that I didn't think we would ever know the answer to -- namely what was going through someone's mind.

Plenty of the evidence was established in order to conflict with nature and contradict the norm.

True, that.

What if the size 12 undies were specifically chosen to simply make LE wonder why the child was wearing undies far too large for her?

If you are saying they were specifically chosen because of their size -- for what purpose?

Let's see. May need some help here. To hide the obvious sexual abuse,

• the child was wiped down with a cloth even though she died in wet panties with blood on them.

Yes, whatever blood was present was at least wiped away. I suspect (but not 100% certain) she may also have been cleaned internally with water because of what is stated in the AR. If the sexual assault was staged, or if (as some have speculated) it was done to hide the chronic injuries (which it didn’t) there would be no reason to clean up the blood. The blood that was found in her panties (as I understand) was only two very small droplets. There are probably at least several possibilities of how those droplets came to be there.

• it is possible the child was not rushed to the ER after her skull was injured for fear of the abuse being discovered.

I don’t agree that this was the case, but I suppose that is a possibility. But then if you follow that scenario out, you would almost have to say she was then deliberately strangled with the cord to kill her. I just don’t believe that’s the way it happened. In fact, I don’t think the parents even knew about the head injury.