WI WI - Evelyn Hartley, 15, La Crosse, 24 Oct 1953

[pleasestandby]

why is a shoe downstairs and one upstairs and why the hell would he take her out a basement window if his size 11 showprind was found upstairs why not go out the front door now that he was in ..i get breaking in u come in the window but how do u drag a full grown girl out a basement window very oddd to me.

I think there were two suspects. The one without the muddy shoes possibly came in the window, went upstairs and let the guy with the muddy shoes into the house from the front door. They then exited that door, taking Evelyn with them. It's also possible that Evelyn let one or both of them into the house, knowing at least one of them.

 

[46daze]

Update on the woman found in 1984, on HWY 14 between Westby and Viroqua, just south of La Crosse. Her body has been exhumed and will be sent to Madison for DNA testing. I know there was some speculation that this could be Evelyn as the age matches up:

http://lacrossetribune.com/news/loc...cle_2fabda76-8a6a-5b0f-bbec-f96f5c1d8ae0.html

"VIROQUA -- Bludgeoned to death, her hands cut from from her body, Jane Doe's body was left along a rural Vernon County road in May 1984, leaving no clue of her identity or the circumstances surrounding her death.

Wednesday afternoon, Vernon County Sheriff John Spears watched as the unidentified woman's casket was removed from the Viroqua Cemetery to be sent to the state crime lab, so the body can go through DNA testing.

"It didn't come lightly, our decision to exhume the body," Spears said. "Thinking positively, we're hoping further investigation will lead to her being identified. Her family will know that we never gave up."

<modsnip>

The department has worked through more than 4,000 leads in the case. Additional tips can be called to the Vernon County Sheriff's Department at 608-638-5710 or Vernon County Crime Stoppers at 608-637-8477."

Also, I cannot yet search the boards, I haven't seen anything specific to this woman...

 

[scriptgirl]

That Jane Doe is older than Evelyn would have been

 

[jashrema]

That Jane Doe is older than Evelyn would have been

Evelyn would have been 46 in 1984...I think that would put her close enough as far as a guesstimate by the coroner at the time. It will be interesting to see...

 

[scriptgirl]

yeah, but no one in Evelyn's family will give DNA, so...

 

[mommylicious]

yeah, but no one in Evelyn's family will give DNA, so...

Really?

 

[flourish]

Really?

I suspect they've gotten to a point of closure. They are victims and have lost their Evie. We may not understand, but...thank goodness we aren't in the situation to know how they feel.

 

[flourish]

I keep thinking about this. Imagine sixty years of false, dashed hopes. A literal lifetime of wondering, hoping, coping, moving on, feeling guilty for moving on, ever grieving.

I'm sure what I can imagine is only a drop in the bucket. And all of this is assumption/presumption on my part.

 

[wendybtn]

About the bloody handprint - was LE able to determine whose blood it was? I'm assuming it was Evelyn's, although it could have belonged to one of the kidnappers. She probably put up quite a struggle.

It appears Evelyn was not a little petite girl (at age 15 wearing a size 16 pants and a size 34 top), so it seems like dragging her through that window definitely would require two people.

I can understand the perpetrators getting into the house through an unlocked basement window, but why use that same window to carry Evelyn out of the house? Going through the front door would have been much easier. The tracking dogs tracked her scent to the street in front of the house, leading LE to assume she was taken away by car.

I wonder how dark it was at 7:15 p.m. in the latter part of October? Were there streetlights in that neighborhood?

Clothing sizes for women were completely different then and all police could tell about blood at that time was the type, A, B, AB, & O.

 

[Claireishere]

Clothing sizes for women were completely different then and all police could tell about blood at that time was the type, A, B, AB, & O.

That's exactly what I was going to say. There is no way she had a 34 top with a modern size 16 bottom. I'm not saying it's completely impossible but highly improbable. With a 34 top and a size 16 bottom she was probably more like a modern size 6 or 8. Marilyn Monroe was a size 16 from my understanding, and I believe she would have been. Size 8 modern time.

 

[Claireishere]

I don't know if it's been gone over but could we discuss reasons as to why they went through the back window like that. Obviously it's not to be seen but if it was a fast abduction and they were strangers to the area I don't see the reason for them needing for it to be through the back window. Also there was clearly premeditation. The house had to be watched or someone had to be aware there would be a female alone in the house. Much less that there was a back window available in the basement. what time did the dad get to the house again?

 

[jashrema]

While there are no hard and fast rules (especially as clothing size numbers continue to drop as measurements remain the same - a practise which is known in the fashion industry as vanity sizing), generally speaking, garments from the 1930s-1950s are sized double plus or minus one or two sizes than what the same garment, manufactured and labelled by a company today, would be. For example, a dress from the 1950s with a size 18 tag would likely fit a woman today who wears a modern size eight or ten


Claire: My theory has always been we know there was a struggle in LR as evidenced by the shoe and her glasses. I think he then threw her down the basement, or Evelyn actually ran down the basement. At some point, I think EVELYN moved the crate/ladder over to the window to escape out the basement window and actually made it threw half-way or all the way. When the perp saw her going out the window, he ran out of house to basement window and grabs her again there (This is where scream is heard) he clobbers her and then begins carrying her, I believe he staggered into neighbors garage and had to steady himself with his hand (bloody handprint) and then surmising he couldn't carry her all the way to the car he lays her down (shes unconscious from the clobber outside basement window) and runs to bring his car around. Where he laid her accounts for huge pool of blood found on neighbors basement window well (so big it actually seeped thru window) picks her up again or drags her half standing/staggering to his car at the street and is then gone. That's it. I think people get stuck on the basement window as a point of entry and it may have been. BUT, if he entered that way there is no way he put the step ladder under the window to get IN. Evelyn did that to get OUT. That makes the most sense. Whether he threw her down there for safe keeping while he robbed house, or she fled down there to get away from him..SHE is the one that tried climbing out that window and I think she made it...only to end up face to face with the perp as he ran outside and around house to get her as she was climbing out. JMO

 

[Claireishere]

That all makes sense except for the pry marks. I wonder what type of locks were in the doors. If it was dead boots that would require keys and effort to get through. I think you are likely right in her attempting to flee that way. I just think if it were me my immediate direction would be to get the baby. Unless you knew the person was there for you specifically.

 

[Robin Hood]

Claireishere, I like the '' Unless you knew the person was there for you specifically'' I think you are spot on.

 

[jashrema]

That all makes sense except for the pry marks. I wonder what type of locks were in the doors. If it was dead boots that would require keys and effort to get through. I think you are likely right in her attempting to flee that way. I just think if it were me my immediate direction would be to get the baby. Unless you knew the person was there for you specifically.

Claire: I don't think they were there for her specifically. i also think, jmo, that a 15 year old girl, that has no ties to the infant and had I think only babysat once before, would think of herself first and flee. The baby wouldn't be a priority for her. I'm certainly not saying she was an awful person and thought only of herself, but she was only 15, from all accounts very prim and naive, and she doesn't have a mother's instinct nor even a solid friendship with family. She also probably did not have a chance. I think he clobbered her in LR and she either ran or he threw he down basement not expecting her to recover quickly or have the sense to put a step ladder underneath the window and try to go out that way.

 

[Vivette]

I suspect they've gotten to a point of closure. They are victims and have lost their Evie. We may not understand, but...thank goodness we aren't in the situation to know how they feel.

I really do not understand this at all. If there's ever a chance of finding her, it's with the help of dna, why wouldn't you?! I'd give them every drop of blood I have.

 

[Vivette]

Claire: I don't think they were there for her specifically. i also think, jmo, that a 15 year old girl, that has no ties to the infant and had I think only babysat once before, would think of herself first and flee. The baby wouldn't be a priority for her. I'm certainly not saying she was an awful person and thought only of herself, but she was only 15, from all accounts very prim and naive, and she doesn't have a mother's instinct nor even a solid friendship with family. She also probably did not have a chance. I think he clobbered her in LR and she either ran or he threw he down basement not expecting her to recover quickly or have the sense to put a step ladder underneath the window and try to go out that way.

If it had been me, I might have decided to absolutely not to take the baby in hopes he won't find the baby. Why bring a baby to a murderer? Also, if she was surprised she wouldn't have had any time to get the baby, she had to run for her damn life. " Excuse me mister murderer, can you give me a minute, I have to get the baby so we can both escape from you. Ok thanks"

 

[dogperson]

I think a flight or fight response would take place and Evelyn would run for her own life, not to save the baby, since it wasn't her baby. A mom would think of the baby but quite possibly a babysitter would not. It wouldn't be my first thought unless it was my own child and even then I might be hoping the men wouldn't find the baby. When faced with intruders the first thought would probably be to get away, it would be a fear reaction to just run as fast as you could.

 

[flourish]

I really do not understand this at all. If there's ever a chance of finding her, it's with the help of dna, why wouldn't you?! I'd give them every drop of blood I have.

Right I get that but they've been living with this longer than I've been alive so perhaps they're at a point of needing closure in the best way they can do for themselves now. I've never been in their awful position so I'm completely withholding judgement.

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[EveDallas]

I have a couple of questions I hope someone can answer for me. 1. When Mr. Hartley came to investigate on why Evelyn did not called., and when though the basement window, was the basement light on or off when he arrived? The reason why I ask this is because I pretty sure the Rasmusen would not leave a basement light on, so how did the UNSUB able to move around in the dark without disturbing anything and how did Mr. Hartley able to see Evelyn shoe near the basement stairs ? ( If the light was off, I pretty sure the intruder who not turn on the light. Do you? Also news articles stated that there was mud or dirt in the living room, but why none on the stairs or near the window on the inside of the house. Also was the basement door open or close?