Would We Be Willing To Change Our Theories?

[Camper]

The town square typically has roads leading to everywhere one would wish to go from dead center. This case is no different, WE have OR most of us have gone up each road to see WHO is where, and how come. We have then traveled back to square one and started yet again.

New evidence, that was actually true and vital to put together ALL of the puzzle pieces would indeed make value points, and a NEW direction in which to travel.

I would be there with bells on rethinking it all again.

My thread 'Fantasy Island, Da Plane, Da Plane' covers yet more un answered questions and possible side streets that were NOT traveled by BPD investigators, OR even the Ramseys own investigators.

-----Halycon and Lacy Wood, Websleuths has a great thread on Chandra Levy, go to Cold Cases forum.

Ralph Doherty who wrote an intensive book about the case called "Murder On A Horse Trail" posts on our thread. He points out that it is a fact that CONDIT could not cover HIS entire day, May 1, 2001, that Chandra disappeared, with his holey alibi. His noonish meeting with the VP was found to have been about 30 minutes.

You can respond to me on the thread in WS, Cold Case forum, on Chandra Levy. I do know that the Enquirer used Ralphs book to counter Condits suit against them. Ralphs book has a boatload of information about the case. A good read. You can find the link for his online FREE book at the Chandra forum on WS.



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[halycon]

Thanks for that info, Camper. I looked for a Chandra discussion here before but must have looked in the wrong area.

 

[Bobbisangel]

I can't even imagine Burke killing JB because he was only 9 years old at the time. I look back on my son at 9 yrs old and there is no way he would have known how to murder anyone and not leave evidence or have known what a groat was.

I think that Ramsey's said that Burke was in bed because they wanted to keep him out of the whole thing. I think they were protecting him from being asked a ton of questions that he didn't have answers for. He very well could have still been asleep with the 911 call was made though. I have a couple of kids that when they were his age a tornato wouldn't have woke them up.

I don't know who killed this little girl. At one time I thought it was one of the parents but I don't think so anymore. I just wish that LE would find out who did it and that beautiful little girl would have justice.

 

[Miss Daisey]

Interesting BC .....

But wouldn't there have been a way for the Ramsey's to go after the culpable age person without BR being involved?

I don't think I'm wording this right ... so bare with me while I "talk" this through.

Let's say BR was involved but didn't actually kill JB, the culpable age person (will use CAP in rest of post) did. I'm thinking the Ramsey's of course will cover up for BR,but no way are they going to let CAP get away scott free for murdering their daughter.And since you believe the grand jury knows the whole story,but cannot do anything with BR because of his age ... don't you think the Ramsey's would want CAP to pay for this crime? Why would they want to cover up for CAP also?

Is this making sense to you?

Capp,

It makes perfect sense to me. I don't believe the Ramsey's would have allowed a second person to escape justice even if it meant Burke was involved...especially an adult person. It's the one issue in the BDI theory that completly turns me away from it.

It's also incredible to believe either parent would string up the body, or place a paint stick in her vagina as a staging process. Or...if those things had already occured when they discoved her body...how they could have viewed this horror without wanting to hang whoever did it?..even if Burke was involved. If that were the case, wouldn't any parent have wanted to get him into a mental facility ASAP?

With all the money the Ramseys have spent on this "evasion", it would have been less to spend it on Burke's defense...especially since CO couldn't prosecute him anyway. (and I bet they knew that already, if they had suspected him).

If as much effort were placed on an intruder theory as on the BDI theory..I believe there's as strong a case to be made. There aren't any more, or less, missing pieces to the intruder did it theory than in the BDI theory. Any perp...known or unknown to the Ramseys..could have gotten into the house. For what reason would they commit such a hideous act? Why does any sick, perverted killer do it?

As violent as the murder was, it could have been for revenge. If one could believe a Ramsey staged it...during the hectic/horrific aftermath.. why wouldn't one consider that a determined perp could have staged it as though someone in the family did it?...with advance planning.

IMO

 

[sissi]

Today's news.

Man Charged With Kidnapping, Raping Two Girls

PORT CHARLOTTE, Fla. (May 22) - A man kidnapped two girls from their homes while their parents slept, took them to a construction site and raped them before sending them home, threatening to kill their families if they said anything, authorities said.




Erick Thomas Knapp Jr., 31, confessed to investigators that he kidnapped, bound and raped the girls, ages 13 and 7, in separate incidents, sheriff's Capt. Michael Savage told the Charlotte Sun Herald for Sunday's editions. He said there may be more victims.

"He went into occupied residences and snatched children while their parents were sleeping in the next room," Savage said. "I don't know how much more of a monster" one can be.

Knapp was charged with kidnapping, armed burglary and sexual battery and was being held in the Charlotte County Jail without bond. If convicted, he could face the death penalty for allegedly raping a person younger than age 12.

A woman who answered the phone at the jail early Sunday said Knapp would not be allowed to answer a reporter's questions and said she did not know whether Knapp had legal representation.

According to an arrest report, Knapp kidnapped the 13-year-old girl early Thursday from her South Florida home, tied her hands and blindfolded her. He took her to a house under construction nearby and raped her, then sent her home, saying he would kill her family if she told authorities.

The girl went home and told her parents, who called police. During the investigation, the 7-year-old came forward to say she had a similar experience weeks earlier, officials said. The girl had been afraid that Knapp would harm her family if she reported the crime.

Charlotte County Sheriff John Davenport praised the 13-year-old girl's courage for reporting the rape, which the sheriff said may have saved other young girls.

"This girl was very brave in coming forward," he said. "He would still be out there looking to victimize."

Port Charlotte is about 95 miles south of Tampa on Florida's Gulf Coast.

On April 16, the body of 13-year-old Sarah Lunde was found near her family's mobile home in Ruskin, a Tampa suburb. Convicted sex offender David Lee Onstott has pleaded not guilty to first-degree murder and attempted sexual battery in her strangling death.


05/22/05 14:22 EDT

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Most of the posters here,in this point of the JB murder (8 long years!),after grueling novice investigating and reviewing (with the help of this forum),have pretty iron clad theories.

Would we at this time be willing to change our theories,if something was discovered that pulled you away from your theory.I'm not talking big this is the smoking gun discovery,but something that would make you say ...hmmmm,never thought of that?

Would you ... honestly?

never thought of...

...the brutality of the RN combined with the brutality of the killing make some kind of joint statement, unnecessary in any RDI theory?

...the RN author was able to write a long note while in the house is an indication as to how calm the perp was, a calmness that would not be present in a coverup or staging?

 

[Lacy Wood]

...the RN author was able to write a long note while in the house is an indication as to how calm the perp was, a calmness that would not be present in a coverup or staging?

This is a very good question to address and a key element of my suggestion that the note was written prior to the 25th, and not by a family member or an intruder on the night of the murder. Either a family member or an intruder in the home that night would have a problem with "calmness" and the facts, references, and thoughts that went into the note. An intruder with a complex story to tell would have almost certainly practiced and written a note to his satisfaction away from the home and brought it, for many reasons

The problem with the note is why, and who on earth could gain from it? But if we can envision a compelling situation in the family that a phony abduction would address, then a perceived need for a note as part of a scheme might emerge.

I have previously discussed the conjecture of a possible abduction scheme to address the "handicap" of being a rich white girl with no "issues" for JB in a Miss America competition. She would be "coping" with a kidnapping she might have slept through. That scheme failing by several possible complications.

After reading some of the thoughts of Blue Crab posted on the forum, I thought of a scenario that may explain the note even better. Assume that sexual games, play, or abuse between an unnamed person (family or ?) and JonBenet is discovered by Mom and there is visible injury or change to JB's genitalia. The danger would exist that it could be seen and reported by a pediatrician, or mentioned by JB to a school nurse or counselor required by law to report it. Criminal investigation of the family is a possibility.

A plan could emerge to create an explanation for the abuse. A note is written for a staged abduction that will provide cover for her injuries. I suspect a plan would include immediately leaving Boulder for good after the incident to "start over". JonBenet would have been "rescued" in some way in the plan. She might sleep through the incident, or be rendered unconsious (pillow over the face or choking) if she started to wake. (She would need to be prevented from seeing anyone she knew in the plan to avoid her possibly exposing the scheme.) The police would be given the note to puzzle over and reports made, but the entire family including JonBenet would be gone. Obviously this hypothetical plan fails...She awakens and in rendering her unconsious, silencing, and/or otherwise, she is hurt badly...possibly by accidental asphyxia. Even the perception she was dead could lead to panicked coverup measures.

This way you have a relaxed note written from the notepad with the mom's fingerprints, by a pen from (and replaced in) the cup, a devastated family with no desire to talk about their role in even an accidental death since it brings out sexual abuse and their own role in the daughter's death from a bizarre scheme. And, in conclusion, since the thread addresses changing views, I will say my views seem to have been changing.