Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #103

[anneg]

No, I agree that it’s’ not always black and white regarding the vaccine and sometimes masking. But the question we are responding to is regarding those who “flaunted every protocol from the beginning,” not people who may have valid reasons. The people flouting the protocol are “treating with contemptuous disregard” or “engaging in scornful behavior” regarding these scientific standards of healthful behavior during a pandemic. These people are loud and proud of their attitude of “nobody’s going to tell me what to do.”

In your comment you referred to parents sending their kid to school sick, which is definitely flouting rules. I would think it would definitely be your business if they deliberately did something that could get your kid and the whole class sick. Would you “respect” their decision as you claimed in the comment I quoted?

Flout (sorry, but it’s not “flaunt” ) means:
Definition of flout
(Entry 1 of 2)

: to treat with contemptuous disregard : SCORN
flouting the rules

: to indulge in scornful behavior
Definition of FLOUT

Although due to usage, “flaunt” is sometimes viewed as acceptable, but it doesn’t mean the same as “flout.”
The Grammarphobia Blog: Flaunting and flouting

BBM

ETA: Corrected spelling of Flout

Thank you for correcting this and including the links...seeing "flaunt" when "flout" is correct always bugs me! (although I'm sure "auto-corrupt" plays a role sometimes)

 

[Lilibet]

I think this sums up where we are for me. Covid has absolutely ruined relationships for me in the past 2 years. You can't tell me that you don't care about my health or others and then expect me to feel the same about you. All "you" have done is told me I can't trust you and that "you" care more about yourself. The relationship can't be the same for me after that.

BBM

Well said, and you’ve said in a few words how most of us would feel about the ones mentioned in the question @MrX asked.

And to quote Maya Angelou:

“When someone shows you who they are believe them the first time.”

Many, many people in the U.S. have shown us who they are. Thankfully, I don’t know any of them personally.

 

[ilovewings]

I absolutely do not even believe people like this anymore. Most of the people I see do whatever the hell they want with NO regard for a pandemic. Then when they get sick they act like they just didn't understand the situation. Baloney. They all think they've researched the issue. No one 2 years into this thing is unaware that this is contagious and you get it from other people.

I have seen people over and over online look into vacations and trips with the very specific goal in mind of avoiding having to do anything to prevent contracting or spreading a contagious illness. This is more about people embarrassed getting caught sick or killing people, "Oops! I didn't realize!" Yes, you did. You knew. You were taking the risk and just hoping to come out unscathed because you probably have so far.

Every time I watch sporting events on TV and see crowds of screaming
humanity, unmasked, squeezed together, I just shake my head in wonder!!
Even though these are outdoor events, with Omicron, I dont think
it matters much---these people are just plain out of touch with the
real world we are presently living in---

 

[Lilibet]

Thank you for correcting this and including the links...seeing "flaunt" when "flout" is correct always bugs me! (although I'm sure "auto-corrupt" plays a role sometimes)

I’m such a word nerd that these things grate like fingernails on a chalkboard. I was disappointed in the link I posted saying it’s starting to become accepted usage. I agree about “auto-corrupt.”

 

[Cool Cats]

BBM

Well said, and you’ve said in a few words how most of us would feel about the ones mentioned in the question @MrX asked.

And to quote Maya Angelou:

“When someone shows you who they are believe them the first time.”

Many, many people in the U.S. have shown us who they are. Thankfully, I don’t know any of them personally.

I will add:

Fool me once shame on you.

Fool me twice shame on me.

 

[Lilibet]

I will add:

Fool me once shame on you.

Fool me twice shame on me.

Yuppity, yup yup!

 

[beatrixpotter]

It’s not just a Covid vaccine. It’s any vaccine. And her doctors have advised her not to get it. So say what you will or downplay her autoimmune but she was almost suicidal before her autoimmune cleared up. We’d rather not go there again.

I'm not at all downplaying autoimmune diseases. My sil has lupus and has literally not figuratively almost died from something as simple as the flu more than once. And not one of the specialists she sees would suggest it was safer to not get vaccinated in case a vaccine could induce a transient autoimmune flare.

But I am over all highly suspicious of all the people who claim their doctors suggest not to get one. I do not know one serious reputable doctor treating actual autoimmune disease say this to anyone. I do however know medical doctors I could go to though and get them to say I shouldn't get it. And all my alternative medicine friends know the same and have actively sought doctors out just for this.

I'm sorry if I'm wrong about your mil's situation. But having seen similar situations repeatedly of people who are only seeing "alternative" practitioners who tell them this, always makes me suspicious. Severe depression sucks. But a severe case of covid isn't going to help someone with an autoimmune disease either. It sure won't help with severe depression either.

And unfortunately covid has serious side effects on the brain. I'm very sorry for your mil and all the millions out there having to risk covid. This is a perfect example though of why other people SHOULD be making better and safer choices for everyone involved like regularly masking indoors. There is no real risk free scenario. The vaccines might be risky for some. But we've got covid which is even riskier.

Choosing to not protect others is what bothers me. And that's what most people are choosing to do. When they choose to go everywhere unmasked they make the entire world riskier and unsafe for those who can't be vaccinated and those who are still vulnerable while vaccinated. I'm very bothered by that level of thoughtlessness.

 

[WichitaFalls]

<modsnip>
Unfortunately the pandemic has brought about the same hard decisions. I disagree with some of my family members choices through the pandemic (some haven't vaxed or they have vaxed and continue to go to restaurants, consets, etc.). I don't and they don't expect me to make choices that I'm uncomfortable with. It's awfully lonely, it feels like being on an island at times.
My bottom line is I'm in charge of only me and man, although it sometimes feels like my head will explode, I force myself not to continually challenge them. Managing the worry about them getting sick and contributing to the ongoing pandemic is a struggle sometimes every day but I'm getting better at that. Sometimes that means taking a short break from talking with them, I'll just email or text until I regain my balance. They know how I feel and I know how they feel. I love them and that trumps all. Tough times in so many ways but I do find comfort in being true to my self and my beliefs it would be impossible for me to do otherwise.
I heard this quote from William Shakespeare when I was 14 in an English class . . . it rang so true then and still does for me.
"This above all: to thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man."

 

[Cool Cats]

U.S. Blood Banks Experiencing Biggest Shortage in a Decade

Schedule Your Blood Donation With The Red Cross

The pandemic has caused many supply-chain bottlenecks in everyday life, but few are as critical as the United States’ ever-shrinking blood banks. For the American Red Cross, which supplies about 40% of the nation’s blood, and other nonprofit blood centers, the problem lies mostly at the top of the chain: the diminishing number of healthy donors.

“This is the biggest challenge that I’ve seen in my 30 years in the business,” Chris Hrouda, president of biomedical services at the American Red Cross, said in an interview Thursday.

We simply like to keep three days of inventory,” he said. “We’re struggling to keep one day.” Blood takes up to three days to be tested and prepared for patients.

Remote work, blood drive cancellations, and the limits that colleges and businesses have placed on the number of people allowed in public spaces have all reduced donor turnout.

“We just didn’t get as much access as we had hoped for this fall,” Hrouda said.

Compounding the problem, the Red Cross, like many employers, is struggling to attract and retain employees amid the pandemic.

Vanderbilt, the only level-one trauma center in its region, has recalibrated the transfusions it uses to rescue patients — by using fewer red blood cells — to ensure that there is enough for all. “We still think that’s safe, and we know that saves lives,” Andrews said.

Other hospitals have altered treatment for some patients or canceled some patient surgeries, Red Cross officials said.

At Vanderbilt, “an elective surgery put off today is an emergency surgery tomorrow,” Andrews said. The medical staff has held two to three blood drives a month, up from one before the pandemic, to help replenish the center’s supplies, she said. But more is needed.

 

[CharlestonGal]

Will you be able to go back to normal with people who flaunted every protocol from the beginning?

Nope. When people show me who they are, I believe them.

I also don't hang out with people who drink and drive, refuse to put their kids in car seats or don't bother to lock up their guns. Recklessly endangering other people is not a quality I can get over. Nor do I want to. jmo

 

[Jsizzle]

I'm not at all downplaying autoimmune diseases. My sil has lupus and has literally not figuratively almost died from something as simple as the flu more than once. And not one of the specialists she sees would suggest it was safer to not get vaccinated in case a vaccine could induce a transient autoimmune flare.

But I am over all highly suspicious of all the people who claim their doctors suggest not to get one. I do not know one serious reputable doctor treating actual autoimmune disease say this to anyone. I do however know medical doctors I could go to though and get them to say I shouldn't get it. And all my alternative medicine friends know the same and have actively sought doctors out just for this.

I'm sorry if I'm wrong about your mil's situation. But having seen similar situations repeatedly of people who are only seeing "alternative" practitioners who tell them this, always makes me suspicious. Severe depression sucks. But a severe case of covid isn't going to help someone with an autoimmune disease either. It sure won't help with severe depression either.

And unfortunately covid has serious side effects on the brain. I'm very sorry for your mil and all the millions out there having to risk covid. This is a perfect example though of why other people SHOULD be making better and safer choices for everyone involved like regularly masking indoors. There is no real risk free scenario. The vaccines might be risky for some. But we've got covid which is even riskier.

Choosing to not protect others is what bothers me. And that's what most people are choosing to do. When they choose to go everywhere unmasked they make the entire world riskier and unsafe for those who can't be vaccinated and those who are still vulnerable while vaccinated. I'm very bothered by that level of thoughtlessness.

Like I said in my previous post. She would rather take her chances with Covid than have an outbreak of her autoimmune. She has Bullous pemphigoid. It surfaced a few years ago and she dealt with it for almost 2 years before it went into remission. She would get huge! (Like bigger than your fist) sores/blisters all over he body but most commonly in her groin, under her arms etc. they were painful and when they burst they would get infected. It’s a very rare condition and she had a hard time finding a doctor who specialized in it. She had to be put on a high dose of prednisone for about 18 months and coming off of that is no joke either. It was a constant state of pain, medications and deep depression (especially living alone). It’s finally under control but she does not want her immune system to go haywire and have this tear it’s ugly head again. Under any circumstances. She said she’d rather die from Covid. I’m not kidding. She’s also not out snd about flaunting her unvaccinated self. She’s almost 80. She hardly goes anywhere. It’s sad and I feel for her because I know how terrible it was for her. Her doctors basically said they weren’t sure if it would cause an immune response or not. She’s not taking the chance and they agreed it’s probably not the best idea (not to mention she told them she’d rather die than get it again). Constant pain and infection. So judging someone like this is just not right IMO.

 

[Cool Cats]

Nope. When people show me who they are, I believe them.

I also don't hang out with people who drink and drive, refuse to put their kids in car seats or don't bother to lock up their guns. Recklessly endangering other people is not a quality I can get over. Nor do I want to. jmo

It is often not even about masks or vaccines but simply about creating drama.

You know the type.

I say to them that I don't do drama and to take it else where. I am good at changing the subject.

"I'm bored with this subject" .... yawn.

No one wants to be boring.

 

[WichitaFalls]

I'm not aware of any autoimmune disease that preclude getting a covid vaccine. I know people who have an autoimmune disease and who believe it precludes them because they in general don't trust pharmaceutical companies, the CDC etc.

<modsnip: no link> I have seen people literally trashing their career because they are terrified of the vaccine in large part because of the enormous scare mongering campaign.

I am in some health groups on FB and you literally can not admit you were vaccinated and had no serious side effects without people jumping down your throat and saying, "Yet!" "That you know of!". It's like a religious belief the vaccines are scary and going to cause horrible damage and it's invariably based not on science but speculation and nonsense.

Also I don't believe unvaxxed people are out to get me. I believe they simply do not care if they do get me. All the ones I know will do NOTHING to protect anyone else that inconveniences them in the slightest. They simply do not believe they are in anyway responsible for the health and well being of others around them. It is someone else's responsibility to only protect themselves and avoid catching covid. And if that means others have to stay home and can't ever participate in the slightest indoor group activity again so be it. They usually believe those people are just over reacting and "scared" for no real reason.

I have two friends with Rheumatoid Arthritis that are being treated with big gun drugs such as IV Rituxan, IV Humira, etc. One was told by her RD at a huge teaching hospital she could not take COVID vaccine (her inflammatory markers are seriously high and her disease is very active). The 0ther was given the vaccine with the caveat being that her Rituxan would most likely render the vaccine ineffective which it did. It was devastating to her hopes to spend time with her grandchildren.
So technically an AI issue doesn't preclude the vaccine but the drugs taken for the condition do. At least that's the way I understand their situations.

 

[RANCH]

How Should Patients With Autoimmune Diseases Approach COVID Vaccination?
— Mixed messaging and a lack of tailored research leaves providers and patients in the dark

Healthcare is a personal and individualized relationship between a provider and patient. Each patient is treated according to their particular symptoms and personal health characteristics. For this reason, the wide variability in patient responses to the same medical treatments must be acknowledged and accounted for in making public health decisions. Yet, there has been a lack of specific government guidance to help those with autoimmune diseases navigate COVID-19 vaccination.

https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/second-opinions/95207

 

[WichitaFalls]

Our main health aide that works for numerous residents here...in and out of their apartments all day long, doesn't mask...she is going to Vegas for NYE weekend. Big gambler, Can't stay away.

I don't know how one can be a home health aide and carry on with that kind of behavior. I would think there would be massive legal issues if and when she infects residents due to her behavior. If there aren't legal ramifications, there should be. That type of behavior renders the residents sitting ducks.

 

[indicolite22]

Anti-vaxxer kickboxing champion who refused to acknowledge he had Covid and discharged himself dies | Daily Mail Online

• Kickboxing champion Fred Sinistra died from complications relating to Covid-19
• Anti-vaxxer discharged himself from hospital in Liege, Belgium, before his death
• Sinistra, 41, told followers he would treat 'the little virus' from home with oxygen

 

[Jsizzle]

I don't know how one can be a home health aide and carry on with that kind of behavior. I would think there would be massive legal issues if and when she infects residents due to her behavior. If there aren't legal ramifications, there should be. That type of behavior renders the residents sitting ducks.

Agreed! That is just insanity to me.

 

[beatrixpotter]

I have two friends with Rheumatoid Arthritis that are being treated with big gun drugs such as IV Rituxan, IV Humira, etc. One was told by her RD at a huge teaching hospital she could not take COVID vaccine (her inflammatory markers are seriously high and her disease is very active). The 0ther was given the vaccine with the caveat being that her Rituxan would most likely render the vaccine ineffective which it did. It was devestating to her hopes to spend time with her grandchildren.
So technically an AI issue doesn't preclude the vaccine but the drugs taken for the condition do. At least that's the way I understand their situations.

Yes, I have friends and family on immune suppressing drugs that were vaccinated but mounted no measurable immune response to it. Exactly why we need to protect the vulnerable. It's simply not within everyone's power to protect themselves. But too many are making choices only for themselves.

 

[SouthAussie]

<RSBM> But too many are making choices only for themselves.

Because they completely disregard the fact that with rights come responsibilities.

A person may have a right to decide not to vaccinate, but that then negates their right to not wear a mask to protect others.

imo

With rights come responsibilities: how coronavirus is a pandemic of hypocrisy

 

[WichitaFalls]

Yes, I have friends and family on immune suppressing drugs that were vaccinated but mounted no measurable immune response to it. Exactly why we need to protect the vulnerable. It's simply not within everyone's power to protect themselves. But too many are making choices only for themselves.

Heartbreaking isn't it? You verbalize what I'm feeling in many of your posts. I think you must be a remarkable young woman/mom(everyone is young to me in my ehhhh mid to late 60s).