FL - 17-yo Teen Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #5

[ScubaTwinn]

The altercation, if one believes the girlfriends account, came immediately after GZ asked TM what he was doing there. Not exactly fighting words and a simple answer would likely have sufficed... "visiting my dad's girlfriend, they live at **** blah blah", who are you?"

No doubt this post will be answered with fingers pointing to a dismissed criminal action on GZ's record. We don't know, and couldn't post it if we did, what TM has done in his past or why he was suspended and sent to his dad's in Sanford - keep in mind, juvenile records are not made public, and LE would not say one way or the other when asked about TM's background.

Respectfully snipped for space. Why couldn't George have given a simple answer with "I'm with the neighborhood watch. What are you doing here?"

 

[Wise Old Owl]

QUOTE:

Speaking on ABC's "Good Morning America," Joe Oliver said George Zimmerman is not a racist and has virtually lost his own life since the shooting.

"This is a guy who thought he was doing the right thing at the time and it's turned out horribly wrong," Oliver said.



http://www.timesunion.com/news/arti...ould-say-he-s-sorry-3434526.php#ixzz1qEADzWNl



Ok, so GZ THOUGHT he was doing the right thing by shooting Trayvon. Really? And yet, GZ is now very remorseful? How could that be? He's remorseful for doing "the right thing"? GMAB!

GZ had a choice. GZ took a gun to a fist fight and CHOSE to pull the trigger. Bad choice - bad decision.

I'm just so tired of all of this. We, the public, need more information. IF there is evidence of GZ being justified - then SHOW US! The fact that its been this long and this story is now nationwide and we've still not seen nor heard any of this "justified evidence" tells me it doesn't exist. Why would you want the public tension to continue to simmer (its very close to boiling at this point) if you have evidence that shows justification? But that's JMHO and all that there.

 

[rossva]

One can ask the same thing about Martin's gf, and her waiting so long before coming forward.

Wouldn't this mysterious 911 caller have come forward by now with this case breaking news? Or are they waiting like Casey Anthony for those big buck interviews. If they are holding a 911 tape it's probably the one TM supposedly made. jmo

 

[Wise Old Owl]

One can ask the same thing about Martin's gf, and her waiting so long before coming forward.

Respectfully, we do not know when the gf came forward. I've siad this before - we know she was so distraught that she was hospitalized and couldn't attend Trayvon's wake. So, I'm quite sure that the family knew about her and what she knew - she was hospitalized FGS - they knew.

Just because the public wasn't told about her doesn't mean she waited to come forward. If it was my daughter, of course we would have told authorities and Trayvon's family and I certainly would not want her splashed all over the news and would do everything I could to keep that from happening.

JMHO

 

[Isabelle]

Trayvon's girlfriend probably came forward as soon as she heard Trayvon was killed. I would bet LE were keeping that information 'close to the vest'. I think LE thought the case was closed!

 

[LambChop]

Respectfully snipped for space. Why couldn't George have given a simple answer with "I'm with the neighborhood watch. What are you doing here?"

Because by GZ's proven actions GZ does not feel he has to answer to anyone. He disregarded advice from LE to wait in his car for a patrol car that was on the way. He expresses concern that "they always get away" another LE failure. He reports his neighbors to LE for leaving garage doors and windows open. GZ appears to have appointed himself as the taking on the responsibility of the one in authority. And I mean no disrespect but it could have a lot to do with being raised in a family with a strict father who happened to be a judge. This certainly would explain why GZ could have made a judgment call to disregard a request by LE to wait and took matters into his own hands. We may disagree on a lot of things but the moment he told LE okay he understood to wait in his vehicle and then continued to pursue he was taking the matter into his own hands. With 46 calls to 911 this is what he would normally do. jmo

 

[SuziQ]

Reasons one might be suspended in this district.

http://www.neola.com/miamidade-fl/pdf/scsc.pdf

I got suspended for staging a "Kent State" Walk out when I was in 7th grade. Not in the handbook. hmph.

Love this!

You are the coolest I swear!

 

[jjenny]

Honestly, this doesn't seem to address who started what.
It only seems to address some of the moments after the fracas has ensued.
imho

Yes, the witness doesn't claim to know who started what. But he still supports GZ's version of events that GZ was the one screaming for help (considering most everybody was assuming it was Trayvon that's pretty important).

 

[LambChop]

One can ask the same thing about Martin's gf, and her waiting so long before coming forward.

Having lost an 11 year old grandson in December and seeing what it did to his siblings, classmates and cousins, I think this post is incredibly cruel. I'm sorry but how is it possible to judge what condition this child was in when she heard the news knowing TM could have died the moment they were disconnected. Severe emotion shock and under a doctors care, her parents made the right decision. jmo

 

[jjenny]

Mary C. described GZ as a big guy, chunky, twice TM's size.

Well she also calls TM "little boy" and some reports say TM is 6'3''.

 

[SuziQ]

Actually, he's right - I was like, are you kidding me, then I took a minute to look it up. No kids around here to ask:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=goons

goons
Known as Gangstaz and killers. Partners who ride and die together.
1)"I'll come to your house, me and my goons
Loadin up bangers, ridin under the moon
Throwin up fingers sayin "My side rule"-Lil wayne

2)You shouldnt had f'd wit tyrone, his goons are comin to whoop your *advertiser censored**.

_______
I also have to agree that the other "c" word is not something a 28 year old man would use, unless he was raised by the KKK.

It's acceptable to people within the same race to use those words as endearments towards each other. One race talking about another is not a positive statement. No way.

 

[jjenny]

Trayvon's girlfriend probably came forward as soon as she heard Trayvon was killed. I would bet LE were keeping that information 'close to the vest'. I think LE thought the case was closed!

I believe Trayvon's family lawyer said they contacted her after they looked at Trayvon's phone records and looked at the time of her call.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

QUOTE:

Speaking on ABC's "Good Morning America," Joe Oliver said George Zimmerman is not a racist and has virtually lost his own life since the shooting.

"This is a guy who thought he was doing the right thing at the time and it's turned out horribly wrong," Oliver said.



http://www.timesunion.com/news/arti...ould-say-he-s-sorry-3434526.php#ixzz1qEADzWNl



Ok, so GZ THOUGHT he was doing the right thing by shooting Trayvon. Really? And yet, GZ is now very remorseful? How could that be? He's remorseful for doing "the right thing"? GMAB!

GZ had a choice. GZ took a gun to a fist fight and CHOSE to pull the trigger. Bad choice - bad decision.

I'm just so tired of all of this. We, the public, need more information. IF there is evidence of GZ being justified - then SHOW US! The fact that its been this long and this story is now nationwide and we've still not seen nor heard any of this "justified evidence" tells me it doesn't exist. Why would you want the public tension to continue to simmer (its very close to boiling at this point) if you have evidence that shows justification? But that's JMHO and all that there.

There is evidence of it. GZ had injuries and a witness said Trayvon was on top of GZ in a fight. What more is needed?

 

[SuziQ]

But why would Zimmerman be referring to Trayvon in that manner? He and Trayvon certainly were not "goons" together. & by him saying effing goons, it certainly doesn't sound endearing. I don't say I love my effing kids, or that my spouse is an effing sweetheart...

I don't buy it...

Speculation here: but racism is often passed down through generations...we don't know where Zimmerman would have heard/picked up a term like that, but he does certainly have older relatives and possibly friends. There's no such thing as an old racial slur.

& I doubt he would have been so blatant as to say the word N99999 which certainly would have been more clear. I think he muttered the "c" word never intending for anyone to pick up on it, much less have it analyzed.

IMO MOO JMO

I grew up in L.A. One group was always getting into it with another. But the two groups that had the most animosity towards each other were blacks and latinos. IMO, the fact that Mr. Zimmerman is of hispanic heritage does not convince me he is not racist.

 

[annalia]

It's acceptable to people within the same race to use those words as endearments towards each other. One race talking about another is not a positive statement. No way.

And it makes no sense that's how GZ would have meant it.

Are we really going to try to say, after we hear GZ saying that these *advertiser censored****** always get away, that saying effin **** was some term of endearment? :waitasec: That's supposed to make what he said all fine and dandy?

Even if it was goon and not the other word, using the urban dictionary term, to me it would say that's exactly what GZ decided Tray was, some gangbanger up to no good.

GZ's friends have gone into spin overload.

BUt with the FBI involved, hopefully they can conclude exactly what was said.

JMHO

 

[daisy7]

For those that missed it last night, here's the link to the WS radio show which discussed this case and Richard Hornsby was a guest.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2012/03/26/websleuths-radio

 

[Wise Old Owl]

We've been told GZ had injuries - everything from a bloody nose to a broken nose and he had a wound on the back of his head that they've said had already started to heal (makes no sense). But, for me, just telling us that doesn't prove anything.

The one witness saying he saw Trayvon on top then goes on to say that "once I got upstairs" - again, doesn't make sense. If this guy ran upstairs then he turned his back on this fight. If you are witnessing a fight - why turn your back and run upstairs? Plus, he goes on to say that once upstairs the guy on top was now on the ground. Well, then this witness had to have heard the gunshot. Wouldn't he have turned back around or at least looked when he heard the shot? And, if he heard the shot and was right there - he would have vital information as to who was where when GZ fired.

I would also like to know about the autopsy - the trajectory of the bullet, and exactly where Trayvon was shot on his body.

Also, what about GZ's shirt? If he shot Trayvon at close range he would have spatter on his shirt and arms and maybe even face depending on how close.

We've heard nothing of all of this - vital crime scene information. Just one witness saying so - doesn't make it so.


JMHO

 

[jjenny]

We've been told GZ had injuries - everything from a bloody nose to a broken nose and he had a wound on the back of his head that they've said had already started to heal (makes no sense). But, for me, just telling us that doesn't prove anything.

The one witness saying he saw Trayvon on top then goes on to say that "once I got upstairs" - again, doesn't make sense. If this guy ran upstairs then he turned his back on this fight. If you are witnessing a fight - why turn your back and run upstairs? Plus, he goes on to say that once upstairs the guy on top was now on the ground. Well, then this witness had to have heard the gunshot. Wouldn't he have turned back around or at least looked when he heard the shot? And, if he heard the shot and was right there - he would have vital information as to who was where when GZ fired.

I would also like to know about the autopsy - the trajectory of the bullet, and exactly where Trayvon was shot on his body.

Also, what about GZ's shirt? If he shot Trayvon at close range he would have spatter on his shirt and arms and maybe even face depending on how close.

We've heard nothing of all of this - vital crime scene information. Just one witness saying so - doesn't make it so.


JMHO

I presume he run upstairs to call 911. None of the witnesses that called 911 physically interfered with the fight and as I recall at least one different witness said they went upstairs. So why pick on this one?

 

[LambChop]

We've been told GZ had injuries - everything from a bloody nose to a broken nose and he had a wound on the back of his head that they've said had already started to heal (makes no sense). But, for me, just telling us that doesn't prove anything.

The one witness saying he saw Trayvon on top then goes on to say that "once I got upstairs" - again, doesn't make sense. If this guy ran upstairs then he turned his back on this fight. If you are witnessing a fight - why turn your back and run upstairs? Plus, he goes on to say that once upstairs the guy on top was now on the ground. Well, then this witness had to have heard the gunshot. Wouldn't he have turned back around or at least looked when he heard the shot? And, if he heard the shot and was right there - he would have vital information as to who was where when GZ fired.

I would also like to know about the autopsy - the trajectory of the bullet, and exactly where Trayvon was shot on his body.

Also, what about GZ's shirt? If he shot Trayvon at close range he would have spatter on his shirt and arms and maybe even face depending on how close.

We've heard nothing of all of this - vital crime scene information. Just one witness saying so - doesn't make it so.


JMHO

Did I read it correctly that this man also took time to lock his door? Some people would have run over to yell at them to stop and some people just will not get involved. To think he could have helped when GZ was asking for help and didn't, things could have turned out differently....or he could have been shot. It would have been better all around if GZ had just kept TM in sight from his truck or done as LE suggested wait for the patrol car to get there. jmo

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I presume he run upstairs to call 911. None of the witnesses that called 911 physically interfered with the fight and as I recall at least one different witness said they went upstairs. So why pick on this one?

This one witness said it was GZ screaming for help and that he told GZ he was calling 911. Ok, let's assume this guy didn't have a cell and had to go to his apt for a phone. He lives upstairs and that's where he heads. Once on the stairs his back is toward GZ and Trayvon and the fight. Evidently he (the witness) didn't know about the gun either - because if you saw a fight with a gun why in the world would you turn your back? You could be caught in the crossfire.

I'm thinking this witness lived upstairs in either one of the buildings that they were between. Ok, so he runs to the stairs and heads upstairs - where GZ and Trayvon were - it was between the back of both buildings. So, once at the top of the stairs this guy had to go down the hallway/walkway to get to his door. The walkways were on the other side of each building - he was completely and totally out of sight of this fight now. Which leads me to believe that's when the shot rang out - he heard it - but saw nothing because he was on the opposite side of the building. Once in his apt - he ran to the back to look out the window and that's when he saw Trayvon face down.

If that is what happened - this guy isn't much of a witness. He saw the beginning of the fight and ran off and out of sight. He saw nothing of the shooting and who was where when it happened.


JMHO