Terri very upset in the weeks before Kyron's disappearance

[debs]

And of course I have a drs appt tomorrow morning, so I will miss it even if I tried to get the time zone thing right and found a link. I give up.

abbie

I hope you have that appointment backed up with appt cards and it can be verified by at least 4 other people

 

[KeyboardCat]

I think that its probably true that she was upset that her older son had to leave.

I bet that Kaine would even maybe defensive or evasive about this... simply because then blame could be irrationally laid on him for his missing son. Its not his fault. Who cares if he is a control freak? I'd be a control freak too involving a family of that size. Spouses, ex spouses, spouse's ex's, ex spouse's new spouse, children, half siblings, step children... whatever... If I were a man, I'd run a dang tight ship too.

I don't see him being manipulative... maybe its just a man who's life has had some drama and roller coaster type stuff... who hasn't? Maybe he wants to exert the authority he naturally has as a father and husband. He isn't a wife beater, at least nobody has come forward to accuse him of being abusive. Terri obviously didn't feel that she was unable to leave the house, or do her own thing... or have her own friends. She wasn't on a leash. She could do what she wanted when she wanted, quite obviously.. and he even bought her a beautiful car to do her own thing in style.

My father was a genuine control freak. I was never allowed to spend the night with friends... who I was not related to. No one was ever allowed to spend the night with me, that was not related. I never had a slumber party.. nor attended one. My mother was never allowed to leave the house, other than to the grocery store or work. We were not even allowed to use the telephone, unless he authorized it. No visitors were ever permitted who was not 'family.' I was never allowed to have after school activities... sports. Every thing that ever happened in my young life, my father had to okay it... music, movies, food, games, toys... everything had to be approved by him.

The ultimate goal of a true control freak is manipulation and isolation for a psychological reason. Kyron seems to have a full life. He was not isolated. He has friends, vacations, his own interests. Terri also had the same... she was not blocked access to her own telephone, the internet, a social life, friends, hobbies, whatever... Kaine did not block anyone's feelings of happiness or freedom.

Now. Maybe he was controlling during one press conference during a time when he would have grasped at some control at ANYTHING after feeling so helpless with his child gone. I can imagine a lot of people would do the same. Please give him a break. This broken hearted man is not a control freak.... nothing close.

Anyway, of course Terri would have been upset if her son 'had to leave.' I just wish we knew for sure if that is how it went down. Remember, Kaine said he got along well with her older son. I believe this. Kaine seems like a fun loving guy, who is firm and likes stability... routine... and I can see that as a wonderful attraction to any child... who has had feelings of insecurity or doubt due to family situations.

I think Kaine seems like a great father, husband, and maybe even role model, and if that isn't enough to generate a lot of respect, the fact that he is a victim of every parent's absolute nightmare should.

 

[watchful_eye]

1. No wonder J was having a rough adolescence, his mother had gone from man to man, setting up family each time, only to break it.

2. They say Terri was upset WEEKS before Kyron went missing. But J moved out of her and Kaine's home in MARCH. Was Terri just STILL upset from the move in March? Just a little confusing.

3. Boy does this give her a motive. You gotta think...your husband demands your oldest son to live with other family members...very frustrating and traumatizing....and you in return kidnap (or do worse) to his biological son?? DAYUM. That is COLD. GET A DIVORCE. NOT A VENDETTA.

 

[OneLove]

I think that its probably true that she was upset that her older son had to leave.

I bet that Kaine would even maybe defensive or evasive about this... simply because then blame could be irrationally laid on him for his missing son. Its not his fault. Who cares if he is a control freak? I'd be a control freak too involving a family of that size. Spouses, ex spouses, spouse's ex's, ex spouse's new spouse, children, half siblings, step children... whatever... If I were a man, I'd run a dang tight ship too.

I don't see him being manipulative... maybe its just a man who's life has had some drama and roller coaster type stuff... who hasn't? Maybe he wants to exert the authority he naturally has as a father and husband. He isn't a wife beater, at least nobody has come forward to accuse him of being abusive. Terri obviously didn't feel that she was unable to leave the house, or do her own thing... or have her own friends. She wasn't on a leash. She could do what she wanted when she wanted, quite obviously.. and he even bought her a beautiful car to do her own thing in style.

My father was a genuine control freak. I was never allowed to spend the night with friends... who I was not related to. No one was ever allowed to spend the night with me, that was not related. I never had a slumber party.. nor attended one. My mother was never allowed to leave the house, other than to the grocery store or work. We were not even allowed to use the telephone, unless he authorized it. No visitors were ever permitted who was not 'family.' I was never allowed to have after school activities... sports. Every thing that ever happened in my young life, my father had to okay it... music, movies, food, games, toys... everything had to be approved by him.

The ultimate goal of a true control freak is manipulation and isolation for a psychological reason. Kyron seems to have a full life. He was not isolated. He has friends, vacations, his own interests. Terri also had the same... she was not blocked access to her own telephone, the internet, a social life, friends, hobbies, whatever... Kaine did not block anyone's feelings of happiness or freedom.

Now. Maybe he was controlling during one press conference during a time when he would have grasped at some control at ANYTHING after feeling so helpless with his child gone. I can imagine a lot of people would do the same. Please give him a break. This broken hearted man is not a control freak.... nothing close.

Anyway, of course Terri would have been upset if her son 'had to leave.' I just wish we knew for sure if that is how it went down. Remember, Kaine said he got along well with her older son. I believe this. Kaine seems like a fun loving guy, who is firm and likes stability... routine... and I can see that as a wonderful attraction to any child... who has had feelings of insecurity or doubt due to family situations.
I think Kaine seems like a great father, husband, and maybe even role model, and if that isn't enough to generate a lot of respect, the fact that he is a victim of every parent's absolute nightmare should.

Thanks for sharing your very personal insight and experience with a "true" control freak. Its good to have you here at Websleuths.

On Kaine and his stepson, is it possible that they really DID get along, that the stepson DID like Kaine's attentiveness as a father-figure, and that Terri might have had major problems of jealousy with that? Could she have thought this 'relationship' detracted from HER relationship with each of them? That would be fairly inline with borderline personality thinking, and I've known a few with this kind of thinking. Covering by telling others that the two didn't get along would have fit the BPD mentality also. Just wondering if there are any other indicators that Kaine and stepson might have gotten along much better than Terri likes to admit.

 

[mayagrl]

It seems appropriate to be upset that her child was being told he couldn't live with her anymore.

It becomes a stretch to suggest it then is reason for motive that Terri harmed Kyron.

It could have been a motive, people have killed for much less. Maybe she just didn't like Kyron. IMO

 

[GrainneDhu]

Well I'll be a Monkey's Uncle. If my son was doing bad in school, would I send him away, confusing him even more. NO! If J is being shuffled around from step-dad, to dad, to grandparents, it's no wonder. I feel extremely sorry for J, and this whole case is only going to make it worse. I hope someone takes the time to sit down with him, help him with his homework, get the proper tutoring -- you know...things parents are supposed to do

MOO

Mel

I feel sorry for J as well.

As for removing him from the school he was going to, I think it depends on the reasons the grades were slipping. For example, before I met my husband, he chose to remove his son from one high school just before mid-year because he discovered that his kid was hanging out with a group of teens who were very actively into drugs.

This was nothing that help with homework, extra tutoring, etc, would help. And I'm not talking about a little pot being passed around, I'm talking about kids who were into crack cocaine, heroin, meth, etc.

The school itself had a pretty good reputation overall but it had close to 4000 students (my mind reels; my high school graduating class was less than 200). There were just too many kids present for the staff to closely supervise each and every kid.

When my husband discovered that his son's friends were all doing hard drugs, he couldn't see any viable way of breaking up the pattern than transferring him to a different school. As a single parent, my husband tried to closely supervise his son but it isn't possible to supervise a teenager closely enough if all his friends are doing drugs.

 

[gardeness]

I can't hold this against Terri or Kaine (sending son to live with bio dad), because I know too many divorced families who, once their son reached puberty, basically *had* to send the son to live with the father (all for behavior problems--including negative attitudes and failure in school). There comes a point where the father truly needs to be in charge...

 

[sogren]

I believe she was intentionally vague, intentionally misleading, or possibly just downright dishonest about when that appointment was. She said things about the doctor appointment in order to keep the teacher from being worried when Kyron didn’t report back to class. She didn’t want his absence to send up any red flags.

I agree about her being intentionally vague. And yup, her alleged appointment story worked like a charm.
I also wanted to say hi to you because I recognize you from the digiscrapping forums! :Banane19:

 

[human]

I think that its probably true that she was upset that her older son had to leave.

I bet that Kaine would even maybe defensive or evasive about this... simply because then blame could be irrationally laid on him for his missing son. Its not his fault. Who cares if he is a control freak? I'd be a control freak too involving a family of that size. Spouses, ex spouses, spouse's ex's, ex spouse's new spouse, children, half siblings, step children... whatever... If I were a man, I'd run a dang tight ship too.

I don't see him being manipulative... maybe its just a man who's life has had some drama and roller coaster type stuff... who hasn't? Maybe he wants to exert the authority he naturally has as a father and husband. He isn't a wife beater, at least nobody has come forward to accuse him of being abusive. Terri obviously didn't feel that she was unable to leave the house, or do her own thing... or have her own friends. She wasn't on a leash. She could do what she wanted when she wanted, quite obviously.. and he even bought her a beautiful car to do her own thing in style.

My father was a genuine control freak. I was never allowed to spend the night with friends... who I was not related to. No one was ever allowed to spend the night with me, that was not related. I never had a slumber party.. nor attended one. My mother was never allowed to leave the house, other than to the grocery store or work. We were not even allowed to use the telephone, unless he authorized it. No visitors were ever permitted who was not 'family.' I was never allowed to have after school activities... sports. Every thing that ever happened in my young life, my father had to okay it... music, movies, food, games, toys... everything had to be approved by him.

The ultimate goal of a true control freak is manipulation and isolation for a psychological reason. Kyron seems to have a full life. He was not isolated. He has friends, vacations, his own interests. Terri also had the same... she was not blocked access to her own telephone, the internet, a social life, friends, hobbies, whatever... Kaine did not block anyone's feelings of happiness or freedom.

Now. Maybe he was controlling during one press conference during a time when he would have grasped at some control at ANYTHING after feeling so helpless with his child gone. I can imagine a lot of people would do the same. Please give him a break. This broken hearted man is not a control freak.... nothing close.

Anyway, of course Terri would have been upset if her son 'had to leave.' I just wish we knew for sure if that is how it went down. Remember, Kaine said he got along well with her older son. I believe this. Kaine seems like a fun loving guy, who is firm and likes stability... routine... and I can see that as a wonderful attraction to any child... who has had feelings of insecurity or doubt due to family situations.

I think Kaine seems like a great father, husband, and maybe even role model, and if that isn't enough to generate a lot of respect, the fact that he is a victim of every parent's absolute nightmare should.

Thanks for that and it's good you see that as an adult.

ITA that there is no way that Kaine is a control freak.

A control freak does not buy his wife a flashy red car and let her do what she wants to all day with no accounting for her time.

People have talked about how he didn't know what was going on with Terri.

It can't be both ways. He can't be a control freak and unaware of what Terri is up to all day.

 

[Snowball58]

Maybe it's more simple. Maybe she wanted to get her son out of the house because she was pursuing either the MFH plot or had moved on to her Kyron plot and didn't want to expose her son to it. But she needed an excuse as to why her son was moving away, so she makes up some BS about him not getting along with Kaine and Kaine made him leave (also an opportunity to play the victim). Little did she know it would come back to bite her as possible motive.

Just thinking out loud and pondering ideas that would explain the two different stories we're hearing about Kaine's relationship with her son...

 

[GrainneDhu]

also re above I thought tarver was the bio dad.......and the 2nd hubby who was with her for about 5 years adopted him......he is the one now paying the child support....after of course she complained to the courts......

To be fair, if TMH had been unemployed at the time and applied for some sort of family assistance, the state may have forced her to go to court as a condition for getting aid.

That's the way it works in my state, anyway. The Aid to Dependent Children program determines if there is a non-custodial parent who can be taken to court to contribute child support.

So it may not have been TMH's idea at all to take J's adoptive father to court for child support.

 

[Jo in Calif]

I think the key issue to this news release was what Terry was doing before the disappearance of Kyron, be it months or weeks. It doesn't matter who's fault it was the son was sent away, it was Terry's reaction to the fact that he was sent away. She was ranting to people at the gym. I think this is just another dot to be connected. Remember, after the first pressure from LE, they wanted to talk to the media, off camera? I believe they were asked not to publish certain info, that media found out about. IMO the LE and media have done a pretty good job of not leaking a lot of info while the investigation has been going on. I think we will be hit with quite a bit of info in the coming weeks, IMO, before an arrest, for just what, we don't know yet, but LE sure does. Then we might see a confession or plea deal. Before then she wont plea or confess, until she knows what to confess or plea to. I don't think she knows exactly what LE knows.

 

[grandmaj]

2. Assumptions about victims - we still aren't sleuthing the victims here. We can't say "Kaine is a control freak" unless someone who knows him is quoted as saying that in the MSM. This is just one example. If you are going to jump out and say such a statement, be sure to link to the MSM so everyone knows this isn't your assumption

Those that are calling names here must have already forgotten the post from 2 days ago.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111263"]***PLEASE READ - Current Forum Issues***#2 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Donjeta]

I think two issues are sometimes confused.
The person responsible for deciding to send a child away may or may not be the same one who has butted heads with him the most.

 

[greenpalm]

J was adopted by TH's second husband, I think his name is Ecker. He is the one that pays child support. His bio dad is Tarver. So, one real dad, one adopted dad and one step dad. That poor guy. And to be shuffled around like an unwanted pet. My heart goes out to him.

Thank you for clearing that up. I tried to sort it all out. I kept searching for "Eckler" (I had it misspelled) before I posted that. Of course I didn't find anything with the wrong spelling. I wasn't precisely sure who was who. Only that she asked for child support from the non-bio dad. That also means that this Tarver guy had to sign over his parental rights, doesn't it? Ecker couldn't have adopted J if Tarver didn't grant permission or relinquish his? So, how does that all boil down? I would think if Tarver is still exercising parental rights (as in, he currently has custody) then Ecker would be off the hook on Child Support. But, I confess, my parents stayed married, my husband's parents stayed married, and so, far 14 years, and DH and I are still married, so I know little to nothing about divorce and child support legalities.

As you noted, my real point was that this was just one more thorn in the side of this kid, as far as I'm concerned. He's just been shuffled. I think about the mommy guilt I feel about the day in day out imperfections my kids have to tolerate in me, and there are many, but they do not compare to these kinds of shenanigans. Perhaps that's part of the reason this case has been like a car wreck, from which I can't quite tear my eyes away. It's real life, but the drama is unbelievable.

 

[greenpalm]

I agree about her being intentionally vague. And yup, her alleged appointment story worked like a charm.
I also wanted to say hi to you because I recognize you from the digiscrapping forums! :Banane19:

Well Howdy Right Back Atcha! :Banane19: You know I'm glad you popped up here, because it's made a good point. I've thought about RedSquirrel's long nut trail she's left all over the internet to Kingdom Come and back. Boy, let me tell you, "Greenpalm" has left some kind of groovy coconut trail too. When I commit some heinous crime, no one will have any trouble having a field day with my whole life. It's pretty much all out there! LOL! (Particularly a lot of the journaling I've put on scrapbook pages!)

Nice to see you!

 

[Amster]

I saw that interview too. Do you think Kaine misunderstood that question?

Yes...

 

[cypress]

Do you think it's possible that Terri gave different accounts of why J went to live with his dad based on whether or not Kaine was present?

What if Terri, outside Kaine's presence, told her friends and acquaintances what was really going on, but when with friends in Kaine's presence, she presented a watered down version of events per Kaine's request or direction. Desiree and Kaine had a different account of their break-up, and naturally Kaine's version presented him in a more favorable light. What if that's what's going on here?

My main issue with the different stories floating around is that even if Terri is a pathological liar, J has been living with his father for a while now. I'm sure J and his father have discussed what led to J living with his father after living all his life with his mother and even being adopted by another man. J has no reason to lie to his father, and J's father has no reason to lie to the press or to protect Terri. He was honest about Terri cheating on him, etc., I don't believe he'd lie about this.

All IMHO, of course.

 

[nurseratchett]

Who knows what the truth is...KGW again @ 1800 newscast saying although TH telling people it was due to Kaine butting heads with J, "reliable sources" say that is not correct, that it was Terri's idea. For all we know, maybe J recognized dysfunction and simply wanted to get out of his own accord.

 

[Ellebelle]

Yes, I thought we had been told that the teen was sent to live with his grandparents in Jan, 2010. Then he moved in with his dad in March.

We don't know if this info came from people who had only been talking with Terri or both Terri and Kaine.

Kaine's answer to why the teen left made no sense at all. Maybe he meant the summer plans, but I don't think so. Much of what Kaine has 'explained' has only muddied the waters even more.

I don't think Kaine is guilty directly in this, but I might nominate him for the most detached, purposely vague person I have ever heard of. I am not sure if I believe he really was so unaware, or if he is trying to fool us or himself.

I have always considered the move to me a very strong part of the motive, if Terri had one, in this. I too feel very bad for the teen. So many victims in this.

Exactly!!