The Brother & the Bike Fight

[not_my_kids]

She made that comment on June 17. Using the Washington court records name search and searching JB's name, I found that an individual with JB's name had a review hearing (in a felony case!) on June 18 in Grays Harbor County Superior Court. It seems likely to be JB's case as the case history includes an entry labeled "Stmnt Of Juv Offndr/plea of Guilty".

I think Lindsey probably heard her mother talking about the appearance and, while he wasn't actually being sent to a juvenile center on that date, an 11 year old girl wouldn't really know the distinction between going to court and going to juvy.

I should add that I learned the case was a felony-level case by taking the case number that I obtained from the name search and then searching by case number on the superior court case number search page.

If these are the same records that I found early on, they should also contain, at the end, a reference to probation modification. It could have been that Lindsey was hoping and praying that he would go to juvie, but they just revised his probation on him again.
I can't check myself, because my computer hates me and has decided that it will punish me by not opening links or letting me copy and paste unless it wants me to.

 

[Animal04216]

Just want to say that you all are walking a fine line with the juvenile records. DO NOT post his information here at this time. I have no problem with you talking about the fight and who may have been the adult who supposedly told him to go home, I do have an issue with his court info being put here unless LE actually comes out and says he is a POI. If that happens we can revisit what will be allowed.

 

[Normcar21]

I agree, Animal, thanks for holding us back from going overboard, which would not be helpful in any way.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Just want to say that you all are walking a fine line with the juvenile records. DO NOT post his information here at this time. I have no problem with you talking about the fight and who may have been the adult who supposedly told him to go home, I do have an issue with his court info being put here unless LE actually comes out and says he is a POI. If that happens we can revisit what will be allowed.

It is too late to edit my posts about that matter. Sorry.

I have a thousand questions about the brother in this case! :X His mother has been quite outspoken about the physical altercations between he and Lindsey to the point she grew long fingernails for self defense. Are we free to discuss these things since she brought them into the media spotlight herself?

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Brought over from Gen. Discussion thread:

Originally posted by Cyberswept:
I met JB. He seemed well mannered enough, but in my honest opinion, detached from the whole thing. Most of the kids sat and listened to the speakers while he was up moving around most of the time. My wife also told me that when they would go to the park there, they would always see him and that he was very friendly. He even pushed my daughter around in a wheel barrow one day. My wife didn't realize who he was until tonight.

~snipped~

You mentioned that your wife said JB pushed your kiddo around in a wheelbarrow while at the park. Where did the wheelbarrow come from? Where is it now? How long ago was that activity with your kiddo?

She said he brought the wheel barrow with him. It was only about 2 weeks before Lindsey disappeared.

Have no idea where it is now.

Isn't that interesting? He just carts around his own wheelbarrow to put people in at the park. :waitasec:

 

[JenniferO]

Wait.. wheelbarrow?

That makes transporting things around a lot easier. Wonder if he has access to a shovel too.:waitasec:

 

[DogMom2JoeAndWillie]

Off Topic: My dog found out if he hid his favorite toys, I would go buy him new toys. He has gained quite a stockpile! I dropped my remote under my bed and while fishing it out...I noticed his cache of hidden toys! He was busted! Which reminds me, his OCD is emerging...he has started laying his toys end to end in a neat straight line across the living room. WTH? Get your degree in doggie psychology fast! My dog needs serious therapy.

On Topic: For a girl that willingly pushed a bike without a chain all over town that day, I find it difficult to believe she didn't want one of her own. If she comes home, I am buying Lindsey a shiny new bike with a siren and a mace canister (forget the bells n whistles). We can add a license plate that says, Protected By WS.

Love the story about your dog. Consider yourself lucky....at least you know where you can expect to find the toys! I regularly stumble across doggie "boobie traps" that I trip over when it's dark or if I'm not paying attention....my house is like an obstacle course of bones and toys....as if it wasn't hard enough to stay upright with two dogs and a cat underfoot 24/7. Current working theory is that they're training me.....but I can't figure out what they're training me for and am not sure why a bunch of dog-bone-land-mines are necessary.

I'll see your siren, mace canister, and license plate and I will raise you a GPS tracking device, a dog leash attachment for Kadence (saw them on Animal Planet the other day....thought they were really neat), and I'll throw in the bells and whistles (just cause she's a little girl and IMO needs some sparkly streamers). :blowkiss: OMG, almost forgot about helmet and other safety stuff....LOL....I'm not very "on-top-of-it" lately.

Nice searching guys, you've found SOOOO much interesting information. I'm impressed AND jealous (I would LOVE to be able to do that kind of sleuthing)!!
Quick question: Since the brother is a child, would the police be able to tell the media or the public? I know that there aren't any POIs at all right now, but didn't think that they would be able to tell anyone if he ended up being a POI for the same reasons that we can't post about his records on here.
And about the wheelbarrow....does anyone have any more info on that? It's an interesting item....not the typical play-thing. I mean, I used to get my Grandfather to give me a ride in his but we were always at home and in his yard. I also remember how difficult it was to climb out of it once I got in it (because of the slope they have on the sides, especially on the front).

 

[kageykaren]

I'm curious if we have an enlarged photo of JB? Also I'm wondering if JB has a different father from Lindsey? Sorry if I missed that info. I have experience in adolescent psychiatry and noticed members are beginning to take a closer look at JB's history and may be feeling something is a bit off. Just from what members have posted about his behaviors it seems JB has displayed the beginnings of anti social behavior. Age 12 is about the time these behaviors start surfacing. Although I need a closer look at his physical appearence, from the pictures & behavior associated with the pics one could asess sweetly so that he is a bit of a goofy kid, eager to be a part of a group. It seems that his maturation level is a bit delayed compared to other boys his age. It would interesting to find out his educational placement in the classroom and if he struggled with classes designed for that age group. I think I read one of our posters is a local teacher who may be able to address this topic without crossing boundries. My thoughts are if sluethers start at the nucleus of the family and work outword from the days before Lindsey posted her fears on Myspace. My gut says to me alittle spunky girl would share her fear with one of her BFF's. One of the first things a child will hide from the world is a sincere feeling of family strife causing fear. Kids this age want to fit in. Lindsey however left the world to see her message of trepadation for her future. This is huge in my book and should not be taken lightly. Ten yr. old girls aren't usually quite so "heavey" about lifes future. I'm not blaming mom brother, boyfriend but something within the nucleus of the family hasn't been addressed. I feel knowing if Linsey shared her trepadation within her family and her fears were laid to rest or did she not share. We are talking about a ten yr. old that you would think would go straight to mommy or a trusted adult. This tells me A:it wasn't an issue, B:lindsey did share with mom or an adult and her fears were laid to rest, C: She kept her fear to herself, and went on with life playing as normal, D: The fear and trepadation for her future came to light on the day she vanished. Please no barking about guilt of mother for this is more like profiling a families everday life that may then extend away from family to everyday close friends and to aquaintences, & on &on till one has sluethed everything Mc Cleary. Also did lindsey have an adult friend male or female she could confide in so as not to bother mom with her "drama". Side note, I'm sorry for getting my advocating hairs up on the threads as this is more of a sluething site for Lindsey and enlisting help can be done within the county and Seattle as that is where the FBI is working out of. My empathetic heart goes out to Lindsey's family but my L brain "Spock Logic is used for sluething anything and anybody.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Originally Posted by cyberswept
Just showed the wife a picture of the pool where the wheelbarrow is setting. She says that is not the wheelbarrow he was pushing my daughter in.

It is curious where he got a wheelbarrow unless their landlord owns it and had it at their house for a reason. I know if I didn't have a vehicle and was supporting to kids alone...a wheelbarrow would not be on my list of things to buy.

I noticed in the photos behind the white barriers behind the ballfield...there are large piles of what look to be gravel. Were they there before? Could they have a wheelbarrow to use to move that gravel around to different areas? Maybe he "borrowed" it.

 

[Bobbisangel]

O/T - Smart dog, hilarious story, I'll bet his eyes and ears got all droopy once busted.

ON/T - I'm sure Lindsey would appreciate that gesture for sure. The more I "don't" learn about this family the more troublesome it is to me, no real statements of the great family unit, the love, the joy that is often shared in situations like this. The lack of family photos showing great smiles and healthy structure. I can think only of 2 off hand, the christmas photo (mother's little trouble maker) and the one of JB and MB with body paint and swim goggles. Surely there are more family photos that help identify Lindsey in her natural environment. All that I get from this family is silence, fear, juvie, trouble, broken bikes, arguments, 911 calls, etc., etc.

It's disturbing

I love the dog storys too. I've never heard of a dog lining up his toys end to end. That must have been something to watch! Pretty smart dog you have SS hiding his toys under the bed!!!!

Remember that the parents had just gotten a divorce. Maybe it wasn't the happiest of homes for a long time. I would imagine now the mom and kids are trying to adjust to the divorce and everyone might not be to happy about it. Maybe this is a part of the son's troubles. We don't know how close to dad the kids were and dad has moved a long ways away if I remember correctly.
The adjustment might have been really hard for the kids even if it was for the best. I wonder if the boy was getting into trouble when dad was there or since he left? I wonder how close to dad Lindsey was? Girls tend to be really close to their dads. I wonder if this caused problems if Lindsey was the closest.

 

[kageykaren]

I love the dog storys too. I've never heard of a dog lining up his toys end to end. That must have been something to watch! Pretty smart dog you have SS hiding his toys under the bed!!!!

Remember that the parents had just gotten a divorce. Maybe it wasn't the happiest of homes for a long time. I would imagine now the mom and kids are trying to adjust to the divorce and everyone might not be to happy about it. Maybe this is a part of the son's troubles. We don't know how close to dad the kids were and dad has moved a long ways away if I remember correctly.
The adjustment might have been really hard for the kids even if it was for the best. I wonder if the boy was getting into trouble when dad was there or since he left? I wonder how close to dad Lindsey was? Girls tend to be really close to their dads. I wonder if this caused problems if Lindsey was the closest.

I think looking at this aspect of the family trying to possibly work through their grief of a daddy moving out with and I believe into a new relationship would take its time for all. It makes you ask if someone new their pain and struggle starting over and befriended Lindsey. I just read an article quoting one of the officers that they feel it is someone she new. I believe he stated that this assumption was due to know one hearing screams. This is just so sad. I gotta stick to the asrro thread and keep a more positive outlook. This would noy be a good thing as the abductor has everything to loose.

 

[Normcar21]

KAGYKAREN SAID

We are talking about a ten yr. old that you would think would go straight to mommy or a trusted adult.

My response, and some other things that I'd like to say about your super input:

I agree, posts that I have read from a ML claim that LB visited her a number of times in order to report abuse to 911. Now, assuming without any objective verification that ML's statements have some veracity, I have wondered why LB would rush 2 blocks down to ML's home to report abuse rather than just tell mom. One thing that ML apparently was bothered by is that LE would simply pick LB up and return her to "her abuser" as she described. In otherwords, a potential crime was reported agains LB, by LB, and then LE picked her up and drove her a few blocks home to the supposed location of offense. If true, and I cannot verify it and have heard of nobody who can, this is sick beyond words, poor LB.

To me this household shows signs of heightened dysfunction, and I am basing my thoughts only on what I have learned over the years working with counsellors as applying to students that I have taught, and have been given professional advice as to what and how to respond in order to glean positive responses.

I am not local to McCleary so I have no information relative to her school, or JB's.

A ton of red flags are bursting forth relative to this family, the divorce, the juvie thing, the apparent 911 reports, the suggested "remoteness" of JB in some situations and then reports of extremely positive openness in other reports where he gives wheelbarrow rides and is pleasant. Then another report describes the individual as having anger spurts that last for a few minutes, then back to a controlled nature. It's just a whole lot of evidence of what I have been told is dysfunction related to a family in trouble. One report claimed that JB looked up to MB seemingly as evidence that he could not be suspect in any way. I've seen people who can turn it on and off at a whim, and not only adults. I have not heard one report that this individual has any friends or is in any way socially adept, which tosses out another red flag. This person appears to be a loner which is another sign of dysfunction, from what I have been told throught the years, and I have seen it myself in classroom situations where one tiny incident will set the child off, then next day all is well.

Karen, Your comments are welcome, thanks for your input, everything needs to be looked into without -- as Animal suggests -- infringing on legal considerations. However, perhaps the legal system needs to do some second thinking about protection of juvenile records, especially in cases like this.

 

[Normcar21]

I love the dog storys too. I've never heard of a dog lining up his toys end to end. That must have been something to watch! Pretty smart dog you have SS hiding his toys under the bed!!!!

Remember that the parents had just gotten a divorce. Maybe it wasn't the happiest of homes for a long time. I would imagine now the mom and kids are trying to adjust to the divorce and everyone might not be to happy about it. Maybe this is a part of the son's troubles. We don't know how close to dad the kids were and dad has moved a long ways away if I remember correctly.
The adjustment might have been really hard for the kids even if it was for the best. I wonder if the boy was getting into trouble when dad was there or since he left? I wonder how close to dad Lindsey was? Girls tend to be really close to their dads. I wonder if this caused problems if Lindsey was the closest.

Good points, perhaps something well worth checking would be the past history of this family prior to all of this divorce stuff. Clearly the time of disappearance was a heightened time of stress for both kids.

 

[Normcar21]

It is curious where he got a wheelbarrow unless their landlord owns it and had it at their house for a reason. I know if I didn't have a vehicle and was supporting to kids alone...a wheelbarrow would not be on my list of things to buy.

I noticed in the photos behind the white barriers behind the ballfield...there are large piles of what look to be gravel. Were they there before? Could they have a wheelbarrow to use to move that gravel around to different areas? Maybe he "borrowed" it.

That's an interesting question SS as I was wondering about what type of wheel barrow it actually was. I did a lot of construction work while going through college and, ugh, a whole lot of it was pushing one of those "pro" construction wheelbarrows with the big fat fluffy tire, really bouncy. I'd like to know what sort of wheelbarrow JB was pushing around, was it a "consumer" barrow...weak wheels, breaks in a second...or one of those real "construction" barrows. If it was a construction barrow, then I'd say your idea of "borrowing" from a construction site is very viable.

 

[Normcar21]

I've been re-reading everything about JB and am really finding fault with the idea that he is responsible in any way:
- it has been indicated that he looked up to his sister
- it is doubtful that he would have the intelligence to commit such a flawless crime, without clear evidence
- he simply does not have the intelligence to commit such a crime and hide it
- I reiterate the above

I don't think this possibility is very credible. And the pain to the family, if they read this, moves me to put it way back on the back burner, personally.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Sorry, Norm...but I have to disagree.

I don't see how we can rule out the brother here. I haven't been able to yet. And yes...he could keep it from LE and his mother. We don't know his personality and his mental make-up at this point except that he has some behavioral issues.

Sociopaths were children once, too. Psychopaths didn't just wake up one day and become crazy either. Not saying JB is either one of these things, but the truth is...we don't know.

IF those rumors are true about knives, shovels, choking etc., then we have to look at how far out of hand things could have gotten with Lindsey. Her mother obviously wasn't doing much to combat the problem between them since she herself brought up that Lindsey grew her fingernails long to defend herself against her brother. She also said there were physical altercations. They must have been pretty bad for Lindsey to purposefully need those nails to gouge him. The mother was promoting Lindsey to physically harm her brother during fights, imo. What does this say about her ability to control him?

(Brought over from the gen. dis. thread)

 

[concentric]

So no word on who the "family friend" is who broke up the fight?

 

[NWDolphinsFan]

Sorry, Norm...but I have to disagree.

I don't see how we can rule out the brother here. I haven't been able to yet. And yes...he could keep it from LE and his mother. We don't know his personality and his mental make-up at this point except that he has some behavioral issues.

I agree about not ruling out the brother. Or maybe one of his friends.

I grew up with an older brother who abused me. He had several warnings as a juvi with LE for drinking; when intoxicated, he was very abusive towards vulnerable people around him. Being I was 10-years younger than my brother, I was often the target - beginning when I was about 7-8. I'd have bruises on my arms and legs but our mother and father did nothing to try to stop the abuse or get my brother help. They'd sweep it under the table and forget about it. Eventually, I gave up complaining to our mother & father and I found someone else with sympathetic ears - our neighbors. One neighbor took me bowling. Another neighbor later (as a teen) hired me to babysit their children. But I grew up as a pre-teen and teenager being close to other adults; I'd still confide in my mother & father but their approach was to sweep it under the table and forget about it.

One time, my brother almost drowned me after drinking beer can after beer can.

Serving time in juvi did not help my brother, it actually made him more secretive and selective in picking times to abuse me. He moved out of our parents' home at age-18. Serving time in jail as a young adult did not help my brother (and he served time twice for resisting arrest while under the influence of beer). What turned him around? It took a special woman he meet at a bar to turn him around. And they have been married for almost 40-years - and he has not consumed an alcoholic drink in that time. And today, I am proud of my brother and his accomplishments ... but the scars remain, even if they are not physical scars.

I wonder what scars LB has from JB and JB's friends?

Another thought here - could JB have hit-up on one of LB's friends (sex or drugs or stolen property) and LB found out? Just a thought here from left-field.

-------------
In My Opinion

 

[kageykaren]

I'm so sorry you had to deal with this as a child and greatful that you found away to stay semi-safe by including other good adult mentors in your life as this form of abuse has long lasting effects. You and others are the prime example I posted the info. on "Sibling Abuse" So glad to here your brother turned a tide to live a happier life, alcohol and abuse free! Thank you for sharing your personal story in order to help others realize this problem.