WA - Lindsey Baum, 10, McCleary, 26 June 2009 - #15

[Salem]

H Salem - hard to tell what patterns he was following, I'm not sure we know enough about his past patterns - maybe texting and driving around town.

His texting on the night of June 16th abruptly stopped
His driving the loud car through town abruptly ceased (maybe he was out of town)
He was spending time with his girlfriend (for a long weekend in July - was he no longer working at the Youth Camp)
He stalked mom Baum (I doubt stalking is new behavior for him) mho

Couple things that don't make sense: If he is indeed the perp who took Lindsey - why would he stalk mom Baum and risk being stopped.
- If he took Lindsey why would he stay around the crime scene to be seen/heard at 10p that same night. Unless he took her right into the Bee Hive, perps don't usually hang around their own crime scene (this sighting continues to bother me).

Time-wise his ceased texting and being seen near the Beehive can't be ignored. Maybe he's an incredibly stupid criminal who has had mom to bail him out of trouble for the last 9 years. all just my opinion

Hi eyes - I agree about the 10:00 p.m. sighting, however I don't think it was at exactly 10:00 p.m. According to the affidavit: "He also told investigators that on the night of June 26th 2009 at about 10:00pm he saw a small white sports car with loud exhaust on Maple street in McCleary that he thought was Golder’s." The sighting was about 10:00 p.m. - to me, that could mean anytime between 9:45ish and 10:15ish. If DG met Lindsey on the street at, say 9:27 p.m. and spent 10-15 minutes or so talking to her and trying to convince her to get in his car, then 10:00ish makes sense to me.

Again, this works only if DG did not have a plan in mind. Saw Lindsey while he was talking and only had half an idea in his head. He ends his phone at 9:26 p.m. Maybe turns his car around and pulls up alongside Lindsey. Asks if she wants a ride? She says no. So he parks, gets out of the car to talk to her. They chit chat, all the while his mind is working. After talking for a few minutes, he tries to get her in the car again. Again, she says no, she will walk. Maybe he starts pleading here.... aww, come on, I'll take you straight home. I would think by now were are somewhere around 9:30-9:35ish. Lindsey continues to say no, she better walk, her mom might get mad. He continues to plead - I'll stop a couple of houses before yours so she won't know. I'll even let you drive my car. He can see Lindsey weakening....... so he continues to talk.... trying to convince her, while he is trying to figure out how to get her in his car.

So probably pushing 9:37/9:38... Then, either she gets in the car or he shoves her in the car. I really think he took time to convince her though, because if he shoved her, she would have screamed, unless he covered her mouth. Given that Lindsey is a friendly, outgoing personality who loves to talk, I think if she was taken by surprise, she would have made some noise. The question is, would the noise have been loud enough for others to hear? I think she got in the car willingly, although reluctantly. So, 10ish still makes sense. I wish the witness would have said what he was watching on TV - then we could have gotten the time closer.

As for stalking MB - I can only speculate (like above) about his motive. Maybe he wanted to scare her, maybe he wanted to see where she was searching for Lindsey. That makes me think Lindsey is very close to the BeeHive. I think that area should be thoroughly searched again.

Boy.... I write mini-novels when I post, don't I. Sorry to be so long-winded :angel:

Salem

 

[JenniferO]

Searches Scheduled this Weekend for Lindsey Baum (10th & 11th)
Soldiers to Aid the Lindsey Baum Search Center this Saturday


McCleary, WA – October 9, 2009 - On Sat. October the 10th and Sun. the 11th we will be conducting searches. We will meet up behind the Evergreen Christian Center on 4th and Fir in McCleary, WA at 9am.

We anticipate having a large number of soldiers showing up to volunteer both their time and their expertise to help aid our search for Lindsey this weekend. We ask for your help and attention in this matter as well, we need to keep Lindsey’s face and story out there on the front pages and being broadcast with other major stories until we can bring her home.

Volunteers and media are welcome at the search center and urged to attend. We are always in need of additional searchers and support to help us cover the areas needed to be covered and aid us in keeping Lindsey’s story alive.

If you would like more information about the Lindsey Baum Search Center, scheduled searches or the disappearance of Lindsey Baum please visit our websites at www.findlindseybaum.com, www.lindseybaum.com or visit the blog at www.FindLindseyBaum.blogspot.com.

 

[coastal]

Did anybody ever see Lindsey talking to Dale, that we know of? It seems likely that Lindsey would recognize him, at least, from his 'cruising' down McCleary's main street in his loud car (as reported by a witness in the SW) and/or his travel to and from his Beehive job, as she and KK's daughter bounced between their respective homes (like I imagine they did) but I doubt that kind of recognition alone would have been enough to instill Lindsey's trust so that she would willingly get into his car. Was there more than the occasional wave between these two, some shared interest that we can point to?

I just can't get past the idea that nobody heard anything, and there is no evidence of a struggle. How can that be?

 

[Jules71]

Did Libby have to work at the Beehive that night? Is that who saw Lindsey on her way to work? (Or was it the county worker on their way to work?) Did Lindsey go in and ask her if she could spend the night at their house? Was it payday - and Golder came in to the Beehive to pick up his paycheck? Thus running into eachother.

Does it seem like Lindsey really didn't want to stay at home that night? She wanted to stay over at KK's, then I think I heard she asked if she could stay at someone elses. Then back to her comment on ms about having bad dreams and thinking something bad was going to happen.

And what's the deal with her swim suit? Is MB the one who said she went home after swimming to shower before she went to KK's? Obviously her suit was not found at home because it is listed in the sw.

 

[Jules71]

Are there any vacant homes or homes being built along the way between KK's and Lindsey's house?

 

[Jules71]

What does Mom Baum say she was doing that night? Did she have anyone over who maybe made Lindsey feel she didn't want to stay at home that night?

 

[eyes4crime]

Taken from Salem Post #41....

Snipped, bolded, and italics by me...

Hi eyes - I agree about the 10:00 p.m. sighting, however I don't think it was at exactly 10:00 p.m. According to the affidavit: "He also told investigators that on the night of June 26th 2009 at about 10:00pm he saw a small white sports car with loud exhaust on Maple street in McCleary that he thought was Golder’s." The sighting was about 10:00 p.m. - to me, that could mean anytime between 9:45ish and 10:15ish. If DG met Lindsey on the street at, say 9:27 p.m. and spent 10-15 minutes or so talking to her and trying to convince her to get in his car, then 10:00ish makes sense to me.

I don't think your post is a novel - this particular time is crucial in the Lindsey disappearance. mho

'...seeing a small white sports car with a loud exhaust'.....I may sound like a defense attorney asking this but: seeing and hearing a small white sports car is not the same as seeing the driver of it. I know his car wasn't reported stolen that night but what if someone borrowed it?

Your scenario is a good one...regarding DG meeting Lindsey on the street: if he was on the street talking with her, how would he know he wasn't seen with her? On another thread, someone else had the scenario that DG was turned down by the girl at the BBQ, drove her home, saw Lindsey, and because she was available, kidnapped her. I think if DG had a bruised ego from the girl he was with at the BBQ, that may very well have happened.

When putting a crime puzzle together, I usually reach a point where I think the person is alive or deceased...in this case I reached that point quite awhile ago, I think Lindsey is no longer with us and hasn't been since she was reported missing. Somehow, I think that whomever disposed of her, did so on private property or forest that would require LE to have a search warrant. I find that every scenario helps - each one makes me stop and think....so thanks!

 

[SadlyMistaken]

Hi eyes - I agree about the 10:00 p.m. sighting, however I don't think it was at exactly 10:00 p.m. According to the affidavit: "He also told investigators that on the night of June 26th 2009 at about 10:00pm he saw a small white sports car with loud exhaust on Maple street in McCleary that he thought was Golder’s." The sighting was about 10:00 p.m. - to me, that could mean anytime between 9:45ish and 10:15ish. If DG met Lindsey on the street at, say 9:27 p.m. and spent 10-15 minutes or so talking to her and trying to convince her to get in his car, then 10:00ish makes sense to me.

Again, this works only if DG did not have a plan in mind. Saw Lindsey while he was talking and only had half an idea in his head. He ends his phone at 9:26 p.m. Maybe turns his car around and pulls up alongside Lindsey. Asks if she wants a ride? She says no. So he parks, gets out of the car to talk to her. They chit chat, all the while his mind is working. After talking for a few minutes, he tries to get her in the car again. Again, she says no, she will walk. Maybe he starts pleading here.... aww, come on, I'll take you straight home. I would think by now were are somewhere around 9:30-9:35ish. Lindsey continues to say no, she better walk, her mom might get mad. He continues to plead - I'll stop a couple of houses before yours so she won't know. I'll even let you drive my car. He can see Lindsey weakening....... so he continues to talk.... trying to convince her, while he is trying to figure out how to get her in his car.

So probably pushing 9:37/9:38... Then, either she gets in the car or he shoves her in the car. I really think he took time to convince her though, because if he shoved her, she would have screamed, unless he covered her mouth. Given that Lindsey is a friendly, outgoing personality who loves to talk, I think if she was taken by surprise, she would have made some noise. The question is, would the noise have been loud enough for others to hear? I think she got in the car willingly, although reluctantly. So, 10ish still makes sense. I wish the witness would have said what he was watching on TV - then we could have gotten the time closer.

As for stalking MB - I'm can only speculate (like above) about his motive. Maybe he wanted to scare her, maybe he wanted to see where she was searching for Lindsey. That makes me think Lindsey is very close to the BeeHive. I think that area should be thoroughly searched again.

Boy.... I write mini-novels when I post, don't I. Sorry to be so long-winded :angel:

Salem

I totally agree Salem. I think the 10pm time was just a relative time. Who knows if it was 15-20 minutes before or 15-20 minutes after 10.

We know that he stopped texting at 9:26 to "go to work" according to his girlfriend. I think that your scenerio is very probable. Although.. if that is the case.. I wonder why nobody saw her talking to him during that time. But.. then I doubt it is a real busy area right there at 9:30 at night. I was there at 4:30 and didn't see many people.

I wonder if.. he didn't see her and maybe use the fact that she knew someone at the Beehive (if he knew this or even if he didn't) and say something like.. someone wandered away or something and they couldn't find him/her. Ask if she had seen them. Then ask if she could help him find them. Maybe she would have gotten in to his car.. especially IF she had seen him there several times and knew that he worked at the Beehive. Or even if she didn't get in the car but started looking for the person.. COULD be why the dog supposedly has her headed up the hill on 6th. If she trusted the person enough.. they could have at some point.. after looking for a bit.. told her.. to just get in the car and he would take her home or even back to The Beehive for helping them. What I am saying is.. perhaps the abduction spot wasn't on Maple.. but another place where people wouldn't see.

I'm sure it has already been done but I hope that the woods back there behind those homes were searched thoroughly for anything that might have belonged to Lindsey.

IIRC as you look south down 7th from Maple.. you just see grass at the end and then a hill heading into the woods that are between there and the highway.

I just can not see there being no evidence of someone snatching her.. kicking and screaming.. off the street. There would be a shoe.. piece of clothing.. blood.. even where the gravel was all messed up.. something. I am pretty convinced she either went willingly or she was lured from there and abducted somewhere else.

This could also be why he could have been see there more around 10pm. Although I still don't think that is a definate time. IMO that time could be 9:30-9:40 all the way to after 10PM. It is so hard to pinpoint time when trying to remember.

 

[SadlyMistaken]

Searches Scheduled this Weekend for Lindsey Baum (10th & 11th)
Soldiers to Aid the Lindsey Baum Search Center this Saturday


McCleary, WA – October 9, 2009 - On Sat. October the 10th and Sun. the 11th we will be conducting searches. We will meet up behind the Evergreen Christian Center on 4th and Fir in McCleary, WA at 9am.

We anticipate having a large number of soldiers showing up to volunteer both their time and their expertise to help aid our search for Lindsey this weekend. We ask for your help and attention in this matter as well, we need to keep Lindsey’s face and story out there on the front pages and being broadcast with other major stories until we can bring her home.

Volunteers and media are welcome at the search center and urged to attend. We are always in need of additional searchers and support to help us cover the areas needed to be covered and aid us in keeping Lindsey’s story alive.

If you would like more information about the Lindsey Baum Search Center, scheduled searches or the disappearance of Lindsey Baum please visit our websites at www.findlindseybaum.com, www.lindseybaum.com or visit the blog at www.FindLindseyBaum.blogspot.com.

Is this the National Guard that was asked from Gregoire?

BTW.. my sister, son a I will be there for Saturday's search. I have a couple more "maybe's".. hopefully they will come too.

 

[Track292008]

Did anybody ever see Lindsey talking to Dale, that we know of? It seems likely that Lindsey would recognize him, at least, from his 'cruising' down McCleary's main street in his loud car (as reported by a witness in the SW) and/or his travel to and from his Beehive job, as she and KK's daughter bounced between their respective homes (like I imagine they did) but I doubt that kind of recognition alone would have been enough to instill Lindsey's trust so that she would willingly get into his car. Was there more than the occasional wave between these two, some shared interest that we can point to?

I just can't get past the idea that nobody heard anything, and there is no evidence of a struggle. How can that be?

My understanding is that Lindsey used to drop by the Beehive to visit with the residents (I'm sure the seniors took great delight in her bouncy, friendly manner!), which would have given her the opportunity to become somewhat better acquainted with DG. I think that's what may have happened and he took advantnge of it. MOO.

 

[eyes4crime]

I found this info that might support the idea DG was the one to always drive his own car...Is "THE MAN" DG????

According to the affidavit, a person contacted investigators more than a month after the girl disappeared with information that led detectives to identify the man as a person of interest.

The tipster said the man always drove a distinctive car with a loud exhaust, and found it suspicious that the man stopped driving the vehicle after Lindsey disappeared.

Another person told detectives that they saw the vehicle near where Lindsey was last seen the night she vanished.

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/63303447.html

 

[Jules71]

I found this info that might support the idea DG was the one to always drive his own car...Is "THE MAN" DG????

According to the affidavit, a person contacted investigators more than a month after the girl disappeared with information that led detectives to identify the man as a person of interest.

The tipster said the man always drove a distinctive car with a loud exhaust, and found it suspicious that the man stopped driving the vehicle after Lindsey disappeared.

Another person told detectives that they saw the vehicle near where Lindsey was last seen the night she vanished.

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/63303447.html

Yes, the man is DG - who was the POI,

 

[eyes4crime]

Yes, the man is DG - who was the POI,

Thanks for the clarification - I guess I wasn't sure DG was named as the POI in the warrant.

 

[Track292008]

Did Libby have to work at the Beehive that night? Is that who saw Lindsey on her way to work? (Or was it the county worker on their way to work?) Did Lindsey go in and ask her if she could spend the night at their house? Was it payday - and Golder came in to the Beehive to pick up his paycheck? Thus running into eachother.

Does it seem like Lindsey really didn't want to stay at home that night? She wanted to stay over at KK's, then I think I heard she asked if she could stay at someone elses. Then back to her comment on ms about having bad dreams and thinking something bad was going to happen.

And what's the deal with her swim suit? Is MB the one who said she went home after swimming to shower before she went to KK's? Obviously her suit was not found at home because it is listed in the sw.

Jules 71, I think you have summarized a lot of possibilities here that could explain a few things about the case: i.e., DG possibly picking up a paycheck, Lindsey not wanting to be home that night and the discrepancy about the bathing suit, plus your wondering what the mother was up to that night and if that was the reason Lindsey seemed to not want to go home. MOO.

Thanks!

 

[scandi]

Jules 71, I think you have summarized a lot of possibilities here that could explain a few things about the case: i.e., DG possibly picking up a paycheck, Lindsey not wanting to be home that night and the discrepancy about the bathing suit, plus your wondering what the mother was up to that night and if that was the reason Lindsey seemed to not want to go home. MOO.

Thanks!

WOW Track that last statement of yours hit me right between the eyes!

We have read she did stop on her way home to ask if she could spend the night. That might not be a fact. But it makes me wonder was it that she was afraid something might happen on the rest of her walk home if she saw someone or something that spooked, her or was it what she might be concerned with at home?

 

[eyes4crime]

...If DG was named the POI in the search warrant
...was seen driving his well known white car around the Bee Hive on the 26th
...gave different stories to police about working at the Youth Camp, or the Bee Hive, BBQ, or sleeping
...suddenly stopped texting after 9p
Why isn't he the POI now - what the heck am I missing? :waitasec:

 

[nosylla]

Can't LE get pay stubs and hours worked for any reported job the perp has? To rule out working hours. Need to narrow down things.

What about the mention about this person at the search center early on ....that said they knew about where LB is?

Were names logged as they were when searchers searched last week? Names... and times had to be recorded.

Ugh... the answers are so close. The puzzle seems like a rubics cube. I know that all the colored squares fit into it's colored form...and someone knows how to do it.

 

[eyes4crime]

Can't LE get pay stubs and hours worked for any reported job the perp has? To rule out working hours. Need to narrow down things.

What about the mention about this person at the search center early on ....that said they knew about where LB is?

Were names logged as they were when searchers searched last week? Names... and times had to be recorded.

Ugh... the answers are so close. The puzzle seems like a rubics cube. I know that all the colored squares fit into it's colored form...and someone knows how to do it.

Seems like I'm always missing an important fact - sorry! You say someone knows where Lindsey is???? Have the police talked to that person?

I'm sure LE checked pay stubs but DG already said he didn't work the night of the 26th, it was his scheduled day off. He was laid off from the Youth camp for poor behavior. He lied about both places. If someone knows where Lindsey is - why on earth haven't they told police? This isn't a game, that person should be arrested if he/she refuses to tell? mho Yikes, I just can't keep up. Sorry everyone.

 

[Track292008]

WOW Track that last statement of yours hit me right between the eyes!

We have read she did stop on her way home to ask if she could spend the night. That might not be a fact. But it makes me wonder was it that she was afraid something might happen on the rest of her walk home if she saw someone or something that spooked, her or was it what she might be concerned with at home?

Scandi, now you've added a new -- and valuable --idea to those that were started by Jules 71: Lindsey might have seen her predator, recognized him as a danger or at least someone who made her uncomfortable, and didn't want to have to keep walking past him. I didn't know until this week that the dogs had picked up her scent going up the hill on 6th Street, and what you've added makes me wonder if she turned around and headed up the hill on 6th when she saw him in order to avoid him...and he followed her.

We just don't know where DG was from 9-ish, when the neighbor said he left the BBQ, and ~10, when his car was reportedly back in town. MOO.

I hope LE keeps an eye on him tomorrow during the search!

Thanks!

 

[Track292008]

Seems like I'm always missing an important fact - sorry! You say someone knows where Lindsey is???? Have the police talked to that person?

I'm sure LE checked pay stubs but DG already said he didn't work the night of the 26th, it was his scheduled day off. He was laid off from the Youth camp for poor behavior. He lied about both places. If someone knows where Lindsey is - why on earth haven't they told police? This isn't a game, that person should be arrested if he/she refuses to tell? mho Yikes, I just can't keep up. Sorry everyone.

I think the poster was just referring to the fact that the perp -- whoever that may be -- knows where she is...not implying that anyone else knows!!! Not to worry about that!