WA - Unidentified Male: "Lyle Stevik", Grays Harbor, 17 Sept 2001 - #2

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It appeared to me that a towel was wrapped behind his neck between belt and skin. If i'm seeing that correctly, it tells me he took some time to 'experiment' with positioning himself and belt. Maybe the first attempt, the belt didn't situate properly for sufficient constriction and he had to adjust it and opted with towel to get belt aligned right? Macabre, I know, but ligit question. Surely chaffing and discomfort on the back of his neck couldn't have been a major concern for him at that moment. so IF i see it right, there was a purpose for the towel. If my wild guess is right, one could file that in the same folder as hesitation marks on slit wrists. He may have battled with it so much and only delayed the ordeal. Same as writing the word Suicide as if he had to see the letters himself to be sure. THe pain he must have been in frustrates me. If only someone reached out to him in time. Not an angel for miles.
kk
 
I am Sweetie, buI dont have any answers to give you. You have asked poignent things about his trip there and his relationship to Idaho.

Tell you what I think after thinking about this case much of the time. I think He was the product of a mixed marriage {there were roots of family there}, being Native American and White. The Indian genes were predominant, as from his profile you can see he is a classic fine art painting quality study in his appearance. Where he steps out being augmented from that race is he has hazel eyes and good height, 6'2", which are not the norm for the Indian race.

I think his Indian parent was from a Northwest tribe, maybe back in Idaho, Washington or British Columbia. It is interesting that his native roots did not lead him on the traditional death path, much as the Apache indians were known for. When they felt death was knocking at their door or they were resigned to it, they would go out into the wilderness and simply sit atop a hill until they died. It was an honerable way to go, and I have never heard anything negative written about it. Lyle did not choose to go up on top of a hill and sit there till the life ebbed slowly out of him, nor did he go to a reservation to end his life within the peramiters of the spirit of his people.

Now maybe I am wrong about that if this little town at the edge of Lake Quinault is actually in the reservation. Maybe it is. But he chose a white man's motel to sit in and die, and there was nothing indian about that at all.

He was a mixture, tossed and torn between the two cultures, probably very well schooled and intelligent and thoughtful of others, as we know for one thing he stood with his back to the door before he bent over and went limp in the process of committing this final act of leaving earth forever.

I brought up something about the book that no one has commented on which might lead us to the why's of his giving up. At the heart of that book that he took his name and address from, was a case of incest. I know from living with a man of partial Navaho descent, that any deviation from normal sexual behavior is verbotten and never worthy of being talked about among the members of the tribe. They are social outcasts, their respect from others forgotten and stuck with what they have chosen in life.

Since our man was evidently familiar with that book and it did make an imprint in his life, maybe this is the reason he gave up. Either he was abused and couldn't live with it or he was the abuser, and not having the normal outlet for sexual activity.

Just a thought. It gives a logical basis for him giving up and committing the final act of killing himself. Purposely with plan, not a sudden drunken move. The reason was deep and the planning and carrying out of it was not rushed or hurried, but down to a specific time. A few days there and he was dead.


Scandi
 
Hi Wannabe,

I would do the same thing if I were going to commit suicide, that is take time to adjust things properly so I was comfortable so I could endure those few seconds motionless to accomplish the deed ending in death.

The site has been posted here that was put on the web not long before Lyle went, and I don't have it memorized, but many think Lyle had read this site - maye even written it, although I doubt that- as he did many of the same things suggested in that online article. One of those was to put a washcloth inbetween the metal ring {his belt buckle} and the skin to add to comfort.

Lyle had experimented I think, because he put the buckle in the front of his neck above the Adams Apple I think. The article suggests it being at the side of the neck I believe.

Anyway, if there is pain because the metal is pinching a nerve, you are not likely to be able to sit it out to the finis, and if you go so far depriving your brain of this oxygenated blood moving up to the brain, and then release the preassure because you are uncomfortable, you may live and end up brain damaged, and that is one thing no one, even a suicide candidate wants to end up being.


Scandi
 
wannabesleuthkk said:
what leads, if any, are there back to ID? Coldcaseman: did you find out the bus company names and routes to see if one could have come from ID area? Even if drivers tend to tune out their passengers and can't recall a face, it doesn't mean he wasn't on one of them. Nodameen?
What's with the addy he gave, was it a hotel? He didn't pick that out of thin air just like he didn't his alias from the book.
Also, the handwriting, IMO, looks like mine. I tend to like to write in a style that's mostly print with some hints of cursive, letters connecting but still 'blocky'. My Dad influenced me there. He was USAF and worked for FAA. Very meticulous, clarity was important in his line of work. So i sorta adopted the style. I tend to write things with thinking about how others are going to read it. Lyle's looks like that. Perhaps a person of military background. Someone who fills out many forms perhaps. It also looks like mine in that he's practiced in writing like that with speed. For some, printing is laborious. I can write just as fast both ways. My cursive looks like crap. Would love to have an expert "read" my writing. Ok, last query...
What kind of readers read this book, or Oates for that matter. How much is this book an influence? What famous killer had the 'Catcher in the RYe'?
A person who's sinking into a depression can lose touch with reality and some paranoid individuals have been known to obsess over a story or book and relate to characters because this world sucks to bad. Just a thot.
Any feedback? Coldcaseman? Anybody up>?
kk
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The address is for a motel in Meridian, Idaho. No one there, nor the Police, recognized Lyle. The bus drivers were interviewed, but neither specifically remembered Lyle. The handwriting style, a cross between cursive and block printing, is a style I have seen from people with a medical background. People who are writing quickly, and they tend to not pick the pen off of the paper as they make the individual lines in a letter. The "suicide" was written more carefully. He may have written it out to see what it looked like, or he had thought about making a sign for whoever found him and decided against it. As for the towel, he wanted his last moments to be comfortable. It does show he put alot of thought into it. I have investigated a number of suicides where towels or clothing were placed between the ligature and the neck.
 
Great, thanks. I still to can't remember the guy w/ the 'catcher in the rye' book. was it maybe Reagan's shooter? Anyway, i pray for an answer to this one day. He may not have family that's missnig him too much, but he himself deserves to be remembered by those who care, even if it's just us folk.
thanks again, kk
 
wannabesleuthkk said:
Great, thanks. I still to can't remember the guy w/ the 'catcher in the rye' book. was it maybe Reagan's shooter? Anyway, i pray for an answer to this one day. He may not have family that's missnig him too much, but he himself deserves to be remembered by those who care, even if it's just us folk.
thanks again, kk
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More than anything in the world- it's what he deserves, people that care(d) about him. At least he's not lonely right now, he's probably got some friends in heaven and or someone who's giving him what he truly needs: a hug and some comfort
 
wannabesleuthkk said:
Great, thanks. I still to can't remember the guy w/ the 'catcher in the rye' book. was it maybe Reagan's shooter? Anyway, i pray for an answer to this one day. He may not have family that's missnig him too much, but he himself deserves to be remembered by those who care, even if it's just us folk.
thanks again, kk
Click to expand...
It is off topic for here but:
Try this link for your question about the book and the killer that read it.
http://www.lennon-chapman.com/new4.htm
 
Ok, so I read all the pages to this thread. I wanted to make sure I was well informed before blurting in to post. There are some things that I was concidering and thought I would run by you all. When I see the side pictures of Lyle I defanitely see the native american resemblance to him. But for some reason when I see the front picture I think Polish or Russian. I don't know why, maybe the pollish is because of the very bushy eyebrows. I was trying to figure out why he would have been pacing up and down the highway. If you were trying to figure out a plan of action or whatnot, why not just walk. I think maybe he was contimplating jumping in front of a moving car as his means of suicide. Maybe this was his original plan and so he wrote suicide on that little piece of paper and left it on his desk. Once he decided that the method wasn't the one for him he threw that piece of paper in the garbage. Then stays up throughout the night trying to decide what he is going to do. The sun starts to come up, so he puts the bedspread over the window and hangs himself.

I am wondering if maybe he had a very good job at some point in time. Then lost it, in which his wages were severly diminished. Because of this he wouldn't be able to afford the food he previously was. Causing his weight loss. Then he may have had more monetary hardships and left where he was to find more work. Running out of options and places to go. He finds this motel uses his last few dollars on a room, meal, and newspaper.

If he was planning on commiting suicide on that highway is it possible he threw his bag on the side of the road there. Junk is strown about all over highways and could have been overlooked. He may not have bothered to pick it back up because he knew he was going to kill himself one way or another. Seeing how particular he was about his appearance, teeth, and methods I find a few other things odd. Did he have any jewelry? Necklaces, rings, watches? If not are there any pawn shops in the area where he was located? It would be an easy way to explain the crisp money and no belongings. He needed an extra day at the motel and the skimpy prices he would get for his belongings would fit with the money he had. If he did have jewelry what were the brands, emblems, gems, etc.

Sorry so long. So many questions and theories to go over.
 
Hi BAD BUTTERFLY,

Remember it was thought he took a bus there, so if he ditched his backpack it had to be within walking distance from the motel. Now when he checked into the motel, I thought CCM said he could have had a backpack but weren't sure. Or was it they thought he had a backpack, but weren't sure. I'll have to go back and read.

But that is kind of a sleepy little tourist area as I remember so probably not a whole lot has changed. The motel has sold and probably remodeled, but it would be interesting to see if the roads approaching and around it look much the same. It could still be there way back in tall grass, right?


Scandi
 
Interesting thoughts, Bad_Butterfly. I'd like to get something clarified, if I could, by Coldcaseman (or anyone else who knows). Post #88 says:

Sat. 9-15 the maid came to the door. He said that he was going to stay a little longer, didn't need the room cleaned, but could use clean towels. Later in the day, the manager saw him pacing up and down the highway. She thought he was getting some exercise.


I initially wondered if Lyle was seen pacing up and down the hallway instead of the highway. Was it, indeed, the highway where Lyle was pacing?

It sounds odd (to me) to describe someone's pacing as getting some exercise. The word "pacing" usually indicates a level of agitation. In working with psychiatric patients, I've seen that it's quite easy to read when someone is pacing out of anxiety/agitation versus walking for the purpose of getting some exercise.
 
scandi said:
Remember it was thought he took a bus there, so if he ditched his backpack it had to be within walking distance from the motel.
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Since neither bus driver could definitively recognize him, could he have flown into a nearby city and taken a cab there? What with ATMs at airports and stuff - thus the crisp bills - and not wanting to draw attention to himself...I'd think that only being seen by one person who doesn't live in the town would be the best way to go.

Were other bus riders interviewed to determine if they could recognize him? It just seems to me that if no one really remembers him, maybe he didn't travel that way at all.
 
Hi again Pardilia,

As I remember, the closest public airport is in Seattle. There could be a smaller airport in Olympia, but only small planes would be able to land there.

This area is kind of in the SW quarter of that huge peninsula that makes up the NW quadrant of the State of Washington and so is quite isolated. I think the bus is the only way to get there unless you have a car.

CCM did a great job investigating I think, but we have to remember the only crime committed was Lyle killing himself, so I don't think the police went the extra mile of intense investigation they would if he had say hurt someone else or done something else against the law. So they wouldn't search bushes or maybe interview people say at the stores or restaurants in town, and were simply concerned about removing his body and documenting the suicide properly. Only CCM took a personal interest in trying to find out who he was so he could be buried near his family.

Scandi
 
pardilia said:
Since neither bus driver could definitively recognize him, could he have flown into a nearby city and taken a cab there? What with ATMs at airports and stuff - thus the crisp bills - and not wanting to draw attention to himself...I'd think that only being seen by one person who doesn't live in the town would be the best way to go.

Were other bus riders interviewed to determine if they could recognize him? It just seems to me that if no one really remembers him, maybe he didn't travel that way at all.
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The closest airport is Sea Tac (Seattle), about 140 miles North. There is a small airport in Hoquiam (40 miles away), but doesn't have commercial flights. I wasn't able to locate any bus passengers. We had put the information in the local paper, but no one called saying they had seen him. In hindsight, alot more effort should have been put into neighborhood interviews, etc. but it was obviously a suicide of a person who did not appear to be a "street person". I had investigated many deaths where the next of kin hadn't seen the person for years. I strongly believed that Lyle would be reported missing by his family. Concerning the pacing, the motel is next to US HWY 101, a two lane road. The manager saw Lyle walking or pacing up and down the road. She "thought" he had a backpack with him when he checked in. It appears that she didn't pay attention when she checked him in. There was no jewelry, and no tan lines indicating he had worn jewelry recently.
 
did anyone think to check for a Lyle Stevik checked in anywhere in Meridian or Boise area week or so before checking in to Gray's Harbor?? If our John Doe actually stayed at Meridian hotel, my gut is he may have intended to do there what he accomplished in WA. Checked in, changed his mind, checked out kept heading west. He could be from down by Salt Lake if he was just venturing by bus or hitching up the interstate. Roaming northwest with a heavy heart. so sad. got anything on that, ccm? I've begun checking news articles and crime reports of incidents in salt lake and boise around August or sept. Only thing struck my eye was 3 girls missing from Utah all in July, same area. THe cases were on the Utah BCI, however nothing on any other MP site that i can find re these 3 tho.
all feedback is greatly appreciated
thanks kk
 
I e-mailed a Detective with Meridian PD last night, asking him to circulate the photo around again to see if anyone recognizes Lyle.
 
coldcaseman said:
I e-mailed a Detective with Meridian PD last night, asking him to circulate the photo around again to see if anyone recognizes Lyle.
Click to expand...

please let us know the results ccm.
God bless you and yours.
kk
 
coldcaseman said:
The closest airport is Sea Tac (Seattle), about 140 miles North. There is a small airport in Hoquiam (40 miles away), but doesn't have commercial flights. I wasn't able to locate any bus passengers. We had put the information in the local paper, but no one called saying they had seen him. In hindsight, alot more effort should have been put into neighborhood interviews, etc. but it was obviously a suicide of a person who did not appear to be a "street person".
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Could he have hitchhiked to the region? He just strikes me as a man with at least *some* money - what if he found a cab driver and offered him $500 to drive him somewhere? It just seems to me that he put a lot of thought into this - into keeping a low profile and the money to finance his trip and just his general methodology. It seems like everything he did, he did for a reason - I agree that his family likely already knows what happened. Perhaps the key lies in finding the flaw in his plans?

As a side note, he strongly resembles an ex-aquaintance of mine who was of mixed heritage - Native American and Caucasian.
 
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