Found Deceased FL - Madeline Soto, 13, Missing Child Alert, 13500 blk Town Loop Blvd, Orlando, 26 Feb 2024 *arrest* #8

[Forest_Wood]

I got the impression that their contact might be controlled by the custodial parent, and the Texas couple were patiently playing by the guidelines before them -- perhaps expecting a change when MS came of age. (I think this might be age 14). MOO

From where are you getting this information?

 

[IzzyBlanche]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

"Observed is trained police speak (i.e., utilizing the five senses)."

I have never heard LE use the word "observed" to mean anything except "saw." If JS said, jumping off your example, that she smelled Maddie's shampoo, it's a huge leap IMO to equate that to JS observing Maddie getting ready for school.

As a comparison, on the days when Mr. Izzy has to leave for work way before I even get up, I can smell the shampoo he recently used when I go to the bathroom. But I would never equate that to observing him getting ready for work, since I didn't actually see him doing that.

It doesn't make sense that LE would use that terminology when I didn't, especially since it would be completely inaccurate.

If I said I smelled his shampoo, I would expect LE to say I smelled his shampoo and assumed that he had recently taken his morning shower and had already left for work.

 

[grannygates]

I’ve shared my own thoughts about a police report being an LEOs impression of a conversation/situation (I’ve written them before so I know it was my wording in my report) Unless we see direct quotes (“”) or see the copy of the written statement handwritten by JS, the statement about “observed MS getting dressed” remains open to interpretation in my opinion. A lot of people have shared very interesting theories/ideas of what this could mean and I appreciate reading everyone’s ideas.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I’ve shared my own thoughts about a police report being an LEOs impression of a conversation/situation (I’ve written them before so I know it was my wording in my report) Unless we see direct quotes (“”) or see the copy of the written statement handwritten by JS, the statement about “observed MS getting dressed” remains open to interpretation in my opinion. A lot of people have shared very interesting theories/ideas of what this could mean and I appreciate reading everyone’s ideas.

BBM for focus. Would you mind elaborating?

 

[grannygates]

BBM for focus. Would you mind elaborating?

(My opinion only) it’s a very brief, unspecific sentence for what could mean a multitude of different situations.

Did JS say she actually walked upstairs to MS room and witnessed her getting dressed, did JS see a blur run past her bedroom door while she was half asleep and wasn’t wearing her glasses and assumed it was MS running around gathering clothes to get dressed or Did LE ask JS if she saw MS getting ready that morning and JS just responded yes and no further info? We don’t know any details so (my opinion) it’s open to our interpretation.

 

[Seattle1]

Respectfully, I am not the OP but this that you seemingly stated as fact jumped out at me:

"Observed is trained police speak (i.e., utilizing the five senses)."

I have never heard LE use the word "observed" to mean anything except "saw." If JS said, jumping off your example, that she smelled Maddie's shampoo, it's a huge leap IMO to equate that to JS observing Maddie getting ready for school.

As a comparison, on the days when Mr. Izzy has to leave for work way before I even get up, I can smell the shampoo he recently used when I go to the bathroom. But I would never equate that to observing him getting ready for work, since I didn't actually see him doing that.

It doesn't make sense that LE would use that terminology when I didn't, especially since it would be completely inaccurate.

If I said I smelled his shampoo, I would expect LE to say I smelled his shampoo and assumed that he had recently taken his morning shower and had already left for work.

In Orange County's Deputy Joseph (10644) incident report, he wrote "...Feb 26, 2023 at approximately 0800 hours, Jennifer observed (missing) Madeline Soto getting dressed for school..." [emphasis added by me].

The year stated in the report as 2023 was in error by Deputy Joseph.

In police work, observation means perception of details pertaining to persons, objects, plans, and events, through the use of the five senses (sight and hearing are relied upon most often but the senses of taste, smell, and touch may occasionally be used advantageously).

An investigator makes descriptions to convey to others his or her own observations or the observations of witnesses as reported to the investigator.

Please review the Deputy Joseph (10644) incident report for an example of a trained officer using the term "observed" in his report.

IMO, the report appears to be the Deputy's initial interaction with the parents.

Understanding the IR will be subject to public disclosure, one should not expect the report to include very specific details as told to the investigator-- especially if the Deputy has suspicions of the witness.

Unless the investigator "quotes" the witness, in my experience, it's safe to assume the report is the investigators own description of the witness statement.

IMO, Joseph did not write "Mother saw daughter getting dressed for school," because that's not likely what JS said to him, or he did not necessarily believe what she said.

The investigator has a duty to protect the investigation while still conveying critical information in his missing person report.

And I've read hundreds of IRs. MOO

Observation, Description, & Identification

ETA: Reportedly, JS said that she last talked to MS on Sunday night. Take note that this information (last time JS talked to MS) is suspiciously omitted from Deputy Joseph's IR. I don't believe it's because the Deputy failed to ask the question-- I believe excluding this from the IR was intentional.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Please review the Deputy Joseph (10644) incident report for an example of a trained officer using the term "observed" in his report.

IMO, the report appears to be the Deputy's initial interaction with the parents.

Understanding the IR will be subject to public disclosure, one should not expect the report to include very specific details as told to the investigator-- especially if the Deputy has suspicions of the witness.

Unless the investigator "quotes" the witness, in my experience, it's safe to assume the report is the investigators own description of the witness statement.

IMO, Joseph did not write "Mother saw daughter getting dressed for school," because that's not likely what JS said to him, or he did not necessarily believe what she said.

The investigator has a duty to protect the investigation while still conveying critical information in his missing person report.

And I've read hundreds of IRs. MOO

Observation, Description, & Identification

Thanks for explaining.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

(My opinion only) it’s a very brief, unspecific sentence for what could mean a multitude of different situations.

Did JS say she actually walked upstairs to MS room and witnessed her getting dressed, did JS see a blur run past her bedroom door while she was half asleep and wasn’t wearing her glasses and assumed it was MS running around gathering clothes to get dressed or Did LE ask JS if she saw MS getting ready that morning and JS just responded yes and no further info? We don’t know any details so (my opinion) it’s open to our interpretation.

Thank you.

 

[ttjo]

When you read the first statement keep in mind it was taken as a missing persons report, written on the night she went missing, LE didn't have a reason to suspect JS or SS ( at that time). so fair to say he wrote "Jenn observed" if that is what she told him, he likely believed her. Their focus was a missing child. Sure he could have added Jenn "reported", but its understandable here. Later they write differently

after that report, Info is discovered ( on SS phone and cameras) that warrants the arrest of SS, and then the narrative in these reports changes to JS "advised" skepticism on JS comes into play now ( putting it mildly)

https://content.govdelivery.com/attachments/FLCIKISS/2024/02/29/file_attachments/2799407/Sterns.24-001809.pdf

 

[photoprose1122]

I think perhaps we’re harping too much on semantics that don’t really matter too much at this point, because it isn’t possible that JS “observed” Maddie getting dressed at 8am, regardless of what she actually said or what “observed” even means in the context of the report. Bottom line is, Maddie was already deceased. So either she deliberately lied, or she somehow got the time confused. I’m leaning towards the first one.

 

[ttjo]

I think perhaps we’re harping too much on semantics that don’t really matter too much at this point, because it isn’t possible that JS “observed” Maddie getting dressed at 8am, regardless of what she actually said or what “observed” even means in the context of the report. Bottom line is, Maddie was already deceased. So either she deliberately lied, or she somehow got the time confused. I’m leaning towards the first one.

At least we know what's true now.

 

[Seattle1]

I think perhaps we’re harping too much on semantics that don’t really matter too much at this point, because it isn’t possible that JS “observed” Maddie getting dressed at 8am, regardless of what she actually said or what “observed” even means in the context of the report. Bottom line is, Maddie was already deceased. So either she deliberately lied, or she somehow got the time confused. I’m leaning towards the first one.

I think JS was drugged asleep -- either self medicated or by SS. JS's mother very early reported JS too tired to take MS to school. School wasn't until after 9:00AM! IMO, too tired translates to medicated. Regardless, she did not "see" anything-- including MS on Monday morning. JMO

 

[Forest_Wood]

I’ve shared my own thoughts about a police report being an LEOs impression of a conversation/situation (I’ve written them before so I know it was my wording in my report) Unless we see direct quotes (“”) or see the copy of the written statement handwritten by JS, the statement about “observed MS getting dressed” remains open to interpretation in my opinion. A lot of people have shared very interesting theories/ideas of what this could mean and I appreciate reading everyone’s ideas.

I think observed Madeline getting dressed is very precise wording IMO.

 

[Megnut]

I think JS was drugged asleep -- either self medicated or by SS. JS's mother very early reported JS too tired to take MS to school. School wasn't until after 9:00AM! IMO, too tired translates to medicated. Regardless, she did not "see" anything-- including MS on Monday morning. JMO

Or she wasn't home at all.

I wonder how long before we can fill in some of these details.

Jmo

 

[PayrollNerd]

I don't see a date on this video so it may have been posted before.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I think observed Madeline getting dressed is very precise wording IMO.

Either way it's worded Jen Lied. There's no way she saw,or observed Madeline getting dressed that morning. MOO.

 

[ttjo]

When Shannon Butler says " she may have been murdered that night, not the following morning"
we've been told he's on camera at the garbage bins at 7:35. We have never been told they have video of him leaving the complex, before the dumpsters. Are those dumpsters outside the gates? They look like they are?

 

[Seattle1]

Or she wasn't home at all.

I wonder how long before we can fill in some of these details.

Jmo

I dunno. I'm thinking that maybe it was MS and SS who never returned until the early morning hours on Monday.

I'm wondering about SS's use of the "Telegram" app at midnight. I understand Telegram uses end to end encryption, can't ever be traced, and a favorite by persons similar to SS.

Unfortunately, if we are waiting on a grand jury indictment (for JS), I think we have a to wait until trial to learn the details.

At this time, we know SS was indicted and there is no prelim hearing for us to learn about the details and the evidence. MOO

Madeline Soto Murder: Stephan Sterns' Secret Text Messages | Murder suspect #StephanSterns was using Telegram, an encrypted instant messaging app, the night before #MadelineSoto was reported missing. #CourtTV's... | By COURT TVFacebook

Murder suspect #StephanSterns was using Telegram, an encrypted instant messaging app, the night before #MadelineSoto was reported missing. #CourtTV's...

www.facebook.com

 

[PayrollNerd]

When Shannon Butler says " she may have been murdered that night, not the following morning"
we've been told he's on camera at the garbage bins at 7:35. We have never been told they have video of him leaving the complex, before the dumpsters. Are those dumpsters outside the gates? They look like they are?

I'm pretty sure they're on the complex property. That is likely a code requirement. They may be offset just a bit due to debris, rodents, smell, etc.

 

[ttjo]

There's just some things that dont flow.
- Ive heard SS was at the party , Ive heard he wasnt. Were there issues between JS family and SS or JS? if there was, would he be at the party or even be welcome?

How did Madi get to and from that party?
was there family at Jenn's residence after the party (presumably to drive Maddi home?)
if SS was at the Party, and the family thinks they dont live together anymore, maybe they drove her home , not letting him ?


Without the times of him entering the complex the night he arrived on the 25th, exiting the complex again on 25 ( evening) or 26 before 7:35am. it's really hard to know what happened.