17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #15

[mercuriod]

There is NO way he d' get a fair trial, many people here think he is guilty.

JMO

Many people here are not from Florida, have you read the comment sections on the Orlando newspaper and news stations? They are ready to give GZ a medal and put him up on a pedestal. The comments actually are sickening!

 

[Velouria]

Just because GZ thought TM had a gun - I wasn't implying that he did. If TM pushed him and exposed GZ's gun - you're right IF TIM HAD ONE - maybe he would have pulled it - but he didn't. At that point, it was on and whether or not GZ still thought the same - there was a matter of seconds and GZ had pulled his trigger. I also think this because the witnesses saying after the shot they saw him standing / kneeling over TM - I think he was checking for that "imagined" gun and GZ had his "come to Jesus" moment of what he had just done.

I don't know about the second quote you had - that wasn't mine. Sorry.

Sorry if it wasn't clear, but the second quote was from the article I posted in reply.

I see your point, and I agree that GZ may indeed try to assert this - the mistaken idea that Trayvon had a gun. I just don't think it's a valid excuse due to what I stated previously.

 

[OneLove]

Out of all the questions being contemplated here, I don't think they case is going to hinge on a red coat, or a red/black/gray coat.

I believe if this officer's claim is that he examined the coat closely enough to BE SURE that it was wet and had grass stains, his not knowing the color of said coat will cast great doubt on the truthfulness of his claim and therefore could be VITALLY influential in the judgements of a jury. They may not decide the officer is intentially LYING, just that his powers of observation are not keen enough to take his account as the gospel truth. They may also find reasons to believe the officer could have his OWN bias and therefore disregard his testimony.

 

[jjenny]

I believe if this officer's claim is that he examined the coat closely enough to BE SURE that it was wet and had grass stains, his not knowing the color of said coat will cast great doubt on the truthfulness of his claim and therefore could be VITALLY influential in the judgements a jury.

It is a red coat. Red coat with a black stripe on the back and shoulders.

 

[203_forensics]

BBM
How many of his calls lead to a actual arrest? I find it odd that every time a so called break-ins took place he was there stopping it. I wonder if he witness any of those crimes taking place. Having the neighborhood call him when something's wrong made him feel important in his eyes.

That must be what happened. What are the chances it was actually black teens committing those burglars? Much more likely it was GZ doing it and calling it in just to blame them.

 

[tlcya]

snipped by me for space

Info for that article came from an "unnamed former co-worker" so read with a grain of salt.

My gosh people! None of you know what George Zimmerman was thinking any more than you know for certain what Trayvon Martin was thinking that night. Maybe he walked to 7-11 and bought ice tea and skittles. Maybe he was out just walking around and had ice tea and skittles from home. No one here knows.

Maybe George Zimmerman is a rampant racist that tries to cover it up by mentoring black kids. Maybe he skulks around the community every single night prowling for black teens to harass. No one here knows.

FACT IS NONE OF YOU KNOW! Please stop trashing this man because he could be telling the truth.

News outlets have edited the 911 audiotapes to make GZ look guilty. The former attorney general claims the Martin family lawyer of outright lies. http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/02/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html

What if -- what IF - George Zimmerman is telling the truth?

Then a jury of his peers or a judge as the case may be will hear ALL of the unedited, unenhanced actual evidence along with witness testimony that exists and GZ will be acquitted or not charged.

Fact is a young unarmed man is dead and it appears as if no one in official capacity thought that worth properly investigating until public pressure made it happen.

Whether GZ is guilty of murder, manslaughter, or completely innocent, that is for the justice system to decide.

Either way, a teenager, with an entire life ahead of him is dead. That won't change no matter the outcome for GZ. Period.

:cow:

 

[cityslick]

Many people here are not from Florida, have you read the comment sections on the Orlando newspaper and news stations? They are ready to give GZ a medal and put him up on a pedestal. The comments actually are sickening!

I don't live in FL, but I know a lot of people who do and have been there more than a few times. All areas are different and I don't mean to bag on the state as a whole but...

There are some serious pockets of prejudice that runs there, more than a lot of other places. A lot of folks who live in FL are not originally from there and they have brought a lot of bias' from wherever they came from. Take that into account when thinking in terms of 'jury pool'.

That's my observation, both from what many tell me and what I've seen and heard.

 

[w1df10wr]

Don't forget, this cop who says he saw water and grass on the back of Zimmerman is so smart he knows he needs to put that in the report he did at 3:29 am the night of the shooting. Without knowing anything else about the case he knows that is important.

But even after arresting Zimmerman and looking at him and taking him to the station and even searching him again there he still does not know the color of Zimmerman's coat. He says it is red.

:waitasec: Wouldn't he have been home by then and the 3rd/ night shift officers be on duty at that time? Did he change his report or did someone else?

 

[miimaa]

I would like to know why the AG didn't say anything about this before, It is not new news. imo

And, the Martins are not accusing the AG of having a meeting with the Zimmermans. They are asking him about the meeting he had with LE that night.

The letter came from the Martin family lawyer.

"An "outraged" Florida prosecutor fired back on Monday at the family of Trayvon Martin, describing as "outright lies" their account that he and a local police chief met and decided not to follow a detective's advice and arrest the teenager's killer."

"Wolfinger, who stepped aside in the case last month, vehemently denies that any "such meeting or communication occurred" between him and Lee."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/02/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html

 

[miimaa]

BBM

One news organization, NBC News, made one bad edit and it is being investigated. It is about 3 seconds worth of coverage. There have been about 8 billion hours of coverage where that has not happened.

Not so. The tapes that were played have GZ calling TM black when that was his response to the dispatcher's question. The dispatcher asked if the person was white? black? hispanic?

 

[csziggy]

Trying to find timeline of events. Would that be in the media file and if it is, where is the Trayvon Martin media file? Thanks

I've got the timeline I put together and posted several threads back but I am not sure if links to individually created material are allowed - at one point mods said only MSM information was being allowed.

The post is still up: [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7742915&postcount=310"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - FL 17 y/o Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #12[/ame]

 

[tlcya]

It is a red coat. Red coat with a black stripe on the back and shoulders.

true. But officers who are taking down information and making reports regarding what they saw, heard and collected are trained to be very specific in their notes because they well know that they may need to refer back to them a year or two later during testimony. As a result, LEO tend to be very specific when making such observations that may later be recalled as evidence.

Who knows if the lack of detail regarding the jacket will be relevant but when being placed together with witness testimony - if there are differences, it could be important.

:cow:

 

[wishuwerehere]

Many posters have asked the question why did Zimmerman get out of his vehicle in this instance and not in other instances while on his neighborhood watch. IMO he made the horrible decision to get out of his vehicle because he had been drinking, and was feeling cocky. How convenient for Zimmerman that LE did not perform a breathalyzer?

Does anyone believe this case would have been a slam dunk for an arrest and charging of Zimmerman if it could have been proven that he was under the influence?

jmo

 

[gator]

My goodness. All I have to say is: Occam's Razor, y'all. The simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

-Who has documented aggression issues?
-Who was recorded stating that he was following the deceased victim?
-Who had the loaded gun?
-Whose story keeps changing?
-Who was shown to have no visible injuries in the police station video?
-Who did not go to the ER the night of the shooting? (as opposed to the morgue)
-Who did 2 audio experts verify was not screaming?

I guess it's possible that Trayvon somehow turned into a raving belligerent lunatic after displaying none of those tendencies previously and attacked and beat GZ into near unconsciousness, but his head wounds were internal, and his broken nose was not swollen or bloody, and GZ was actually screaming like a teenager. Is it likely? I submit that it is not.

JMO

 

[OneLove]

It is a red coat. Red coat with a black stripe on the back and shoulders.

Understood. I'm just pointing out how this disparity or lapse or incomplete description, whatever vocabulary you want to use to describe it, this can be spun to a jury in a way so as to persuade them to disregard the claim. Just sayin. Who knows whether a jury would buy it. I've seen stranger things by far in jury thinking. Caylee Anthony comes to mind, for some reason.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

It is a red coat. Red coat with a black stripe on the back and shoulders.

So his eyesight was so bad he couldn't see the large black stripe as wide as the shoulders and going down part ways on the arms was not red. WoW But he saw little pieces of grass?

 

[cityslick]

Many posters have asked the question why did Zimmerman get out of his vehicle in this instance and not in other instances while on his neighborhood watch. IMO he made the horrible decision to get out of his vehicle because he had been drinking, and was feeling cocky. How convenient for Zimmerman that LE did not perform a breathalyzer?

Does anyone believe this case would have been a slam dunk for an arrest and charging of Zimmerman if it could have been proven that he was under the influence?

jmo

Would they even perform a breathalyzer here? He wasn't driving a car. I don't know what the procedure to make someone take a breathalyzer is. Is there a law to be drunk and carry a gun?

 

[Velouria]

snipped by me for space

Info for that article came from an "unnamed former co-worker" so read with a grain of salt.

I promise to give it the same weight that I do the words of Joe Oliver, Frank Taafe, and of Robert Zimmerman Jr. and Sr.

My gosh people! None of you know what George Zimmerman was thinking any more than you know for certain what Trayvon Martin was thinking that night. Maybe he walked to 7-11 and bought ice tea and skittles. Maybe he was out just walking around and had ice tea and skittles from home. No one here knows.

We actually do know TM purchased those items at the 7-11 that evening.

However, I agree, we don't know what GZ was thinking that night, any more than he knew that TM was "up to no good" and "on drugs".

Maybe George Zimmerman is a rampant racist that tries to cover it up by mentoring black kids. Maybe he skulks around the community every single night prowling for black teens to harass. No one here knows.

IMO, you can engage in racial profiling without being a "rampant racist".

FACT IS NONE OF YOU KNOW! Please stop trashing this man because he could be telling the truth.

I don't believe that examining GZ's past behavior is trashing, but would agree that it's important to distinguish fact from opinion and avoid "unnecessary roughness" toward any of the players in this case.

He could be telling the truth, and he may not be. What I have learned thus far leads me to believe he is not being completely honest about what happened.

IMO

News outlets have edited the 911 audiotapes to make GZ look guilty. The former attorney general claims the Martin family lawyer of outright lies. http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/02/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html

What if -- what IF - George Zimmerman is telling the truth?

But what if he isn't?

I think a jury should have the opportunity to decide.

 

[TonyGatto]

Why do I think Chris Serino is going to be the John Dean of this case?

Investigator Chris Serino then took Martin to another room and told him Zimmerman's version of events. Sanford police have stopped talking to reporters about the case, and Serino has never spoken publicly about his role in it, but here is how Martin recalls what Serino said:

Sanford police released Zimmerman without charge, but Martin says Serino told him he would challenge Zimmerman's account.

"The detective's words were, 'I want to interview him again to catch him in a lie,'" Martin said.

A law-enforcement source, who had been informed of the case by investigators, told Reuters that Serino was eager to bring a charge but encountered resistance from the office of the prosecutor, State Attorney Norman Wolfinger.

"Chris (Serino) would have made a recommendation for manslaughter, but Norm Wolfinger's office wanted it to be a slam dunk," said the source, who spoke on condition of anonymity. "They don't want to hear that this is wrong or that is wrong with the case. That's the way this county does business."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/03/usa-florida-shooting-trayvon-idUSL2E8F31ZX20120403

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Out of all the questions being contemplated here, I don't think they case is going to hinge on a red coat, or a red/black/gray coat.

I think there is a very good possibility this case will hinge on this report done by Officer Smith, at least the breaking open of the coverup going on in the police dept. From what I am putting together this report is false and he was instructed on what to put in it. IMO