17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #29

[m00c0w]

It just hit me... A flashlight shining onto the top of his head (especially a high-lumen one, like was purportedly carrying), combined with the flash of the phone's camera, would produce a crappy overexposure like that...

 

[SuziQ]

MO'M took this case pro bono so I think he's absolutely reveling in all the attention this case is going to get him. Did he pick GZ or did GZ pick him, that is the question!

Good question. I hope the state steps it up. This will be one heck of a trial to watch.

 

[suzihawk]

Spontaneous? Should he have done this on NG? Or a letter to the paper? Or maybe sent flowers and a card? Really?

How often does someone actually apologize in a situation like this? From GZ's standpoint, saying sorry is somewhat ridiculous I'd think. JMO

I agree. And yet he did - nearly two months later when he had the eyes of the world upon him. Why not NG or any other talk show that FT wrangled his way on where he spoke on GZ's behalf?

 

[sleonardelli]

I don't know if this has been noticed and posted by someone else / but I would add from listening to the tape from my earlier posting at 167 that: As I was listening to some background sounds on the Zimmerman tape him fidgeting with his pistol? Because right after the operator says 'Alright, George / what is your last name?' - (then what sounds like slide of pistol cocking) @ 7:12:14:25. He then replies and says 'Zimmerman'. the very next thing (he swears a lot doesn't he?) he says is '$hi* no..' Then I hear what sounds like him hitting the bottom of the magazine three times with the palm of his hand... (this same sound is also repeated) Not sure any of this matters....it probably was just his loose magazine. This is time-stamped at @ 7:12:14:25 from the 911 tape I linked at 167. (George Zimmerman Police Call w. Time Stamps and Notes - YouTube)

:gthanks: OMG! I never heard that before! Maybe it's my subconscious, since you told me what to listen for, but I do hear the click that could be a lock slide (though I would only know this from tv/movies as I haven't handled a weapons [M16, USAF, and only for qualifying] in over 5 years). Perhaps this is some of the evidence the SA has.

 

[grandmaj]

Good Evening everyone. It is Saturday night "date night". I guess if we are all here we are old, married, don't have dates, or are ignoring our dates, maybe a combination of all of the previously mentioned choices. So we are here to talk and enjoy each others company even if we DISAGREE right?

Please be kind, respectful and don't shoot snips or torpedoes at one another. We need to be respectful first and foremost. It would be more enjoyable to all.

 

[Concerned Papa]

Just so I can be clear, isn't this dude, who we're supposed to believe in certifying the legitimacy of this picture, the same one who claimed he saw gunshot residue on TM's hoodie?

When he was face down?

After allegedly being shot from the front?

 

[badme102]

It just hit me... A flashlight shining onto the top of his head (especially a high-lumen one, like was purportedly carrying), combined with the flash of the phone's camera, would produce a crappy overexposure like that...

Yup, I was thinking the same. Sad to say, but about an hour ago, I grabbed my flashlight and was all over the house taking cell pictures of stuff to see if I could recreate that "light" :blushing::blushing:

 

[ThoughtFox]

MO'M took this case pro bono so I think he's absolutely reveling in all the attention this case is going to get him. Did he pick GZ or did GZ pick him, that is the question!

Maybe the NRA or Sean Hannity picked him for GZ? JMOO :cow:

 

[PaintingAnemone]

The detective saying they have no evidence who started the fight is huge, because if they did, SYG is out the window.

I'm not sure I agree with you there. The detective saying he doesn't know who struck whom first doesn't mean they can't intimate which one of them was the aggressor. He already indicated that they have evidence that Zimmerman continued to chase Martin - I think they may be about to use that to make the case that Martin was the one to whom SYG should have applied in that situation.

O'MARA: Since. Today. Do you have any evidence that conflicts with his suggestion that he had turned around and went back to his car?

GILBREATH: Other than his statement, no.

O'MARA: Any evidence that conflicts with that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He answered it. He said no.

O'MARA: Any evidence that conflicts any eyewitnesses, anything that conflicts with the contention that Mr. Martin assaulted first?

GILBREATH: That contention that was given to us by him, other than filling in the figures being one following or chasing the other one, as to who threw the first blow, no.

So it looks like Zimmerman's own statement is what they're using to contest that he went back to his car (probably the timing issues and inconsistencies in location that have been previously noted here). Also, I notice that even though he couldn't definitively state who threw the first blow, he made sure to exclude from that whether they knew who was following whom that night. And isn't it beside the point who threw the first punch if, as has been discussed here ad nauseum, a person does not need to suffer injury in order to fear for his or her life and defend him or herself? I don't know who hit first, but it's been presented repeatedly that Zimmerman's head was being slammed into the concrete, and we heard during the hearing that there is evidence that this is not true (Gilbreath concedes only that Zimmerman's wounds could be consistent with his head striking something harder than his own head, but not that it was concrete or even what he thinks it might have been).

I'm not presenting anything new here. I'm mostly just thinking out loud - or thinking in type.

 

[m00c0w]

And, testing my theory out, I got extremely similar results.

Here is the control image (just the phone flash):


And here is the image with my Surefire shone into what seems to be about the same position:


If you take a look at FotoForensics, you'll see the same phenomenon in my image:

http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=459d4a3be598f801ccd546bd5fd7be87a57c6083.153339

For full disclosure, I did crop the second blown-out photo in order to focus more on my head than my ability to take photographs with my hands behind my head and I shrank both of them because of size issues. If anyone wishes for the originals, I'll be happy to PM you a link.

 

[badme102]

:gthanks: OMG! I never heard that before! Maybe it's my subconscious, since you told me what to listen for, but I do hear the click that could be a lock slide (though I would only know this from tv/movies as I haven't handled a weapons [M16, USAF, and only for qualifying] in over 5 years). Perhaps this is some of the evidence the SA has.

One of our posters posted a self made video with the sounds of this exact firearm. I also think ConcernedPapa made his own video comparing the sounds.
I'll go see if I can find them

 

[PaintingAnemone]

And, testing my theory out, I got extremely similar results.

Here is the control image (just the phone flash):
View attachment 21728

And here is the image with my Surefire shone into what seems to be about the same position:
View attachment 21729

If you take a look at FotoForensics, you'll see the same phenomenon in my image:

http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=459d4a3be598f801ccd546bd5fd7be87a57c6083.153339

For full disclosure, I did crop the second blown-out photo in order to focus more on my head than my ability to take photographs with my hands behind my head and I shrank both of them because of size issues. If anyone wishes for the originals, I'll be happy to PM you a link.

EXCELLENT! Now, do you see how round that is? Round heads make round glare. So why does the ABC image have a straight edge?

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I just got there! Just found this myself, less than a minute ago!

SA: "Did he, Mr Zimmerman, the defendant, at one point claim to the police that he was scared because Mr Martin started circling his car"?

Galbraith: "Yes"

http://www.wral.com/news/video/11004815/#/vid11004815

:tyou:

(Thank you... where were you 1.5 hours ago?! LOL)

I am not saying it is nefarious or anything but there is something cut out of that spot on the tape.

 

[suzihawk]

Does it really matter if he "beat" or "hit" his head on the ground? How injured does one need to be to defend themselves? JMO

More injured than GZ allegedly was, IMO.

 

[Reader]

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justic...in-Zimmerman-s-story-raised-police-suspicions

George Zimmerman bond hearing: 5 new things we learned

3. ‘Inconsistencies’ in Zimmerman’s story raised police suspicions

Testimony at the hearing suggested that Sanford police – who released Zimmerman without charges before a special prosecutor filed charges against him last week – didn’t fully believe Zimmerman's story, noting” inconsistencies” in his account of how he was attacked by Trayvon.

When Zimmerman was on the stand, Mr. De La Rionda asked him about whether, when police asked him about inconsistencies in his story, he began to say that he didn’t remember exactly what happened. The judge cut off that line of questioning, saying it veered into evidence that should be introduced at trial.

But during his turn on the stand, Gilbreath drew attention to Zimmerman's assertion to police that Trayvon was at one point running around Zimmerman's car. Gilbreath questioned why that should make Zimmerman fear for his life. “[Zimmerman] was so scared that he still got out of the car and chased Mr. Martin,” Gilbreath said skeptically.

Under questioning from O’Mara, Gilbreath also described new details that Zimmerman told police, including the claim that Trayvon allegedly tried to suffocate Zimmerman and grab for his gun before Zimmerman “scooted away” and shot Trayvon at close range.

4..........Mr. De La Rionda asked Gilbreath: “If Mr. Martin was minding his own business and coming home and someone starts accusing him of a crime, would you consider that a confrontation?”

“Yes,” Gilbreath responded.

More at link.....

 

[LolaMoon08]

I've had worse lacerations from playing with my cat -- especially when she was a cute little demon kitten -- She's still alive.

 

[LambChop]

I don't know.....about this apology. I'm all over the place.

On the one hand we have the legal system at work here. So GM has to be careful.
On the other hand we have Trayvon's parents saying they didn't want an apology at this point from him....

I have to say that I get frustrated with gamesmanship in the law. It is like a big chess game. While I appreciate our legal system I just wish the gamesmanship could be toned down.

I think if I were George I wouldn't have used the bail hearing to do this. It made him appear to be doing it in spite of Trayvon's parents refusal to hear an apology at this date. It upset Trayvon's parents who said it was too late for an apology. The prosecutor was really drilling on this was this part of a game to get bond? I don't know if I believe that. There are some things we just never will reconcile.

I know it doesn't play well with me that grieving parents were kinda forced into hearing it. Probably because I'm a funeral director and it takes me so much love, energy, and commitment to reach a family who has just lost a child.

IMO It is way too soon to forgive, to listen to George or feel anything but anger toward the man who took their son's life. That is just how grief works. And with young people when they die, it is the worst possible thing a family can ever have to deal with. I can tell you my experience is that they never are the same ever again. They express things in murder situations like the killer isn't going to cleanse his conscience at my expense. See what I mean. It is a huge gaping hole that needs much time to heal.

Now like it or not, GZ is the accused. Only the legal system can determine the outcome.

Trayvon is dead. If only...... but it doesn't change things.

This apology isn't going to change how Trayvon's parents feel, or how they speak out. Their son is gone. And it was just kinda hollow to me the way it appeared staged. Don't do it again George. Don't cleanse your own hurting conscience on the family of the young man you killed. Deal with it the way you have to but don't do that. It may not feel fair but it is reality.

I was watching the news last night. I live very close to Columbine yesterday being the 13th anniversary. One of the parents said he is just starting to heal, and this was the first year that he could sit with the parents of Dylan Klebold. He said it healed some but he is still bitter in some ways. 13 years later! I think a better approach would have been to get through the legal system no matter which way it went. Once that was determined then would be the time to apologize.

So as long as GZ is the accused, he needs to keep quiet I believe. Work for his defense and not do things like he did yesterday which really came off not so well. Because really what was accomplished? He was going to get bond anyway IMO. And the parents are no where near ready to hear anything form this man. What was the gain? GZ has to accept he is responsible for a death and find a way to cope with that in his way. Maybe prayer, or counseling or whatever.....during the course of the next year there will be hearings and a trial probably. But don't encroach on where the family is at this time.

I can't say with certainty what happened. I don't know. I know what I believe happened. Doesn't mean I'm correct.

Whether he meant it or not people will assume he used the apology for his own personal benefit during the bond hearing. It would have sounded more genuine had he sent them a private message that the media would not have had access to unless the Martin's wished to reveal it's contents. So, technically, he again has taken something away from them. He sounded self serving at best. jmo

 

[PaintingAnemone]

And, testing my theory out, I got extremely similar results.

Here is the control image (just the phone flash):
View attachment 21728

And here is the image with my Surefire shone into what seems to be about the same position:
View attachment 21729

If you take a look at FotoForensics, you'll see the same phenomenon in my image:

http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=459d4a3be598f801ccd546bd5fd7be87a57c6083.153339

For full disclosure, I did crop the second blown-out photo in order to focus more on my head than my ability to take photographs with my hands behind my head and I shrank both of them because of size issues. If anyone wishes for the originals, I'll be happy to PM you a link.

Also, can you pour a little ketchup on there and do another one for us so we can see if red would wash out, too? I swear, you'll be good as new after a quick shower. ;-)

:floorlaugh:

 

[m00c0w]

EXCELLENT! Now, do you see how round that is? Round heads make round glare. So why does the ABC image have a straight edge?

Because of the blood and contusions in the area. It's no longer a light-colored scalp. You can see where the corona of the light is, it just didn't produce the same result in that specific area because of the contrasting colors.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Heck, I've had worse lacerations from shaving my legs! Jumping into the pool and scaping my head on the bottom of the pool. You should have seen my knees when I feel really hard on concrete one time.

Just sayin'.