2009.11.19 Defense Files Motion suggesting Kronk as Killer #4

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I made that insuinuation to NTS a few posts ago-That the defense may be picking on RK because it brings Richard Cain into the picture and his bad police work, and because the state had not dumped investigative info on RK like they did on JG.
But you are right, maybe the state does have a dossier on RK.



Why put an innocent person thru what RK has endured when the intention is to go after someone else? Oh, that's right...we are talking about Baez....


Novice Seeker
 
Don't anyone take this too seriously. Even the defense lawyers have publicly backed way, way off of this. I think they received a schooling from other lawyers publicly opining and possibly a letter similar to the one LP received from Kronk's lawyer. This is fresh in our mind, but they have been down this road before with many other people they tried to implicate.

First there was the ever elusive Zeniada FG story that they worked on promoting. They insisted for months that LE simply found the wrong Zenaida and needed to keep looking for the real one.

Do you remember the hearing where Baez was trying to get all of Tony's phone, cell, and computer records released?

Do you remember the overt attempts to blame this on Jesse? If you google Jesse's name it will refresh your memory how far that went, it was a concentrated effort.

Remember Cindy literally telling LE that Zanny was either Ricardo, Jesse or a Jesse/Amy combination?

They all get debunked and we laugh them off and say whose next because we follow the case and we are on to this pattern. For the person who is questioning that all the evidence against Casey is similar and flawed compared to what is circumstantial against Kronk.......naaaa.

Do not worry that the evidence against Casey is circumstantial. You may have heard the Anthonys or Baez say that so often it seems like it is a legitimate concern. It is not, imo. Circumstantial evidence is most often employed in criminal trials. ... In many cases, circumstantial evidence is the only evidence linking a defendant to the crime. In fact many successful criminal prosecutions often rely largely or entirely on circumstantial evidence, ... The 2005 murder trial of Scott Peterson trial was a perfect example.

Fear not, there will be other theories the defense tries to float and this one will be comical to the jury because of the crying wolf and blaming of so many others. None of these stories will be taken seriously by the good taxpayers of the jury. Big colorful story written on blackboard, Baez walks up with eraser and inserts new name every couple of months is how it looks. In the words of L. Drane-Burdick........"It doesn't even come close. It is a farce".

My posts are my opinion only, I am not a lawyer, but I use the common sense God gave me! The jury will too. We all know where Scottie is right now.

Welcome, welcome, welcome Joypath and News Junkie !!! Your discussion is very interesting. We are glad to have you.
 
Interesting,
A. if someone not seeing something is not evidence, then would it not be true that KC not seeing Caylee for 31 days is not evidence? Because Caylee was her 2 year old daughter.
B. What facts do we have that tie KC to the premeditated murder?The decomposition evidence found in her trunk including the odor. KC can be connected to HER car on specific dates. She left the care at the check cashing place until it was impounded. When Tony picked her up at the place SHE left the car KC left her purse. She never mentions to Tony, oops, darn we have to go back I left my purse in the car. BUT, the most important piece of evidence is that when Tony picked KC up Caylee wasn't with her. The 31 days is not evidence.It is when there's a two year old who hasn't been seen by anyone including the grandparents who provided 90% of the care for Caylee. When ever KC is asked where HER daughter is KC lies as to Caylee's whereabouts. She lied about many things, but lying does not mean someone committed murder.I disagree, she lied about the location of her daughter. Knowing how narcissistic KC is she would have milked Caylee's disappearance for everything she could get. Instead KC enjoyed a month of partying, not having to deal with her parents and living the good life. According to the FBI report the Henkel Duct tape found on Caylee’s remains was dissimilar to the tape found on the gas can, and no fingerprints were found on the duct tape, so the Duct tape can’t be used to tie KC to the crime.What we do know is that KC admitted to breaking into George's shed that had gas and duct tape stored. And when George was shown photos of the duct tape that had been replaced on HIS gas cans he denied, very strongly as a matter of fact that, of placing such sloppy duct tape on those cans. There is forensic evidence of decomposition in KC's car, Caylee's body was found with duct tape. Why would Caylee put the duct tape on herself? The FBI could not confirm that the hair found in the trunk had a death band.That isn't what I recall, but ok. Cadaver dogs,Death wax, lab results from Oak Ridge and the oldest test of all SMELL point to death in that car. The forensic reports about the trunk are all questionable. There was no blood found in the trunk. The air sample technology has never been used in court before. So was DNA when it was first used as a legal tool. Isn't that insulting to the experts who possess such advanced qualifications and knowledge in science? We're expected to label their work as questionable b/c it's beyond what we can understand?
C. Deductions regarding the topic of discussion can be drawn from related facts and information. They infer other facts which usually and reasonably follow from the available evidence.ITA, the disagreement is what's considered fact. Some determine a fact based on common sense, 1+1=2 How can one make deductions regarding the topic of discussion if there is no available evidence? If the only evidence you have is circumstantial, how can you make circumstantial deductions? Again, not everyone believes all the evidence is circumstantial. There's plenty of facts connected to this crime that doesn't require a rocket science IQ to determine. Using the example when KC came in her umbrella was soaking wet circumstantially rain, so now you can infer that her shoes are wet because she was walking in the rain so it is a fact. You can infer that her pants had water spots on them because it was raining hard, so it is a fact. So you are now ready with 3 pieces of evidence that KC was walking in the rain, two facts and one piece of circumstantial evidence? Is this correct? Because, the truth was KC walked by a fountain on her way, dropped the umbrella in the fountain which splashed on her shoes and pants and made the umbrella soaking wet, the facts and the circumstantial evidence was wrong. That would imply that LE and SA's office based this entire case on the explaination KC gave regarding her daughter. Honestly I am confused about all this circumstantial stuff. If the available evidence is circumstantial, which to my understanding it is, So everyone else should accept this assumption b/c someone else doesn't believe or acknowledge another's opinion? what facts are available to make deductions from?Start back at page #1 Is the prosecution or the defense for that matter allowed to make deductions from circumstantial evidence, and this allows them to infer other facts which usually and reasonably follow from the available evidence?Unless KC is willing to tell the court the truth. Otherwise the SA has to rely on the forensic evidence, KC's behavior, actions and statements and all the other witness's I don’t understand how something inferred from a circumstance can be considered a fact.What some would imply is circumstantial others recognize as fact. I do think you can infer a circumstance from something that is a fact.
D. What is the prosecutions hypothesis as to when, where, how, and why KC committed the premeditated murder of Caylee?Go back to page #1. Standing alone, the evidence the state has that we know of is not sufficient to draw any definite conclusions.That's one's opinion.
E. Need more data from the prosecution to convict KC, IMO, but not saying they cannot come up with something good.There's more than enough, IMO.

Using what some will probably consider illogical logic, from the above points, it seems to me that the circumstantial evidence against KC is equally as strong as the circumstantial evidence against RKSeriously??, forget it.. I think this because it seems like there are precious few actual facts in either scenario, and almost everything is circumstantial from both sides. The judge may very well dismiss this motion, but if he does, I will be very interested in his explanation as to why he dismissed it.Does that mean Judge Strickland lacks the ability to recognize what is fact and that which is circumstantial??
I have to agree with those who believe the defense is trying to raise doubt, since that is their job, also that AL has used spaghetti throwing as a tactic. RK’s inconsistent statements and his past makes him a good candidate for the defense to use.But, what if it were you that the Defense was using as a scapegoat? The media has insinuated that many others have been thrown under the bus, but I think that is all just media hype.I'm sure that comforts the innocent people whose personal life has been attacked by the Anthony's and Baez. As far as I know, this motion is the first time the defense has shown anything that involves a SODDI defense.and they can't even do that within the rules and laws set forth by our constitution. As always my entire post is moo



My questions and opinions in red. My question is how many times does it take in :other_beatingA_Dead before they accept the horse isn't going to jump back up???


Novice Seeker
 
To JBean :blowkiss:
For putting us back on track we :back:
or get :offtopic:

You more than deserve a:gold_star:

Here's to you :toastred:



Novice Seeker
 
SODDI #4 ??

Why not - nothing else to get on with.

JMHO
 
I totally agree. But perhaps she is scared to death of him.

Are you talking about KC here? The same KC who shook her fist at her parents, claimed she was so angry she could not swallow, sat and gave a statement to LE where she bold faced lied, tole LP to get the he!! out of HER house (the very man who bailed her out of jail)....please, the women in that family are afraid of no one, absolutely no one. Makes no sense that you are facing death and you won't say anything to connect him to Caylee's disappearance because you don't have the information you need to make the connection.

So maybe that is what defense is trying to do. Make that connection because they certainly can't get that information from KC because KC knows who put her daughter there and it was not RK. The motion stinks like a body in a freezer. JMO
 
Caylee was not seen after June 15th. Kronk was not assigned to the Hopespring area till August 11th. That has been verified with documentation. AGAIN, on page 7 of the link it says that Roy's timesheet and detailed log of when Roy worked at the Suburban area were acquired from the District Manager for Orange County Public Works, Tim Armstrong.

http://www.momlogic.com/cdn/v3/pdf/casey_anthony_detectives_report.pdf

Caylee had already been missing for approximately seven weeks before Kronk even came into the picture. <sigh>
 
Not sure where or if you guys have a TV alert section, but Tru TV - InSession show is covering Caylee case and RK issues right now.

MOD's - please move where all Caylee case readers will find this, if this is not the right spot. THANKS!!!!!!!!
 
Casey just lied too many times...and didn't blink an eyelash.


Well, she did but I think it was for the cameras that she's postured and preened at all this time. No access to Tony or any other male friend... Access to her attorney - that's another thing, altogether.

JMHO
 
It appears that most of the "circumstantial evidence" that has been presented here against RK is fabricated by theories and way after the fact of Caylee going missing. So what is the point of this motion? No one has provided a link to June 16th when Caylee was supposed to be spotted at Walmart with her mother shortly after 4pm. By 6pm we know she was not with her mother. Not too much of a stretch of the imagination to know that she ended up in the trunk.

Having duct tape means nothing...we all have it and I bet even Nun's have it in their households. Now the brand found on Caylee..not so much..but clearly that brand points it's finger squarely at her mother. With all the finger point CA has done for her to come out through her attorney and make a statement supporting RK, I think speaks volumes. The A's know who the guilty party is so why ruin innocent people unnecessarily when they have to live in this community after this trial is over. They are covering their bases. JMO
 
I can't wait for June 2010. RK theory will be a huge fail. Nanny theory will be a huge fail. Grunds theory huge fail. He may even throw the Cindy Anthony theory and that will be a huge fail.

Maybe AL will be able to spare KC's life, but she will never be free again. KC should have given more thought to her story, the nanny thing was just ridiculous.
 
Little Caylee......I believe that she is a bright star in Heaven above. Boy, her grandmother sure is a firely individual -- she reminds me of a pitbull.
 
BBM...actually it's not my opinion. It comes from AL's mouth....so I consider it routine and fact not opinion. Her position is that if you don't like the evidence...file a motion about it. File a motion on everything....one out of (can't remember what number she used ) every ___ may get approved. Feel free to listen to the 3 plus hours of her lectures about "story telling and defender tools" at the link in this post.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4581777&postcount=798



That's how I was able to anticipate her plan. I share my opinion here often, but most of the time I have a reason for it and back it up with a link. The AL thread is closed, but I have a number of posts with AL quotes that I find worthy of notice. I did post specific quotes there but you must listen to the MP3 in its entirety to get the full effect. Like I said....this is her strategy and nothing more.... and certainly not brilliant. AND certainly not JB's doing.

I certainly respect your opinion. I have come up with one similiar, but I acceppt it as SOP.

Just because a defense Lawyer throws stuff at the wall, doesn't mean they don't believe in their clients innocense. It is their job to create as much doubt as possible.. You may be right that the motion was not brilliant, but clever. I can accept that. Seems to be a good word.

Sa has done the same thing with the trunk. There is no physical evidence that Caylee was in the trunk, so just throw everything out there that you can and hope it sticks. SOP in my opinion.

Hopefully the Judge will stay above the frey when the SA and Defense use SOP tactics, meanwhile taking the motions seriously and considering the defendants right to a fair trial. MOO
 
Too late now...how will the PI protect her? I'd think that LE would be better able to do that.

I agree. Hence the motion. Le does need to talk to her and get sworn testimony. I would feel much more comfortable with this. She does need protection.
 
Don't you think it's pretty sad when a mother can't remember the last day she saw her child? Especially if someone kidnapped her child...and she was h*ll bent on finding her. So how come Casey never said it was RK? Sorry, this theory has become so convoluted I can't keep track of what's what. LOL

bold 1: I thought she said 31 days. Sounds pretty accurate to me. So no not sad at all. She was being truthful.

Bold 2: Did you see the defense on 48 hours where they said that Kc did have someone looking into it? I myself wonder who that was.

Bold 3: I don't think Kc knew Rk. And Rk is the topic of this thread. I think most need to tie Kc to Rk to take the motion seriously. I do not. There are many perps that do not know their victim.
 
I certainly respect your opinion. I have come up with one similiar, but I acceppt it as SOP.

Just because a defense Lawyer throws stuff at the wall, doesn't mean they don't believe in their clients innocense. It is their job to create as much doubt as possible.. You may be right that the motion was not brilliant, but clever. I can accept that. Seems to be a good word.

Sa has done the same thing with the trunk. There is no physical evidence that Caylee was in the trunk, so just throw everything out there that you can and hope it sticks. SOP in my opinion.

responding to bolded and underscored by me...
Hopefully the Judge will stay above the frey when the SA and Defense use SOP tactics, meanwhile taking the motions seriously and considering the defendants right to a fair trial. MOO

Hopefully Joypath will weigh in as to whether there is physical evidence in the trunk and your claim that SA is just throwing it out there to see if it sticks. That would help put the Kronk charade to rest since Casey was the only one with custody of her vehicle.
 
Don't anyone take this too seriously. Even the defense lawyers have publicly backed way, way off of this. I think they received a schooling from other lawyers publicly opining and possibly a letter similar to the one LP received from Kronk's lawyer. This is fresh in our mind, but they have been down this road before with many other people they tried to implicate.
First there was the ever elusive Zeniada FG story that they worked on promoting. They insisted for months that LE simply found the wrong Zenaida and needed to keep looking for the real one.

Do you remember the hearing where Baez was trying to get all of Tony's phone, cell, and computer records released?

Do you remember the overt attempts to blame this on Jesse? If you google Jesse's name it will refresh your memory how far that went, it was a concentrated effort.

Remember Cindy literally telling LE that Zanny was either Ricardo, Jesse or a Jesse/Amy combination?

They all get debunked and we laugh them off and say whose next because we follow the case and we are on to this pattern. For the person who is questioning that all the evidence against Casey is similar and flawed compared to what is circumstantial against Kronk.......naaaa.

Do not worry that the evidence against Casey is circumstantial. You may have heard the Anthonys or Baez say that so often it seems like it is a legitimate concern. It is not, imo. Circumstantial evidence is most often employed in criminal trials. ... In many cases, circumstantial evidence is the only evidence linking a defendant to the crime. In fact many successful criminal prosecutions often rely largely or entirely on circumstantial evidence, ... The 2005 murder trial of Scott Peterson trial was a perfect example.
Fear not, there will be other theories the defense tries to float and this one will be comical to the jury because of the crying wolf and blaming of so many others. None of these stories will be taken seriously by the good taxpayers of the jury. Big colorful story written on blackboard, Baez walks up with eraser and inserts new name every couple of months is how it looks. In the words of L. Drane-Burdick........"It doesn't even come close. It is a farce".

My posts are my opinion only, I am not a lawyer, but I use the common sense God gave me! The jury will too. We all know where Scottie is right now.

Welcome, welcome, welcome Joypath and News Junkie !!! Your discussion is very interesting. We are glad to have you.

Bold 1: What makes you think the defense Lawyers have backed off?

Bold 2: When were they down this road? Where is a motion that they tried to implicate someone. Asking for phone records is not implicationg someone, it is just trying to get to the truth.

Bold 3:I missed this one. Where is the motion insisting this?

bold 4: Is there a motion asking for them to look into JG?

bold 5: Well your wrong about Sp, he had motive. Reasonable motive at that. He was cheating on his wife. So it was not entirely circumstantial. Can you point to a case that is entirely circumstantial?
 
Are you talking about KC here? The same KC who shook her fist at her parents, claimed she was so angry she could not swallow, sat and gave a statement to LE where she bold faced lied, tole LP to get the he!! out of HER house (the very man who bailed her out of jail)....please, the women in that family are afraid of no one, absolutely no one. Makes no sense that you are facing death and you won't say anything to connect him to Caylee's disappearance because you don't have the information you need to make the connection.

So maybe that is what defense is trying to do. Make that connection because they certainly can't get that information from KC because KC knows who put her daughter there and it was not RK. The motion stinks like a body in a freezer. JMO

We were talking about Jill kerley
 
Hopefully Joypath will weigh in as to whether there is physical evidence in the trunk and your claim that SA is just throwing it out there to see if it sticks. That would help put the Kronk charade to rest since Casey was the only one with custody of her vehicle.

Who is JOYPATH?
 
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