2011.04.01 Frye Hearing (DISCUSSION THREAD) - PM edition

[LancelotLink]

HeeHee!!
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6280578&postcount=17671"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[Turnadot]

This is all I can say. I am not a Judge. I have no idea what goes into being a Judge and the very serious decisions that they have to make. I will say that since Judge Perry has a very impressive record... I will trust what he is doing is in the best interest for everyone involved in this case.

I have faith in him and I think he has done a good job in getting this case to the point it is at today. I don't think Judge Perry simply goes home and relaxes when he leaves the courthouse. I believe he spends many, many hours going over all the testimony, case law, and whatever else it is that Judge's do.

All I can say is... Keep the Faith!

BBM

I don't either. You know what else HHJP doesn't do? Follow through on his threats. There's probably some awesome reason for it that I'm not seeing, but so far, Beaz continues to act the way he does and stall because he is allowed to.

Of course this trial will happen at some point, and I know HHJP will be much tighter come trial, but it's not a great moral boost to see the defence always being handled with kid gloves and coddled, while the State has to depose a witness again because apparently, JA has nothing better to do than wipe Baez's messes.

I'm not a judge, so obviously I'm not seeing the logical reason behind making idle threats and allowing the defence to piss away money on experts that aren't.

FWIW, I'm not angry, I'm just thinking this trial won't start in May because the defence has been allowed to piss away valuable time.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Starting next week... we will be 5 weeks away from the start of jury selection.

I believe jury duty notices will be sent out next week. I base this on the fact that my mom got a jury duty notice 6 weeks ago and had to call yesterday to find out if she was needed.

April 6th, 7th, and 8th... will be the rest of the Frye Hearings. What do we have left? We have to finish up with Logan... is there another witness or will that be the end of the decomposition/chloroform air samples? What do we have left after that? The stain? The sticker? What is going on with the Plant growth?

I believe the Frye Hearings will be finished this upcoming week.

The week of April 10th-15th... we don't have anything scheduled that I know of. Judge Perry will make his rulings on the Frye issues in this week.

The week of April 18th-22nd - Tying up loose ends.

The week of April 24th-29th - Tying up loose ends.

The week of May 2nd-6th - Rulings on all the loose ends.

May 9th... Jury selection.

It is very doable! Even with JB's antics!

 

[LolaMoon08]

Also... didn't Judge Perry give a final deadline for all motions to be filed? I thought I remember him saying something about that when he was talking about tying up the loose ends the week of April 18th-22nd?

 

[A_News_Junkie]

food for thought -
by my calculations (08/09/2005 -06/16/2008) Caylee was here 1042 days

If we go to jury selection May 9, 2011 (from 06/16/2008), she will have been gone 1057 days

Let us pray that these slow moving wheels of justice grind exceedingly fine

That my fellow posters, is perspective.

GA and CA --- why? Why are you helping delay justice for Caylee? Why JB, CM, and 'team'......... WHY?

 

[Kentjbkent]

Yep, Baez has been threatening and posturing for months now about "trial delay, trial delay" - he had these dirty little tricks up his sleeve the whole time.

I'm right with you - I don't believe the trial will start on time either. My question is this though, what does it gain the defense to have more delays? This will "eventually" go to trail....Not even the precious Miss ICA can get out of this one.

You know, Darnudes, you bring up a very good point, and after reading your question, I thought long and hard about it....and this is the best I can come up with...

Several years ago, my Aunt was SA down in Key West and she tried several child molestation/rape cases. She told me that a common ploy by defense attorneys was a game of "chicken"....with overwhelming evidence, the defense would refuse and hold out pleaing all the way up to trial date in the hopes the victim or family would "chicken" out of putting a child through testifying...

With that in mind...the only scenario I can come up with for delays by DT in this case is.....is it POSSIBLE that there is truth in the speculation that KC and DT are ready to negotiate a plea, but SA continues to say NO WAY...

The reason behind dragging this out in delay after delay is simply a game of "chicken"....? Will SA finally cave and be willing to end this case through a plea deal due to financial constraints, as well as time constraints ( having many other cases to prepare for trial?)????????????????

 

[LolaMoon08]

Maybe this picture will help everyone! It reminds me why we're all here... still here... and will remain here until Justice prevails... and it will!!

Justice for Caylee!

 

[Kentjbkent]

Also... didn't Judge Perry give a final deadline for all motions to be filed? I thought I remember him saying something about that when he was talking about tying up the loose ends the week of April 18th-22nd?

Yes, but he also gave final dates for specific reports to be filed...then did not honor those deadlines either after JB "forgot".....

Wonder how long it will take someone to come up with a list of HHJP deadlines and promises that HHJP did NOT enforce?

Off the top of my head, I can come up with about 10....beginning with courtroom behavior! :banghead:

 

[Numbers]

It's funny how each attorney has their own signature style..... Let's review a few of them.....

JB: Suit # 3 and nifty coordinated tie and pocket square. Not to be confused with Suit # 1 and Suit # 2.
A question for Numbers.....if JB has 3 suits, 4 different colored shirts,20 ties and 20 pocket squares...how many unique "looks" could JB show us.

CM: Gigantic umbrella, John Lennon glasses, cowboy boots.

MM: Suit with tight jackets.

DCS: Attractive suits but bad hair.

LDB: Skirt with matching blazer and perfectly coiffed hair.

JA: Well fitted suits with nice ties. Nothing flashy.

4,800.

But they all come with the same smirk. Alas.

 

[Intermezzo]

http://www.wftv.com/news/27395081/detail.html
Attorneys Scolded During Casey Evidence Hearing

snipped

"Perry agreed that Baez was trying to ambush the prosecution by trying to introduce brand new evidence.

Sheaffer even saw defense attorney Cheney Mason make a vulgar gesture toward the prosecutor with his arms.

"I've not seen anything like this in the 33, 35 years that I've been practicing law," Sheaffer said. "The judge will either stop it or bankrupt them, one of the two."

bbm
Did anyone see that on video today?

I hope Amil or someone from Hinky was in the courtroom today to give us a summary from the gallery.

 

[A_News_Junkie]

Starting next week... we will be 5 weeks away from the start of jury selection.

I believe jury duty notices will be sent out next week. I base this on the fact that my mom got a jury duty notice 6 weeks ago and had to call yesterday to find out if she was needed.

April 6th, 7th, and 8th... will be the rest of the Frye Hearings. What do we have left? We have to finish up with Logan... is there another witness or will that be the end of the decomposition/chloroform air samples? What do we have left after that? The stain? The sticker? What is going on with the Plant growth?

I believe the Frye Hearings will be finished this upcoming week.

The week of April 10th-15th... we don't have anything scheduled that I know of. Judge Perry will make his rulings on the Frye issues in this week.

The week of April 18th-22nd - Tying up loose ends.

The week of April 24th-29th - Tying up loose ends.

The week of May 2nd-6th - Rulings on all the loose ends.

May 9th... Jury selection.

It is very doable! Even with JB's antics!

I think the State will almost have to recall Vass and other rebuttal witnesses after today.

Wed - 9am. Let's get this done!

 

[sleutherontheside]

4,800.

But they all come with the same smirk. Alas.

you are amazing.

 

[ynotdivein]

You know, Darnudes, you bring up a very good point, and after reading your question, I thought long and hard about it....and this is the best I can come up with...

Several years ago, my Aunt was SA down in Key West and she tried several child molestation/rape cases. She told me that a common ploy by defense attorneys was a game of "chicken"....with overwhelming evidence, the defense would refuse and hold out pleaing all the way up to trial date in the hopes the victim or family would "chicken" out of putting a child through testifying...

With that in mind...the only scenario I can come up with for delays by DT in this case is.....is it POSSIBLE that there is truth in the speculation that KC and DT are ready to negotiate a plea, but SA continues to say NO WAY...

The reason behind dragging this out in delay after delay is simply a game of "chicken"....? Will SA finally cave and be willing to end this case through a plea deal due to financial constraints, as well as time constraints ( having many other cases to prepare for trial?)????????????????

KJBK, thank you for this. I think it really is a game of "chicken" (not to in any way dilute what the SA has brought to the table this far)--but... argh, how to express this?

Anyone here ever played Texas Hold'em poker? Where you can get trapped in a bidding war even though you don't want to and don't have anywhere near the cards you need to win the hand? In that case, your best option is to bid high, hoping to scare off your opponents that you have the cards that will make up a winning hand.

IDK and that's enough from me. But KJBK, I think you are right on.

 

[TigerBalm]

Can we come to any consensus re: if HHJP is doing all of this to avoid overturn on appeal, is it worth it?

BBM

I don't either. You know what else HHJP doesn't do? Follow through on his threats. There's probably some awesome reason for it that I'm not seeing, but so far, Beaz continues to act the way he does and stall because he is allowed to.

Of course this trial will happen at some point, and I know HHJP will be much tighter come trial, but it's not a great moral boost to see the defence always being handled with kid gloves and coddled, while the State has to depose a witness again because apparently, JA has nothing better to do than wipe Baez's messes.

I'm not a judge, so obviously I'm not seeing the logical reason behind making idle threats and allowing the defence to piss away money on experts that aren't.

FWIW, I'm not angry, I'm just thinking this trial won't start in May because the defence has been allowed to piss away valuable time.

Judge Perry is always aware of appellate issues.
He has an excellent record, only a portion of one of the cases has ever been overturned on appeal.
Very impressive record for anyone, let alone presiding on the bench for 22 yrs, wouldn't you agree?
He only wants this case tried once!!

I have total faith in HHJP, he knows what he is doing.

 

[TigerBalm]

I think the State will almost have to recall Vass and other rebuttal witnesses after today.

Wed - 9am. Let's get this done!

While I would love to see/listen to the lovely Dr. Vass once again, I am not so sure after the mess the DT made with their own witnesses, that the state even needs to call any rebuttal witnesses.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Just had a thought.... JB was making such a big deal about the velveeta, but wasn't there only a velveeta wrapper? How much velveeta was in the garbage??

If there was no velveeta...where did it go? Did it decompose into adipocere and spead itself all over the trunk carpet? I know that Velveeta is a cheese spread but that really would be amazing it is was self spreading.

If there was a little velveeta....how did it turn into adipocere? Did JB's expert place a hunk of veleveeta in a bag and check for off gassing???

Did JB buy stock in Kraft BEFORE the velveeta theory????

Anyone else feel like queso for dinner???

 

[JSR]

Also important note, I have yet to ever have a case to to trial on the first trial date that was given. Not a single one. So delays are common, at least among civil cases. And I would venture to guess that it's very common among criminal cases as well. It wouldn't be the end of the world if the case gets delayed. The point is that EVENTUALLY Casey will be tried. They can't drag this out forever.

But I really do feel as though HHJP needs to really flex his muscles and start pounding down hard on the DT and their antics. The DT knows they are getting away with stuff they shouldn't.

 

[LolaMoon08]

Judge Perry is always aware of appellate issues.
He has an excellent record, only a portion of one of the cases has ever been overturned on appeal.
Very impressive record for anyone, let alone presiding on the bench for 22 yrs, wouldn't you agree?
He only wants this case tried once!!

I have total faith in HHJP, he knows what he is doing.

I agree 100%!!

I know everyone is anxious and they want things to go at a faster pace, but these Frye issues are the most complex part of any pre-trial hearing, imo. It is the deciding factor in some of the most crucial evidence in this case. Once we are done with these hearings... it may not be completely smooth sailing until May 9th, but is sure won't feel like sailing through a Hurricane! Slightly choppy might be a good way to put it.

I think people are taking it too personal... and I understand completely that it is hard not to get upset (Prozac does wonders!! I can attest to that!!). I just think that people are being way too hard of Judge Perry. I think he is allowing these things to be heard at these hearings simply because he wants to be 100% sure when he disallows it at trial! He's getting these witnesses to swear in their answers NOW so that we don't run into these problems at trial.

 

[sleutherontheside]

JVM talking now about the case.

Says "The Judge Flips Out"

 

[sleutherontheside]

An aside...I'd like to shove a hunk of Velveeta in JVM's mouth. Arghhhhhhhhh