2011.06.10 Sidebar (Trial Day Fifteen)

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So I've been wondering if KC has any visitors when court is over. I wonder if anyone from the DT visits her. I've also been wondering if JP could have a visit with her in private, just him and her.
 
I think Zanny was her chemical "babysitter" Xanax, which she ran out of or couldn't get her hands on any so she would make some chloroform to give Caylee so she could do her thang.

True! But I always believe she used Zanny as an outlet for her emotions or how she's feeling. Remember "Zanny" told ICA she was not a good mother! I'm sure ICA felt the same way but didn't want to say it "herself"
 
I think Zanny was her chemical "babysitter" Xanax, which she ran out of or couldn't get her hands on any so she would make some chloroform to give Caylee so she could do her thang.

I was shocked when Dr G said they tested for xanax, but, I should know that if anyone in the field hears Zanny, they automatically think xanax.
 
Watching the clip of Dr. G on HLN over and over...the reasons it's a homicide ("...that duct was anywhere on the child's face"), has me completely convinced it's now a matter of LWOP or DP. ICA HAS TO KNOW after today that she is NEVER getting out....any thoughts?

I still feel it could have been a way to stage a kidnapping. But either way ICA was RESPONSIBLE for Caylee, therefore RESPONSIBLE for her death! GUILTY!
 
Hey,I mentioned it too :maddening:

There's a great post by Desdemona on the duct tape thread. The Buenoano case was cited in Huck. That was PROSECUTOR Belvin Perry's case :woohoo:

ETA HUCK CASE

Thread: 2009.10.09 Duct Tape Photos From Remains Released
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Old Yesterday, 11:12 PM
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Desdemona Desdemona is offline
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Originally Posted by ynotdivein View Post
Hey Pink Panther. Today, there was not any discussion about this. IIRC, Dr. Garavaglia indicated in the autopsy report that the duct tape was placed "peri-mortem"--meaning either shortly before or shortly after death.

IMO the SA is being fairly methodical about presenting information to the jury, and so I expect to see Dr. Garavaglia testify sometime tomorrow.
Here is a link to the WS thread where Huck vs. Florida has been previously discussed, addressing the issue of duct tape being applied before or after death, and the affirmed assumption by the expert witness that it was applied antemortem, based on the concept of what is reasonable versus unreasonable.

Implications of Huck Case Ruling RE: duct tape on nose and mouth - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community



In Huck, it is stated that in a circumstantial case, the State may assert reasonable assumptions as to the evidence, and has no obligation to refute unreasonable claims by the Defense. In this case, the unreasonable claim was that duct tape had been applied to the victim's eyes and mouth AFTER death. The appeals court decision stated that it was NOT reasonable to assume duct tape had been applied to someone already deceased, but that the State was right to contend that the duct tape had been applied during the commission of the murder.

Page 13
http://www.denverda.org/DNA_Documents/Huck.pdf

P.S. The Huck ruling, citing Buenoano v. State and Butts v. State, also says:

The Florida Supreme Court has held that "expert medical testimony as to the cause of death need not be stated with reasonable certainty in a homicide prosecution and is competent if the expert can show that, in his opinion, the occurrence could cause death or that the occurrence might have or probably did cause death."

Same document as above, see pages 19-21.
http://www.denverda.org/DNA_Documents/Huck.pdf
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You most certainly did!!!! See that quarter sized patch over there on this here cloud? While that was my contribution to Huck and I'm pulling a Baez - I want a pat on the head tooooo! :innocent:
 
I took a break from watching/listening to testimony this afternoon because yesterday and this morning were very difficult. I'm watching a Judy Garland movie (I love old movies!) and read through the trial thread to get the gist of the proceedings. Thanks to everyone who contributed. I'll be back in the morning. Sweet dreams!
 
Watching the clip of Dr. G on HLN over and over...the reasons it's a homicide ("...that duct was anywhere on the child's face"), has me completely convinced it's now a matter of LWOP or DP. ICA HAS TO KNOW after today that she is NEVER getting out....any thoughts?

I think Dr.G sealed her faint today!!
 
KC would have been, would be, so much better off telling the truth.
Nothing could be worse then what the Prosecution in claiming so the jury may decide it is the truth
(as it may be but still no concrete proof).
Nothing the DT has said so far is very convincing to support an alternative theory even if they aren't required to prove their case.
Dr. G is very sure of herself, the 84 hits on the computer for chloroform and the 31 days and car/dogs is too much to simply explain away or ignore imo.
Fortunately for our justice system, the standard of "concrete proof" is not the legal standard that has to be met. Beyond a reasonable doubt is not a 100% certain standard.
 
Hopped over to this thread before I ABSOLUTELY have to get up from here and fix DH some supper and try to act like I have done something around this house just so I could give you all a shout out for being here where I can follow along and hit that THANKS button a jillion times! Somehow clicking THANKS seems to help me let off a little steam and to feel I have "brothers and sisters" that allow me to be on their team. Team Caylee. THANKS to EVERYONE OF YOU!!!

I understand completely. My DH and DD are rebelling against Chinese takeout and Frozen California Pizza's for dinner. My 2 dogs spent the afternoon ripping apart some food wrappers they found in my DD's room,and they have strewn them all around the house, and the kitchen sink is overflowing with dishes because the dishwasher has not been unloaded yet....YIKES. I better make up for some lost time before everyone gets back home.:panic:
 
What a great day for justice! Keep on rolling, SA. :great:
 
KC would have been, would be, so much better off telling the truth.
Nothing could be worse then what the Prosecution in claiming so the jury may decide it is the truth
(as it may be but still no concrete proof).
Nothing the DT has said so far is very convincing to support an alternative theory even if they aren't required to prove their case.
Dr. G is very sure of herself, the 84 hits on the computer for chloroform and the 31 days and car/dogs is too much to simply explain away or ignore imo.

bbm

Tell truth as in, I drugged my child then wrapped her face in duct tape let her decompose in my car then finally dumped her in a swamp - You want ICA to admit to that? :) ICA will take that to the grave.
 
I always knew that no juror would agree or believe that ridiculous defense story put forth about an accident and hiding the body and Kronk taking it. Why would Kronk have to take it and hide it til some months down the road. Makes no sense at all. And where did Kronk get the body? JB has locked himself into this ridculous theory and even admitted his client killed the child or that she was killed in his client's care. Her story makes no sense. The States story makes all the sense. Start packing for death row Casey Marie Anthony

I agree. Again I will say no reasonable person would find a child in the pool and think it would be better to cover up an accident by making it look like a murder.

Also on the duct tape, why would you need to put duct tape on the body to make it look like a murder? I think the fact the body was in bags and thrown in the woods would take care of that. I just have to believe the Jury is going to see this too.
 
I have to say that if ICA truly is afflicted with a cluster b personality disorder (or several) I do not believe she would think herself a poor mother or project those feelings in an alter ego.

Instead, imo, it would be more likely that she believed herself to be an awesome parent and it was everyone else's fault who could not/would not acknowledge that. I believe ICA used the 'bad mother to Caylee' ruse to garner sympathy of those that loved her and feed her ego. JMHO
 
I was so proud today!!!
When Dr. G. was talking about the statistics on child drownings and she was so emotional - I thought it was from anger because she was outraged the Defence team dared to suggest that a small child whose face was duct taped, was bagged and tossed in a swamp to rot was in fact an accidental drowning.
She scored huge points and made the defense look just plain silly by suggesting it - no insisting on it in their opening statement.

GOOD TIMES!!!!!!!
 
Other thread is closed, posting tweets here:

Court adjourned until 9 a.m. tomorrow morning. Thanks for playing everyone.by Jessica Steck/WESH.com at 5:02 PM
..........................................................
Baez calls for mistrial because of superimposed video with duct tape calls highly prejudicial and speculative #CaseyAnthonyby cfnews13casey via twitter at 5:03 PM
...............................
Baez arguing for a mistrial because of the "2 minute video of this beautiful child with her skull in the background meant to inflame the jury"by koestreich via mobile at 5:05 PM
....................................
No reaction from #CaseyAnthony on discussion of this video state says it was fair and necessaryby cfnews13casey via twitter at 5:06 PM
......................................
Judge Perry denies motion for mistrial see my behind the camera coverage on News 13 thanks Dave D'Marko #CaseyAnthonyby cfnews13casey via twitter at 5:08 PM
 
We thought the SAO was going to argue Caylee died from chloroform. Crap...now what do we do? We spent all our time planning to discredit Vass and now you tell us we guessed wrong?

So the duct tape didn't hold the mandible in place but instead it was the significant root growth?Crap....did we just support SIGNIFICANT root growth? Take it back take it back.

Dr. G. you couldn't rule out a drowning?
Crap...she just said in 100% of drowning cases she has seen there was a 911 call. Can we say KC lost the # to 911? It was in her other phone?

Hair is on top of the head so how do you explain the mat being posterior? Crap we didn't expect him to say skin slippage.
 
The way JB is delivering hisself to the witnesses, I wonder if he is actually practicing his speeches he will give after the trial is over. I picture him feveriously drafting two versions. One if he wins, the second if she is found guilty. He is so full of hisself, he is working overtime on the first one which in turn, will get him the second one.
 
I've been taking screen shots and notes all day to show Casey's reaction to what is said. Takes a while to put it all together though. Here's from this morning.
ForensicAnthropologiststestimony2a-1.jpg
 
What a great day for justice! Keep on rolling, SA. :great:

It's been an amazing day hasn't it? I mean, I've believed for three years that the SA had a rock solid case to present, but their evidence just knocked me between the eyes today and wow! Amazing amazing day!!

I am almost overwhelmed with ...gratitude? Relief? Awe??? Can't describe it.
 
I have to say that if ICA truly is afflicted with a cluster b personality disorder (or several) I do not believe she would think herself a poor mother or project those feelings in an alter ego.

Instead, imo, it would be more likely that she believed herself to be an awesome parent and it was everyone else's fault who could not/would not acknowledge that. I believe ICA used the 'bad mother to Caylee' ruse to garner sympathy of those that loved her and feed her ego. JMHO

I totally agree. she only talked of being labeled as such when trying to garner sympathy. Twice from Brother Lee. Hinted at it with LE...
I'm guessing more along the lines of a cluster F disorder.
 
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