2012.05.17 Doc Dump Thread

[TorisMom003]

I would sure like to walk around that area looking for something shaped like that mark on Zimmerman's head.

Per the SFD report that was in the doc dump the EMT that looked at Zimmerman wrote the following in the narrative part.~

"Pt #1 - Pt has abrasions to his forehead, and bleeding/tenderness to his nose, and a small laceration to the back of his head. All injuries have minor bleeding."

Now, is that really another laceration to the back of Zimmerman's head in that photo or is it simply dried blood that formed a blood clot that is on the skin? Wouldn't the EMT have listed laceration in the plural if there was more than one?

MOO

 

[tehcloser]

I would sure like to walk around that area looking for something shaped like that mark on Zimmerman's head.

Sure looks like an outline of something.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Sure looks like an outline of something.

It is a mystery.

 

[Lovelymountains]

I'm not directing this at you precisely, only that yours was the first post I saw regarding the MJ = crime story after a little google to back up what I am about to say...

I'm not trying to ruin any gardener's lives here so I'll just say to click here if you dont have poppies in your garden or want to think a little about arbitrary drug laws specifically in the united states.


if my garden was transported along with my dear little self to any US state, I would be committing felonies left right and center simply because of my knowledge of horticulture and my desire to have huge, glorious black flowers in some of my planters.

I've never heard of Papaver Somniferum being black. They can be deep purple and actually white, violet, red, almost any color. However, I don't think TM has been accused of using opium---yet.

 

[Lovelymountains]

Your statement makes every part of what occurred seem very compartmentalized, however, I don't think people live their lives in such compartmentalized ways.

*As* someone involved in something of an 'official' capacity within his neighborhood, GZ had an experience bank. This bank included intimate knowledge of the sidewalks and streets and the layout of the apartments. It included knowledge of LE's typical response time. It included an awareness of the time of day burglaries had been occurring and general descriptions of who committed them. He probably knew where there were cracks in the sidewalk and exactly how the 'step' felt when you stepped up a curb. It was *home* to him, this neighborhood where he walked his dog each night, and he was likely as comfortable walking those streets as any of us are walking down our own hallways from our bedrooms to our kitchens.

It has been stated that their neighborhood watch program was not an *official* one. I could be incorrect, but my understanding is that the residents had just banded together and decided they needed some sort of a watch system, and GZ was either suggested as a leader or he volunteered as a leader. It looks like the neighborhood association purchased signs and cameras, but it doesn't sound like they became officially-trained members of the nationally-recognized "Neighborhood Watch" group that would have gone through training with the police department.

It looks like the PD *does* have a system in place for neighborhood watch training, but if this neighborhood had not formed that level of an alliance with the PD, I do not believe GZ can be held accountable to those standards of procedure.

Regardless... if he was on his way to Target - a legal act - and carrying a gun for which he had a permit - a legal act - and just so happened to see somebody acting suspicious, I would not expect him to go through a checklist so he could go 'on duty' as a watchman before engaging in visual surveillance of his own neighborhood.

He's *not* a paid police officer or anything of the sort. He's just a guy.

"Visual surveillance" does not begin to describe what GZ did.

 

[m00c0w]

Sure looks like an outline of something.

I would sure like to walk around that area looking for something shaped like that mark on Zimmerman's head.

You mean like the objects strewn along the ground I've continuously pointed out as having the same right-angled shape as the contusion I've said existed all along on the back of his head?

It is a mystery.

Not if you exercise critical thinking skills.

 

[LambChop]

It is a mystery.

It looks like a bruise above and to the side of the cut at the top of the picture. It looks almost like the handle of something.....a flashlight handle, maybe? jmo

 

[Lovelymountains]

Not to mention, he'd already "gotten away" once, and missed another chance while GZ was on the ground yelling for help. You don't yell for help when you are detaining someone, imagine it, lmao.

There is no proof that it was GZ yelling for help. Many believe it was TM. TM's mother says it was he. GZ's father says it was his son. IMO The best evidence is the yelling stopped when TM was shot. GZ did not know TM was dead, so he said, and jumped on him to detain him. If it were GZ yelling he still needed help. In fact, I think GZ should be charged with false imprisonment, too.

 

[tehcloser]

You mean like the objects strewn along the ground I've continuously pointed out as having the same right-angled shape as the contusion I've said existed all along on the back of his head?

View attachment 22323


Not if you exercise critical thinking skills.

How can you get close enough to see what's in that pic? The line I see on GZ's head is pretty clear.....unless we have close up photos of what that arrow is pointing at...I can't see anything to compare.

 

[cityslick]

Quite true. And TM was not breaking the law when he was walking down the sidewalk.

Correct, so then we come to the actual confrontation. Who confronted who? Who attacked who?

 

[m00c0w]

How can you get close enough to see what's in that pic? The line I see on GZ's head is pretty clear.....unless we have close up photos of what that arrow is pointing at...I can't see anything to compare.

Sigh.

 

[cityslick]

No, but all we know is "Maybe" it was broken. Doesn't look broken to me. Hardly scratched.

No it was likely broken. Let's not change the wording on the doc report now.

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

~Snipped by me

The facts may be...that tragically, TM is dead within an hour because GZ decided to use his GUN to deal with a problem rather than his intelligence. Trayvon had no ESP to discern what GZ's intentions were...

I don't know many people who teach their kids to walk up to STRANGERS and say "HI, here is where i'm staying..." As parent's we teach our kids starting as early as Pre-school about "stranger-danger"! We drill it into their heads DO NOT talk to strangers! We tell them run-scream-fight back - do what you have to do to get away or be heard!

What is SAD is children having to grow up in a society fearing being abducted and/or abused. But that is reality...

Why is it Trayvon at 17 years-old should be held to a higher standard than an adult- GZ? IMAGINE... if GZ had been taught how to appropriately approach a situation...instead of rudeness, sense of entitlement?
Oh wait...he was taught in the Neighborhood Watch training class.

~JMHO

BBM--How do we know if George Zimmermn identified himself when he met up with Treyvon Martin?? Has he stated that somewhere and could you point me in the direction of finding that statement? Thanks

....anf frankly I don't think anyone of us here knows if they would use their "intelligence"to deal with this kind of situation, Furthermore who is to say our "intellect" would not tell us to use the Gun--cause talkin wasn't going to do a thing?.

It is so easy to say "IF" George Zimmermann did not get out of his car --none of this would of happened....but then I guess if Treyvon Martin had taken a different way home "none of this would have happened. What's done is done, George Zimmermann shot and killed Treyvon Martin that is the ONLY action we look at. Who started it does not matter--at least that is the way I see it. I may be wrong maybe you can prove guilt or innocent by WHO started it--but then we were not there, so how would that work.JMO

 

[tehcloser]

Sigh.

I still see nothing that looks like the "lazy s" for lack of a better description.

 

[cityslick]

There is no proof that it was GZ yelling for help. Many believe it was TM. TM's mother says it was he. GZ's father says it was his son. IMO The best evidence is the yelling stopped when TM was shot. GZ did not know TM was dead, so he said, and jumped on him to detain him. If it were GZ yelling he still needed help. In fact, I think GZ should be charged with false imprisonment, too.

BBM

Where are you getting that from? That GZ didn't know TM was dead after he shot him?

 

[m00c0w]

I still see nothing that looks like the "lazy s" for lack of a better description.

Huh?

I just see a right-angled mark on the top of his head. What "S"?

 

[tehcloser]

Huh?

I just see a right-angled mark on the top of his head. What "S"?

lol........hey I said "for lack of a better description"...I think the mark goes further than just the right angle.

ETA: more like a question mark without the period than a lazy s...lol.

 

[Lovelymountains]

GZ was in his car. How did he get from his car to where TM was? GZ lived on the other side of the community. Those condos are not his property. He was not on "public property". He had no authority to follow anyone whether it's legal or not. No one gave him the authority to follow someone within the community within the common areas. No one. His only responsibility involved calling it in. He had no business following a visitor who was staying in a condo within the community. He called LE.....he was done. jmo

Also, the law often takes into account, "Intent." What was GZ's intent when he followed TM? I believe it was to detain him--certainly an illegal act--false imprisonment. So GZ killed TM during his commission of an illegal act. He was not going to allow another "*advertiser censored**h**to get away. Not this time. Not while he had his trusty little revolver loaded with hollow-point bullets. IMO, of course. The more I think about it the more I'm convinced of GZ's "Depravity."

 

[diesel]

Stmarysmead, can't quote your post as it takes up the whole box on my iPad and can't scroll down to the bottom either. No there is no law that GZ should have stayed in his car but there is common sense. I don't know that Trayvon was 'darting' between buildings and Trayvon was on his way home or to where he was staying. GZ's injuries tell me Trayvon was a scared kid trying to get away from a potential abduction. GZ should have identidied himself. There was plenty of opportunity. I want to hear where GZ identified himself to Trayvon but so far haven't.

 

[Skully]

BBM--How do we know if George Zimmermn identified himself when he met up with Treyvon Martin?? Has he stated that somewhere and could you point me in the direction of finding that statement? Thanks

....anf frankly I don't think anyone of us here knows if they would use their "intelligence"to deal with this kind of situation, Furthermore who is to say our "intellect" would not tell us to use the Gun--cause talkin wasn't going to do a thing?.

It is so easy to say "IF" George Zimmermann did not get out of his car --none of this would of happened....but then I guess if Treyvon Martin had taken a different way home "none of this would have happened. What's done is done, George Zimmermann shot and killed Treyvon Martin that is the ONLY action we look at. Who started it does not matter--at least that is the way I see it. I may be wrong maybe you can prove guilt or innocent by WHO started it--but then we were not there, so how would that work.JMO

BBM

It does matter, all of it, and I do understand your post. I am not criticizing it. I have posted that myself; HE SHOULD HAVE STAYED IN THE CAR AND WAITED UNTIL LE ARRIVED. I believe this with all my heart, that once he called 911 to report a suspicious person, and knew LE would be there, he was done. End of story. GZ put himself in a position that ended in the death of a child. He had no authority to question, or make an arrest, he was not LE. When you carry a gun, you have to think of the consequences of your actions and how they can put you in a situation that will require you to use that gun. JMO