4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 74

[Dotta]

The defense team is also trying to persuade their case. They can use descriptive language.

You know, it reminds me of the saying:

"BETTER is the enemy of GOOD"

If you know what I mean

JMO

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

JMO MOO
He was 'stupid enough.' Make that evil. LovingIdaho4. We seek justice, because the victim's can not. WOJ

Hmmm dunno. If he'd been stupid enough to leave the sheath that he'd actually used it would have had far more traces on it, wouldn't it? IMO JMO

 

[Dotta]

But where did he go immediately after to clean up?

Didn't he "get lost" for some time (phone turned off) while going to his apartment?

Or did he go straight home?
I don't remember.

JMO

 

[Sleuth2010]

The defense team is also trying to persuade their case. They can use descriptive language.

DOTTA said (TY)
You know, it reminds me of saying:
"BETTER is the enemy of GOOD"
If you know what I mean

------------------

First recorded as an Italian proverb in 1603, this aphorism has been discussed by many thinkers including Voltaire and Shakespeare. There is general agreement that the meaning of the proverb is that:

"always striving for something better keeps us from appreciating the good we already have."

 

[mooseandcoffee]

DOTTA said (TY)
You know, it reminds me of saying:
"BETTER is the enemy of GOOD"
If you know what I mean

------------------

First recorded as an Italian proverb in 1603, this aphorism has been discussed by many thinkers including Voltaire and Shakespeare. There is general agreement that the meaning of the proverb is that:

"always striving for something better keeps us from appreciating the good we already have."

I don't get what you mean. .

 

[Dotta]

I don't get what you mean. .

GOOD response to Press would be normal legal language.

BETTER (in their view) was a response using tabloid expression.

JMO

 

[ktm44]

Yeah, that's why I'm wondering how easy it is to walk with one of those things looped. IMO, the length of the knife sounds like it would restrict movement, especially the type of movement the perp probably had to make to kill four people.

It doesn’t really restrict movement, if worn correctly and once the knife is out of the sheath, the bulk is greatly reduced.

I don’t wear mine because I’m about 5’2” and much of my time is spent on a horse and working cattle in the bush. I found it cumbersome in the beginning and simply never bothered taking the time to get used to it.

 

[ktm44]

I'm not sure DM will testify. But if she does, I'm not at all sure she can identify BK. We've speculated that she was shocked to see anyone who didn't live there at that hour much less someone in the dark in a mask. But even if she says she's now sure it was BK, 1) that may not come across as believable and 2) that's still not direct evidence he committed murder anyway. She didn't witness him killing anyone. So she's not an eyewitness to murder. People may think the only reason he was there was to kill but that still means an inference has to be made. Same with presence of DNA on the sheath. DNA is indirect evidence like fingerprint evidence or shoe print evidence. Placing someone at the scene isn't direct evidence of murder although conviction is certainly possible based on only indirect evidence. And I've personally not seen any direct evidence discussed in this case.
JMO

I don’t believe her testimony would be to identify BK but will help establish the time the murders occurred. Then PCA mentions he statement being backed by phone records.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Respectfully, they have a lot of circumstantial evidence against him as well. With the DNA, the videos, the stalking, etc., if he can't come up with a pretty strong explanation for how the sheath got there without him having left that sheath there during the attack, I think he's toast.

I guess he could say he visits the local hunting and fishing store now and then and had maybe once handled the different types of knife on sale? Or that someone he once met showed him a knife they had purchased.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Didn't he "get lost" for some time (phone turned off) while going to his apartment?

Or did he go straight home?
I don't remember.

JMO

Dunno... have we even been presented with any theories or evidence and timeline?

 

[jepop]

Dunno... have we even been presented with any theories or evidence and timeline?

There's some time-line for pre and post murders based on historical phone ping records and video surveilance footage of the white elantra (suspect vehicle) in the PCA.

pp c5-8 Reconstruction of movement of white elantra from early morning to afternoon of 13 November 2022 based on detailed expert analysis of video surveilance footage of white elantra.
pp c13-15 BK phone ping records for 24 hours surrounding approximate time of crime.

122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf | PDF Host

PDF Host read free online - 122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf

pdfhost.io

 

[mooseandcoffee]

GOOD response to Press would be normal legal language.

BETTER (in their view) was a response using tabloid expression.

JMO

from the article you posted:

Taylor's office is tasked with defending Kohberger against four charges of first-degree murder, for which he could face the death penalty if convicted. He also faces a felony burglary count.

"The judge is doing the cautious thing and siding with the defense to avoid an appellate issue," Rahmani said. "As a defense attorney in a capital case, Taylor is trying to not only defend her client at trial, but also to create issues that may get a conviction or death sentence overturned on appeal."

 

[Nova]

I have one really important question. Was BK framing someone?

BK being the type of personality he was (as we have gleaned a fair bit over time) - why would he have taken the sheath for the knife into the house in the first place? If it wasn't affixed to his clothing via a belt / loop / cable tie etc. We know he barely left a trace in the house never mind only a single speck on the sheath itself. He must have handled the sheath incredibly carefully that it didn't have a jot of his DNA bar a tiny speck in the fastener, I mean that in itself is almost impossible.

So effectively, IMO, he didn't go in the house and take that knife out of the sheath to use it. The knife he used must have already either been out of that sheath -or- maybe was never in it and he used a knife that had it's own sheath.

He *must have* carefully deposited the 'discarded' sheath in a location he'd thought about either before or after all what he did, meantime having kept it in a sealed ziplock type bag so as it didn't pick up even a scrap of DNA or fibre, like he wasn't even breathing near that sheath.

Where was the sheath found again? It's placing must be significant. It's placing may have also been 'ceremonial' ie marking the end of his action - or - the 'commencing' of his action. I would argue the end because having kept it free from contact with the outside world in all the time he had it, he wouldn't be so stupid as to place it before he commenced his gruesome plan.

JMO MOO

With respect, I think you are turning BK into a super-villain. I think one keeps a knife that large in its sheath so nobody sees you with it in the street and so you don't accidentally cut yourself while swinging your arms when you walk.

I'm not a big knife person, but I think walking around with such a big knife loose in your hand would be like walking while holding a loaded gun with the safety off: just asking for trouble.

IIRC, the sheath was said to have been found "next" to Maddy's body. I don't recall the source and I don't remember that the report said the sheath was on the bed, a nightstand, or the floor.

Since we don't know in what order M and K were attacked, there's no way to know for sure. But Occam's Razor argues, I would guess, that the intruder took the knife out its sheath just before he began to use it.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

BBM: I've never seen that verified by any LE source or in any documents released by LE and the courts (including the PCA which says something very different in regards to how BK's car was located). See PCA (link in media thread) for details of how BK's car was identofied initially. It sounds like media speculation. MOO

I know the car was identified differently, I said the DNA correlated to the car registration. In other words, the familial DNA if searched through genealogy could have pinged a 2nd cousin for example, then tracing to great-grandparents could have possibly shown the Kohberger name, the name on genealogy PLUS the separate identification of the car being registered to a “Kohberger”, would IMO show a pretty strong correlation.
Anyway, as you say it has not been confirmed by LE yet, but from my own experience of genealogy and education in biotechnology I would guess IMO that this is how it was done with the evidence they had at the time.
JMO

 

[Boxer]

Hmmm dunno. If he'd been stupid enough to leave the sheath that he'd actually used it would have had far more traces on it, wouldn't it? IMO JMO

MOO I would say he thought he cleaned it like all his gear, but the snap area grabbed a bit of TDNA and retained it.

 

[schooling]

With respect, I think you are turning BK into a super-villain. I think one keeps a knife that large in its sheath so nobody sees you with it in the street and so you don't accidentally cut yourself while swinging your arms when you walk.

I'm not a big knife person, but I think walking around with such a big knife loose in your hand would be like walking while holding a loaded gun with the safety off: just asking for trouble.

IIRC, the sheath was said to have been found "next" to Maddy's body. I don't recall the source and I don't remember that the report said the sheath was on the bed, a nightstand, or the floor.

Since we don't know in what order M and K were attacked, there's no way to know for sure. But Occam's Razor argues, I would guess, that the intruder took the knife out its sheath just before he began to use it.

I think there are quite a few theories that start delving into Hollywood style movie plots. Dateline and other TV shows haven't done us any favors either. In an effort to get their own unique take on a crime they often take quickly dismissed suspects and implausible theories and stretch them out into 50 minute episodes. So every murder has the intrigue and suspense of a crime novel.

Sometimes it just is what it is.

He was a Criminology PhD student at a decent public University so he MUST be a criminal mastermind? No, of course not. Intelligence has very little to do with competence in committing a crime. The more planning you do the longer a trail evidence you leave behind. Irony, the inherent kind.

Harvard Lawyers, MBAs, PhDs etc. with 'perfect' personal lives do stupid things all of the time and get caught. BK's personal life was far from perfect (could even be characterized as 'crumbling') and he was not Harvard material.

Let's stop giving this psychopath unwarranted credit.

MOO

 

[Gemmie]

Do you think he was planning to never return to Idaho?

Snipped for focus.

It's of my opinion that he was planning to go back. The fact that he returned the next morning to (IMO) see what was going on (figuring LE had to be there by that time) tells me that he'd most definitely go back to Idaho, Moscow specifically. I'm thinking to frequently eat at the Mad Greek, attend any vigils for the victims, hang out at whatever the university has planned for the murder site to "feel close to what he did and overhear others conversations on the topic", and potentially start stalking the 2 survivors, but only to watch them, maybe get close enough to say something, even if just a Hi in passing (what a rush that would be for him IMO), but not to kill them.

Simply to observe and to be close to anyone and anything regarding his 'work'. Same for the MG, vigils, and whatever the university turns the site into. It would all be in order to watch others in regards to the the victims. It's kinda like how he'd engage his neighbor in chit chat about the murder (wanted to talk about it, learn others opinions and thoughts on the matter.) MOO

One other comment about my views above on him planning to go back, and why I think he'd do that... that makes me think he'd be the sort to take a souvenir. I wonder if he did.

"He brought it up in conversation," the neighbor exclusively told CBS News on Wednesday. "[He] asked if I had heard about the murders, which I did. And then he said, 'Yeah, seems like they have no leads. Seems like it was a crime of passion.'"

Neighbor of Bryan Kohberger says suspect talked about Idaho student murders

"'Yeah, seems like they have no leads. Seems like it was a crime of passion,'" the neighbor said Kohberger said.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

I guess he could say he visits the local hunting and fishing store now and then and had maybe once handled the different types of knife on sale? Or that someone he once met showed him a knife they had purchased.

He would have to testify to make those claims. His DNA is on or under the snap of the knife sheath so it's not relevant that he handled some knife at some other time.
I think it's most likely he cleaned the sheath and knife and only handled them with gloves on before/during/after the murders. The lab may have removed the snap and got DNA from skin cells pushed under the edges or underneath the snap where they were protected from cleaning. MOO

 

[Gemmie]

Slightly sideways and a 'me-rail' but I once dropped a tin of gloss paint all down myself just outside my house. It bounced, the lid flew off, I was covered head to foot in bright blue oil based paint. I couldn't go inside my home because that would have destroyed the carpet, walls, door. Ideally I needed to strip off but couldn't as public outdoors. So, I had to think what to do. I went (dripping) to the shop next door and yelled out for them to please give me some heavy duty garbage bags and some selotape. I was able to seal my whole self head to toe in bin liners, sealing the paint inside, to get into my apartment. Once inside I sat in the bath to peel my clothes and the bin liners off me and I honestly didn't get a speck of paint on anything except the bath tub.

So what I'm saying is, three or four bin liners, or pull on some waterproof rain pants and anorack (is that a word?) would have kept the car relatively free of mess.

But where did he go immediately after to clean up?

His bathtub.

 

[Gemmie]

IIRC, the sheath was said to have been found "next" to Maddy's body. I don't recall the source and I don't remember that the report said the sheath was on the bed, a nightstand, or the floor.

Since we don't know in what order M and K were attacked, there's no way to know for sure. But Occam's Razor argues, I would guess, that the intruder took the knife out its sheath just before he began to use it.

Snipped for focus.

It was in the PCA that the sheath was laying on the bed next to Maddie. It's my opinion (for that reason, and reasons other than the sheath was nearest to her) that she was not only the only one BK intended to kill, but that she was first since Kaylee was sleeping in the same bed and he felt she had to go too.

All MOO