4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #83

[10ofRods]

Thank you @10ofRods RE: direct quote from LaBar about BK going to be exonerated.
At 1m 30sec BK's PA public defender LaBar in live-on-camera TODAY interview said:

"He believes he's going to be exonerated. That's what he believes. Those were his words."

IDK if PD LaBar would go on camera saying BK said it if not true; possibly.

https://www.today.com/video/bryan-kohberger-believes-he-ll-be-exonerated-public-defender-says-159178821680

Odd that this attorney feels okay breaking attorney-client privilege, isn't it? Everything a client says to an attorney is confidential.

I don't trust PD LaBar, as a result. And it's interesting that it's only after there was a bit of publicity for him having said it in the first place, that he doubles down and goes on the Today show. If LaBar did decide to transmit Kohberger's actual words to the world, he should be brought up on ethical charges.

I note that the word "eager" has now dropped out of the utterance. Having a very hard time believing this little corner of this story.

IMO>

 

[Twistinginthewind]

True, but him letting his brother know enough to be able turn him in was a slip up, IMO.

Mentioning this because, to connect the dots back to the topic of BK, I think he either didn't realize or care whether his behavior was off enough for his family members to take notice when he was home for the holidays, and IIRC his sister(s) were concerned enough to search his car.

JMO

 

[schooling]

Hmmmm...total speculation here - wonder if he was trying to set up the DD Driver? A few things align with that theory...like: did he know someone in the house ordered DD. This may explain why he drove past the house multiple times. Also, Since BF's room was downstairs, adjacent to where the DD was delivered, maybe that was why the defense wants to interview her.

Not sure how much detail about the DD driver investigation was part of the records handed over to the defense. Does anyone know how much would be in discovery about the DD delivery, like timing, interview, etc.?

IMO the DoorDash driver and the interview(s) he participated in where likely amongst the first batch of evidence the prosecution turned over to the defense.

If there was anything there that was exculpatory we likely would have seen hearing requests.

IMO the DoorDash timing is 100% coincidental. The birthday paradox forever changed the way I looked at probability.

 

[schooling]

Mentioning this because, to connect the dots back to the topic of BK, I think he either didn't realize or care whether his behavior was off enough for his family members to take notice when he was home for the holidays, and IIRC his sister(s) were concerned enough to search his car.

JMO

The two stops in Indiana (as benign as we now 'know' that they were) likely scared the *advertiser censored* out of him. Convincing him to thoroughly clean his car, (again?), even though he likely got a mini cleaning with his service upon arrival back in PA. I wonder what his family thought about that.

Also, it seems like using gloves to sort through trash in the kitchen was likely to avoid (further?) scrutiny from his family. I'm not OCD and I've never lived with anyone who is OCD. But I do know 2 people and they are unabashed users of gloves, towels, napkins and anything else they need to come into contact with surfaces. But that's just my personal experience and observations, obviously.

MOO

 

[Ursamajr]

The two stops in Indiana (as benign as we now 'know' that they were) likely scared the *advertiser censored* out of him. Convincing him to thoroughly clean his car, (again?), even though he likely got a mini cleaning with his service upon arrival back in PA. I wonder what his family thought about that.

Also, it seems like using gloves to sort through trash in the kitchen was likely to avoid (further?) scrutiny from his family. I'm not OCD and I've never lived with anyone who is OCD. But I do know 2 people and they are unabashed users of gloves, towels, napkins and anything else they need to come into contact with surfaces. But that's just my personal experience and observations, obviously.

MOO

I wonder if he will claim the trash sorting is normal behavior. He kind of has to, right? It puts his family in an awkward position if its not and any of them are called to the stand.

 

[Rumination1]

Hmmmm...total speculation here - wonder if he was trying to set up the DD Driver? A few things align with that theory...like: did he know someone in the house ordered DD. This may explain why he drove past the house multiple times. Also, Since BF's room was downstairs, adjacent to where the DD was delivered, maybe that was why the defense wants to interview her.

Not sure how much detail about the DD driver investigation was part of the records handed over to the defense. Does anyone know how much would be in discovery about the DD delivery, like timing, interview,

 

[Rumination1]

This is really well reasoned.

May I go one step further? I don't think this was a pre-planned mass murder: I am convinced it was a pre-planned single murder. And had it been a single murder, it may have followed in his (studied in crime) mind that it would be investigated but surely not with the vigor of a mass murder. Many murderers make this miscalculation. They underestimate the effort LE and families and the media will go to discover the truth and exact justice.

I will go on record (in the record of my mind) to say that this was a case of intimate partner homicide, the only difference is that one party was entirely unaware of the "partnership", a partnership that existed only in the fantasy world of the other.

I don't know why he brought his phone to Moscow or why he disabled it in some fashion where he did (if it was to create the illusion of an alibi, why not turn it off and leave it at a likely running path and pick it back up there after a fake run, buying time off the grid?) but I do think he felt invisible and invincible. I think he had decades to master stealth. I think he found his white sedan to be as generic as could be, beyond notice.

Hotbed of a college town, crime of passion, LE would be busy looking at every jilted collegiate jock...

IMO that's why he didn't plan better. He didn't think he'd ever be found out. Virtually no connection to the victim.

Virtually. Oh, the irony. Digital trails become runway lights for investigators.

So does leaving DNA behind. The sheath might have been his calling card too, as it appears he wiped it nearly free of DNA. Let LE go down some military wormhole.

Forgive me for venturing into the mind of someone like this, but I think the (ill) logic might have gone something like this: I see her. I find out where she lives. I stalk her. Silently. She has no idea how close I've gotten or even what I may have klepted of hers. She's exactly the kind of girl who thinks she's too good for me. But I can get any girl I want. I'll show her. As well, I'll make her pay. I'll make her pay for all girls. I'll make her pay for all guys too, the idiots who get girls like this.

If he had one target, was in and out in under a minute, hadn't left that whiff of DNA, we might've seen a very different investigative approach, one that may have left him well outside the scope of it for a very, very long time. Long enough that IMO he might've felt slighted by another woman, imagined or otherwise, and somewhere near that campus or another, another headline...

JMO

I have had numerous thoughts about this case ….
At first I was thinking the Ex soldier who was shot by police had done it but in such a way as to leave red herrings which led then to a different subject ( Bk )
Then I thought coukd it have been BK with another as the image of killing 4 noiselessly couldn’t process in my mind

Then I thought no it was him but he made a mistake leaving behind the DNA and he just considered himself too clever to have left evidence against himself ie car hard to identify , phone off , excuses ready
However the recent refusal to be interviewed or state an alibi sing out to me of a person who did it, wanted to be caught , but want to play with the legal loopholes to figure a way to get out of it as proof of his intellect and understanding of law . With no regard to the 4 lives taken.

The other option is he was set up by an equally clever mastermind who took his knife sheath, his car , his phone not to mention had knowledge of his strange trash habits and sample of his dna and set this up to frame BK whilst committing atrocities

All too convoluted and conniving plans but at the end of the day I fall towards he did it and this needs speedy resolution
These legal wrangling s and stays etc must be hell for the families

 

[Auntie Cipation]

It wouldn't surprise me if it was a piece of TP stuck on his shoe.

As for would he have the same shoes 4-5 yrs later? Possibly, unless he wore them every single day. I have a lot of shoes way older than 5 yrs. They aren't worn a lot so will last a long time.

IMO serious runners are advised* to replace their running shoes every 400 miles or so.

BK was what I would call a serious runner in terms of his reported mileage, though who knows if he replaced his running shoes that often or not. Running 25 miles a week would mean covering 400 miles in roughly four months, so three pairs per year. That gets expensive.

* I don't know if it's doctors/fitness experts who recommend the 400 mile maximum or if it's what the shoe companies, with their obvious interest in sales, recommend.

If the shoes pictured were work shoes and not his runners, then disregard.

MOO

 

[gitana1]

It's so nice to see you, posting here @gitana1 ! Thanks for weighing in.

Thanks!!

 

[gitana1]

I think he did it. I personally am not comfortable co-signing, for lack of a better term, declarative statements at this stage, MOO. The rest of the post really resonated with me.

Ah. Got it. Makes sense.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

Thanks!!

Thanks to you too, @gitana1!

 

[SLouTh]

Mentioning this because, to connect the dots back to the topic of BK, I think he either didn't realize or care whether his behavior was off enough for his family members to take notice when he was home for the holidays, and IIRC his sister(s) were concerned enough to search his car.

JMO

BBM

Do we have evidence of BK’s actual sister/s saying this on audio or video? Or was this information released via an “un-named source”????

I can imagine his sister/s going to look in his car for something, or to retrieve something from his car, could easily be misconstrued by a casual observer as “searching his car” …. IMO

The media can so often misconstrue information to make a headline …. IMO

I just can’t recall an an interview with his sister/s … but happy to be corrected if there is a link….. or if there is a description of how they actually “searched” his car….

Sorry I am just very sceptical of media sensationalism ….

JMO

 

[Twistinginthewind]

BBM

Do we have evidence of BK’s actual sister/s saying this on audio or video? Or was this information released via an “un-named source”????

I can imagine his sister/s going to look in his car for something, or to retrieve something from his car, could easily be misconstrued by a casual observer as “searching his car” …. IMO

The media can so often misconstrue information to make a headline …. IMO

I just can’t recall an an interview with his sister/s … but happy to be corrected if there is a link….. or if there is a description of how they actually “searched” his car….

Sorry I am just very sceptical of media sensationalism ….

JMO

Just mentioned it as I read about it in MSM, that one of BK's sisters may have had concerns. Looks like an unnamed source, so of course, take it with grains of salt, and MOO:

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

 

[gitana1]

I believe you misunderstood my point. I explained it up thread.

I might have. I was responding to the thought you noted that if he was involved in a lesser crime, it could be motive to hold back an alibi. That doesn’t make sense to me.

I added #s for ease of discussion...


The only item on the above list that is concrete is BK's DNA on the knife sheath. While it is implausible that his DNA got there other way than by his handling of the sheath and subsequently leaving it, It is not impossible that the sheath was left by someone else or by BK at some other time.

THE CAR: There is nothing in the videos that uniquely identify the car as belonging to BK (LP #, BK seen inside the car driving by the house, etc.). The car driving toward the scene may be BK's but that does not mean that the car seen in #2 is the same car (the reverse is also true). Again, not likely but not definitively "his car."

THE PHONE The phone appears to have been on the move for a short period of time before the crimes happened and a short time after they happened. Yet, the phone is not known to be in the car that is at the crime scene...what did someone say earlier--a negative is not proof or something like that?

THE "EYE WITNESS" Was not an eye witness to the murders. What the witness did see was a man she did not say she knew, whose face was partially covered. His body and the part of his face that she did see "did not exclude BK", nor do they exclude a lot of other men.

My sense of justice for victims, defendants, and potential victims due to a wrongful conviction or pitiful prosecution demands that I don't declare someone guilty, online or otherwise without knowing more than what I can poke holes through. OR maybe part of me enjoys playing devil's advocate.

it should go without saying at this point, but all of the above is based on what we are privy to at this moment.

Oh, in my opinion, based on decades researching true crime, and as a lawyer in general, the evidence is incredible.

The investigators did an impeccable job and built an exceedingly strong case. To recap:

1. A white sedan was captured on security footage leaving the area of WSU, on their security cameras, the morning of the murders.
2. What looked to be the same white sedan was captured crossing state lines from WA to ID right before 3:00 a.m.
3. A white sedan was captured on security cameras traveling towards the victims’ residence the morning of the murders, at 3:30 am.
4. The same car appeared to pass by the house several times thereafter.
5. The same car departed the area of the house at a high rate of speed, at 4:20 am.
6. A white sedan, appearing to be the same car in all the footage, crossed back over state lines into WA at 5:30 am.
7. BK was a student at WSU at the time.
8. BK drove a white Elantra that matched the vehicles seen in the footage.
9. BK was put on the radar after a search of all white sedans registered to students at WSU, due to tracing the footage of the sedan, from and to WSU. Not because BK is some weird guy. The evidence led to him.
10. BK’s cell phone records were thereafter searched and showed that on the morning of the murders, his phone pinged leaving his residence in Pullman, WA, at 2:47 am.
11. Those same records thereafter did not ping for the next two hours, as if it was turned off.
12. Then, at 4:48 am, his phone pings south of Moscow, ID, just into WA.
13. The pings match almost perfectly with the security footage of the white sedan, which is the car BK drives.
14. His cell then pinged again, at around 9:00 am, at the crime scene, prior to the time police were called. So back in Moscow.
15. Phone records showed BK’s phone was also at the crime scene 12 times in the early morning or late at night, prior to the murders. And yet there is zero evidence that the victims knew BK or had any dealings with him of any kind.
16. DNA from his family’s trash in PA showed that the genetic material belonged to the father of the person whose DNA was found on a knife sheath at the scene of the crime.
17. The knife sheath found at the scene matches the type of weapon used to stab the victims.

This is incredible evidence. Phenomenal.

 

[MassGuy]

I might have. I was responding to the thought you noted that if he was involved in a lesser crime, it could be motive to hold back an alibi. That doesn’t make sense to me.


Oh, in my opinion, based on decades researching true crime, and as a lawyer in general, the evidence is incredible.

The investigators did an impeccable job and built an exceedingly strong case. To recap:

1. A white sedan was captured on security footage leaving the area of WSU, on their security cameras, the morning of the murders.
2. What looked to be the same white sedan was captured crossing state lines from WA to ID right before 3:00 a.m.
3. A white sedan was captured on security cameras traveling towards the victims’ residence the morning of the murders, at 3:30 am.
4. The same car appeared to pass by the house several times thereafter.
5. The same car departed the area of the house at a high rate of speed, at 4:20 am.
6. A white sedan, appearing to be the same car in all the footage, crossed back over state lines into WA at 5:30 am.
7. BK was a student at WSU at the time.
8. BK drove a white Elantra that matched the vehicles seen in the footage.
9. BK was put on the radar after a search of all white sedans registered to students at WSU, due to tracing the footage of the sedan, from and to WSU. Not because BK is some weird guy. The evidence led to him.
10. BK’s cell phone records were thereafter searched and showed that on the morning of the murders, his phone pinged leaving his residence in Pullman, WA, at 2:47 am.
11. Those same records thereafter did not ping for the next two hours, as if it was turned off.
12. Then, at 4:48 am, his phone pings south of Moscow, ID, just into WA.
13. The pings match almost perfectly with the security footage of the white sedan, which is the car BK drives.
14. His cell then pinged again, at around 9:00 am, at the crime scene, prior to the time police were called. So back in Moscow.
15. Phone records showed BK’s phone was also at the crime scene 12 times in the early morning or late at night, prior to the murders. And yet there is zero evidence that the victims knew BK or had any dealings with him of any kind.
16. DNA from his family’s trash in PA showed that the genetic material belonged to the father of the person whose DNA was found on a knife sheath at the scene of the crime.
17. The knife sheath found at the scene matches the type of weapon used to stab the victims.

This is incredible evidence. Phenomenal.

<modsnip - circumventing the profanity filter>. Brilliant recap of the evidence. I’ll be stealing this in the future. With credit of course.

 

[Sheila Terranova]

Just mentioned it as I read about it in MSM, that one of BK's sisters may have had concerns. Looks like an unnamed source, so of course, take it with grains of salt, and MOO:

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

No matter how coincidental …car, gloves, living nearby, I can’t imagine thinking my brother would be guilty of multiple homicides ever. I’m curious what sort of childhood background could make a sister suspect this. Fire setting? Animal cruelty? Sadistic?

 

[SLouTh]

IMO serious runners are advised* to replace their running shoes every 400 miles or so.

BK was what I would call a serious runner in terms of his reported mileage, though who knows if he replaced his running shoes that often or not. Running 25 miles a week would mean covering 400 miles in roughly four months, so three pairs per year. That gets expensive.

* I don't know if it's doctors/fitness experts who recommend the 400 mile maximum or if it's what the shoe companies, with their obvious interest in sales, recommend.

If the shoes pictured were work shoes and not his runners, then disregard.

MOO

Great points about the shoes !! Makes total sense…. IMO ….
The “Nike’s” IMO would have most likely been the current running shoes …. And possibly the “referred to“ shoes back in 2018, were work shoes …

I had thought the purpose of trying to identify the shoes was to establish if they could have matched the latent print found at the scene .??

Described in the PCA as a “diamond shape pattern similar to a Vans shoe”.

New Balance soles seem to come in a variety of patterns ….

Vans seem to have this sole ….

 

[gitana1]

<modsnip - circumventing the profanity filter> Brilliant recap of the evidence.

I can’t take credit! It’s directly from articles about the case.

But yeah, this is such a strong case. The state must be thrilled with the job that was done. Of course you’ve been around long enough to know a great case when you see one. My confidence is through the roof.

 

[MassGuy]

I can’t take credit! It’s directly from articles about the case.

But yeah, this is such a strong case. The state must be thrilled with the job that was done. Of course you’ve been around long enough to know a great case when you see one. My confidence is through the roof.

I just can’t wait for the DNA from the car to come out. As we learned from the Berreth case, you can’t clean it all.

Gold mine.

 

[SLouTh]

No matter how coincidental …car, gloves, living nearby, I can’t imagine thinking my brother would be guilty of multiple homicides ever. I’m curious what sort of childhood background could make a sister suspect this. Fire setting? Animal cruelty? Sadistic?

Agree… if it was our brother or son, I think you would almost go insane trying to think if you missed any major clues or behaviours …. Especially if there were none of the “know behaviours” like you mentioned above ….

And although it seems frustrating, and must be extremely hard for the victim‘s families, if it was our brother or son, I think you would want AT to fight as hard as she has / can …. to question all of the evidence … she is just doing her job …..

JMO