4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #94

[Cool Cats]

I just find it hard to believe a guy who was literally teaching at a college on this type of stuff is dumb enough to take his phone with him and commit the murders. Don't you?

I also find it hard to believe he left the sheath at the scene since it's not like he was running out of the house. DM stated he just walked past her bedroom door allegedly.

Just opinion of course.

Killer Mistakes

He was smart enough to turn his phone off for 2 hours from 2:55 until 4:55 am. Smart enough not to leave any evidence in his apartment or car. Smart enough not to get seen on any security cameras. Smart enough to wash his car and hide his victim's DNA blood evidence.

His specialty was online data in helping police depatments. He was very good at this as we know. No evidence of online victim stalking or following. He was very good hiding his connection to the victims.
It is possible this criminal "genius" left the sheath on purpose to make it look like a military guy. The sheath he left is a military type sheath.

It appears that because his DNA is only on the snap that he cleaned the sheath. This means he could have planned to skew the crime scene off in a military direction.

The snap has indentations around it and he wasn't able to get all his DNA out, or he did what we all do, made a simple mistake and touched it before putting on gloves that night.

2 Cents

 

[Justice101]

I just find it hard to believe a guy who was literally teaching at a college on this type of stuff is dumb enough to take his phone with him and commit the murders. Don't you?

I also find it hard to believe he left the sheath at the scene since it's not like he was running out of the house. DM stated he just walked past her bedroom door allegedly.

Just opinion of course.

I think it was dark enough and he wasn't going back into the first or second bedroom again and he probably thought everyone in the house was dead.

 

[Cool Cats]

Respectfully, we don't know if the sheath actually housed the actual murder weapon either. For that matter we don't even know if it really was a kbar knife that was used in the crime either.

There is a reasonable doubt threshold and that means that the jury can decide that it is reasonable to assume that the sheath housed the large fixed blade knife that killed the victims. The knife that goes with that sheath fits the coroner's description of "large fixed blade knife."

Circumstantial evidence presents the jury with reasonable assumptions.

They could decide it is reasonable that DM saw BK

And decide it is.....

Reasonable it is his white Elantra on video
Reasonable he was trying to hide his DNA in Pennsylvania
Reasonable he turned his phone off to cover his murder tracks
Reasonable he covered his car with plastic and changed his clothes
Reasonable he washed his car
Reasonable he made mistakes
Reasonable he had a negative history with women
Reasonable he covered his digital footprint to tie him to any victim

Beyond Reasonable that this is his DNA

This is a circumstantial case and it will be won in my opinion because of the overwhelming evidence put together. It is astonishing how much circumstantial evidence there is in this case.

2 Cents

 

[Boxer]

I just find it hard to believe a guy who was literally teaching at a college on this type of stuff is dumb enough to take his phone with him and commit the murders. Don't you?

I also find it hard to believe he left the sheath at the scene since it's not like he was running out of the house. DM stated he just walked past her bedroom door allegedly.

Just opinion of course.

MOO One reason is I think BK had more than enough preparation for a rape in a party house.
The max subpoenas for the area used for tracking his phone would be unavailable to LE for a rape.
I think it was a rape with a knife for compliance and it all went sideways when the target had a friend with her. He then found he was good at murder and kept doing it.
Regarding DM.
Immediately before passing by DMs door he fully face the Good Times neon sign in the livingroom, meaning he lost his acute night vision for a few seconds and MOO missed the slightly larger black line of DMs door being open a crack to see.

 

[whiterhino]

The killer of these 4 people will not have a "motive" that normal people understand. There's a book on Richard Speck, the killer of 8 student nurses in 1966. He didn't have a motive other than he wanted to do it. These people are depraved--they want to fulfill fantasies or experience something that gives them pleasure. That's the "motive."

Just to clarify: The comments regarding motive were related to a theory suggesting that it was not BK but someone else who had the sheath etc etc.

My question was "What would the motive be?". What are the odds that someone else acquired the sheath after BK touched it and that person left the sheath at the scene of the murder? With BKs DNA on it?? Hardly any alibi, awaiting trial, facing the DP. Whoever it is must be rolling! (fwiw I do not subscribe to this theory)

Also, I agree re- motive and fantasy.

@daydreamin IMO the perpetrator doesn't have to know the victims personally. If there is some element of fantasy maybe it's not personal towards the victims themselves? Having said that, if stalking were a factor then murder might've also been part of a fantasy? The other housemates might have been killed bc they saw the perpetrator and not for any other reason.

JMO.

 

[Megnut]

Killer Mistakes

He was smart enough to turn his phone off for 2 hours from 2:55 until 4:55 am. Smart enough not to leave any evidence in his apartment or car. Smart enough not to get seen on any security cameras. Smart enough to wash his car and hide his victim's DNA blood evidence.

His specialty was online data in helping police depatments. He was very good at this as we know. No evidence of online victim stalking or following. He was very good hiding his connection to the victims.
It is possible this criminal "genius" left the sheath on purpose to make it look like a military guy. The sheath he left is a military type sheath.

It appears that because his DNA is only on the snap that he cleaned the sheath. This means he could have planned to skew the crime scene off in a military direction.

The snap has indentations around it and he wasn't able to get all his DNA out, or he did what we all do, made a simple mistake and touched it before putting on gloves that night.

2 Cents

IMO this was a crime of stealth. He choose 3 am +/- to ensure everyone was asleep, not unlike police raids, his own included. However, all was not quiet so he circled widely until the house was dark.

IMO he did not calculate for K's new jeep nor X's doordash.

IMO he had one target, alone on the third floor.

Had four roommates awakened in the morning to discover one stabbed roommate, how different the optics might have looked.

The $64,000 question -- if he had stabbed one roommate, would he have left the sheath behind?

This is a) or b). He left it on purpose or he left it accidentally.

IMO he was unaware there was his DNA on it.

If he left it behind on purpose, it was his calling card and IMO, if he evaded LE, there would have been another murder in time....

If he left it accidentally, he must have been holding a bloody knife when he left the top floor and emerged on the middle floor. Seems sloppy.

Was he carrying it defensively, should he encounter anyone? Where was the knife when D saw him? At his side, dripping blood? Not like he could pocket it. Way too sharp. Raises the possibility of a second sheath. (Maybe he purchased a spare, for the purposes of leaving on at a crime scene and mixed up which one was pristine, ultimately unaware that his DNA could snag in the grooves.)

Same questions. After encountering X awake, I think X and E, like K, were unplanned. Reactionary. All three IMO stood in the way of his getting away. D, too, if he had seen her.

And when he reached his car, where was the knife? How did he protect it so he wasn't injured, so it didn't pierce whatever held it?

I think there's a fair chance he picked that knife and left the sheath deliberately. Personal vendetta against the Marines and also to point LE in the wrong direction. I happen to think BK harbors anger at women, LE, the Marines and has quite an internal collection of people and classes of people who annoy him.

I don't think he mind being separated from society, a society he doesn't think much of.

JMO

 

[Balthazar]

MOO One reason is I think BK had more than enough preparation for a rape in a party house.
The max subpoenas for the area used for tracking his phone would be unavailable to LE for a rape.
I think it was a rape with a knife for compliance and it all went sideways when the target had a friend with her. He then found he was good at murder and kept doing it.
Regarding DM.
Immediately before passing by DMs door he fully face the Good Times neon sign in the livingroom, meaning he lost his acute night vision for a few seconds and MOO missed the slightly larger black line of DMs door being open a crack to see.

I think we need to wait and hear precisely what DM says happened. We don't know if she was literally standing with her door wide open or if the door was cracked a little bit. Was she standing in her room or the hall? We really don't know yet.

 

[10ofRods]

I just find it hard to believe a guy who was literally teaching at a college on this type of stuff is dumb enough to take his phone with him and commit the murders. Don't you?

I also find it hard to believe he left the sheath at the scene since it's not like he was running out of the house. DM stated he just walked past her bedroom door allegedly.

Just opinion of course.

When I was at uni, 2 different grad students murdered someone. It was an R1 institution. Their fields were math and physics. Both of them left quite a trail. Both attempted not to be caught - and there were no cameras on campus in those days.

When I was at uni, one of our most famous psych professors beat up his secretary (and did try to lie about it and reframe the situation). He was not fired. He behaved really stupidly, imo, in the way he handled the whole thing. So did his boss, IMO.

And frankly, as someone who spent my whole life in higher ed, yes, I can believe that students (including grad students) can be quite confused and thoughtless. If you want to use the word "dumb," I suppose you can - but you haven't lived until you've worked for a Nobel Prize winner and find out just how lacking in common sense and ordinary life skills they can be (I was Girl Friday for one of them and attempted to work with another one on a non-profit project). The one for whom I was Girl Friday was so socially inept that he arranged his visits to his offices only on condition that everyone (except for one trusted longterm assistant) cleared out of the whole wing of the building. He was not to be seen. One of my jobs was to organize his week's journal clippings and book chapter photocopies (this was before everything was digital). He clearly enjoyed using the photocopy machine AND the scissors - but there was often very little rhyme or reason to what he was collecting. We then left him notes with questions (as he asked us to do) - and he was often unable to remember or interpret why, in fact, he had that particular item or what it was relevant to. This was not just him - there were other absent-minded prof types as well. He still didn't want to throw anything away.

And then, of course, we have famous cases like that of Dr. Death. He was obviously quite intelligent, but very poor at covering up his malfeasance and criminality.

Anyway, even having an advanced degree does not guarantee a person will be able to execute the perfect crime. One of my interests is in doctors who kill. Here's an interesting article on doctors who became true murderers - and got caught, even before DNA:

When Physicians Go Bad: Doctors Who Killed Their Patients

and here's another:

Top 10 Serial Killer Physicians - Listverse

A physician is a person who is trained in the art of healing. Unfortunately, these ten medical doctors preferred to apply their training and skills to the

listverse.com

I am going to assume that someone who has completed medical school and an entire residency is pretty smart. I don't want to get into academic rankings, but WSU's criminology program is ranked middle of the pack by those who do such rankings. Some of these doctors who kill went to the University of Leeds, which is well-respected (#75 of top ranked global institutions of higher learning). Ranks Tier 1 in most subjects. He killed a bunch of people (and got caught).

I think BK's status as a beginner criminologist is part of the overall interest in this case. He has a past criminal record (expunged, as he was a juvenile). He didn't even make it through the first semester of grad school without getting fired from teaching. He has issues.

IMO.

 

[whiterhino]

When I was at uni, 2 different grad students murdered someone. It was an R1 institution. Their fields were math and physics. Both of them left quite a trail. Both attempted not to be caught - and there were no cameras on campus in those days.

When I was at uni, one of our most famous psych professors beat up his secretary (and did try to lie about it and reframe the situation). He was not fired. He behaved really stupidly, imo, in the way he handled the whole thing. So did his boss, IMO.

And frankly, as someone who spent my whole life in higher ed, yes, I can believe that students (including grad students) can be quite confused and thoughtless. If you want to use the word "dumb," I suppose you can - but you haven't lived until you've worked for a Nobel Prize winner and find out just how lacking in common sense and ordinary life skills they can be (I was Girl Friday for one of them and attempted to work with another one on a non-profit project). The one for whom I was Girl Friday was so socially inept that he arranged his visits to his offices only on condition that everyone (except for one trusted longterm assistant) cleared out of the whole wing of the building. He was not to be seen. One of my jobs was to organize his week's journal clippings and book chapter photocopies (this was before everything was digital). He clearly enjoyed using the photocopy machine AND the scissors - but there was often very little rhyme or reason to what he was collecting. We then left him notes with questions (as he asked us to do) - and he was often unable to remember or interpret why, in fact, he had that particular item or what it was relevant to. This was not just him - there were other absent-minded prof types as well. He still didn't want to throw anything away.

And then, of course, we have famous cases like that of Dr. Death. He was obviously quite intelligent, but very poor at covering up his malfeasance and criminality.

Anyway, even having an advanced degree does not guarantee a person will be able to execute the perfect crime. One of my interests is in doctors who kill. Here's an interesting article on doctors who became true murderers - and got caught, even before DNA:

When Physicians Go Bad: Doctors Who Killed Their Patients

and here's another:

Top 10 Serial Killer Physicians - Listverse

A physician is a person who is trained in the art of healing. Unfortunately, these ten medical doctors preferred to apply their training and skills to the

listverse.com

I am going to assume that someone who has completed medical school and an entire residency is pretty smart. I don't want to get into academic rankings, but WSU's criminology program is ranked middle of the pack by those who do such rankings. Some of these doctors who kill went to the University of Leeds, which is well-respected (#75 of top ranked global institutions of higher learning). Ranks Tier 1 in most subjects. He killed a bunch of people (and got caught).

I think BK's status as a beginner criminologist is part of the overall interest in this case. He has a past criminal record (expunged, as he was a juvenile). He didn't even make it through the first semester of grad school without getting fired from teaching. He has issues.

IMO.

FWIW What are your thoughts on the possibility that BK left the sheath behind intentionally?

Some have suggested that he left it on purpose and I've been wondering about that. I've always thought that only certain types of SKs leave calling cards or taunt LE, insert themselves etc. Aside from leaving the sheath behind, there are the comments/accounts suspected to have been made by BK after the fact. I'm also wondering about BKs initial "cooperation" when he was talking to LE without a lawyer. Could that also be seen as a way of involving himself? Framing it as if he's assisting LE, possibly getting a thrill out of it? (taunting, thinking he's outsmarted them etc)

JMO/IMO/MOO.

 

[daydreamin]

IMO this was a crime of stealth. He choose 3 am +/- to ensure everyone was asleep, not unlike police raids, his own included. However, all was not quiet so he circled widely until the house was dark.

IMO he did not calculate for K's new jeep nor X's doordash.

IMO he had one target, alone on the third floor.

Had four roommates awakened in the morning to discover one stabbed roommate, how different the optics might have looked.

The $64,000 question -- if he had stabbed one roommate, would he have left the sheath behind?

This is a) or b). He left it on purpose or he left it accidentally.

IMO he was unaware there was his DNA on it.

If he left it behind on purpose, it was his calling card and IMO, if he evaded LE, there would have been another murder in time....

If he left it accidentally, he must have been holding a bloody knife when he left the top floor and emerged on the middle floor. Seems sloppy.

Was he carrying it defensively, should he encounter anyone? Where was the knife when D saw him? At his side, dripping blood? Not like he could pocket it. Way too sharp. Raises the possibility of a second sheath. (Maybe he purchased a spare, for the purposes of leaving on at a crime scene and mixed up which one was pristine, ultimately unaware that his DNA could snag in the grooves.)

Same questions. After encountering X awake, I think X and E, like K, were unplanned. Reactionary. All three IMO stood in the way of his getting away. D, too, if he had seen her.

And when he reached his car, where was the knife? How did he protect it so he wasn't injured, so it didn't pierce whatever held it?

I think there's a fair chance he picked that knife and left the sheath deliberately. Personal vendetta against the Marines and also to point LE in the wrong direction. I happen to think BK harbors anger at women, LE, the Marines and has quite an internal collection of people and classes of people who annoy him.

I don't think he mind being separated from society, a society he doesn't think much of.

JMO

Just a question but what makes you think he harbors anger at women, LE, and the Marines? Especially, LE b/c wasn't he trying to get a job with LE?


Just a question. Thanks

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

IMO this was a crime of stealth. He choose 3 am +/- to ensure everyone was asleep, not unlike police raids, his own included. However, all was not quiet so he circled widely until the house was dark.

IMO he did not calculate for K's new jeep nor X's doordash.

IMO he had one target, alone on the third floor.

Had four roommates awakened in the morning to discover one stabbed roommate, how different the optics might have looked.

The $64,000 question -- if he had stabbed one roommate, would he have left the sheath behind?

This is a) or b). He left it on purpose or he left it accidentally.

IMO he was unaware there was his DNA on it.

If he left it behind on purpose, it was his calling card and IMO, if he evaded LE, there would have been another murder in time....

If he left it accidentally, he must have been holding a bloody knife when he left the top floor and emerged on the middle floor. Seems sloppy.

Was he carrying it defensively, should he encounter anyone? Where was the knife when D saw him? At his side, dripping blood? Not like he could pocket it. Way too sharp. Raises the possibility of a second sheath. (Maybe he purchased a spare, for the purposes of leaving on at a crime scene and mixed up which one was pristine, ultimately unaware that his DNA could snag in the grooves.)

Same questions. After encountering X awake, I think X and E, like K, were unplanned. Reactionary. All three IMO stood in the way of his getting away. D, too, if he had seen her.

And when he reached his car, where was the knife? How did he protect it so he wasn't injured, so it didn't pierce whatever held it?

I think there's a fair chance he picked that knife and left the sheath deliberately. Personal vendetta against the Marines and also to point LE in the wrong direction. I happen to think BK harbors anger at women, LE, the Marines and has quite an internal collection of people and classes of people who annoy him.

I don't think he mind being separated from society, a society he doesn't think much of.

JMO

Excellent synopsis Megnut….. and gets to thinking. Since it seems BK made great attempts (albeit incomplete) to remove his DNA from the knife sheath - that tends to suggest IMO that he left it intentionally? A possible plant, a supposed false tell, or a ruse?

Yet one would think he’d have made a better attempt to have cleaned it. (Then again…… perhaps he thought he was suited up well and ‘clean’ and had no intention of leaving it? Hard to tell.)

Which begs the other point - would love to have been a fly on the wall when the suspect (and perhaps his attorney) learned that his DNA was found on the sheath. MOO

 

[Megnut]

When I was at uni, 2 different grad students murdered someone. It was an R1 institution. Their fields were math and physics. Both of them left quite a trail. Both attempted not to be caught - and there were no cameras on campus in those days.

When I was at uni, one of our most famous psych professors beat up his secretary (and did try to lie about it and reframe the situation). He was not fired. He behaved really stupidly, imo, in the way he handled the whole thing. So did his boss, IMO.

And frankly, as someone who spent my whole life in higher ed, yes, I can believe that students (including grad students) can be quite confused and thoughtless. If you want to use the word "dumb," I suppose you can - but you haven't lived until you've worked for a Nobel Prize winner and find out just how lacking in common sense and ordinary life skills they can be (I was Girl Friday for one of them and attempted to work with another one on a non-profit project). The one for whom I was Girl Friday was so socially inept that he arranged his visits to his offices only on condition that everyone (except for one trusted longterm assistant) cleared out of the whole wing of the building. He was not to be seen. One of my jobs was to organize his week's journal clippings and book chapter photocopies (this was before everything was digital). He clearly enjoyed using the photocopy machine AND the scissors - but there was often very little rhyme or reason to what he was collecting. We then left him notes with questions (as he asked us to do) - and he was often unable to remember or interpret why, in fact, he had that particular item or what it was relevant to. This was not just him - there were other absent-minded prof types as well. He still didn't want to throw anything away.

And then, of course, we have famous cases like that of Dr. Death. He was obviously quite intelligent, but very poor at covering up his malfeasance and criminality.

Anyway, even having an advanced degree does not guarantee a person will be able to execute the perfect crime. One of my interests is in doctors who kill. Here's an interesting article on doctors who became true murderers - and got caught, even before DNA:

When Physicians Go Bad: Doctors Who Killed Their Patients

and here's another:

Top 10 Serial Killer Physicians - Listverse

A physician is a person who is trained in the art of healing. Unfortunately, these ten medical doctors preferred to apply their training and skills to the

listverse.com

I am going to assume that someone who has completed medical school and an entire residency is pretty smart. I don't want to get into academic rankings, but WSU's criminology program is ranked middle of the pack by those who do such rankings. Some of these doctors who kill went to the University of Leeds, which is well-respected (#75 of top ranked global institutions of higher learning). Ranks Tier 1 in most subjects. He killed a bunch of people (and got caught).

I think BK's status as a beginner criminologist is part of the overall interest in this case. He has a past criminal record (expunged, as he was a juvenile). He didn't even make it through the first semester of grad school without getting fired from teaching. He has issues.

IMO.

Excellent point. Different kinds of smarts. High I.Q, low E.Q. Book smart, street dumb. Street smart, book dumb.

Had BK gone home instead of to 1122, he'd be saying it was the school, the administration, the students who were all in the wrong. IMO he does not have the social awareness nor the personal insight to consider that HE might be the issue.

He has issues. He IS the issue.

I can't help but to wonder if there's ANYONE in the courtroom he doesn't DISDAIN.

He must be exhausted, looking down on everyone. Star of his own movie, he.

JMO

 

[Megnut]

Just a question but what makes you think he harbors anger at women, LE, and the Marines? Especially, LE b/c wasn't he trying to get a job with LE?


Just a question. Thanks

Three inroads into which he had no success.

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

There is a reasonable doubt threshold and that means that the jury can decide that it is reasonable to assume that the sheath housed the large fixed blade knife that killed the victims. The knife that goes with that sheath fits the coroner's description of "large fixed blade knife."

Circumstantial evidence presents the jury with reasonable assumptions.

They could decide it is reasonable that DM saw BK

And decide it is.....

Reasonable it is his white Elantra on video
Reasonable he was trying to hide his DNA in Pennsylvania
Reasonable he turned his phone off to cover his murder tracks
Reasonable he covered his car with plastic and changed his clothes
Reasonable he washed his car
Reasonable he made mistakes
Reasonable he had a negative history with women
Reasonable he covered his digital footprint to tie him to any victim

Beyond Reasonable that this is his DNA

This is a circumstantial case and it will be won in my opinion because of the overwhelming evidence put together. It is astonishing how much circumstantial evidence there is in this case.

2 Cents

Personally, I would want the forensic report on the sharp force injuries to pull the sheath and the knife together. If that wasn't available (which it will be), I probably wouldn't be too doubtful about the sheath belonging to the killer - given that the sheath housed a weapon and was found underneath a dead person.

It's clearly BK's sheath, though, from my POV.

Those autopsy reports are going to be brutal. I predict that there are several strands of evidence that either exactly identify the knife (I've written about this before, but forensic MRI and forensic spectometer analysis could reveal the actual brand Ka-Bar, since it has a proprietary coating on the blade and such blades have been identified in this fashion before). But even if not, the depth of the wounds and the microscopic analysis of any marks on bones would be enough.

I do think that BK chose a manner of killing designed NOT to hit bone - but was he successful? He expected all his victims to be sleeping and not moving. Xana was moving around. I believe BK is immune to and incapable of anything like "panic" (Based on his tap=a=talk posts and general research on VS), but I do think his plan went awry when he realized Xana was still up and about. His mind may have gone blank. He writes that he suffers from derealization AND depersonalization. That explains a lot in this discussion about "how smart he was." He's (according to his own posts) neuro-atypical. There are are anomalies in his perceptual apparatus (as I believe there were in the professor I was describing in a previous post).

I do not believe he left the sheath intentionally. Kaylee was clearly still awake, the situation did not unfold as he expected/planned. I believe he was wearing something like a black coverall with those big pockets and had the sheathed knife in that pocket (he probably, while kneeling on the bed to kill Maddie, thought he slid the sheath back into that pocket, but in the haste of the moment, managed to drop it, may not have realized it). If the theory that he was after just one woman is true, then the presence of another woman (who appears to have awakened and heard him) was startling.

He wanted to walk as quietly as possible (so, no running). He had timed it in his mind, perhaps not planning to kill four people (but willing to).

He's so meticulous about packaging his trash, cleaning his apartment and car, etc., I can't believe he would intentionally leave a sheath that almost certainly had his DNA on it. However, he had not taken a grad course in forensic anthropology (which studies use points on items and also studies the genes and their various methods of extraction and reconstruction). DeSales had one master's level course in that subject, but we don't know if he took it - he was not on that particular track according to what was announced at graduation. One could easily take 9 courses in related topics (including the study of metal objects as a forensic category).

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

Excellent synopsis Megnut….. and gets to thinking. Since it seems BK made great attempts (albeit incomplete) to remove his DNA from the knife sheath - that tends to suggest IMO that he left it intentionally? A possible plant, a supposed false tell, or a ruse?

Yet one would think he’d have made a better attempt to have cleaned it. (Then again…… perhaps he thought he was suited up well and ‘clean’ and had no intention of leaving it? Hard to tell.)

Which begs the other point - would love to have been a fly on the wall when the suspect (and perhaps his attorney) learned that his DNA was found on the sheath. MOO

We don't know that he made "great attempts" as most of the sheath has not been swabbed or studied. Just that initial use point.

I personally think he did no more than possibly wipe it with a Clorox wipe or similar (surely he knew that anything super harsh was going to be detectable and possibly incriminating?) I think he simply didn't know much about how small DNA is, how small the tools for extraction are, how guided by advanced computerized equipment and special lighting all of this is. He certainly had never worked in such a lab himself, and that's where most of this is learned.
web

 

[schooling]

BBM

In addition to the missing data testimony:

156:14
I have had concern since the very first day I saw the Cast Draft report that there are significant errors. I can look at the coverage areas and I can tell you they are wrong

201:15
There are statements and assumptions made in the records that will never be supported by the data.
There are a lot of claims made in these emails and even in the name files. It does not represent what is claimed to represent.

2:02:23
It could be extremely impactful to either side.
The problem is the problem, not what the data helps or hurts.

203:41
If I was contacted on Dec 1 by MPD there are things I would have absolutely said. You do this today. Do not hesitate and especially on Dec 23.
Not because of who it is helpful for but but because those documents are the only way to interpret what it really means.

204:15
As I have gotten more documents, I am finding a lot of misstatements that have been made.

204:26 To date it is helpful to Mr K. I reserve the right to change opinion.

IMO, This statement is just her doing her job as a defense attorney.

IMO As explosive as those statements sound there’s gray area in each and every one of them. Not one of them is substantive or specific.

This was the same play with the DNA genealogy information that many claimed was going to be a bombshell last summer. There were folks discussing full dismissal based on AT’s words alone. Yet, here we are. A year later. BK still behind bars. And now the next bombshell is the cell evidence apparently. JMO

If she had cold hard facts we would likely be seeing motions to dismiss right now (MOO)

The fact that we are not tells me that this is just a different interpretation of the same evidence.

MOO

 

[Cool Cats]

Personally, I would want the forensic report on the sharp force injuries to pull the sheath and the knife together. If that wasn't available (which it will be), I probably wouldn't be too doubtful about the sheath belonging to the killer - given that the sheath housed a weapon and was found underneath a dead person.

It's clearly BK's sheath, though, from my POV.

Those autopsy reports are going to be brutal. I predict that there are several strands of evidence that either exactly identify the knife (I've written about this before, but forensic MRI and forensic spectometer analysis could reveal the actual brand Ka-Bar, since it has a proprietary coating on the blade and such blades have been identified in this fashion before). But even if not, the depth of the wounds and the microscopic analysis of any marks on bones would be enough.

I do think that BK chose a manner of killing designed NOT to hit bone - but was he successful? He expected all his victims to be sleeping and not moving. Xana was moving around. I believe BK is immune to and incapable of anything like "panic" (Based on his tap=a=talk posts and general research on VS), but I do think his plan went awry when he realized Xana was still up and about. His mind may have gone blank. He writes that he suffers from derealization AND depersonalization. That explains a lot in this discussion about "how smart he was." He's (according to his own posts) neuro-atypical. There are are anomalies in his perceptual apparatus (as I believe there were in the professor I was describing in a previous post).

I do not believe he left the sheath intentionally. Kaylee was clearly still awake, the situation did not unfold as he expected/planned. I believe he was wearing something like a black coverall with those big pockets and had the sheathed knife in that pocket (he probably, while kneeling on the bed to kill Maddie, thought he slid the sheath back into that pocket, but in the haste of the moment, managed to drop it, may not have realized it). If the theory that he was after just one woman is true, then the presence of another woman (who appears to have awakened and heard him) was startling.

He wanted to walk as quietly as possible (so, no running). He had timed it in his mind, perhaps not planning to kill four people (but willing to).

He's so meticulous about packaging his trash, cleaning his apartment and car, etc., I can't believe he would intentionally leave a sheath that almost certainly had his DNA on it. However, he had not taken a grad course in forensic anthropology (which studies use points on items and also studies the genes and their various methods of extraction and reconstruction). DeSales had one master's level course in that subject, but we don't know if he took it - he was not on that particular track according to what was announced at graduation. One could easily take 9 courses in related topics (including the study of metal objects as a forensic category).

IMO.

Yes. Forensics can compare knife wounds to a Ka-Bar blade pattern and length and conclude a strong possibility the wounds were made specifically by a Ka-Bar knife that would fit this specific sheath.

It's Circumstantial evidence reasonable to conclude. Why does it matter?

Because BK's DNA was not found on any old knife sheath laying around the house, it is on a sheath that could have easily harbored the murder weapon. That the sheath contained the murder weapon is even more likely due to the location where the sheath was found.

I slightly entertain the thought of BK trying to tamper with the murder scene by deliberately leaving the knife to falsely point to some military guy.

But your senario makes sense.

BK is wearing a black coverall with those big pockets and hastily slides the sheath into his right pocket, if right handed. The attack was violent with possible fighting/defending so while he is moving around the sheath fell out. Gravity plain and simple...not rocket science.

But why wouldn't he notice the sheath was missing once he was done with the knife? Wouldn't he want to put it back into the sheath?

The answer could simply be he was in too much of a hurry to be bothered doing that. Simply drop the knife into a coverall pocket ... get rid of the knife and coverall together later.

Or, according to the house plan - correct me if I'm wrong - DM was standing outside her door and BM would have walked by her with his left arm towards her and his right arm towards the hall wall.

If he is right handed he could have been holding the knife down by his right side away from DM, thus, her not seeing it. Also, likely dim lighting and apparently she was more focused on his bushy eyebrows.

2 Cents

 

[schooling]

I just find it hard to believe a guy who was literally teaching at a college on this type of stuff is dumb enough to take his phone with him and commit the murders. Don't you?

I also find it hard to believe he left the sheath at the scene since it's not like he was running out of the house. DM stated he just walked past her bedroom door allegedly.

Just opinion of course.

Anyone dumb enough to kill 4 innocent people that he didn’t know in cold blood…is also a big enough dummy to make those mistakes and more.

IMO their decision making and judgement and fear of getting caught is so severely compromised (IMO) who’s to say that they wouldn’t just turn off their phone and drive their own car? Not I.

I could never put myself in the shoes of a killer in any meaningful way. Our brains are wired 100% differently. If I can’t explain their motivations and/or empathize then judging what they would do in any given situation is a lost cause. JMO

And that’s not even getting into the “arrogant” personality trait that a lot of reporting has labeled him with.

MOO

 

[ilovewings]

Personally, I would want the forensic report on the sharp force injuries to pull the sheath and the knife together. If that wasn't available (which it will be), I probably wouldn't be too doubtful about the sheath belonging to the killer - given that the sheath housed a weapon and was found underneath a dead person.

It's clearly BK's sheath, though, from my POV.

Those autopsy reports are going to be brutal. I predict that there are several strands of evidence that either exactly identify the knife (I've written about this before, but forensic MRI and forensic spectometer analysis could reveal the actual brand Ka-Bar, since it has a proprietary coating on the blade and such blades have been identified in this fashion before). But even if not, the depth of the wounds and the microscopic analysis of any marks on bones would be enough.

I do think that BK chose a manner of killing designed NOT to hit bone - but was he successful? He expected all his victims to be sleeping and not moving. Xana was moving around. I believe BK is immune to and incapable of anything like "panic" (Based on his tap=a=talk posts and general research on VS), but I do think his plan went awry when he realized Xana was still up and about. His mind may have gone blank. He writes that he suffers from derealization AND depersonalization. That explains a lot in this discussion about "how smart he was." He's (according to his own posts) neuro-atypical. There are are anomalies in his perceptual apparatus (as I believe there were in the professor I was describing in a previous post).

I do not believe he left the sheath intentionally. Kaylee was clearly still awake, the situation did not unfold as he expected/planned. I believe he was wearing something like a black coverall with those big pockets and had the sheathed knife in that pocket (he probably, while kneeling on the bed to kill Maddie, thought he slid the sheath back into that pocket, but in the haste of the moment, managed to drop it, may not have realized it). If the theory that he was after just one woman is true, then the presence of another woman (who appears to have awakened and heard him) was startling.

He wanted to walk as quietly as possible (so, no running). He had timed it in his mind, perhaps not planning to kill four people (but willing to).

He's so meticulous about packaging his trash, cleaning his apartment and car, etc., I can't believe he would intentionally leave a sheath that almost certainly had his DNA on it. However, he had not taken a grad course in forensic anthropology (which studies use points on items and also studies the genes and their various methods of extraction and reconstruction). DeSales had one master's level course in that subject, but we don't know if he took it - he was not on that particular track according to what was announced at graduation. One could easily take 9 courses in related topics (including the study of metal objects as a forensic category).

IMO.

Could not agree more with your theory of the murder
No way did he leave the sheath intentionally

 

[10ofRods]

MOO One reason is I think BK had more than enough preparation for a rape in a party house.
The max subpoenas for the area used for tracking his phone would be unavailable to LE for a rape.
I think it was a rape with a knife for compliance and it all went sideways when the target had a friend with her. He then found he was good at murder and kept doing it.
Regarding DM.
Immediately before passing by DMs door he fully face the Good Times neon sign in the livingroom, meaning he lost his acute night vision for a few seconds and MOO missed the slightly larger black line of DMs door being open a crack to see.

I share your opinion. I think he was a long term peeper and stalker (starting back in PA, JMO). He went to frat parties and tried to ingratiate himself into that community, including its pre- and post-parties. The number of grad students who go hang out at undergrad parties (hoping to get some attention by their apparent age and their status) is large.

Really good point about his departure and the sign removing his night vision. That's what protected DM.

I figure his fantasy life included several limited scenarios, for which he thought he was prepared. If the initial goal was rape, the subsidiary goal was always homicide. This is a truism in criminology. A person who is willing to break into someone's house to rape them is always and also willing to kill. Perhaps they try to restrain themselves, but they came with a weapon that can easily kill and intend to use that weapon to threaten to kill.

Over and over we see stranger killings by people who planned for just 1-2 scenarios. It's an extension, IMO, of their fantasy life and, perhaps, delusions. Being "good at crime" was one of BK's self-descriptors, inside his own head, with dual meaning.

IMO.