Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #188

[Vaderman]

I'm currently reading a book on the murders and it's made me wonder: assuming Richard Allen is guilty as charged, what happened here? How did he evade capture for so long? Is he especially skilled or were the investigators especially bumbling?

 

[photographer4]

I'm currently reading a book on the murders and it's made me wonder: assuming Richard Allen is guilty as charged, what happened here? How did he evade capture for so long? Is he especially skilled or were the investigators especially bumbling?

Which book? I recently read this one: Down the Hill: My Descent into the Double Murder in Del…

 

[Megnut]

I'm currently reading a book on the murders and it's made me wonder: assuming Richard Allen is guilty as charged, what happened here? How did he evade capture for so long? Is he especially skilled or were the investigators especially bumbling?

LE may have had hairs, fibers, a DNA profile (human or animal), a fingerprint (full or partial) and just no one to compare it to -- kind of surprised there seems to ne no mention of genetic genealogy which is the new way to CODIS! So.... since they didn't, maybe they didn't recover human DNA at all -- there's no database for animal DNA -- so it's entirely possible IMO that LE had a good handle on the profile of the murderer, just no one to compare anything to. Not a seasoned criminal, or at least not a previously convicted one.

Waiting on that one tip, a name, a lead strong enough that they could finally pair the evidence to a man. And maybe to his home, his apparel, his pets, his weapons, his ammo, his vehicle, his carpet. And a statistical match to his DNA.

They may have had their man, just couldn't stick an arrest -- until they could.

JMO

 

[susiQ]

I'm currently reading a book on the murders and it's made me wonder: assuming Richard Allen is guilty as charged, what happened here? How did he evade capture for so long? Is he especially skilled or were the investigators especially bumbling?

OR, maybe he didn’t do it? It will be interesting to see if the D can prove he wasn’t at the bridge after 1:30 pm. I can’t wait to see if the P can prove that he was there AFTER 1:30 pm, without a doubt. We don’t know do we, and yet, so many have him convicted already. SMH.

 

[Vaderman]

Which book? I recently read this one: Down the Hill: My Descent into the Double Murder in Del…

That's the one I'm reading!

 

[photographer4]

OR, maybe he didn’t do it? It will be interesting to see if the D can prove he wasn’t at the bridge after 1:30 pm. I can’t wait to see if the P can prove that he was there AFTER 1:30 pm, without a doubt. We don’t know do we, and yet, so many have him convicted already. SMH.

I mean, we certainly don’t know what we don’t know but if the D could prove for sure where RA was after 1:30 would he still be in prison? Would they not be screaming from the rooftops if they had anything to show couldn’t have been him? Eg: with RL, he had his cousin lie for him, but a reciept said he was at a store or something? ETA - edited bc I don’t recall all the details and don’t want to confuse anyone!

But if RA left the trail just after seeing the witnesses - like within a couple mins and:
- no one saw him leave
- nothing on cam shows him leaving
- he went home and had a nap instead of logging internet time or texting friends or whoever - anything with a date and time attached to it… then it may be very hard to prove he left before the killings.

What I wanna know:
- where was he in the 24 hours before the murders?
- what was he up to? With anyone?
- where did he go after he left the trail (if he is innocent). What did he do and how did he get there?
- who did he see in the hours leading up to when the kids were found? Or talk with? Text with?
- what internet stuff may he have done?
- what errands did he do in the evening or next day (if any). With anyone?

So many questions!!

 

[photographer4]

That's the one I'm reading!

What are your thoughts so far?

 

[grannygates]

I mean, we certainly don’t know what we don’t know but if the D could prove for sure where RA was after 1:30 would he still be in prison? Would they not be screaming from the rooftops if they had anything to show couldn’t have been him? Eg: with RL, he had his cousin lie for him, but a reciept said he was at a store or something? ETA - edited bc I don’t recall all the details and don’t want to confuse anyone!

But if RA left the trail just after seeing the witnesses - like within a couple mins and:
- no one saw him leave
- nothing on cam shows him leaving
- he went home and had a nap instead of logging internet time or texting friends or whoever - anything with a date and time attached to it… then it may be very hard to prove he left before the killings.

What I wanna know:
- where was he in the 24 hours before the murders?
- what was he up to? With anyone?
- where did he go after he left the trail (if he is innocent). What did he do and how did he get there?
- who did he see in the hours leading up to when the kids were found? Or talk with? Text with?
- what internet stuff may he have done?
- what errands did he do in the evening or next day (if any). With anyone?

So many questions!!

Your list of questions brings up MY biggest question - where is the cell phone data from RAs phone? There doesn’t seem to be mention of it anywhere from the state and I have a hard time believing that they wouldn’t have collected this ?

 

[sunshineray]

Your list of questions brings up MY biggest question - where is the cell phone data from RAs phone? There doesn’t seem to be mention of it anywhere from the state and I have a hard time believing that they wouldn’t have collected this ?

The State is respecting the gag order. Maybe we'll hear about all sorts of things at the pretrial hearings starting July 30th?

 

[photographer4]

Dbm.

 

[MiniMoo]

IMO We’ve heard three stories about where the round was found - Ligget said between the bodies, Holeman said “under the dead girls foot” and the defense says 2 feet away, several inches underground. (Have I got that right?)

Friend of the state, Barb McDonald confirms on CourtTV that the bullet was found during the “re-securing” of the crime scene and confirms the bullet was found underneath the ground.

Joseph Scott Morgan says you can’t resecure a crime scene and asks what everyone wants to know… How long has that round been there? How are they connecting it to this crime? He states that scientifically, a qualified person could inspect the corrosion of the brass and dirt embedded and give a guess on how long it’s been there. Was this done? How did this round immediately bury itself several inches under the ground ? That would all need to be explained by a qualified person if I’m to believe this round is even related to this crime.

If the chain of custody exists, the state should just hand it over and defense wouldn’t be pointing out how none exists. IMO That appears to me to be the most blatantly obvious solution to curb that concern

All MOO

That would make a difference in the case then if it was found the second time around, also, if nothing can be matched to it.

Missing photos or photos not being taken is also significant.

Am I right in understanding that the only physical evidence tying RA to the actual crime scene is that unspent bullet - only that unspent bullet mightn't actually be his or from his gun.

 

[MiniMoo]

Based on this, can we assume she thinks the jury will be smarter than the D thinks the jury might be?

Doesn't matter how smart anyone is - the jury can only go with facts and what is presented in court as convincing evidence.

Facts and evidence.

 

[MiniMoo]

Is this not almost unbelievable? Frightening the mindset of these people. Fabricate lies to get an accused murderer, Richard Allen, off on lies and technicalities. They spend their time not disputing the charge of murder because Richard Allen did not committee the murder, they spend their time attempting to get the charges dismissed due to technicalities.

Add the issue of the families of the victims not being able to discuss these lies is horrific for them to endure. What are these people going to say should the evidence lead directly to Richard Allen? "oh, I didn't know?" Of course the public wouldn't know, we haven't been privy to the state's evidence. The families pain and suffering can not be "taken back".

It is one thing for a person to be found not guilty due to lack of evidence. To spread and support lies in hopes of getting an accused murderer set free is a whole other form of evil. Libby and Abby did nothing wrong, they are innocent.

This is what needs to be kept in mind - justice for Abby and Libby.

 

[MiniMoo]

Here it is:
Page 254

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

That was an interesting read - the ballistic part of it. I also went down to the bottom of it where M.O's findings can be found.

 

[MiniMoo]

That would make a difference in the case then if it was found the second time around, also, if nothing can be matched to it.

Missing photos or photos not being taken is also significant.

Am I right in understanding that the only physical evidence tying RA to the actual crime scene is that unspent bullet - only that unspent bullet mightn't actually be his or from his gun.

Just read Pages 254 and 255 of the Delphi Document Combined and what M.O. found after tests where carried out - in the last part of it.

Seems to be a positive match.

 

[susane7]

I'm currently reading a book on the murders and it's made me wonder: assuming Richard Allen is guilty as charged, what happened here? How did he evade capture for so long? Is he especially skilled or were the investigators especially bumbling?

Bumbling. Someone misfiled the tip and RA was hiding in plain sight and didn't stand out. The main investigators didn't knew about RA until 2022 probably. If they didn't misfiled the tip, the case have been solved in the first week after the crime. It would have been easier for the police and the prosecution as there would probably have been more evidence and he wouldn't have had time to get rid of the evidence and we wouldn't have had as many conspiracy theories like now. At the end, the investigation made many mistakes but they managed to find the right guy IMO.

 

[katydid23]

Why would Judge Gull recuse herself? She's done nothing to recuse herself for according to the SCOIN. The D is mad because she's mean to them, hurts their fee fees and doesn't jokingly call them ding dongs too.

The PCA and SW aren't going anywhere no matter how hard the D tries to spin it. Why not just get their completely innocent client to Court and prove it as soon as possible??? Should be easy to do based on what they've reported around the gag order.

JMO

Yes, if it's true, as they imply in their motions, that there is 'no' real evidence against RA, and the bullet has no valid chain of custody, and all the confessions are phoney and meaningless, then why not just go to trial as soon as possible?

Why do they try so desperately to dump the judge if there is no evidence against their client to speak of?

 

[katydid23]

Apparently this would not be allowed per this post: Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #188

I think mrjitty was joking. The DT did say at one time that JG was going to have to be a witness, which didn't really make any sense, but...?

 

[katydid23]

Does she get to just skip over it then? If something is brought up that requires her to be a witness? For example, how either she, TL, or the jail worker lied about that witness who was supposed to show up to court and testify? Can she just throw that out and not settle the matter?

IMO MOO

That incident did not prove any one lied. There is no reason for her to take the witness stand. That was wishful thinking on their part. IMO