Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #189

[TTF14]

This is a GREAT article outlining what happened yesterday, including a bunch of stuff MS left out of their summary. Bravo to this journalist. Bravo.

https://fox59.com/news/judge-considers-motion-to-dismiss-charges-and-sanction-prosecutor-in-delphi-case/

"Taking the stand was Kevin Murphy, a retired ISP detective who, along with two other officers, wrote a report summarizing their theory that the father and his Odinist associates should be investigated for the killings.

Murphy said that when lead ISP investigator First Sgt. Jerry Holeman learned the defense team had a copy of the report from Murphy’s group, he shouted in a courthouse hallway, “What the F…is this?” and, “How the F…did they get it?”"

 

[TTF14]

He gave his phone's information to DD. I would assume when DD asked for it, it was with the knowledge RA was giving him his phone that he currently was using, the phone he had that day. If that winds up being false then it would be a lie of omission on RA's part. Not a good look in front of a jury. AJMO

Thank you. And, I agree. Not a good look.

 

[vinayd]

This is a GREAT article outlining what happened yesterday, including a bunch of stuff MS left out of their summary. Bravo to this journalist. Bravo.

https://fox59.com/news/judge-considers-motion-to-dismiss-charges-and-sanction-prosecutor-in-delphi-case/

"Taking the stand was Kevin Murphy, a retired ISP detective who, along with two other officers, wrote a report summarizing their theory that the father and his Odinist associates should be investigated for the killings.

Murphy said that when lead ISP investigator First Sgt. Jerry Holeman learned the defense team had a copy of the report from Murphy’s group, he shouted in a courthouse hallway, “What the F…is this?” and, “How the F…did they get it?”"

I would think it's fair to assume Click had no business sharing this information.

 

[TTF14]

I would think it's fair to assume Click had no business sharing this information.

I'm not following. You don't think he should have shared it with his team members?

ETA: Oh...you mean it should not have been shared with the defense team? Why not? It SHOULD have been in Discovery, right?

 

[legalmomma]

Richard Allen appears in shackles for 3-day hearing

Among the topics being addressed at the 3-day hearing are Richard Allen's safekeeping and a motion to dismiss charges against him.

www.courttv.com

Among the topics to be discussed are:

• Richard Allen’s Safekeeping
• Suppressing statements made by Richard Allen
• Allen’s defense request to dismiss case
• Other trial procedures

 

[vinayd]

I'm not following. You don't think he should have shared it with his team members?

ETA: Oh...you mean it should not have been shared with the defense team? Why not? It SHOULD have been in Discovery, right?

Nope. He was retired by the time RA was arrested. We discussed this in a prev thread but I feel Click was out of line sending certified mail and derailing this investigation.

 

[TTF14]

Nope. He was retired by the time RA was arrested. We discussed this in a prev thread but I feel Click was out of line sending certified mail and derailing this investigation.

OK. I'm not familiar with the laws regarding information obtained through an investigation if the person is retired. I wouldn't think that means it's not useful to the current team, but again...I don't know the laws.

 

[Spartygirl]

#JusticeforLibby&Abby

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Depending on the management, they might not have known if he was actually there.

In my personal experience, people clocking each other in and out became so much of a problem that the manager began collecting time cards after lunch and handing them out to the right people at quitting time.

I don't find key fobs to be solid proof, either.

I want to see him on vid in both cases.

I hope we do get to see it on video.
However, at some point you have to appreciate and credit the evidence in front of you. Certainly a juror has to.
You can “what-if” pretty much anything to infinity and beyond.
If we only had video of every crime and every aspect of a crime, legal matters would be much simpler.

 

[sunshineray]

The timeline would be correct because they have Abby’s photo from the bridge and then Libby’s video and then RA (imo) seen walking away bloody or muddy from the crime scene towards his car.



So the defence can try and change the timeline all they wish to, but it doesn’t change the basic facts that their client did it and, let’s not forget, confessed to multiple people, including his wife and his own mother.

IMO MOO

Plus they have the time stamped photo taken right before the girls say RA/BG and RA/BG admits to seeing them (just days after it occured, so fresh in his mind). And they have BB coming and going on the Harvest Store video nailing down her times and her seeing the girls and RA/BG...as well as Kelsei's drop off time of the girls. They have solid time line. MO

 

[sunshineray]

We all know by now "bloody" was not said.

As far as the timeline being confirmed by the photo and the video.....this is not iron clad evidence until we see digital proof interpreted by experts, and I'll leave it at that.

IMO MOO

We won't know for sure what was said until SC testifies but they also supposedly said "looked like he'd been in a fight".

 

[sunshineray]

I would venture to guess that there are videos at both locations. Holeman doesn't have to share every detail about how they excluded BH.

Let's also not forget Murphy also said on the stand that he could never prove BH, PW or EF were in Delphi during the time of the murders.

JMO

And that from an ISP officer who was actually on the FBI's Joint Task Force not just some random officer running the video equipment for interviews from Rushville PD.

 

[sunshineray]

Depending on the management, they might not have known if he was actually there.

In my personal experience, people clocking each other in and out became so much of a problem that the manager began collecting time cards after lunch and handing them out to the right people at quitting time.

I don't find key fobs to be solid proof, either.

I want to see him on vid in both cases.

Well if ISP Murphy has just testified under oath that they could never put BH at the scene, he probably has seen the video confirmation of his alibi and probably eyewitness interviews of his work mates to back it up. MO

 

[sunshineray]

There’s no supporting evidence that he was actually the one who clocked in or attended the gym. There’s no discussion with coworkers, video evidence, digital evidence etc. I would never consider this a verified or solid alibi. IMO It is simply a possibility of what happened that day.

MOO

We can either take ISP Murphy at his word under oath or not. I would choose to believe the person who was actually on an FBI Joint Task Force would not lie under oath. To what end would he do so? To frame an innocent CVS worker with no prior record? I don't believe so, AJMO

 

[grannygates]

Well if ISP Murphy has just testified under oath that they could never put BH at the scene, he probably has seen the video confirmation of his alibi and probably eyewitness interviews of his work mates to back it up. MO

How do you get there? The officer who spoke with the HR woman stated he did not collect or even look at the video from the work site nor did he interview coworkers. There is no indication that any of that exists.

 

[grannygates]

We can either take ISP Murphy at his word under oath or not. I would choose to believe the person who was actually on an FBI Joint Task Force would not lie under oath. To what end would he do so? To frame an innocent CVS worker with no prior record? I don't believe so, AJMO

I don’t think I’m following, sorry. Take Murphy at his word saying what exactly ?

 

[susiQ]

At the end of the day, there exists documentary evidence that he clocked in to work, and into the gym and zero evidence that someone else did it for him - that is just wild speculation IMO

I beg to differ. It is not “wild speculation” for someone to have used BH’s fob at the gym. I have on numerous occasions used a family member’s fob to access underground parking, access to their apartment or their car. JMO

 

[sunshineray]

I don’t think I’m following, sorry. Take Murphy at his word saying what exactly ?

Under oath, that he could never, during his investigations, put BH et al at the crime scene. He answered, "No" he could not put BH there.

 

[vinayd]

It would be important to know what BH does for a living. Just because some mystery person can clock in doesn't mean they can do the job. Do we have to assume they also worked there? If it was a family member did he train them? I'm not training a family member to get in all my systems, make it to my meetings and take lunch on time all while I'm committing a crime.

 

[sunshineray]

I beg to differ. It is not “wild speculation” for someone to have used BH’s fob at the gym. I have on numerous occasions used a family member’s fob to access underground parking, access to their apartment or their car. JMO

Do we know if BH was or wasn't seen at the gym by anyone else there? Those are definitely things that would have been investigated. Since ISP Murphy has testified that within all the investigating he did, he was not able to place BH at the crime scene I'm guessing whatever info he uncovered at the gym was involved in forming his statement in court yesterday. AJMO