Accident or Intentional; Evidence and Debate(MERGED)

[Truth Seeker]

I have to agree with Dr. G. It was not an accident.

She cited three reasons she found Caylee's death to likely be a homicide.

1.Casey's one month delay in reporting Caylee missing was a definite “red flag.”

2. She noted that Caylee's body was hidden in a plastic bag in a wooded area, another indication of murder.

3. She noted there would never be a reason to place duct tape on a child's face – before or after death.

THE END

 

[erinleigh]

IF it were an accident I would expect the defense to paint a full picture of June 16th 2008. If Casey's cell phone pings/computer use place her in the Anthony home until 4pm (place of the "accident") and we know GA left for work prior to 4pm then a practical mind would be led to expect the DT to answer the following
1. Did GA leave with Caylee, if so what time?
2. What he used to transport Caylee's body? (car, stroller, walked out the door with a body?)
3. Whether he placed duct tape on Caylee - (did he enter the garage to get it?)
4. When was Caylee dressed in the Big Trouble shirt. (did she sleep in it the night prior or was she dressed in the morning?)
basically if it were an accident I would think the DT would have laid out a clear timeline of the events and what exactly GA did in the house. There wouldn't be this vague timline that opening statements offered and there the holes would be filled in from WHAT DID YOU DO - to Roy Krunk. Are we to believe Casey had no knowledge of the next step taken by GA when evidence keeps her at the home until 4pm?
This BIG HOLE in the DT opening statement and the lack of testimony filling in these holes on DTs CIC lead me again to murder and GA having no knowledge of this.

 

[Whaleshark]

I voted for accident... :truce:

I don't think Caylee drowned in the pool! Nor do I believe GA was involved in any way. My thought (as i posted on another thread) is ICA used the duct tape to hold in place a cloth/rag soaked in chloroform over Caylee's nose and mouth to keep her from waking up. When ICA returned she found Caylee dead. ICA murdered her daughter due to negligence, but I do not think it was premeditated. I believe she just wanted her "asleep" so she could have her fun. I pray she is found guilty on all charges! LWOP works for me! JMO

Since the tape was still found stuck to the skull, wouldn't you presume the soaked rag it would be holding still stuck there too?

 

[ladylurker]

Diane Diamond's interview with Tracy Conroy is fascinating. She was an associate of Padilla's firm who lived with the Anthony's while Casey was out on bail.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/06/22/casey-s-rommate-tells-all.html

WWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!! thanks for the link! i hope the SA calls her when it is time to rebut. i know the jury would probably love any information they could get that would help them get into the mind of ICA to properly deliberate... an outside party with that much connection to ICA would probably be helpful. am i right in thinking she is not on the SA list? i am sure someone will forward this article (from today) to the SA and i wonder what they will think....

IF it were an accident I would expect the defense to paint a full picture of June 16th 2008.

snipped for length, but this sentence made me think. the defense insists that they needn't prove anything, that the burden of proof is on the state. while this is true, the inmate faces the death penalty!!! the burden of proof may not be on the defense but you would think they would be interested in fighting for ICA's life... isn't that what they are hired to do? i would think it would be in ICA's best interest for the defense to lay out a believable timeline of events that can in some way be backed up by some sort of evidence so that the jury can properly understand their argument.

 

[Dignity4Victims]

The timing of Caylee's sudden death will always convince me that this was intentionally done at the hands of Casey Anthony.

Casey is stealing money from everyone to include Amy, Cindy, Caylee's piggy bank, and her own grandfather's nursing home account.

There has been an ongoing, seemingly life-long raging jealousy from Casey towards Cindy over Caylee, beginning at birth when the nurse handed Caylee to Cindy rather than Casey.

Cindy writes about the jealousy in her myspace letter to Casey, so much so that "jealousy" became the overpowering theme of the letter.

Casey complained to many of her friends about Cindy on a regular basis.

Many of Casey's own spoken words are a reflection of the message she was sending to Cindy, "Zanny was trying to teach me a lesson", etc. - indicative of Cindy's earlier visits to her counselor about the situation between herself and Casey.

The counselor suggested that she toss Casey from the home and keep Caylee.

Cindy threatened even down to one of the 911 calls, to take Casey to court and gain custody of Caylee.

Cindy knew that Casey was capable of something horrific, her immediate words to Casey as soon as Cindy found out Caylee was "missing", - "what have you done?!"

Lee reiterated in his sworn testimony that Cindy had referred to Casey as a "bad mother".

Mainly, Casey's own words, "maybe because I'm a spiteful b!tch!"

And last but not least, "“the b!tch knows what it feels like now", written by Casey in one of her jail house letters about the pain Cindy is feeling.

Intentional, no accident, period.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

My feeling at this moment is that ICA chloroformed and duct taped this child so that she could go meet up with lover boy. I think Caylee died as a result of the two...chloroform and duct tape. I find it less likely she intended to kill this precious child (of course, I'm not completely convinced that she didn't either), but either way, the end result is the same to me. She killed this child, imo, let her poor body rot in the trunk of the car and then dumped the body in a trash heap. First degree murder? Check.

Am I open to hearing any evidence to the contrary? Absolutely. After hearing the testimony and "evidence" presented by the DT thus far, do I think my mind might be changed? No I don't.

JMO

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

I can only refer back to what has been previously said. Unfortunately, the author of the following escapes me but the words express everything I was thinking after hearing the DT OS:

No one covers up an accident by pretending it's a murder.

No amount of dysfunction, abuse; sexual, verbal or emotional, in the Anthony family will ever explain that away for me. I believe Caylee's demise was intentional.

 

[Pink Panther]

This case is so obvious it's disgusting to watch.

moo

 

[Capri]

Which is more cost effective, lethal injection or life in prison? (Assuming she uses all her appeals before lethal injection)

 

[Mosby]

Like many others have said, I have always believed she committed murder but held out a tiny glimmer of hope that it was an accidental drowning and very bad cover up. That tiny glimmer was dashed when I heard the DT opening statement. That wild fantasyland story where she is guility of absolutely NOTHING let me know loud and clear that this was indeed 1st degree murder. No reason in this world to go to those crazy lengths unless you are trying to cover for something heinous. Had it been an accidental drowning you would not go to those lengths.

That whole story was fabricated by ICA and her DT.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I can only refer back to what has been previously said. Unfortunately, the author of the following escapes me but the words express everything I was thinking after hearing the DT OS:

No one covers up an accident by pretending it's a murder.

No amount of dysfunction, abuse; sexual, verbal or emotional, in the Anthony family will ever explain that away for me. I believe Caylee's demise was intentional.

Well, they sometimes do if the death is unintentional but resulted during the commission of a crime.

 

[complex]

It was an accident..... that she got caught.

 

[Icky Etardo]

Which is more cost effective, lethal injection or life in prison? (Assuming she uses all her appeals before lethal injection)

Life in Prison is far, far cheaper:

http://www.deathpenalty.org/article.php?id=42

From the article:

Using conservative rough projections, the Commission estimates the annual costs of the present (death penalty) system to be $137 million per year...(snip)

...The cost of a system which imposes a maximum penalty of lifetime incarceration instead of the death penalty would be $11.5 million per year.

(the figures apply to the State of California alone)

 

[PaulaF513]

I voted for accident... :truce:

I don't think Caylee drowned in the pool! Nor do I believe GA was involved in any way. My thought (as i posted on another thread) is ICA used the duct tape to hold in place a cloth/rag soaked in chloroform over Caylee's nose and mouth to keep her from waking up. When ICA returned she found Caylee dead. ICA murdered her daughter due to negligence, but I do not think it was premeditated. I believe she just wanted her "asleep" so she could have her fun. I pray she is found guilty on all charges! LWOP works for me! JMO

I too thought about a rag being held in place by the duct tape....but if that was the case, it would have been found with the remains.

As far as Caylee getting sick from chloroform, how do we know she didn't get sick? But I don't think this has been a long time practice of KC's. The computer searches are fairly recent and remember that KC didn't need to resort to such measures very often. She had parents who were all too willing to babysit when they were available.

I am conflicted about where Caylee died though. I was sure it was in the trunk of the car, but the 2 dog hits in the back yard have given me some pause to consider that it actually could have been right in the Anthony's house. KC is so nasty, imo, that I can imagine her drugging and/or taping Caylee because she wanted her to be quiet. And when she realized the baby was dead, contemplated burying her in the playhouse. Then she would have had to deal with the pavers and moving the structure and that was too much work for the princess. Thus, the laundry bag and trash bags and the garbage heap on Suburban Drive for her sweet child's final resting place.

I truly hope that the jury is paying attention to the defense's "case" and recognizes it for what it is...and calls Baez to task by finding his client guilty.

 

[PaulaF513]

WWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!! thanks for the link! i hope the SA calls her when it is time to rebut. i know the jury would probably love any information they could get that would help them get into the mind of ICA to properly deliberate... an outside party with that much connection to ICA would probably be helpful. am i right in thinking she is not on the SA list? i am sure someone will forward this article (from today) to the SA and i wonder what they will think....



snipped for length, but this sentence made me think. the defense insists that they needn't prove anything, that the burden of proof is on the state. while this is true, the inmate faces the death penalty!!! the burden of proof may not be on the defense but you would think they would be interested in fighting for ICA's life... isn't that what they are hired to do? i would think it would be in ICA's best interest for the defense to lay out a believable timeline of events that can in some way be backed up by some sort of evidence so that the jury can properly understand their argument.

There is a timeline but I doubt it's going to be useful to the defense of this cold blooded murderer. That's why Baez is plodding along trying to chip away little points that have already been acknowledged by the SA.

That article is indeed provocative. JA should reconsider bringing Ms. Conroy to Orlando for his rebuttal. Her notes will positively absolve GA of any complicity and paint a realistic picture of the defendent during what should have been her darkest hours.

 

[katydid23]

WWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!! thanks for the link! i hope the SA calls her when it is time to rebut. i know the jury would probably love any information they could get that would help them get into the mind of ICA to properly deliberate... an outside party with that much connection to ICA would probably be helpful. am i right in thinking she is not on the SA list? i am sure someone will forward this article (from today) to the SA and i wonder what they will think....



snipped for length, but this sentence made me think. the defense insists that they needn't prove anything, that the burden of proof is on the state. while this is true, the inmate faces the death penalty!!! the burden of proof may not be on the defense but you would think they would be interested in fighting for ICA's life... isn't that what they are hired to do? i would think it would be in ICA's best interest for the defense to lay out a believable timeline of events that can in some way be backed up by some sort of evidence so that the jury can properly understand their argument.

Tracy was deposed by the FBI so the SA already knows most of this startling behavior by Casey. I think they decided against calling her because of some baggage in her background. But I wish they would consider calling her to testify to George attacking ICA and wanting to know what happened to his grandbaby.

I agree that they do not need to 'prove' anything as the defense team. But if they put a theory or a defendant's own version of events out there, that are supposed to prove her innocence, then they should give enough information to make it sound plausible. But Baez says the time will never be known, or something silly like that. That just screams LIE , imo. How could both George and Casey be home and witness the worst tragedy of their lives, yet they have no idea 'what time of day it was."??????

 

[HRCODEPINK]

IMO, the only accident that snowballed out of control in that house is/was Casey, herself.

 

[strach304]

I too thought about a rag being held in place by the duct tape....but if that was the case, it would have been found with the remains.

As far as Caylee getting sick from chloroform, how do we know she didn't get sick? But I don't think this has been a long time practice of KC's. The computer searches are fairly recent and remember that KC didn't need to resort to such measures very often. She had parents who were all too willing to babysit when they were available.

I am conflicted about where Caylee died though. I was sure it was in the trunk of the car, but the 2 dog hits in the back yard have given me some pause to consider that it actually could have been right in the Anthony's house. KC is so nasty, imo, that I can imagine her drugging and/or taping Caylee because she wanted her to be quiet. And when she realized the baby was dead, contemplated burying her in the playhouse. Then she would have had to deal with the pavers and moving the structure and that was too much work for the princess. Thus, the laundry bag and trash bags and the garbage heap on Suburban Drive for her sweet child's final resting place.

I truly hope that the jury is paying attention to the defense's "case" and recognizes it for what it is...and calls Baez to task by finding his client guilty.

Paper towels. Wouldn't have been a trace of them left.

 

[jane the dood]

Diane Diamond's interview with Tracy Conroy is fascinating. She was an associate of Padilla's firm who lived with the Anthony's while Casey was out on bail.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/06/22/casey-s-rommate-tells-all.html

Fascinating reading. What a cold-blooded creature ICA is....completely narcissistic. Me me me.

At the beginning of this case, I was willing to entertain the theory that Caylee's death was an accident, the result of an unintentional overdose administered by her mother.

But after listening to the State's case, I am firmly convinced it was premeditated murder. The defense - so far - has shown nothing that would change my mind.

Why premeditated murder? Those 84 hits on "How to make chloroform." Searches for neck breaking and assorted fatal injuries. The totally self-indulgent behavior during those 31 days Caylee was "missing." The lies. Oh, the lies! The constant, relentless lies.

After June 16th, Casey knew Caylee was already dead because she killed her. She was a burden. She took too much attention away from Casey. I have a theory that Casey got pregnant on purpose, thinking, "Whoopee! Now the parents have to take care of me AND my kid for the next 18 years and I can party hearty!" JMO.

But when her mother pressured her to take more responsibility, I think she fumed and fumed and plotted and planned ... and then killed her child. Freaked out trying to figure out what to do with Caylee's body. Packaged her up with duct tape and bags and threw her in the car trunk until the odor got to be too bad. Then she tossed her into the woods, into a garbage pile.

And how did this so-called loving mother "grieve?" She celebrated by spending a whole day and night in bed with Tony Lazzaro. The Hot Body contest. Shopping sprees (with other people's money). The tattoo. She was a happy camper...no more kid! And certainly no pesky job to worry about! Now it's back to being all about Casey! A beautiful life!

She is GUILTY.

That said, I don't believe she will get the death penalty. LWOP. I think anyone who throws their child into the woods and lets her body be dismembered and eaten by animals deserves the needle, but I doubt that will happen. But I'm fine with having her locked up for the rest of her miserable life.

*Jumps off soapbox*

 

[gamom]

I use to think this could have really been an accident that "snowballed out of controll" but now, seeing that KC can sit in jail for 3 years, put her family through hell and slap the face of her family who have stood behind her all of these years...she has proved to me that she is really a cold hearted person. I have no doubt in my mind that she killed Caylee on purpose. She has no remorse. Very sad.