Found Deceased AL - Paighton Houston, 29, left bar with 2 men, Birmingham, 20 Dec 2019 #5

[Momma2cam]

If you r 100% sure it is the suspect can you link it?

Yes. Fred Smith

 

[ReillyElizabeth]

The DA isn't doing the investigating, and if you read closely, that is not what he said at all. He said that it was based on the statements of her co-workers. As we know that the co-workers statements have been inconsistent, we do not have any evidence that anybody was there. Not saying there were or the weren't, only that there are no facts to support it. In fact, when the detective was asked about it at the press conference announcing the warrant, he had no comment, which should give you a clue, considering that it was police that stated she was last seen leaving Tin Roof with two heavy set black males. Seems that LE isn't sold on the idea that they were there either.

I’m sure the DA knows what the evidence is. And I’m not sure what you think the term evidence means, but witness testimony is evidence. If a witness has provided inconsistent statements, that evidence may not carry as much weight, or may not be uncontroverted, but it is still evidence. We also don’t know whether the witnesses have been inconsistent on this particular point, nor do we know whether there is other evidence that FH and/or PH were at the Tin Roof.

 

[Momof4RN]

The DA isn't doing the investigating, and if you read closely, that is not what he said at all. He said that it was based on the statements of her co-workers. As we know that the co-workers statements have been inconsistent, we do not have any evidence that anybody was there. Not saying there were or the weren't, only that there are no facts to support it. In fact, when the detective was asked about it at the press conference announcing the warrant, he had no comment, which should give you a clue, considering that it was police that stated she was last seen leaving Tin Roof with two heavy set black males. Seems that LE isn't sold on the idea that they were there either.

Just to clarify the DA is a she not a he.

 

[rickcross]

I’m sure the DA knows what the evidence is. And I’m not sure what you think the term evidence means, but witness testimony is evidence. If a witness has provided inconsistent statements, that evidence may not carry as much weight, or may not be uncontroverted, but it is still evidence. We also don’t know whether the witnesses have been inconsistent on this particular point, nor do we know whether there is other evidence that FH and/or PH were at the Tin Roof.

A statement isn't really evidence unless it is backed by fact. For instance, if they were captured by security camera, if they could provide purchase receipts, or if a waitress or other patron could positively confirm that they were there. Until something like this is provided, then there is nothing but the statement of people that could very well be involved, telling us that they were there.

 

[rickcross]

Just to clarify the DA is a she not a he.

Noted. I read her statement so I didn't see her.

 

[rickcross]

As an aside, just remember that police will outright lie in their statements. Remember Jayme Closs? The police chief stated that the perp never stepped more than a couple of feet inside that house. At the trial we learned how completely inaccurate that statement was.

It is in the best interest of LE to keep the public as misinformed as possible.

 

[Van Helsing]

8320 12th Ave S (from Heavy.com) was his 1992 address. FYI, that's in Eastlake. It is one of the last roads under Ruffner Mountain. I had a friend who lived in that area in the early 1980s. The area wasn't too bad back then.
8320 12th Ave s, birminghal, al at DuckDuckGo

 

[Momma2cam]

A statement isn't really evidence unless it is backed by fact. For instance, if they were captured by security camera, if they could provide purchase receipts, or if a waitress or other patron could positively confirm that they were there. Until something like this is provided, then there is nothing but the statement of people that could very well be involved, telling us that they were there.

LE stated they have evidence that they were together the night of the 20th and 21st and no signs of force. I presume that evidence involves much more than just the co-workers statements. They would not release that to the public or even to PH's family for that matter. Moo

 

[FrostedGlass]

8320 12th Ave S (from Heavy.com) was his 1992 address. FYI, that's in Eastlake. It is one of the last roads under Ruffner Mountain. I had a friend who lived in that area in the early 1980s. The area wasn't too bad back then.
8320 12th Ave s, birminghal, al at DuckDuckGo

I'm totally confused. Isn't that the same addy given in the SO registry?

 

[What if...]

As an aside, just remember that police will outright lie in their statements. Remember Jayme Closs? The police chief stated that the perp never stepped more than a couple of feet inside that house. At the trial we learned how completely inaccurate that statement was.

It is in the best interest of LE to keep the public as misinformed as possible.

I fully agree that LE will often say whatever they believe will help them with the investigation, but more often than not, the DA will very selective with any statements they put out regarding what they consider to be factual evidence. The last thing any DA wants is to put out a statement that could be construed as detrimental during the trial phase.
IMOO, PH & FH we’re both at the TR that night. What I am wondering, however, is whether or not either of them actually entered the bar...

 

[rickcross]

LE stated they have evidence that they were together the night of the 20th and 21st and no signs of force. I presume that evidence involves much more than just the co-workers statements. They would not release that to the public or even to PH's family for that matter. Moo

Listen again closely. He said they have evidence that they were together, but he never mentions when or where. When asked specifically if they were at Tin Roof, he declines to answer. Very strange because they have always stated that she was last seen at Tin Roof, now they will not confirm it. IMO this means one thing, they do not have confidence in the people that gave that information. That was the latest from LE, that is what we should be going on.

As for the DA, she really would not have a ton of information at this point. Once LE builds a case, it is presented to the DA, who then approves that charges are fileable.

 

[rickcross]

I fully agree that LE will often say whatever they believe will help them with the investigation, but more often than not, the DA will very selective with any statements they put out regarding what they consider to be factual evidence. The last thing any DA wants is to put out a statement that could be construed as detrimental during the trial phase.
IMOO, PH & FH we’re both at the TR that night. What I am wondering, however, is whether or not either of them actually entered the bar...

We know PH and FH had to meet somewhere. Could have been at TR, but could have been elsewhere. In my opinion, if FH was called as a source for drugs, it would have been easier to meet at GCs house, rather than paying a cover at a bar and leaving almost immediately. I am of the opinion that GC simply was writing herself out of the event, claiming she went to the bar and left PH with the two black men. I believe FH was known to GC and that a meeting was set up. I believe that GC, not PH, was the one that was looking to score. I believe that they went to that residence and while there, something happened to PH. I believe at that point GC and whoever she was with sent the text, then may have headed to Tin Roof.

All MOO.

 

[Momma2cam]

Listen again closely. He said they have evidence that they were together, but he never mentions when or where. When asked specifically if they were at Tin Roof, he declines to answer. Very strange because they have always stated that she was last seen at Tin Roof, now they will not confirm it. IMO this means one thing, they do not have confidence in the people that gave that information. That was the latest from LE, that is what we should be going on.

As for the DA, she really would not have a ton of information at this point. Once LE builds a case, it is presented to the DA, who then approves that charges are fileable.

Sure. I think LE knows who was at TR. I am thinking more about the emphasis on there being no force and no physical trauma to her body. Whether she was at TR or not is yet to be known but it doesn't seem she was with PH against her will- at least initially. MOO

 

[Momma2cam]

We know PH and FH had to meet somewhere. Could have been at TR, but could have been elsewhere. In my opinion, if FH was called as a source for drugs, it would have been easier to meet at GCs house, rather than paying a cover at a bar and leaving almost immediately. I am of the opinion that GC simply was writing herself out of the event, claiming she went to the bar and left PH with the two black men. I believe FH was known to GC and that a meeting was set up. I believe that GC, not PH, was the one that was looking to score. I believe that they went to that residence and while there, something happened to PH. I believe at that point GC and whoever she was with sent the text, then may have headed to Tin Roof.

All MOO.

I have a similar theory but am not convinced it was one over the other trying to score. Moo

 

[Seattle1]

If FH lives on 12th Ave. South and the Tin Roof Bar is on 7th Ave. South does that mean FH lives only 5 blocks from the bar?

According to google maps -- 12th Ave South is about 1.1 miles away from the TRB.

Google Maps

ETA: Map above only reflects 12th Ave So. Map below includes a Street number on 12th Ave So but I don't know if it's confirmed. Nonetheless -- his residence is not 5 blocks from TRB.

AL - Paighton Houston, 29, left bar with 2 men, Birmingham, 20 Dec 2019 #5

 

[Seattle1]

Agree. I think when a reporter asked, LE repeated just that they knew they were together on the night of the 20th and 21st and they had no evidence of force being used ( not direct quote).

During the presser, I believe the Sheriff stated they have evidence that FH was at the TRB on Dec 20 although he did not confirm that PH left willingly with him (a la two HBM). Sheriff also stated that they have evidence they were together at the McClinton St residence in Brighton where PH died. Same was reported in MSM.

ETA: Sorry - it was the DA that stated FH was at the TRB and Sheriff confirmed they were together in Brighton. Please reference the VIDEO interview with DA for complete info. Video at link below

Jefferson Co. district attorney asks for tips as search continues for suspect Fredrick Hampton

 

[Van Helsing]

According to google maps -- 12th Ave South is about 1.1 miles away from the TRB.

Google Maps

True. If you enter the exact address it will bring up the Eastlake location, at least on Duck Duck Go. I have seen this before, where the same street name shows up in different locations separated by some distance. Apparently the post office just uses the house numbers to differentiate between the locations.

 

[bwt42]

8320 12th Ave S (from Heavy.com) was his 1992 address. FYI, that's in Eastlake. It is one of the last roads under Ruffner Mountain. I had a friend who lived in that area in the early 1980s. The area wasn't too bad back then.
8320 12th Ave s, birminghal, al at DuckDuckGo

I thought I saw this address listed on the RSO list

 

[Seattle1]

Hampton was initially held in the Birmingham City Jail on a 48-hour extension on suspicion of kidnapping beginning Saturday, Dec. 28, but was released two days later because investigators did not have enough to charge him with any crime.

Paighton Houston update: Man charged with abuse of corpse, no physical trauma led to death

Was there ever any clarification that the kidnapping suspicion on 12/28 was related to PH? Is there any possibility he was being held in connection to another kidnapping case? There were a few I have come across that occurred earlier in December.

No - he was detained in relation to PH investigation but they did not have the evidence of her body yet and that she was buried on his relative's property timely enough and therefore he had to be released (36 hours is generally the rule but LE obtained a 12 hour extension).

 

[evilwise]

The Alabama Statute for Abuse of a Corpse reads:

Abuse of a corpse, Ala. Code § 13A-11-13.
It is a felony to treat a human corpse in a way that would outrage ordinary family sensibilities, unless the action is specifically allowed by law. Abuse of a corpse may include signing a certificate as having embalmed, cremated, or prepared a human body for burial when, in fact, the services were not performed as indicated. A finding of guilty for this offense must include a specific intent toward the corpse in question. The penalty for this crime is a term of imprisonment not to exceed ten years and/or a fine of up to $5,000.
Alabama Annotations - Burial Law Project - American University Washington College of Law

What else could they potentially get him on? Because he'll still be plenty young to cause harm in 10 years.

I'll take rape for $1000, Alex. All they need is one person to make a statement that she was given drugs to get her to go along with something sexual. I feel pretty confident other felonies were committed too. Maybe drug trafficking, possession of a firearm under disability perhaps. In some states failing to report a death is a crime. Many other things may emerge during questioning. If they can't get him for any kind of homicide I'm sure they'll throw the book at him.