Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #40

[Amee]

In another section, titled "Fear", the mother talks of the shame she would feel should her marriage fall apart.

"I don't want to be alone," Allison wrote.

"I am afraid of being alone and lonely, maybe because I think I can't handle it.

"I am afraid of failing - failing in my marriage and what people will think."

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...she-disappeared/story-e6freoof-1226537242449#

my friend and I were chatting this morning about Allisons diary. The above entries we both related to very well, thinking the same things ,after catching our husbands out having affairs. Its such a shame Allison didnt get the chance to see how strong, well loved , happy and successful not only being a mum but career wise she could have been. Also how not all small town gossip sees a broken marriage as failure, a lot of people do actually stick by and support you. My heart just breaks more and more when I read the latest MSM's

 

[Cobo]

I thought the caterpillars were initially the reason for the scratches?

 

[Makara]

Mods if this isn't allowed please delete. If anyone can find a link online please share. This is from p2 of today's courier mail. Article by Kate kyriacou and Brooke baskin.

"Justice Peter applegarth heard several parts of the Crown's case had been disproven since the first bail application - including the existence of a call using the FaceTime app apparently made by Baden-clay to his father during the early hours of April 20.

The court was told the prosecution would no longer rely on a google search for 'taking the fith' that Baden clay did days before his wife's death.

Justice applegarth told the court Baden-clay had since explained he googled the term to get its meaning after watching a television show where the saying was used......justice applegarth said police checks of the television show and the time it aired checked out."

I haven't seen this anywhere else surprisingly - it was I thought - a pretty crucial piece of evidence. I wonder why they were disproven?

Thoughts on this?

Thanks Champagne4lulu. I really do feel that this is just a bit of confusing journalism. IMO the app referred to was the 'find my iphone' (or whatever it's called). GBC allegedly used this app to find Allison but then stated to Police that he'd never used this app at all, so perhaps the CM journo's have confused this evidence. Secondly there is hard copy evidence (actual phone records) of the FaceTime call from GBC's phone to NBC's phone.

According to court evidence from the first bail hearing, GBC searched "taking the fifth' on the night Allison went missing and again just prior to calling the Police on the Friday morning. Yes, he probably saw that term mentioned on a television show in the days proceeding Allison's murder but why look it up not once, but twice so close to the time he reported Allison missing?

Alioop was in court yesterday and she would be the best one to shed more light on this.

MOO.

 

[Makara]

OK - just been for a bit of a drive around Fig Tree Pocket.

<Respectfully snipped>

Thanks for doing that Doc. Much appreciated as I live in NSW and don't know the Fig Tree Pocket area at all.

 

[Makara]

I thought the caterpillars were initially the reason for the scratches?

Only in GBC's mind!

 

[Champagne4lulu]

Thanks Champagne4lulu. I really do feel that this is just a bit of confusing journalism. IMO the app referred to was the 'find my iphone' (or whatever it's called). GBC allegedly used this app to find Allison but then stated to Police that he'd never used this app at all, so perhaps the CM journo's have confused this evidence. Secondly there is hard copy evidence (actual phone records) of the FaceTime call from GBC's phone to NBC's phone.

According to court evidence from the first bail hearing, GBC searched "taking the fifth' on the night Allison went missing and again just prior to calling the Police on the Friday morning. Yes, he probably saw that term mentioned on a television show in the days proceeding Allison's murder but why look it up not once, but twice so close to the time he reported Allison missing?

Alioop was in court yesterday and she would be the best one to shed more light on this.

MOO.

Thanks my love

Lets see what alioop has to say. Hopefully some misreporting...

 

[Makara]

Thanks very much Doc. I appreciate your effort and kindness for doing the leg work for me...

I'm using mathematics to endeavour to locate where Allison's phone could possibly have been at the time the call was made according to the towers.

If the FTP tower recorded the, let's say 'ping', at a certain time then the phone had to be closer to the FTP tower than any other tower I figure (using common sense).

There are conflicting references to the time the call (or text or ping) was made from Allison's phone according to different media sources - one is 6.21 another 6.31 and yet another 6.51am. (I'll go with what Alioop says over what a reporter may have written down - no offence intended to the journos).

Does anyone remember when the GBC call was made? Did they say a time or was it a general 'few minutes later??

Doc... You're getting me thinking that back way again to the Brookfield house. Dare I mention it...... Rafting Ground Rd!!!

I love how your mind works MM.

 

[Amee]

Baden-Clay asked for the information to be kept confidential "stating that his father and sister did not know" about the affair.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/na...baden-clays-face/story-fndo45r1-1226537344568

yeah right!!

 

[Thinking]

I thought the caterpillars were initially the reason for the scratches?

From memory I think this was his excuse for the scratches that were also found on his torso - which interestingly weren't mentioned yesterday. Does this sound right?

 

[grannie]

Court releases journal entries by Allison Baden-Clay, one written days before she disappeared

 

[Karo]

I don't believe OW would have known or been involved, else why would she tell the police what the moron told the children that morning?

 

[DrWatson]

I don't believe OW would have known or been involved, else why would she tell the police what the moron told the children that morning?

Good point. It's a bit incriminating, isn't it?

Just re that point about the "Find My Friends" app - the way I read that, he texted Allison suggesting that he HAD used the app, and told the police that he had, to try and find her. But examination of the phone showed that the app had NOT been used - that was the way I interpreted the Judge's comments.

Could be wrong though....

 

[Makara]

Good point. It's a bit incriminating, isn't it?

Just re that point about the "Find My Friends" app - the way I read that, he texted Allison suggesting that he HAD used the app, and told the police that he had, to try and find her. But examination of the phone showed that the app had NOT been used - that was the way I interpreted the Judge's comments.

Could be wrong though....

Yes your right Doc. Sorry, I'm still trying to take in all of this new info.

 

[DrWatson]

@Alioop: The judge read out the wording in the autopsy report and said that it says toxicity can't be excluded as a cause of death. Peter Davis said that no other cause of death was identified and that the levels of metabolites in her body have found to be fatal in other cases. I think he was referring to the zoloft as i am not sure of the connection between that and the metabolites (DOC CAN YOU HELP EXPLAIN PLEASE). There was mention of .2mg of metabolite.

All drugs get metabolized, usually by the liver or kidneys. Plenty of other ways as well though. So as well as measuring the levels of the primary drug (eg Zoloft) the labs can often measure the different stages of metabolism of a drug by measuring the known metabolites - i.e. the breakdown products of the drug. And sometimes it is the metabolites that are the active components - in fact, many drugs work that way.

In the case of Zoloft (real name sertraline), the active metabolite is norsertraline, which can be measured. But I don't know what the levels would be that would (a) be expected in the liver, due to that first-pass principle I posted previously, and (b) what level would cause adverse effects. I also don't know how one could extrapolate from a level found in blood from the liver, to the levels that would be in the general circulation.

Any pharmacologists around the place?

EDIT: I may be able to check with a pharmacologist early next week, if it's still of relevance, but would also need to know what levels were actually found in that blood taken from the liver, after 11 days.

 

[indogwetrust]

I agree Curious, Allison's diary notes are just heartbreaking. Referring to GBC as her partner may have been a psychological thing on Allison's part. Perhaps she felt that she had lost her 'husband' to TM. Allison's diary notes have certainly revealed GBC as a cold, callous *advertiser censored*!

I also felt awkward reading Allison's diary notes, given they were private never intended for mass consumption, such personal thoughts and feelings.

One thing which raised the hair on the back of my neck - apologies if it has already been noted, am behind with reading the posts - was this:
"Do you regret the whole thing or just getting court (sic)."

Allison was educated, a spelling mistake such as this - court instead of caught - doesn't seem consistent with her level of education. It's chilling because it is prescient ... and it turns out that GBC just may be 'caught by the Supreme Court'.
I wonder if it was a Freudian slip?

 

[grannie]

Most of the affidavits filed by the defence were by supporters of GBC to say they would provide surety, $800,000 in total, for his bail if it were to be granted. Some names were mentioned but they weren't names I had heard of and see no need to post.

Alioop, thank you very much for sharing that (the whole thing, I mean). Re: names, could you tell whether those were predominantly male or female? I am just wondering who still wants to support the b... BC. Don't people realise that if GBC is found guilty, not only they lose the money, but they will be the supporters of a murderer?

 

[DrWatson]

@Indogwetrust: (love that nick, by the way)

Good pick-up re the spelling of "court". But alas, a good education doesn't necessarily mean good spelling. One of my nieces is a young teacher, and despite having gone to one of Brisbane's best schools, and having gone through teacher training at University, she still is a hopeless speller, and still uses the word "like" every third word or so. And she hates me correcting her when she misuses "its" vs "it's", or "your" vs "you're" for example. And spelling "caught" as "court" is, unfortunately, something that I can see her doing.

I think it's the fault of the DNA - National Dyslexics Association.... :blushing:

 

[indogwetrust]

@Indogwetrust: (love that nick, by the way)

Good pick-up re the spelling of "court". But alas, a good education doesn't necessarily mean good spelling. One of my nieces is a young teacher, and despite having gone to one of Brisbane's best schools, and having gone through teacher training at University, she still is a hopeless speller, and still uses the word "like" every third word or so. And she hates me correcting her when she misuses "its" vs "it's", or "your" vs "you're" for example. And spelling "caught" as "court" is, unfortunately, something that I can see her doing.

I think it's the fault of the DNA - National Dyslexics Association.... :blushing:

'Tis true, my dear Dr Watson - a sad and lamentable fact re:the state of spelling, especially amongst those who have a good education. I too am a member of DNA :blushing:
But at the very least it's ironical and a tad ... what's the word ...? Can only hear the 'Twilight Zone' music playing.

 

[grannie]

Personally I do not think this 'Tight-Ar$$e' would have willingly got rid of an i-phone or anything that had a resale value. He probably kept the phone and dumped the sim card the night before.

>>6.20am: Police allege Mr Baden-Clay sent a text message to Mrs Baden-Clay saying: "Good morning! Hope you slept well? Where are you? None of the girls are up yet! Love G">>
Then...
>>6.41am: A second text message was reportedly sent saying "Al, getting concerned. Where are you? The app doesn't say either? [Two children] now up. I'm dressed and about to make lunches. Please just text me back or call! Love G".>>

What I do know (from experience) is that an i-phone still gets messages if still on 'i message' or whatever that app is called WITHOUT the sim card !

Then Daddy (clipping him across the ears) told him to get rid of it as after he messaged Allison on her phone and it pinged right there on the kitchen table !

>>7.15am: Mr Baden-Clay called triple-0.>> According to old Timeline.

We do know he said to the police
>>"I'm now driving the streets. My, my father's come over and, to look after the children," he said. >>

He was 'out' 'looking for Allison' ? Really ? I too think he was out getting rid of the phone. (grudgingly !) and while he was out phoned the cops

Good point. His texts sound as if he knew that Allison will never get them, alas. Too sugary, too false.. MOO.

 

[Thinking]

I also felt awkward reading Allison's diary notes, given they were private never intended for mass consumption, such personal thoughts and feelings.

One thing which raised the hair on the back of my neck - apologies if it has already been noted, am behind with reading the posts - was this:
"Do you regret the whole thing or just getting court (sic)."

Allison was educated, a spelling mistake such as this - court instead of caught - doesn't seem consistent with her level of education. It's chilling because it is prescient ... and it turns out that GBC just may be 'caught by the Supreme Court'.
I wonder if it was a Freudian slip?

I agree completely that it feels a bit wrong to be reading Allison's private diary entries - they are so very personal and telling of how hard things were for her.

The other thing that raised the hair on the back of my neck was the entry "Were you prepared to live with the guilt if I hadn't found out?" (BBM)

It seems he is able to live with the guilt of having done something much worse than having an affair MOO