Amanda Knox found guilty for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy #15

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I am not and have never been convinced that she and Sollecito murdered Meredith BARD. From reading this thread and other sites, it seems that people simply do not like her because she has a cold demeanor instead of a more pleasant one. Or rather people do not like her mannerisms, personality, and such. I have read many comments saying that you can tell she did it by the look in her eyes and that she is a psychopath, but there is no evidence that proves they did it beyond a shadow of doubt.

Even the evidence that supposedly indicates they were there (bra clasp, a drop of blood) is fickle. Meredith had at least 47 separate wounds and fought her perpetrator. How could Knox and Sollecito come out of that without a scratch and so little DNA at the crime scene? If they cleaned up, how did they manage to get rid of most of their DNA but Rudy's was still all over the place? They would have to be knowledgable.

I am not saying they are "innocent" or that they had no involvement, but I just do not believe they actually murdered Meredith BARD.

I am also curious about the motive. I have only heard that it was a "sex game" gone wrong, that it was a prank, and that Knox was jealous of Meredith. Where is the evidence that it was a "sex game" or a prank? Did people say that Knox was jealous of Meredith?

Where does this come from that AK and RS should have wounds, it a 3vs1 attack and Meredith's 40+ wounds help prove that.

How would you suppose RG(as lone wolf) avoided defensive wounds and no RG DNA under her nails. I mean he would need to restrain her, undress her, stab her from 2 separate directions and cover her mouth.
All this talk of DNA of RG being "all over" is tiresome. It was found in 4 places. In fact his defense argued that so little was found on the cuff of the jacket, it proved he didn't restrain her. If DNA was so easily left RGs would actually be all over Meredith, but in reality DNA isn't that easy to find or leave.

If we really wanna get technical the DNA on the blue hoodie shouldn't count, it was as "contaminated" as the bra clasp.
 
Was just looking on Google News for stories about Knox verdict: Saw many (Slate Magazine, The Atlantic, a Florida news venue, CNN, CBS, NBC, etc.).

It would seem as though most of the American media still feel the same as before (no evidence, all evidence points to Guede as lone wolf, the verdict is an outrage, the Italian system insane, Knox will never be extradited, etc.)

An example:

If the Kercher murder case was brought in the United States, it would be called "People vs. Rudy Guede." The evidence against Guede is strong. Guede, an apparently troubled young man who, at the time of Kercher’s murder, had just committed a series of break-ins, including one just days before the killing, where police caught him with an 11-inch knife (eerily similar to the weapon used to kill Kercher).

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2014/01/31/amanda-knox-guilty-verdict-outrage-darren-kavinoky

It's as if the annulment of the Hellman court and the upholding of Massei is seen as completely irrelevant, in every aspect.

I don't think I've ever seen a case where another country's judicial system is viewed as absolutely nonsensical.
 
A different perspective, from a British paper:

Amanda Knox could face detention in tough US jail

Amanda Knox could spend the duration of any extradition wrangle between the US and Italy locked up in a federal prison five miles from her home

Amanda Knox faces being incarcerated in a grim federal prison five miles from her parents' house for the duration of any extradition battle between the US and Italy, the Telegraph can reveal.

If Italy makes an extradition request, and the case is argued in US courts, she would be detained by US Marshals and sent to Seatac federal detention centre.

A guard was nearly beaten to death at the monolithic grey jail two years ago, his skull fractured by an inmate with a sink pipe. "Every day our lives are on the line, because we’re outnumbered by inmates,” one guard at the 10-storey prison said recently.

In a US extradition case the "fugitive" is held in a federal detention centre. Seatac, the only federal facility listed in Washington state, is a 10-minute drive from the suburban home where Knox watched Thursday's verdict on television.

"She'd be held wherever the federal detainees in that area are held. She would be treated as any other extradition detainee," Professor Julian Ku, who teaches transnational law at Hofstra University, told the Telegraph.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ox-could-face-detention-in-tough-US-jail.html
 
Linked from Vogt's freelance desk,

Italy's Corriere Della Sera:

warning : Google Translate :giggle:

INTERVIEW WITH ALESSANDRO NENCINI, PRESIDENT OF THE COURT OF ASSIZES OF APPEAL OF FLORENCE

Amanda and Raffaele, says the judge
, "I have children myself, it was a difficult choice"

"The defense had asked us to separate the positions of the two defendants But Raphael has not done interrogate»


"I feel liberated because the moment of decision is the most difficult. I also have children and impose sentences of 25 and 28 years to two boys is something emotionally very strong. " At 10 days after the judge Alessandro Nencini is in his office. The President of the Court of Assizes of Appeal of Florence, two nights ago held Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito guilty of the murder of Meredith Kercher is aware that "the judgment will open a new debate, especially the media," but because of this agree to explain how you arrived at a verdict.

You were twelve hours in closed session. The college was divided?
"The acts of this process occupy half the room, there are 30 surveys. The jurors, who are not insiders, had to take cognizance of the file to arrive at a joint decision, as it must be to a Court of Assizes. We must examine the documents, reason above. We did this by taking all the time necessary taking into account that the victim was a girl. "

And then you have reached unanimity? 'I spoke to shared decision-making. I can say that in all these months and especially at the time of the last meeting we felt the severity of a sentence involving children young people and families. This is a story that has upset many lives. "

Your was a narrow path, the Supreme Court had sought to "remedy" with respect to the second-instance judgment in Perugia which had acquitted the two defendants. "Not so, we had maximum practicability. The only constraint was that in case of acquittal would have to give reasons in a logical manner. There was no stake. " Even compared to the judgment entered against Rudy Guede? "In fact the peculiarity of the process was this: a person already convicted on summary judgment and a final competition for the same murder. The Supreme Court asked us to evaluate the role of competitors. We could say that there were two defendants, motivating convincingly. But we did not consider this to be the truth. "

Why did you not question Guede? "For what? He never confessed and even if we had called the right not to say anything. We have not deemed necessary. Instead it seemed important to investigate other aspects and in fact we have an expert report and heard the witnesses on which there were doubts. It is the role of the appellate courts. In four months we were able to get the definition.

[ ...........] Ye have condemned Amanda Knox but you do not have any protective order issued against him. Why? "It is legitimate that she is in the United States. At the time of the crime was in Italy for study and returned to her home after being acquitted. She is an American citizen. The problem will arise if there were to be a need to enforce the sentence. Now I do not think it was a necessary measure. "

Then why have confiscated his passport Raffaele Sollecito? "It was the minimum wage. In these cases, the order is to prevent something and we had to avoid if one is untraceable waiting for the final judgment. " It is enough to believe the travel ban? "Yes, we felt it was more than enough. If we were to be no developments will evaluate them. "

http://www.corriere.it/cronache/14_...ta-48072a24-8b06-11e3-bf44-9aaf223b3498.shtml
 
stayontopicdots_zps1f0298b7.gif


Discuss the case and not other websleuth members...
 

But in the same article he says the Italian press had done the same thing in the opposite direction AND that there's reasonable doubt. ITA agree with him:

Likewise, Dershowitz added, Knox should be outraged by the coverage of the case in Italy.

"They're treating this case as if she's Al Capone, as if there's no question about her innocence or guilt. It's become black and white. [In] Italy, she's guilty beyond any doubt. In America, she's innocent beyond any doubt," he said.

"The truth is it's a very close case. There's a lot of evidence of guilt, there's some evidence of innocence. On balance, it's more likely than not that she did, but there's not enough evidence to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt."

Read Latest Breaking News from Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/NewsmaxTv/al...rder-trial/2014/01/31/id/550244#ixzz2s5ZCR6ri
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Are there any journalistic sources that have looked at all aspects of this case leaving the reader to draw a conclusion? I have not followed this case closely at all and have only seen the 20/20 show (?) that had the FBI guy on it that looked at the case.

In my heart of hearts, I can't believe Italy would go to such great lengths to convict an American simply because they are an American. Italy relies heavily on American Tourism and if anything, I would think the opposite. The US needs to uphold its extradition treaty with other countries. Not doing so would create such Ill will and prevent the thousands of other families who are awaiting justice from achieving it. AK is simply not that important in the grand scheme of things to risk further the reputation of the US.

What saddens me greatly is that Meridith Kercher, the truely innocent victim, seems to have been glossed over as if she is an insignificant detail. Justice needs to be sought and served on her behalf. My deepest sympathies go out to her family and I quietly support them. AK and RS still have the ability to "fight" for their lives and freedom. Meredith does not. IMO, JMO, JMV
 
Was just looking on Google News for stories about Knox verdict: Saw many (Slate Magazine, The Atlantic, a Florida news venue, CNN, CBS, NBC, etc.).

It would seem as though most of the American media still feel the same as before (no evidence, all evidence points to Guede as lone wolf, the verdict is an outrage, the Italian system insane, Knox will never be extradited, etc.)


SBM

Sounds like they've really done their homework. They never did seem as invested in the "burn the witch" sensationalism the case got overseas.
 
But in the same article he says the Italian press had done the same thing in the opposite direction AND that there's reasonable doubt. ITA agree with him:

Likewise, Dershowitz added, Knox should be outraged by the coverage of the case in Italy.

"They're treating this case as if she's Al Capone, as if there's no question about her innocence or guilt. It's become black and white. [In] Italy, she's guilty beyond any doubt. In America, she's innocent beyond any doubt," he said.

"The truth is it's a very close case. There's a lot of evidence of guilt, there's some evidence of innocence. On balance, it's more likely than not that she did, but there's not enough evidence to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt."

Read Latest Breaking News from Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/NewsmaxTv/al...rder-trial/2014/01/31/id/550244#ixzz2s5ZCR6ri
Urgent: Should Obamacare Be Repealed? Vote Here Now!

Yes I saw this morning and thought he was dead on. Her attempt to frame someone else is a big red flag for me. I think she is probably guilty and I was glad to hear him speak out. Especially since he is a defense attorney. jmo
 
SBM

Sounds like they've really done their homework. They never did seem as invested in the "burn the witch" sensationalism the case got overseas.
Well, if you look at Judge Nencini's interview with Corriere Della Sera, posted above, I think you will see he was not on any witch hunt, but suffered emotionally over the case.....
 
BBM: Good point !

:seeya: Just jumping in and adding to your post with my :twocents: . . . fwiw !


Isn't it interesting that Knox claims she was "abused" when she was at the police station that night -- BUT no SIMILAR claim from Rafaelle that he was "abused" when he was right there in the police station also.

Now don't get me wrong, Rafaelle has whined and whined just like Knox ...

But I do not recall any statements from Raf that he was denied food and water ... oh, and "hit on the head" ...

Besides, Knox was not called into the police station that night -- it was Rafaelle who was called by LE to go to the police station -- Knox accompanied Raf there for OBVIOUS reasons ...

:moo:

Patrick Lumumba claimed the same abusive techniques by police.
 
Yes I saw this morning and thought he was dead on. Her attempt to frame someone else is a big red flag for me. I think she is probably guilty and I was glad to hear him speak out. Especially since he is a defense attorney. jmo
I agree. I was particularly touched to see a US expert daring to say this:

"If I were the family of the victim here, I would be outraged at the way the American media is treating this case.''

I wonder how the responses here would change if the nationalities of the two women were the other way around?
 
I agree. I was particularly touched to see a US expert daring to say this:



I wonder how the responses here would change if the nationalities of the two women were the other way around?

To answer your question for myself, I wouldn't matter in the least. They're both strangers to me. I don't sympathize with Knox because she's an American and that wouldn't change if she were the victim.

Also, I pretty much disregard everything the msm says about anything except to the extent it's an independently proven fact, a credible piece of investigative journalism (ha! those are few and far between) or a statement by someone who is an expert on a subject. jmo
 
To answer your question for myself, I wouldn't matter in the least. They're both strangers to me. I don't sympathize with Knox because she's an American and that wouldn't change if she were the victim.

Also, I pretty much disregard everything the msm says about anything except to the extent it's an independently proven fact, a credible piece of investigative journalism (ha! those are few and far between) or a statement by someone who is an expert on a subject. jmo
So what's your opinion on the statement I quoted from a US legal expert?
 
Why would his university care if he was into what you describe ?

I'm still confused by what it is in his background that's supposed to be sexually related and relevant.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

"During the five months of this trial, much has been made of Knox’s sex life and her eccentricities, but what has been said about Sollecito has been just as bizarre. The now 25-year-old has claimed that Knox was only his second sexual encounter. Sollecito’s university residence hall supervisor Francesco Tavernise testified that Rafe was introverted and shy, but that he had once caught him watching a sexually explicit movie focused on bestiality. Sollecito also posted a picture of himself wrapped in surgical bandages brandishing a meat cleaver on his social-networking site, and the prosecution has pointed to his penchant for violent Japanese Magna comics that center on the occult. His only run-in with the law has been for possession of hashish on the beach near his hometown Bari."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2009/06/19/will-knoxs-boyfriend-sacrifice-himself.html
 
So what's your opinion on the statement I quoted from a US legal expert?

I agree with him on his area of expertise. Regarding his statement that he would be outraged if he were the family of the victim, I think that's his personal opinion and I honestly don't care much what he says about that. Especially since I don't care about the media, in general.

That said, presumably he would say the same about the Italian media since he feels that both the US and the Italian media have done the same thing, but opposite.

jmo

eta: I should say I "tend" to agree with him in his area of expertise. I'm not sure how closely he followed the case, and I haven't followed it closely enough to know whether the statements he's basing his opinion on all are true or not. However, I'm sure his general sense of things is very well informed. So even just a "gut" from him is probably close to correct if not perfectly correct.
 
Are there any journalistic sources that have looked at all aspects of this case leaving the reader to draw a conclusion? I have not followed this case closely at all and have only seen the 20/20 show (?) that had the FBI guy on it that looked at the case.

In my heart of hearts, I can't believe Italy would go to such great lengths to convict an American simply because they are an American. Italy relies heavily on American Tourism and if anything, I would think the opposite. The US needs to uphold its extradition treaty with other countries. Not doing so would create such Ill will and prevent the thousands of other families who are awaiting justice from achieving it. AK is simply not that important in the grand scheme of things to risk further the reputation of the US.

What saddens me greatly is that Meridith Kercher, the truely innocent victim, seems to have been glossed over as if she is an insignificant detail. Justice needs to be sought and served on her behalf. My deepest sympathies go out to her family and I quietly support them. AK and RS still have the ability to "fight" for their lives and freedom. Meredith does not. IMO, JMO, JMV

I too do not believe Italy would convict an American just because she is American. Raffaele is Italian
 
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