Anjelica "AJ" Hadsell - COD: "Heroin Poisoning"

[katydid23]

I agree that someone gave it to her but I don't think they did it knowing she would die. So it was someone who knew Jen's cell #?

most teens have their MOM's numbers listed as such. I have had my cell called twice by kind strangers, finding my daughter's cell, and calling me because it said " mom" in the contacts. :wink:

 

[Happyshoes]

most teens have their MOM's numbers listed as such. I have had my cell called twice by kind strangers, finding my daughter's cell, and calling me because it said " mom" in the contacts. :wink:

I'd forgotten whoever sent the text was using AJ's phone, silly me. Any guesses on the green Caravan? I'm very suspicious of that circumstance.

 

[jstinch]

I think she only played club ball for the school not on the actual softball team. Maybe the club isn't mandatory testing and only test based on a person suspected to be using drugs. Does anyone know if practice was just starting?

She played club ball, they do not test.

 

[hey-Debbie]

Sometimes I'm really glad I missed all the stuff that gets a thread closed for clean up All that rumor & stuff can seriously derail the case discussion. So, thank you to the mods for keeping stuff on track and yanking us all back in line when we go all SM-airheaded.

That said, I don't know enough about heroin to voice an opinion one way or the other about whether AJ became addicted in two weeks or not. My personal opinion is that it is a load of horse snot and not only was she not addicted, she wasn't even using. I think, IF those texts from her phone claiming it (that she'd been using for the last 2 weeks prior to her going missing) actually existed (and LE knows by now if they ever existed or not) whoever sent them was setting the stage for whenever her body would eventually be found completely jacked up with a lethal amount of heroin.

I think, whoever sent the texts from her phone is either the very same person that gave it to her, or knows the person who gave it to her, and knew it was going to kill her when they did it. So, who in AJ's direct circle of people has a history with heroin or easy access to those who have a direct connection? Is it Wes? Is it someone else hoping the world will think it was Wes?

I sure don't envy LE working this case right now, I can tell you that.

It would be nice to know actually when those texts started coming in because that might be more telling about the time of death. I would imagine the TOD would be before those texts started coming especially if the first text that came in was to her sister that said AJ texted her that she was out with friends and that there was a confirmed sighting of AJ driving her truck that afternoon unless the first ones came from her and she was blowing off some steam and something went wrong so someone else finished off the texts and therefore setting the scene to explain the OD.

Because there is so much more that we don't know and because WH himself said that they would cover it up if AJ was using what makes it any different that they would cover other things up? He even said that they wanted to take care of things himself (themselves) and IMO that was evident by controlling the flow of who posted the flyers when she was missing and asking everyone to tear down flyers and to contact only them instead of LE and also have secondary cell phones. Do I think WH was involved, yup most likely, but I also think that he isn't the only one that was in on it and that he had help from other people.

Obviously, there is a lot more than the public knows that was going on behind those closed doors in the family and in their lives. If WH and JH were separated, they could have each started dating other people and that could cause for some distress in the family. Sometime extended family is the last to know about a marriage falling apart because some people try to hide when things start going south in a marriage. Sometimes both partners start stepping outside of the marriage before anything legally is done. This would probably cause a lot of confused feelings for the children of the relationship especially for AJ because now WH is her legal father.

 

[Inthedetails]

Yes, they were out helping someone, knew it was around midnight (iirc), and said the caravan turned its lights out and pulled around the back. I found this very credible. They were young, it probably didn't mean much to them at the time.

Thinking aloud here....

Do we know when they REPORTED the sighting of the Caravan? We know when it hit the media, but when did they make the call to LE? It could be that their tip was called in earlier than we heard about it, and LE was simply going down the list of leads to investigate when they hit the jackpot with this lead, ykwim?

I'm not recalling when the witnesses said they informed LE.

??

 

[Anne aka Her??]

Am I able to quote a post from another thread? I hope so, because it is relevant to our discussion:

From http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ia-42-Maricopa-22-June-2015-3-*ARREST*/page22

Post #325 from Luvrosco
I'm so sorry you had to go through that. One of my neighbor's died recently. It was a heroin overdose. He was in his 3rd year at Harvard. The family had no idea he was using. So sad. His mom is a shell of herself now.

This. Its like when we tell our kids that bad guys dont wear big black trench coats and have snaggle teeth. they look like regular people, they have regular jobs, they are friendly. There is no "look" of a bad guy. There is no "look" of a drug user. They are in every age, every job, every social status. As someone said on that other thread, "pretty people do drugs, too."

I want to reiterate, I am not arguing the fact that Aj did or did not use drugs. I am just trying to dispel the myth that because someone is in college or because someone is an athlete or because someone looks a certain way that drugs are not a possibility. I worked in mental health (and therefore with addictions) for 16 years. You would be surprised at the very successful, well liked, pretty people that it touches.

I completely agree. I was an AP student with straight A's and a varsity soccer player and all it took was a back injury from a car accident where I was given pain killers that led me onto a path of addiction that progressively got worse. I also agree with the others saying it would be possible to go through withdrawal if she was using every day. If it was only once it would be unlikely and everyone is different but after two weeks of constant use, her tolerance would already have increased and she most likely would have had several days of hell ahead if she tried to quit.

 

[Happyshoes]

Thinking aloud here....

Do we know when they REPORTED the sighting of the Caravan? We know when it hit the media, but when did they make the call to LE? It could be that their tip was called in earlier than we heard about it, and LE was simply going down the list of leads to investigate when they hit the jackpot with this lead, ykwim?

I'm not recalling when the witnesses said they informed LE.

??

It seems to me, it was after AJ was found and they were just interviewing people in the area. I tried to find the actual interview but didn't know where else to look except WTKR.

 

[MsMarple]

I'm starting to have serious doubts about WH's claim regarding the heroin texts. If his goal was to publicly shame JH then it really wouldn't matter if what he said was true or not. It's not even something that could be used against him in court. My reasoning is pretty simplistic so maybe I'm missing the bigger picture but...

What parent would stay up all night texting back and forth with their child who's talking about painful heroin withdrawal and not be alarmed, do nothing and wait another 16 or 17 hours before calling the police? And then say she believed her daughter was safe?

Uh uh, sorry but it makes no sense. JH would have contacted the police before sunrise if such texts came from AJ's phone. Heck, she would have voice called her to make sure it was her texting and that she was okay.

If I'm wrong then something is way off. But it makes more sense to me that WH was making stuff up to get at JH.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I'm starting to have serious doubts about WH's claim regarding the heroin texts. If his goal was to publicly shame JH then it really wouldn't matter if what he said was true or not. It's not even something that could be used against him in court. My reasoning is pretty simplistic so maybe I'm missing the bigger picture but...

What parent would stay up all night texting back and forth with their child who's talking about painful heroin withdrawal and not be alarmed, do nothing and wait another 16 or 17 hours before calling the police? And then say she believed her daughter was safe?

Uh uh, sorry but it makes no sense. JH would have contacted the police before sunrise if such texts came from AJ's phone. Heck, she would have voice called her to make sure it was her texting and that she was okay.

If I'm wrong then something is way off. But it makes more sense to me that WH was making stuff up to get at JH.

WH is a known liar. No questions about that. However, if he were lying about this, it stands to reason to me that JH would have gone ballistic about it and contacted the media or something to make it known those texts never happened. As far as I know, that has not taken place. For that reason (among many others) I think the texts did happen.

 

[MsMarple]

WH is a known liar. No questions about that. However, if he were lying about this, it stands to reason to me that JH would have gone ballistic about it and contacted the media or something to make it known those texts never happened. As far as I know, that has not taken place. For that reason (among many others) I think the texts did happen.

Good point. I haven't seen any response from her in msm. Maybe she's choosing to ride it out until NPD has something more. But if it's true about the texts then I don't know what to think.

 

[Happyshoes]

Good point. I haven't seen any response from her in msm. Maybe she's choosing to ride it out until NPD has something more. But if it's true about the texts then I don't know what to think.

I hear you, I don't know what to think about those texts, either. And I'm surprised Wes never said anything about them before now.

 

[Anne aka Her??]

So I've been thinking about the whole idea of Wes being framed (not that I necessarily think that but its interesting to theorize about) but what if the intent wasn't actually to frame Wes but just happened that way in their attempt to cover up an OD. Let me see if I can explain this clearly...If AJ did overdose and then the people were trying to cover it up and make it look like she was taken/ran away, they would need to plant evidence to make it appear that way, right? We've been assuming Wes was the one planting the clothes/card but what if it was someone else who was then leading Wes towards that evidence?

He said he was getting phone calls on a second phone and we have all assumed he was lying (as usual) but what if it was true. If Wes was dealing/ buying drugs and was smart, he would very likely have a second burner phone to conduct that "business". I'd bet some of his close friends/family also had that number and maybe one/several of them were using that number to call in tips.

Also, Wes said in one interview that he and another person decided they needed to break into the house for the jacket. What if that person was the one who planted the jacket? Then all they would need is drop some hints that AJ was creeped out this person, or that person was acting suspiciously and it would be pretty easy to rile up Wes enough to do something illegal leading to the break in and discovery of the jacket. And didn't someone else find the first piece of credit card.

Anyways, there are a lot of holes in this theory but it's definitely interesting to think about even though I don't necessarily believe it.

 

[Inthedetails]

So I've been thinking about the whole idea of Wes being framed (not that I necessarily think that but its interesting to theorize about) but what if the intent wasn't actually to frame Wes but just happened that way in their attempt to cover up an OD. Let me see if I can explain this clearly...If AJ did overdose and then the people were trying to cover it up and make it look like she was taken/ran away, they would need to plant evidence to make it appear that way, right? We've been assuming Wes was the one planting the clothes/card but what if it was someone else who was then leading Wes towards that evidence?

He said he was getting phone calls on a second phone and we have all assumed he was lying (as usual) but what if it was true. If Wes was dealing/ buying drugs and was smart, he would very likely have a second burner phone to conduct that "business". I'd bet some of his close friends/family also had that number and maybe one/several of them were using that number to call in tips.

Also, Wes said in one interview that he and another person decided they needed to break into the house for the jacket. What if that person was the one who planted the jacket? Then all they would need is drop some hints that AJ was creeped out this person, or that person was acting suspiciously and it would be pretty easy to rile up Wes enough to do something illegal leading to the break in and discovery of the jacket. And didn't someone else find the first piece of credit card.

Anyways, there are a lot of holes in this theory but it's definitely interesting to think about even though I don't necessarily believe it.

I hear ya, and I was considering keeping an open mind about him....until I remembered his past criminal activities with young girlfriend and wife. It does fit his pattern to inflict his will on young women.

I still am unclear on what to think, but I'm leaning toward Wes partying with the young people at the abandoned house and AJ was accidently given an OD of herion. Wes took charge of the cover-up as the "expert" in the group.

JMO at this point....willing to changing my mind.

 

[hey-Debbie]

I'm starting to have serious doubts about WH's claim regarding the heroin texts. If his goal was to publicly shame JH then it really wouldn't matter if what he said was true or not. It's not even something that could be used against him in court. My reasoning is pretty simplistic so maybe I'm missing the bigger picture but...

What parent would stay up all night texting back and forth with their child who's talking about painful heroin withdrawal and not be alarmed, do nothing and wait another 16 or 17 hours before calling the police? And then say she believed her daughter was safe?

Uh uh, sorry but it makes no sense. JH would have contacted the police before sunrise if such texts came from AJ's phone. Heck, she would have voice called her to make sure it was her texting and that she was okay.

If I'm wrong then something is way off. But it makes more sense to me that WH was making stuff up to get at JH.

Maybe she actually thought AJ was with friends like it was made to look like with the texts. In WH's latest interview he said they were texting by phone and by FaceBook (most likely FB app). Maybe she wasn't sure if she should report her missing because if it was really a drug thing they probably didn't want to bring police into it because it would have been a personal family matter that they thought they would deal with it on their own but after they couldn't really locate her through her personal friends that's when they decided to contact police. I don't doubt that this was a family that probably liked to do things their own way or exact their own revenge. That's just my own opinion based on what I have read through out media.

 

[Anne aka Her??]

I hear ya, and I was considering keeping an open mind about him....until I remembered his past criminal activities with young girlfriend and wife. It does fit his pattern to inflict his will on young women.

I still am unclear on what to think, but I'm leaning toward Wes partying with the young people at the abandoned house and AJ was accidently given an OD of herion. Wes took charge of the cover-up as the "expert" in the group.

JMO at this point....willing to changing my mind.

I'm with you. I am still fairly convinced he was involved too, either intentionally giving her an overdose of heroin or leading the cover-up if she OD'd accidently.

 

[hey-Debbie]

I hear you, I don't know what to think about those texts, either. And I'm surprised Wes never said anything about them before now.

Because now his family and friends have turned their back on him so now he's letting things out. I think he's trying to make JH mad and piss her off because she doesn't want anything out in the media because if she did she would have made more public pleas or appearances. I think she's pissed off because he's going to put their dirty laundry out for everyone to see.

 

[hey-Debbie]

So I've been thinking about the whole idea of Wes being framed (not that I necessarily think that but its interesting to theorize about) but what if the intent wasn't actually to frame Wes but just happened that way in their attempt to cover up an OD. Let me see if I can explain this clearly...If AJ did overdose and then the people were trying to cover it up and make it look like she was taken/ran away, they would need to plant evidence to make it appear that way, right? We've been assuming Wes was the one planting the clothes/card but what if it was someone else who was then leading Wes towards that evidence?

He said he was getting phone calls on a second phone and we have all assumed he was lying (as usual) but what if it was true. If Wes was dealing/ buying drugs and was smart, he would very likely have a second burner phone to conduct that "business". I'd bet some of his close friends/family also had that number and maybe one/several of them were using that number to call in tips.

Also, Wes said in one interview that he and another person decided they needed to break into the house for the jacket. What if that person was the one who planted the jacket? Then all they would need is drop some hints that AJ was creeped out this person, or that person was acting suspiciously and it would be pretty easy to rile up Wes enough to do something illegal leading to the break in and discovery of the jacket. And didn't someone else find the first piece of credit card.

Anyways, there are a lot of holes in this theory but it's definitely interesting to think about even though I don't necessarily believe it.

Well I was one of those people that had always considered that she did OD and it was being covered up so sounds good to me, but I'm not closing my mind off to anything.

 

[carpeverum]

Thinking aloud here....

Do we know when they REPORTED the sighting of the Caravan? We know when it hit the media, but when did they make the call to LE? It could be that their tip was called in earlier than we heard about it, and LE was simply going down the list of leads to investigate when they hit the jackpot with this lead, ykwim?

I'm not recalling when the witnesses said they informed LE.

??

I have no idea if the individual(s) who saw the dark Dodge Caravan in Franklin 3-4 weeks prior to LE finding her there reported seeing the vehicle before or after LE began scouring the property. However: I (finally) found the MSM video link of one of the individuals describing what he witnessed, as well as what his "buddy" saw 3-4 weeks to a month prior to finding AJ's remains.

Brian Potts is named "a nearby resident" and says his friend described the vehicle as being "a dark blue or black Dodge Caravan." The part of the video that has statements given to media by BP begins at 1:30.

http://wavy.com/2015/04/09/investigators-expand-search-area-for-missing-norfolk-teen/

I think it's likely that it's not in the best interests of the tipster(s) and/or LE to divulge info (at this time) on when and who gave the lead re: the Franklin house.

 

[Anne aka Her??]

Well I was one of those people that had always considered that she did OD and it was being covered up so sounds good to me, but I'm not closing my mind off to anything.

Yes. I understand that a lot of people think that saying that it may have been accidental OD is insulting or that her being a drug user is insulting but I don't think that ever makes someone "less than". Lots of bad people become bad drug users but there are lots of good people who get lost in addiction too. It doesn't automatically make them a bad person or erase who they fundamentally are. Addiction is cunning, baffling and powerful. It can happen to anyone.

 

[Inthedetails]

Snipped by me:

I think it's likely that it's not in the best interests of the tipster(s) and/or LE to divulge info (at this time) on when and who gave the lead re: the Franklin house.

The question was posted about why LE were at the house where AJ was found. The LE response has been that they discovered the house through investigation,no further information than that. I am speculating that the tip about the car was reported at some point and LE was following up on that tip. The tip could have been fresh or old, but I think that's what lead them there.

I don't think the tip came AFTER AJ was found, but before.

But, of course, it's all speculation as we don't know what brought LE to the house. My point in posting is to examine what was the hint that led LE to the house, not to call out any witnesses in particular.

JMO.