Anjelica "AJ" Hadsell's Disappearance from Norfolk, VA - 3 March 2015 #2

[arkansasmimi]

Hard for me to think of him that way. Mel is her father, Zach raised her for the most part...Wes was only in her life 4 or 5 years. No biggie, irrelevant in any case.

Respectfully, BBM, that has been repeated over and over ..... What does this say ABOUT ANY ADOPTIVE PARENT OR CHILD? That if the court saw it fit that the adoption was ok, that it has to be ok with anyone else? Not trying to be rude or snarky, but as a family member of some pretty awesome adopted kiddos and friend with some as well, I find it disrespectful. To ANY and ALL adopted or Adoptive Parents. When a child is adopted, or at least most every case I know of when adopted, there is a NEW Birth Certificate that states Father and/or Mother are the Parents. Regardless of how long they have been in individuals life.

Again, Zach Hoffer stated himself that they were estranged many places and even on the interview he did the day AJ remains were found.

JMHO

 

[FindHG]

Respectfully, BBM, that has been repeated over and over ..... What does this say ABOUT ANY ADOPTIVE PARENT OR CHILD? That if the court saw it fit that the adoption was ok, that it has to be ok with anyone else? Not trying to be rude or snarky, but as a family member of some pretty awesome adopted kiddos and friend with some as well, I find it disrespectful. To ANY and ALL adopted or Adoptive Parents. When a child is adopted, or at least most every case I know of when adopted, there is a NEW Birth Certificate that states Father and/or Mother are the Parents. Regardless of how long they have been in individuals life.

Again, Zach Hoffer stated himself that they were estranged many places and even on the interview he did the day AJ remains were found.

JMHO

AJ belongs to the heavens now, no human claims to her body or soul left. These arguments about her relations to Hadsell are moot, it seems to me, so much fodder to focus on. Those who grieve her are obvious, not hard to see, even for complete strangers. Laws were broken when she died and justice is being sought, not who owns AJ.

 

[arkansasmimi]

Interesting, the lowering of the body temp... considering the weather.

IMMEDIATE HARM: The initial effects of heroin include a surge of sensation—a “rush.” This is often accompanied by a warm feeling of the skin and a dry mouth. Sometimes, the initial reaction can include vomiting or severe itching.

After these initial effects fade, the user becomes drowsy for several hours. The basic body functions such as breathing and heartbeat slow down.

Within hours after the drug effects have decreased, the addict’s body begins to crave more. If he does not get another fix, he will begin to experience withdrawal. Withdrawal includes the extreme physical and mental symptoms which are experienced if the body is not supplied again with the next dose of heroin. Withdrawal symptoms include restlessness, aches and pains in the bones, diarrhea, vomiting and severe discomfort.

The intense high a user seeks lasts only a few minutes. With continued use, he needs increasing amounts of the drug just to feel “normal.”

SHORT-TERM EFFECTS
“Rush”
Slowed breathing
Clouded mental functioning
Nausea and vomiting
Sedation; drowsiness
Hypothermia (body temperature lower than normal)
Coma or death (due to overdose)
http://www.drugfreeworld.org/drugfacts/heroin/the-destructive-effects-of-heroin.

 

[mpnola]

Respectfully, BBM, that has been repeated over and over ..... What does this say ABOUT ANY ADOPTIVE PARENT OR CHILD? That if the court saw it fit that the adoption was ok, that it has to be ok with anyone else? Not trying to be rude or snarky, but as a family member of some pretty awesome adopted kiddos and friend with some as well, I find it disrespectful. To ANY and ALL adopted or Adoptive Parents. When a child is adopted, or at least most every case I know of when adopted, there is a NEW Birth Certificate that states Father and/or Mother are the Parents. Regardless of how long they have been in individuals life.

Again, Zach Hoffer stated himself that they were estranged many places and even on the interview he did the day AJ remains were found.

JMHO

That is what I was trying to say but I can't battle about something that feels so offensive to me. I know so many adoptive parents, adopted kids, and I myself considered adopting an older child who does not have a family. It is disrespectful for them to be considered anything other than what they are- parents. He chose to do it. Her mom chose to so it. AJ chose to do it. I'm not privy to the reasons, but it is a reality and a fact. Wes is her dad. A neighbor even said she had no idea that Wes wasn't AJs actual dad because they presented as a "normal" functioning family. Just because people want to create a different reality in their heads doesn't make it true.

By the way, I am aware that someone will post soon about "What does this have to do with anything", because it is posted every time we get to this point. What it has to do with everything is people don't understand what Wes would be doing around AJ or the fact that AJ saw Wes he must have raped her or whatever! He was her dad, plain and simple. Bio, adopted, black, white, criminal, saint, fat or thin- none of those factors matter. He was legally her father and I haven't seen much of anything that told me she thought of him as anything other than that.

 

[NWLady]

And IIRC, Zach himself had said, somewhere along the line, that him and AJ had not interacted much since AJ was age 13. AJ was approximately 5 months away from turning 19 (at the time she was reported missing). So, for almost 6 years, Zach and AJ had very little contact with one another, this has been said by Zach himself. Wes has allegedly been in her life since approximately 2010, so approximately 5 years. I don't recall the date he legally adopted her because IMO, if Wes did adopt her, then he is considered her dad.

But, on another note, it just occurred to me while typing this post, that it would *seem* as if AJ's interaction with Zach ceased around the approximate time frame that Wes became a part of AJ's life. I will end my post on that note as to not violate TOS in regards to further thoughts that just crossed my mind.

To sum it up, whether or not Wesley played a role in AJ's demise, IMO, still does not change what we have been told, which is Wes legally adopted AJ. BUT, if Wes is the guilty one, then does the blame go back to the person who allowed Wes in AJ's life? This conversation/debate could go on and on for pages/threads like it has in the past but it's really irrelevant to the end result, which is AJ's demise. So so sad. And JMO but we need to concentrate on Justice For AJ and a little less on who her father is or was or could've been etc etc because AJ shouldn't be remembered or forgotten about because of the who raised her and who didn't etc.

 

[FindHG]

Zach had a lot less contact than wanted, yet he lived in town, alone away from his own place to be near his kids, he showed up for the girl's events, he took care of his own two girls half the time. You're taking his words mentioned at the height of grief and unknowing, when they were said, before AJ was found, before Wes was arrested even, IIRC, to the most damning extreme, when it comes to Zach, while ignoring facts he has mentioned as well, so this is to remind you of them, upfront. It's all on the thread, but I'd would be happy to go into more of how Zach was received by Hadsell and the crew at these events, so you can get the picture we have of how hard it may have been for AJ to balance an ex con adoptive father capable of ill with a Dad who would have probably ended up in jail or dead if he had known the extent of what Wes may have been up to. For now, it's a true boon to all involved that Wes is in jail.

And IIRC, Zach himself had said, somewhere along the line, that him and AJ had not interacted much since AJ was age 13. AJ was approximately 5 months away from turning 19 (at the time she was reported missing). So, for almost 6 years, Zach and AJ had very little contact with one another, this has been said by Zach himself. Wes has allegedly been in her life since approximately 2010, so approximately 5 years. I don't recall the date he legally adopted her because IMO, if Wes did adopt her, then he is considered her dad.

But, on another note, it just occurred to me while typing this post, that it would *seem* as if AJ's interaction with Zach ceased around the approximate time frame that Wes became a part of AJ's life. I will end my post on that note as to not violate TOS in regards to further thoughts that just crossed my mind.

To sum it up, whether or not Wesley played a role in AJ's demise, IMO, still does not change what we have been told, which is Wes legally adopted AJ. BUT, if Wes is the guilty one, then does the blame go back to the person who allowed Wes in AJ's life? This conversation/debate could go on and on for pages/threads like it has in the past but it's really irrelevant to the end result, which is AJ's demise. So so sad. And JMO but we need to concentrate on Justice For AJ and a little less on who her father is or was or could've been etc etc because AJ shouldn't be remembered or forgotten about because of the who raised her and who didn't etc.

 

[arkansasmimi]

That is what I was trying to say but I can't battle about something that feels so offensive to me. I know so many adoptive parents, adopted kids, and I myself considered adopting an older child who does not have a family. It is disrespectful for them to be considered anything other than what they are- parents. He chose to do it. Her mom chose to so it. AJ chose to do it. I'm not privy to the reasons, but it is a reality and a fact. Wes is her dad. A neighbor even said she had no idea that Wes wasn't AJs actual dad because they presented as a "normal" functioning family. Just because people want to create a different reality in their heads doesn't make it true.

By the way, I am aware that someone will post soon about "What does this have to do with anything", because it is posted every time we get to this point. What it has to do with everything is people don't understand what Wes would be doing around AJ or the fact that AJ saw Wes he must have raped her or whatever! He was her dad, plain and simple. Bio, adopted, black, white, criminal, saint, fat or thin- none of those factors matter. He was legally her father and I haven't seen much of anything that told me she thought of him as anything other than that.

I agree. And to me it is relevant. Everything is because we only know so few FACTS. We don't have a suspect of any crime (or what crime LEO may file charges on) or even a POI. So anyone and everyone .... and everything is relevant and possible suspect to me. Just my honest opinion, for all we know that could have been an issue in all of possibilities of what could have happened. Or is could not have anything to do with.

 

[NWLady]

Agreed. AJ, it has been said, based on her SM history, may have wanted to spend Spring Break elsewhere with other friends, probably people outside the circle of the people she glued together. I'm sure it will be interesting for LE to hear what those friend have to say about AJ as well, as she missed her chance to be with them again. If this were something young people were covering up for to protect themselves and somehow set up Hadsell, well, they would have been out of their league, I think considering his past. Wes does not strike me as the type to go down with the ship or to cover for anyone, not blood relatives, true acolytes or even the pastor, much less a group of kids he knows through AJ. I see Wes as using people around him to get what he wants, but he may have had to have something over them to keep them in line.

BBM
On the other hand, what IF these young people are covering for Wes AND themselves because they very well indeed know what happened and to tell on Wes would be admitting they were involved, or at the very least, admitting they had knowledge of what took place. Also, to put another twist in it, what IF there is another adult that has knowledge of what took place, is that person going to come forward to talk about Wes's *alleged* involvement in AJ's demise? IMO, that answer would also be no because then that person would be admitting they had knowledge ALSO of what took place in regard to AJ's demise. So, pretty soon, we not only have 1 guilty person, but now we could *possibly* have 3, 4, 5, 6, others with knowledge. Is this why everybody is huddled so tightly in their own little group? Hmmmm...sure does make a person wonder what really did take place....

 

[NWLady]

Zach had a lot less contact than wanted, yet he lived in town, alone away from his own place to be near his kids, he showed up for the girl's events, he took care of his own two girls half the time. You're taking his words mentioned at the height of grief and unknowing, when they were said, before AJ was found, before Wes was arrested even, IIRC, to the most damning extreme, when it comes to Zach, while ignoring facts he has mentioned as well, so this is to remind you of them, upfront. It's all on the thread, but I'd would be happy to go into more of how Zach was received by Hadsell and the crew at these events, so you can get the picture we have of how hard it may have been for AJ to balance an ex con adoptive father capable of ill with a Dad who would have probably ended up in jail or dead if he had known the extent of what Wes may have been up to. For now, it's a true boon to all involved that Wes is in jail.

BBM
No, I am not taking "his words mentioned at the height of grief and unknowing"... Just to refresh your memory and to clarify, those things were said years ago, not at all related to WS.

End of subject as far as I'm concerned. I have followed this thread from the beginning and have read everything that's been made available but thank you kindly for the offer to remind me. Kindest regards

 

[arkansasmimi]

Zach had a lot less contact than wanted, yet he lived in town, alone away from his own place to be near his kids, he showed up for the girl's events, he took care of his own two girls half the time. You're taking his words mentioned at the height of grief and unknowing, when they were said, before AJ was found, before Wes was arrested even, IIRC, to the most damning extreme, when it comes to Zach, while ignoring facts he has mentioned as well, so this is to remind you of them, upfront. It's all on the thread, but I'd would be happy to go into more of how Zach was received by Hadsell and the crew at these events, so you can get the picture we have of how hard it may have been for AJ to balance an ex con adoptive father capable of ill with a Dad who would have probably ended up in jail or dead if he had known the extent of what Wes may have been up to. For now, it's a true boon to all involved that Wes is in jail

Respectfully BBM, we are only taking Zach Hoffers words as he chose to post them, here, on social media, on his fb and blog (that he himself gave links to, which all had dates).

And I respectfully say this, but we have 2 Verified Insiders on this thread, Zach Hoffer and ThatGuyBear. They would be the only 2 who would be able to give us any inside info how anyone was received. We also per the mods, can choose if we wish to believe or not.

 

[cluciano63]

Honestly, I do not find it at all unbelievable or unlikely that she would have been left and/or "dumped" if she appeared to OD. That is what drug users do, Imo. Worry about themselves only and run from any problems that may bring them into contact with police. It does not have to be W. And it did not have to be ingested by force (which seems unlikely, Imo...not sure what the motive would be.) If there was a "plan" to make it look like an "innocent" overdose or suicide, for instance, I think she would have been left someplace where she would have been found sooner and not just by chance. To me, this sounds more like either hiding her body out of drugged-fueled panic, or just leaving in the spot where drugs were taken. But...jmo of course.

 

[katydid23]

This is purely out of curiosity- but did LE fully investigate CF's house? I ask as in do you think they did any forensics on the red couch? I know they were over there and such, but I was just wondering what the general thoughts were. I am asking bc we dont know where AJ may have been the afternoon or evening if not with wh. It had been made out to sound like he had an entertainment area? IDk.


I also found this- http://www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/research/job185drugs/morphine.htm. I was trying to see what the serum half life of heroin was/is.

Ok, so who else has a white car I wonder?

According to Wes, LE did get a search warrant for CF's house and also interviewed him. that was in one of Wes's interviews but can't remember which one---it was the one where he babbled about the jacket...

 

[ilovepierre]

Just a thought, but wasn't AJ up until an early hour 'fighting' with her mom? I have never dabbled into the drug world but what I understand is that they will either keep you awake for hours or days, or they may put you to sleep. Would the early morning hours make sense now?

IIRC, that was never verified.
Early on, someone on Twitter said that AJ had had a fight with her mom and then "took a walk" to clear her head.
But I don't think that was ever proven to have happened.

 

[ilovepierre]

Alcohol poisoning is usually from chronic use and or simply over doing it.

But I doubt AJ was by herself. I dont see her indulging without someone else there keeping her company.

It's not like she was that character (Bubs/ Bubbles) from that HBO tv show The Wire.

Only addicts party by themselves. Not occasional users.

Jmo

That's not necessarily true. My dad was an addict and he never partied alone. He was ALWAYS with people.
And I know he wasn't an occasional user. He was doing cocaine every night. He blew all his money on the drug. He gambled constantly to get money for the drug. He pawned away our movies to get money for the drug.
My dad was an addict, and he was never alone while using.

 

[Tealgrove]

I have to admit that I was taken aback when I got caught up this morning with the COD. Maybe I'm naive but I didn't think AJ was a drug user. Again, I stopped with the SM when things got ridiculous but I just never heard or saw the chatter. I would have thought "word" would have gotten out. That's typically something that doesn't stay quiet. As much as family and friends tried to shut information down I still would think that someone would be spilling the beans about drug use.

I am surprised but I'm not entirely satisfied. I have a few in my sights but I'm still waiting for the the real story and the truth.

There's more out there. Of this I am certain.

 

[ninij9]

I had a very dear friend that died of heroin abuse. There is no way on earth he could have maintained college and softball. He slept alot. He scammed everyone for drug money. Heroin users don't "use occasionally" its highly addictive. It's not a party drug either. Now, most kids today that mess with it socially don't inject it either. And it can be mixed with an "up" drug. If she used on purpose, this is more what I see. If she was given it unknowingly, possibly added to something hense the acute poisoning. But no matter what, I have met many users through my friend, and she just does NOT fit that profile. Do you know they spend all night looking for their fix, then as soon as they shoot up, boom they are zombified. So. Not. Social. Anyway, I hate anyone thinking AJ would live like that. It's just one more insult she must suffer I guess.

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[ninij9]

Also you can smoke Heroin in your weed. People have accidentally ingested heroin this way.

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[LavenderLotus]

I had a very dear friend that died of heroin abuse. There is no way on earth he could have maintained college and softball. He slept alot. He scammed everyone for drug money. Heroin users don't "use occasionally" its highly addictive. It's not a party drug either. Now, most kids today that mess with it socially don't inject it either. And it can be mixed with an "up" drug. If she used on purpose, this is more what I see. If she was given it unknowingly, possibly added to something hense the acute poisoning. But no matter what, I have met many users through my friend, and she just does NOT fit that profile. Do you know they spend all night looking for their fix, then as soon as they shoot up, boom they are zombified. So. Not. Social. Anyway, I hate anyone thinking AJ would live like that. It's just one more insult she must suffer I guess.

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I'm a former IV heroin addict. While it's true that a lot of heroin addicts end up like this, it doesn't start out this way. It does start out as perhaps a weekend thing. Using here & there. It CAN be a party drug; especially considering that a lot of heroin users were prescription pill addicts first. Heroin is cheaper so they turn to it.

A lot of new users overdose very easily. This is beause they don't know their limits. Or sometimes they are drunk also or using benzos.

I was using about a gram a day at the end & still managed to keep a household. At the beginning, I was definitely social still & even coached my son's soccer team. It's not impossible.

If AJ did use heroin willingly, she could have been using pills first, somebody then introduced her to heroin, she didn't know her limits, bam, overdose.

Having said all that, I'm completely unsure now. I certainly didn't expect heroin to be her cause of death. Hopefully, we will know the manner soon.

 

[DexterMorgan]

Social people prefer uppers like coke to keep the party going. But there will always be someone at the party that says I Got An Idea.


But her call logs should tell who she was planning on hooking up with. But it seems the most calls and text was to Wes.

 

[DexterMorgan]

That's not necessarily true. My dad was an addict and he never partied alone. He was ALWAYS with people.
And I know he wasn't an occasional user. He was doing cocaine every night. He blew all his money on the drug. He gambled constantly to get money for the drug. He pawned away our movies to get money for the drug.
My dad was an addict, and he was never alone while using.

Since coke is very expensive and can be quickly consumed while leaving you totally awake and chasing the high; Than it's a good possibility that pops was with others as a freeloader tactic or vice versa.

But if you're selling the kitchen sink to get high; Then it would make more sense to get high without the freeloaders around.

Jmo. But everyone is different and I'm sorry pops was like this towards your family. Much love.